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I have a beef with the "it's against bronies' headcanon" strawman (S5 spoilers)


Dark Qiviut

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With the 100th episode of FIM around the corner, there's speculation for what will come up next. I'm looking forward to it, but I'm also somewhat reserved, because the episode will be nothing without a solid story and characterizations that make sense with how the background ponies act and look. Core brony fandom references are nothing new, but DHX's track record has been rather spotty.

 

And lately, one of the reasons many people are looking for it (or not) is "because bronies will complain about their shattered headcanons."

 

Three words: Cut — it — out! Bronies don't fucking care if the show deviates or breaks away from headcanon, whether it's their own or a collective. They only care if the show executes their story well. All they care is the following:

  1. Is the story solid and making sense?
  2. Do the characterizations the background ponies feature make sense with their already established visual, verbal, or active archetpyes? For example, Derpy's actions fit with her innocence, Vinyl's casual attitude, etc.
  3. Do the background ponies actually have a reason to be there, or are they there just to pander to older and younger demographics?
  4. Does the story not mock its fans and the fanon, longstanding or otherwise? The IDW comics have already done something similar: The mocking of brony critics throughout the Reflections Arc, including having Pinkie Pie (one of the most likeable characters) act as their vessel. Here, the main comics jumped the shark.

There's only been one time people complained about broken headcanon, and they had a really good reason: Daring Don't. Do you know why plenty were up in arms? Because the actual plot made no sense. One common headcanon, Twilight Velvet being the author of the DD novels, was a really unique idea for two reasons:

  1. It kept the zany, adventurous worldbuilding of Daring Do alive without sending implications that would affect not only the worldbuilding of FIM altogether, but also not treat Celestia as an inept ruler.
  2. It would be a great, subtle callback to The Cutie Mark Chronicles. There, all six have some symbolic connection dating back before they ever met. Dash and Twilight are very loyal fans of the series. TV as the author would reinforce that cycle.

I already lambasted over the "you're afraid of change" and "it's for kids" fallacies. It's time to cut this crap out, too.

  • Brohoof 2

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It's sickening how certain people reserve the right to insult and demean everyone who disagrees with them, but try to call them out on it and you get banned.

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I feel as if I must disagree with you here, DQ. 

 

Your entire argument is based on this assumption:

 

 

 

Three words: Cut — it — out! Bronies don't fucking care if the show deviates or breaks away headcanon, whether it's their own or a collective. They only care if the show executes their story well. All they care is the following:
  • Is the story solid and making sense?
  • Do the background ponies actually have a reason to be there, or are they there just to pander to older and younger demographics?
  • Does the story not mock its fans and the fanon, longstanding or otherwise? The IDW comics have already done something similar: The mocking of brony critics throughout the Reflections Arc, including having Pinkie Pie (one of the most likeable characters) acting as the vessel for the mocking. Here, the main comics jumped the shark.

 

 

All they care is the following:

 

These clearly are your thoughts. What you care about and what you want to see. That's perfectly fine, of course. I can't help but find fault in this point, however, as it's assuming that every single person in this fandom thinks in this manner. 

 

I'll put it bluntly, I can't really say I think you're of the authority to speak for such a large group of people in this manner unless you've asked every single person in this fandom what they care about in this show and those 3 things were their response - which, you haven't, because I know for a fact you didn't ask me :P 

 

Furthermore, while I do agree that it is a poor argument as to why one would avoid the episode all together, I do think that many would have a sense of dread and nervousness about this episode because of the very reason of fanon being broken, particularly those who have grown attached to the personalities of the background ponies.

 

I know for a fact that I get really nervous before a Rarity episode airs. I get shaky, my arms and legs feel like I've just run a mile, etc. I worry about her being written poorly like she was in "Sonic Rainboom" among other things, as I don't like seeing her deviate so far from the character I've grown to love. I'd place money on this being why many would feel the same way about this episode - they've grown attached to the personalities the fandom themselves has imprinted on the character. It's quite literally one of the only explanations as the only general background pony that's been given a canon personality in the show that I can think of, and please correct me if I'm wrong and I'm leaving one out, is Derpy Hooves. It's either the personalities they've been given by the fandom or the character design, but I digress on that last note.

