Discord: Overrated?

[Hive King 1,998]

Does anyone else think that Discord is overrated? Not in terms of power(different ball game), but in terms of personality. I never liked him, and found it incredibly irritating how he became a recurring side character. 

 

He's unbelievably stupid, which is normally fine, but Discord's enormous holes in logic are so immense, it's hard to take him as a threat when he acts like an idiot half the time. Part of a good villain is making them threatening, at the very least within context. Discord acts more like a 4 year old with immense power, which would have been a cool idea, were it not for the fact that his malice is rather petty by comparison. Half of it doesn't even seem to be intentional. One could make an argument that they're trying to make him a force of nature, but the fact that he has to be reformed indicates this is not true. 

 

Another thing that rather annoys me is his type of humor. I'm sorry, but I just don't find it funny. It seems to be trying to emulate old cartoons like Bugs Bunny or Woody Woodpecker, but, much like Pinkie Pie, they don't take it far enough to be funny(which is understandable, focusing more on the story) and it just comes off as tossed in there so that someone goes "OMG, Discord is best pony for making Twilight Scepter, lol"

 

This is a bit of a rant, I admit, but seriously, what draws people to like him so much. I probably won't post in this thread too much, since all of this is rather opinionated, but yeah

[Jeric 46,834]

I was only 10 when Star Trek: The Next Gen appeared so there is a strong nostalgia factor with Discord's character. That bias makes it unlikely that I can offer a honest appraisal of the character's successful influence on the series, however just his appearance in Return of Harmony and impact on a mostly excellent story leads me to believe that the character itself should not be considered overrated. His presence was the first significant test of the Mane Six, not to mention we saw Celestia lose her cool. A great character is not just one in isolation, but it's essential that you evaluate how that character has influenced the other characters he or she interacts with. In Discord's case, there is little doubt in my mind that he was effective in impacting the Mane Six. 

 

His initial redemption arc almost fell flat, but Twilights Kindom changed a 'way to quick' redemption into a more realistic affair, adding both thematic elements and narrative substance to the character and other characters Discord interacts with. 

 

Discord takes after a long line of mythological and literary characters. Its fine if that doesn't suit your tastes, but I like the Loki types. 

[NavelColt 22,875]

There are bound to people who don't like him, but most people enjoy his personality because he's witty, funny, exuberant, unpredictable, and does visual gags and tricks that no other character in the show does, either from lacking the power to do so or from just not being the kind of character Discord is. He's charismatic The very definition of charisma is 'a compelling attractiveness or charm that can inspire devotion in others'.

[Fawkes The Phoenix 737]

His initial redemption arc almost fell flat, but Twilights Kindom changed a 'way to quick' redemption into a more realistic affair, adding both thematic elements and narrative substance to the character and other characters Discord interacts with. 

 

Discord takes after a long line of mythological and literary characters. Its fine if that doesn't suit your tastes, but I like the Loki types. 

 

I don't think it was a "way to quick" redemption because he didn't change so much, in later episodes he's still the same random Discord and he's still tempted to go back to the evil side, his reformation was a big process which started in Keep Calm And Flutter On and ended in Twilight's Kingdom..

Edited October 31, 2014 by Fawkes The Phoenix

[LightFlicker 91]

I guess people also like him a lot because of the suspence that is rising - who will he love? celestia or fluttershy? and just all these fanfiction and rumors are making him quite popular. but yea he is a great character who makes a lot of plot twists in the main story

Edited October 31, 2014 by LightFlicker

[Fawkes The Phoenix 737]

@@Darker used to say something similar about Discord.

[Misty Shadow 7,059]

To me, no. Right now, he's tied for my favorite character with Fluttershy. I like him as a villain devising plans to trick and manipulate others rather than using blunt force, and I love him as a side character bringing comic relief with imaginative visual gags. Ridiculous, silly humor is totally my thing so long as it's creative.

[Hive King 1,998]

That's a thing I forgot to mention, I never liked Star Trek and stopped watching after just one episode. I would assume a lot of Discord's fanbase comes from Q fans, which was indeed, the episode I saw. And I had the same feelings towards Q as I do to Discord

[A Black Circle 1,585]

Discord is the living embodiment of all chaos ever.

 

He is bound for awesomeness.

[Hive King 1,998]

Discord is the living embodiment of all chaos ever.

 

He is bound for awesomeness.

That's actually not true. 

