The Official Gamergate Discussion Thread

[Wulfgar Von Heltzer 42]

Moderators, PLEASE do NOT put this in the debate pit, there is NO debate to be had as to what the real goal of gamergate is. It's a movement wanting ethical reform of the corrupt video game's journalism industry. NOT a sexist group of angry white males. That is a FACT. I want to have a discussion thread (not a hugbox echo-chamber) about gamergate, in regards to what is REALLY going on here.

 

And yes, I'm aware that there have been other threads on this, but they've gone nowhere. I want to start a new thread with this video that will educate newcomers to what's going on, and discourage people who aren't interested in seeing the reality that this isn't a sexist movement, that we're just fighting for ethical video game journalism.

 

ANYONE WHO DOES NOT KNOW WHAT GAMERGATE IS OR THINKS IT'S A MISOGYNISTIC MOVEMENT WANTING TO ATTACK WOMAN PLEASE WATCH THIS VIDEO BELOW OR DO, NOT, POST, or I'll assume you're trolling and report you as such, (and hopefully, the moderators will punish you accordingly). Because if you're willfully refusing to actually acknowledge the facts, you're not contributing anything meaningful to the discussion, and are not welcome.

 

 

 

So let's please discuss Gamergate here, and not the debate pit.

 

Edited October 23, 2014 by Wulfgar Von Heltzer

[Banul 3,831]

No offense dude, but your post comes off as "agree with me or I'll report you for trolling"

 

Not exactly a great start to a discussion.

Edited October 23, 2014 by Banul

[Revy ~ Two Hands 862]

Pretty sure I started a Zoe Quinn thread between 2 and 3 months ago. Anyone remember when it was just her under the spotlight, I look back at those simpler days with nostalgia.

[Moved to Elsewhere 11,329]

"Remember guys, agree with me or else I'll report you!"

 

Not a great way to start a thread. Anyways, my opinions are still neutral on this. I see where people are coming from with Zoe Quin having sex to get a good review and how the other journalists tried to contrive it to make it talk about feminism, veering off topic of the actual discussion.

 

However, I also see how people went a bit too far with it. The movement started on 4Chan so what do you expect? 

[Mand'alor Dash 2,224]

Moderators, PLEASE do NOT put this in the debate pit, there is NO debate to be had as to what the real goal of gamergate is.

 

 

I want to have a discussion thread (not a hugbox echo-chamber) about gamergate,

 

The debate pit is for controversial topics. And whether or not GG's goal is up for debate, it's still a matter of controversy. Even before we get into all of the he-said-she-said regarding the facts of the matter, it's still a topic deeply related to social justice politics and radical feminism. These are issues that incite alot of controversy.

 

And since you yourself are saying that you do not wish for this thread to be a "hugbox," doesn't that mean you are welcoming controversial discussion or...

 

[pause for effect]

 

...debate?

 

I'm all for that sort of discussion, but let us label it properly, my good fellow.

[Wulfgar Von Heltzer 42]

The debate pit is for controversial topics. And whether or not GG's goal is up for debate, it's still a matter of controversy. Even before we get into all of the he-said-she-said regarding the facts of the matter, it's still a topic deeply related to social justice politics and radical feminism. These are issues that incite alot of controversy.

 

And since you yourself are saying that you do not wish for this thread to be a "hugbox," doesn't that mean you are welcoming controversial discussion or...

 

[pause for effect]

 

...debate?

 

I'm all for that sort of discussion, but let us label it properly, my good fellow.

 

It's not up for debate. Gamergate is looking for ethical video game journalism, there is no debate on that part. It has nothing to do with a hatred of women and or minorities in the industry, anyone saying so is misguided or deflecting. I welcome differing opinions, because I don't like hugboxes, but the question of whether or not gamergaters are just wanting ethical video game journalism or are a bunch of a angry cis-white males who just can't stand women is not subjective. It's a proven fact that it's about wanting ethical video game journalism. Yes, there are surely women-haters, but they're the vast minority, and don't represent the movement as a whole.

 

 

There's nothing to debate about that part. It's an objective truth so anyone arguing that needs to be properly informed, and if they still argue against it, than they're either trolling, in denial, or insane. Either way, they're not adding anything meaningful to the discussion.

 

I'm not going any further on that part. You read my post, acknowledge the real facts, or stay out of the discussion, because you may as well be trolling.

Edited October 23, 2014 by Wulfgar Von Heltzer

[Mand'alor Dash 2,224]

It's not up for debate. Gamergate is looking for ethical video game journalism, there is no debate on that part. It has nothing to do with a hatred of women and or minorities in the industry, anyone saying so is misguided or deflecting. I welcome differing opinions, because I don't like hugboxes, but the question of whether or not gamergaters are just wanting ethical video game journalism or are a bunch of a angry cis-white males who just can't stand women is not subjective. It's a proven fact that it's about wanting ethical video game journalism. Yes, there are surely women-haters, but they're the vast minority, and don't represent the movement as a whole.

 

 

There's nothing to debate about that part. It's an objective truth so anyone arguing that needs to be properly informed, and if they still argue against it, than they're either trolling, in denial, or insane. Either way, they're not adding anything meaningful to the discussion.