 

They've grown to cherish the personalities and whatnot that these ponies have been given. That much is clear, as background ponies in this fandom are quite popular and you'd be hard pressed to look through a thread on these very forums without a background pony appearing in a signature or an avatar. Many of these ponies haven't had a single canonical speaking line, either, so it's all up to what lines they have been given in fanfiction, fanmade videos, what they're being drawn as doing in fanart, etc, to give them the personality that makes people like them. What if these personalities were to be destroyed by canon? That would be a huge game changer for the fan's enjoyment of the product, no doubt. It wouldn't be the same character they've grown to enjoy and care about, it'd be something completely different, and it wouldn't go away. It'd be stuck as canon and there'd be no way around it.

 

And like you yourself have brought up in the past, DQ, writers aren't allowed to look at 3rd parties for inspiration. It's a safe bet that they don't know every nook and cranny of the personalities the fandom has imprinted on each individual background pony and that they just have a base knowledge of what the fans have come up with. If that is the case and they do their jobs within the rules and don't use 3rd parties for direct inspiration, the probability of them messing up in this regard is rather high. They can't know everything, they can only know the bare basics based solely upon what they cannot avoid seeing. They could mess up the personalities that the fandom has grown to cherish rather easily, actually, and there's a chance it wouldn't be for the better.

 

Sadly, I can't say I can agree with your points here DQ, as it all traces back to the fans of the background ponies finding their enjoyment in these characters through headcanon in the first place - whether it be their own or collective fanon, and seeing that enjoyment be toppled down by irreversible canon is something that I can understand people being upset over. Just like there's no going back with the Star Wars prequels, there's no going back once this ship sets sail. They either hit it or miss it with each individual background character, and when their personal enjoyment of something is being put at risk like this, it's easy to understand why some people might be nervous as to what this episode has to offer them :please:

  • Brohoof 2
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@@ghostfacekiller39, From my time in fandom, headcanon breaking hasn't stopped any fandom from doing what they loved. Just a few examples:

  • In the Digimon fandom, there's a mass exodus towards the 25-year-later epilogue from season two's finale, fans basically handwave it out entirely.

    The fact that Sora and Matt are an official couple also hasn't stopped the passionate Taiora fandom from shipping them in their fanwork.
  • Two popular fan-ships in CCS are Sakura/Syaoran and Tomoyo/Eriol. Although S/S is the most popular, Eriol (an actual adult who stopped growing) has a relationship with another adult, Kaho. Still hasn't stopped the E/T shippers.

    (As a Sakura/Kaho shipper, canon is only a switch of the railroad points. B))
  • Dinky has an official sister in Amethyst Star (from Sisterhooves Social). Still hasn't bronies from having Derpy as her mother. Given how none of the adults have any explicit age, there's a section of bronies who have Amethyst as an older daughter of Dinky.
  • Luna's appearance in LE basically broke so much headcanon between her appearances. But because Luna was written so well, and she was so endearing, bronies didn't care. New headcanon cropped up afterwards.

There's no doubt that plenty will be nervous given the reasons you provided. But I think you're taking them for granted somewhat. Even if it breaks away from long-established headcanon, if it creates something better, then either we have a whole new set of headcanon OR the headcanon pre- and post-episode will merge. Bronies are a collective who either chug a host of or are thirsty for new ideas, and those ideas appear each time an episode appears.

 

And if the bkg. characters are written poorly, are out of character, or the 100th episode sucks in general? The way I go about it, I tear apart the episode and keep on chugging the ol' headcanon as if nothing happened. :please:

 

ETA: Fixed an error.

 

P.S.: Not long ago, DHX made it clear how some background ponies won't have long-established fanonical personalities. So we'll see how they're written come episode time.

  • Brohoof 2
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I honestly don't think destroying headcanons was ever really the main issue this episode presented. Any given episode can potentially destroy a headcanon. That's not the issue. 

 

I simply feel this episode's existence will likely be nothing but a gimmick, much like everything from season 4 that really did not have any other purpose except for pleasing the bronies. 