 

Scootaloo suggests he's chaos, but apparently, he represents discord, not chaos

 

Chaos is a neutral force, it's change. Discord is fighting, hatred, lack of harmony between things, and is bad

[Venomous 18,813]

While Discord is a bit overrated, he is, in my opinion, one of the best villians in cartoon history.

[~ Dr. Ocsid ~ 690]

That's a thing I forgot to mention, I never liked Star Trek and stopped watching after just one episode. I would assume a lot of Discord's fanbase comes from Q fans, which was indeed, the episode I saw. And I had the same feelings towards Q as I do to Discord

The first episode is not the best Q episode - if you want to see some character-development in Q, watch "Deja Q". 

I, personally, came from Discord to Q, so it happens the other way round as well.

And...

Now I forgot what I wanted to say. Good Night.

[Coco before Pommel 678]

Short answer: what makes a character a good character, or a good villain, is really subjective: as your post shows, what some people find funny or scary others don't get at all. I'm a big Discord fan but I can definitely see why he wouldn't be everypony's cup of tea, and it sucks when fandom really latches onto a character you don't care for, so yeah, you have my sympathy for that.

 

But...

 

 

He's unbelievably stupid, which is normally fine, but Discord's enormous holes in logic are so immense, it's hard to take him as a threat when he acts like an idiot half the time. Part of a good villain is making them threatening, at the very least within context. Discord acts more like a 4 year old with immense power, which would have been a cool idea, were it not for the fact that his malice is rather petty by comparison. Half of it doesn't even seem to be intentional. One could make an argument that they're trying to make him a force of nature, but the fact that he has to be reformed indicates this is not true. 

I disagree on this point - I think Discord is actually very clever, or at least skilled at manipulating ponies (talking pre-reformation here) - of course he totally acts it/does stupid things, no logic is part of his shtick but I think also part of what's supposed to make him scary is that he's a mix of childishness and just playing around making ridiculous things happen, but he's also very calculating and manipulative - just look at the corruption scenes with the mane 6 in the maze. He definitely has a plan there - he knows exactly what to say to get to them, and you can see he takes real pleasure in tearing them apart and using their worst fears against them in the cruellest way possible (Pinkie's scene is the best example of this, I think, with the balloons and her friends' faces all laughing at her). For me, at least, that's enough to make him seem like a pretty big threat in the context of the show - of course we know he's not going to succeed, but at least for a while, he comes damn close to getting what he wants. I also think his lack of logic, the fact that he (seemingly) can't be reasoned with can also make him seem scarier, as with most childlike villains - again, all of this is subjective as to whether you enjoy that character type and/or find it scary. But I do think that at least Return of Harmony!Discord definitely shows a more clever/calculating side to how he separates the mane 6 - he doesn't seem to have any particular goals after that, other than just amusing himself, but again, that's how he is.

 

I guess you could maybe argue that post-S2 they dumbed him down a bit to make him seem more of a silly/harmless type of villain, to make it easier to reform him? *shrug* all I can say is, it works for me - I love the character development they've given him, and how he wasn't easily reformed straight away and there was always some ambiguity as to whether he could go bad again until Twilight's Kingdom. He still has a lot of the qualities that made him so entertaining (IMO, obviously not everyone's!), but we also see a more complex side to him from Keep Calm & Flutter On onwards - he realises, almost against his will, that he does want friendship, but he's still essentially selfish and using it for his own gains up until the finale when he really has that "oh shit" moment after Tirek betrays him - it takes being used and manipulated the exact same way he did to others to make him realise he actually does want friendship, and care about others (mostly Fluttershy ) apart from how they might be useful to him. For me, it's a pretty satisfying character arc.

 

But yeah...all the humour stuff makes sense, since that is like 95% of Discord's screentime it's pretty hard to get past if you don't like him. It's all just a matter of personal taste and kudos to you anyway for managing to state your opinion in a reasonable and non-bashing way which is a lot more than some fans manage~

[Jeric 46,834]

That's actually not true.

 

Scootaloo suggests he's chaos, but apparently, he represents discord, not chaos

 

Chaos is a neutral force, it's change. Discord is fighting, hatred, lack of harmony between things, and is bad

I always assumed he was based off of Discordia/Eris - The Roman/Greek Goddess of Chaos and Discord whose opposite was Harmonia.