 

I'm not going any further on that part. You read my post, acknowledge the real facts, or stay out of the discussion, because you may as well be trolling.

 

Did you even read my post? I never said the goal was debatable, I said that it's a matter rooted in politics and controversy, and that it in itself was going to stir up debate.

 

Journalism ethics in itself is already a controversial issue. Then when you conflate it with game journos being in bed (literally) with SJWs and Radfems, the only conceivable outcome is extreme controversy.

[Wulfgar Von Heltzer 42]

Did you even read my post? I never said the goal was debatable, I said that it's a matter rooted in politics and controversy, and that it in itself was going to stir up debate.

 

Journalism ethics in itself is already a controversial issue. Then when you conflate it with game journos being in bed (literally) with SJWs and Radfems, the only conceivable outcome is extreme controversy.

 

Well, yes it's a controversial topic. Still, the name Debate Pit implies, well, debate. This isn't one, tho, so I don't agree that it belongs there. That, and 100 character limit is annoying.

 

I'm not going over this any further, if people want to discuss the topic, cool, if not, please leave, I don't like derails.

[TenorSounds 831]

While I acknowledge that there are many who use the "Gamergate" label as a flag for ethical journalism in gaming, this comment I found on the gaming site Polygon sums up my thoughts fairly well:

 

"The problem is that when an activist group is defined entirely by its amorphous, anonymous nature, it's impossible to hold it accountable for anything, because everyone's reasons for being part of it are different.

 

You see it in people's reaction to anti-GG people already – 'GamerGate isn't about THAT, it's about THIS!'. Everybody passes the buck constantly, and nobody is willing to admit that the ship is sinking.

 

As long as GamerGate – or its successor – is populated and piloted primarily by the anonymous masses of the internet within Reddit and the chans while additional hangers-on join via Twitter, it's going to be impossible to make any progress because there's just not enough cohesion to the whole group. It's like a hydra. Too many heads, not focused on any one thing so they keep biting each other instead of attacking their prey."

 

This inherent conflict of the Gamergate "movement" is entirely relevant to any discussion of it, and if people using the label don't acknowledge that they are just as bad as the people who believe everyone involved with it are misogynists.

[Wulfgar Von Heltzer 42]

Pretty sure I started a Zoe Quinn thread between 2 and 3 months ago. Anyone remember when it was just her under the spotlight, I look back at those simpler days with nostalgia.

 

 

I saw that one the other day, I was gonna post there, but noticed that it hadn't gotten any more posts since september, so I figured this site wasn't interested in the topic. I wanted to make a thread that explains the issue to people, but couldn't be assed to go through the mountain of info to make a compilation. Then I found this video, which did the work for me

 

Anywho, there's a stream going on with KingofPol, a gamergate supporter who's been doing many many streams since this started, and has had other pro-gamergate folk and game devs on to discuss. Anti-gamergate, unsurprisingly, has avoided joining in, to my knowledge, except for one guy named Koz, who, even tho he SEEMED like he was getting it after the last stream he was in, seemingly went full-blown anti-gamergate again at some point. Don't know if he's regained some sense, but I doubt. Probably a lost cause, honestly.

 

 

Anyway, here's the stream:

 

http://www.hitbox.tv/kingofpol

 

He's currently taking a brief break tho.

 

While I acknowledge that there are many who use the "Gamergate" label as a flag for ethical journalism in gaming, this comment I found on the gaming site Polygon sums up my thoughts fairly well:

 

"The problem is that when an activist group is defined entirely by its amorphous, anonymous nature, it's impossible to hold it accountable for anything, because everyone's reasons for being part of it are different.

 

You see it in people's reaction to anti-GG people already – 'GamerGate isn't about THAT, it's about THIS!'. Everybody passes the buck constantly, and nobody is willing to admit that the ship is sinking.

 

As long as GamerGate – or its successor – is populated and piloted primarily by the anonymous masses of the internet within Reddit and the chans while additional hangers-on join via Twitter, it's going to be impossible to make any progress because there's just not enough cohesion to the whole group. It's like a hydra. Too many heads, not focused on any one thing so they keep biting each other instead of attacking their prey."

 

This inherent conflict of the Gamergate "movement" is entirely relevant to any discussion of it, and if people using the label don't acknowledge that they are just as bad as the people who believe everyone involved with it are misogynists.

 

How is the ship sinking? We're kicking their corrupt asses across the field, stripping their advertisers. The movement IS focused, overall, on ethical reform for video game journalism. There's nobody in full command giving out orders to the entire movement, but that's GOOD, if anything, because without leader's, we can't be co-opted.

 

Any doing things the way we are now, a multi-headed hydra, has proven successful thus far, so there's no reason to change tactics now.

[11th Doctor Whooves 794]

[member=Wulfgar Von Heltzer] : There's already a topic to discuss Gamergate, and so I'm locking this topic.

 

The original Gamergate topic can be found here: http://mlpforums.com/topic/109763-thoughts-on-gamergate/?hl=gamergate