 

That being said, I do feel that it deserves at least a chance, and that's why I'm still going to watch it. But I'm certainly not expecting to pleased with what I see, that's for sure. 

  • Brohoof 2
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@@Cleverclover, You got a fair point. While attracting the core fandom can be a big hit if done right (i.e., the classic Thomas & Friends/Railway Series references, especially the nostalgic music, in The Adventure Begins), it can go really wrong if the story and references are empty (see the core fandom pandering in EQG). While the 100th episode special is a common occurrence in shows (like Star Trek), story and characterization come first.

 

I'll give it a chance myself, but due to DHX's record, it's definitely something to be concerned of.

  • Brohoof 1
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I'll put it bluntly, I can't really say I think you're of the authority to speak for such a large group of people in this manner

 

I think DQ means "bronies" in a general sense. Not literally every brony fits his criteria, as there's bound to be someone out there (no matter how limited the sample size may be) who is the opposite and will walk away from the show for whatever reason they feel fit.

 

 

They've grown to cherish the personalities and whatnot that these ponies have been given. That much is clear, as background ponies in this fandom are quite popular and you'd be hard pressed to look through a thread on these very forums without a background pony appearing in a signature or an avatar. Many of these ponies haven't had a single canonical speaking line, either, so it's all up to what lines they have been given in fanfiction, fanmade videos, what they're being drawn as doing in fanart, etc, to give them the personality that makes people like them. What if these personalities were to be destroyed by canon? That would be a huge game changer for the fan's enjoyment of the product, no doubt. It wouldn't be the same character they've grown to enjoy and care about, it'd be something completely different, and it wouldn't go away. It'd be stuck as canon and there'd be no way around it.

 

This is a solid point. The background ponies really are sort of a sacred relic of the fandom, in a sense. They (and the stories and artwork that has accompanied them) are a big reason the fandom is where it's at today. The free range of potential that these ponies have gives bronies an endless supply of ideas for fan work and headcanons to toy with. Setting something crucial in stone may discourage certain future content from being made (though on the flip side, it could encourage new content based off this new canon).

 

On the other end, it is just a single episode. This will likely be the only time we see the background ponies under the center stage, and with this much character development. So if some of the ponies personality traits are formed/changed from the brony norm, they won't be brought up again in who knows how long, so it'd be easier for fans to continue with their headcanons anyways. It is a "headcanon" after all; it's all their personal interpretation, so I'd think that most people who dislike the episode's canon would just ignore that certain episode and go with their own ideas.

 

Personally, I'm highly anticipating the 100th episode. I see it as a tribute to the fans from the creators. I think it's existence shows how much of an impact we have had on the show's creation and its direction. But, I do understand the concern some may have.

  • Brohoof 2
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@, @@Cleverclover, @@ghostfacekiller39, @@Dulset Tarn, One more thing to add:

 

While the 100th episode will definitely be a nod to core bronies, keep in mind that there may be thousands of kid bronies who are just as big fans of background ponies as us older bronies and may have a grasp of certain fanon, too. Chances are DHX'll hopefully keep the kids in mind, too.

  • Brohoof 1
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I think it's existence shows how much of an impact we have had on the show's creation and its direction.

 

Fair enough, but I feel the need to ask something: has that impact truly been entirely positive?  

 

I can't really say it has. I mean sure, the bronies are probably a big reason why the show was able to even make it to 100 episodes, but after Twilight's Kingdom, I'm just a bit worried that they've been given far too much control. That the staff has gotten far too comfortable with pandering to them. 

 

Personally, I detest the notion that the bronies are running the show now, and I honestly think that the 100th episode may be setting a very risky precedent. Don't get me wrong, I think it's a good thing that the staff shows their appreciation for the fanbase, and that's why I never had any problem with the subtle nods. However, start pandering to them on a consistently frequent basis, and that's when it becomes a very rocky road. The fanbase will actually come to expect to be pandered to, possibly to the point where they start hoping that popular fanfictions and other such things soon become canonized. 

 

If it gets to that point, that's when you know you've spoiled them far too much. And that's the potential danger the 100th episode presents. 

  • Brohoof 1
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