[Hive King 1,998]

@@Coco before Pommel,

Silly villains are fine with me, but there has to be an element of seriousness to them. Not a huge amount, but still. For all my griping, Discord actually talks somewhat rationally, which clashes greatly with his actions. He straddles the line between Lex Luthor and Joker, and I personally think he doesn't work for either spectrum. If Discord had been all out insane, I think I might have liked him better, conversely, if he was a plotting mastermind that was all seriousness, I might have like him more

I always assumed he was based off of Discordia/Eris - The Roman/Greek Goddess of Chaos and Discord whose opposite was Harmonia.

There was an actual god named Kaos who was basically space before anything was created. And again, Eris was around the battle field a lot, she's discord, not chaos. 

[Jeric 46,834]

@@Coco before Pommel,

Silly villains are fine with me, but there has to be an element of seriousness to them. Not a huge amount, but still. For all my griping, Discord actually talks somewhat rationally, which clashes greatly with his actions. He straddles the line between Lex Luthor and Joker, and I personally think he doesn't work for either spectrum. If Discord had been all out insane, I think I might have liked him better, conversely, if he was a plotting mastermind that was all seriousness, I might have like him more

 

There was an actual god named Kaos who was basically space before anything was created. And again, Eris was around the battle field a lot, she's discord, not chaos.

I would love to hear about the exploits of the Greek god Kaos. Please link me.

 

Eris is recorded as Strife, Chaos, and Discord BTW.

[Hive King 1,998]

@,

http://www.theoi.com/Protogenos/Khaos.html

There's Khaos/Kaos/Chaos

 

And fair point with Eris, but Eris seemed more malicious, whereas Discord seemed more so like an enormous douche, not really a villain. Another one of my issues, incidentally 

[LordDiscord 289]

I believe you are expecting to much from a villain with his power in a show meant for children.  Discord was already proven to be the most powerful character in the show "pre-Tirek" with nothing holding him back other than the elements ( which Discord has shown that they have weaknesses) so with them gone, Discord would be nearly unstoppable. With that said, there has to be balance to his character, there has to be something about Discord that can be used to defeat him, if the elements were ever not a option at the time, and I believe making Discord childish, random and arrogant is that balance. If Discord was the kind of villain you want him to be, with the power he now has, then he would be unstoppable, and it would be nearly impossible to have him appear again without him being dumbed down afterwards; because however the Mane 6 would have defeated him, it would have been based on luck, heck defeating him in "Return of Harmony" was based on luck, because had he discorded, either Spike or Celestia, it would have been game-over. And that was with him acting the way he does now.

 

For Discord to be a serious threat to the ponies, much like "King Sombra" or "Queen Chrysalis" then the Mane 6 themselves would have to have a inherited power that makes them immune to Discords effects,(meaning they can't be discorded) and their way of defeating him would have to be something he could not take away from them (such as the Elements of Harmony). 

 

Just to make a point, lets look at the character "HIM" from the "Powerpuff Girls", much like Discord, him has the ability to literally do whatever he wants and can be vary cunning and sinister in his plans to destroy the girls, but notice how through out all of his appearances he can not directly effect the girls or take away their powers, he can set up plans that have the potential to defeat them, but he can't just snap away their powers like Discord can, and thus this makes it possible to have him be sinister and dangerous because as long as the girls makes it through one of is schemes, then they are going to defeat him. The way MLP is setup however, means that if Discord was anything like HIM, even if they defeated him the first time, does not mean they could defeat him a second time, without some plot-device pulled out of their flank to do so.

 

Also reforming Discord allows for character development which is actually something Discord has that HIM doesn't. 

Edited November 1, 2014 by LordDiscord

[Celli 4,332]

Not in my opinion. I don't he needs to be threatening, personally, and while his motives may have been vastly different from NMM, Chrysalis, Sombra, and Tirek, I don't think his motives were cliche'd like the others mentioned. He wanted eternal chaos. Basically he just wanted to have fun. He didn't want ultimate power, or subjects/followers to feed/take care of, or something else. While that may not be threatening, and you may think he's worse of a character for it, I find it makes him all the more interesting. And what makes him my favorite villain. (I mean,he's reformed now, but still). But that's just my opinion, and I don't expect everyone to think the same way.

[Hive King 1,998]

@@LordDiscord,

When a protagonist's victor is based on luck, it becomes pointless and merely serves to make the villain lose any crediblity, having their victims on the ropes and then losing despite a monstrous power edge.

 

Tirek wasn't beaten with luck, Chrysalis wasn't beaten with luck, Sombra wasn't beaten with luck, the Dazzlings weren't beaten with luck.

 

Nightmare Moon was defeated with luck and for this, she's another of my least favorite villains. Sunset Shimmer's defeat, while based on luck, also held irony, her own crown's power backfiring against her and returning to its true master. Discord's defeat is absolutely pointless because it involves so much PIS, that the victory feels foolish. Think Batman shooting Darkseid and Spider-Man beating Firelord

@@Celli,

I never said he was cliched, indeed, he's not. That's not one of his faults and it's what makes him better than NMM, the worst one 

[Celli 4,332]

@@LordDiscord,

When a protagonist's victor is based on luck, it becomes pointless and merely serves to make the villain lose any crediblity, having their victims on the ropes and then losing despite a monstrous power edge.

 

Tirek wasn't beaten with luck, Chrysalis wasn't beaten with luck, Sombra wasn't beaten with luck, the Dazzlings weren't beaten with luck.

 

Nightmare Moon was defeated with luck and for this, she's another of my least favorite villains. Sunset Shimmer's defeat, while based on luck, also held irony, her own crown's power backfiring against her and returning to its true master. Discord's defeat is absolutely pointless because it involves so much PIS, that the victory feels foolish. Think Batman shooting Darkseid and Spider-Man beating Firelord

@@Celli,

I never said he was cliched, indeed, he's not. That's not one of his faults and it's what makes him better than NMM, the worst one 

I know that, I'm just saying some people might  think he is.

[LordDiscord 289]

When you give a villain the ability to effect not only the hero's but the environment around him, most of the time luck has to be a factor unless the villain has a glaring flaw that the hero's can provoke. In Discords case, his ignorance and lighthearted demeanor is his flaw that can be exploited if all else fails. There has to be balance, you can't give the villain god like powers and then make him sinister unless the hero's are immune or can't be easily effected by the villains powers, which unfortunately for the Mane 6 they can be effected by Discords powers.   

[Conred 274]

People like him not because he is a villain. People like him because he is that new age Bugs Bunny mixed with a bad boy. His personality compared to other ponies outside mane6 is very complex. Most important factor is that he is Chaotic Neutral. He was never evil, as in loving to kill and destroy but he is not supporting toward good either. He is doing what is a benefit to him. Befriending Fluttershy because he like having friend but not being good enough to help someone out of his good will (that fact was tackled in comics). He is a loner mostly for himself, like to taunt others and will never be a "yes man" toward Twilight like her other friends. He is an egoistic, hedonistic cynic and because most humans act more like Discord than examples of virtues like mane6, he is also a fan favourite. Just like Luna. People often find pure good characters like Celestia to be simply boring. Discord is a best example of character that impress others with his "perfection" (godly powers, superintelligence, advanced charisma, sense of humor) but also flawed enough to be relatable and liked (not MR perfect scout like Superman)

[Hive King 1,998]

@@Conred,

I'm going to ignore the Superman comment since you are obviously going off of casual knowledge, but Discord was always Chaotic Evil. He acted like a prick for the sake of it, knew full well what he was doing, and took joy in screwing around with pony's minds. He's not neutral, he's clearly a villain 

[Conred 274]

@@Conred,

I'm going to ignore the Superman comment since you are obviously going off of casual knowledge, but Discord was always Chaotic Evil. He acted like a prick for the sake of it, knew full well what he was doing, and took joy in screwing around with pony's minds. He's not neutral, he's clearly a villain 

I doubt he knew what he was doing. He acted childish and because of that he was annoying. He realised that betrayal is bad AFTER he experienced it. Just like child understand that hurting little animals is bad when he get bitten. Evil creatures know what being good is and they are disgusted by it. Discord can freeze entire lake not because he is evil and want creatures to suffer in cold(evil stance), nor he wanted to freeze the lake to stop the flooding (good stance). He wanted to freeze a lake because of his own fun and lack or consideration for others feelings. Not because he despise them, is because he didnt understand them. We talking about same person who would enjoy seeing unknown ponies getting squeezed by black plants (Season 4 premiere) and at the same time going out of his way to help a pony he enjoy annoying (solving chest mystery for Twilight in Season 4 finale after he heard her song). Evil creature would never got a second chance from Celestia and thats why Tirek, Chrysalis or Sombra didnt get one. Celestia just understood his selfish yet lonely way of looking at world where he thought that everyone is by himself and strongest wins the race.

Its like saying that Mongols or Vikings were evil because pillaging other countries were their normal lifestyle and cultural norm. He represent Chaos and they represent Harmony. It was just an example of cultural difference and his attempt to winning it.