Why do people like Sunset Shimmer (at least now)?

[Dulset Tarn 441]

Well, she is more fleshed out than in the first film, even if not by much. We do see a gilmpse of her true nature and personality in several scenes in RR, including the kitchen scene between her and Twilight.

 

That scene on it's own makes her more fleshed out than the first film.

I could just as easily say we got to see her as a pony in the first film, so that makes her more fleshed out in the first one.

By which I mean that's wrong. It's still just one static unchanging "Oh I wish they would accept me" whiny uninteresting piece of crap writing. At least in the first film she had more than one emotion.

[Tilt 286]

I could just as easily say we got to see her as a pony in the first film, so that makes her more fleshed out in the first one.

By which I mean that's wrong. It's still just one static unchanging "Oh I wish they would accept me" whiny uninteresting piece of crap writing. At least in the first film she had more than one emotion.

Seeing her as a pony would not make her fleshed out, because we don't really learn anything about her character. Okay sure we learn that she is a pony from Equestria but that's it. The kitchen scene makes her learn that she shares quite a bit with Twilight and as such draws a parallel between the characters that would make you think about Sunset as a character, who she is not what she is. The parallel alone can maybe reveal some things in the series future. This is speculation but what if Celestia picked Twilight Sparkle because she reminded her of Sunset Shimmer. Trying to fix another mistake in a round about way, yes this is speculation and not fact but due to that moment I can actually speculate with who Sunset is. In the first one there's nothing to speculate it's "Sunset goes emo, invades high school, wants to capture Equestria because of reasons unbeknownst to the viewer"..

[Dulset Tarn 441]

Seeing her as a pony would not make her fleshed out, because we don't really learn anything about her character. Okay sure we learn that she is a pony from Equestria but that's it. The kitchen scene makes her learn that she shares quite a bit with Twilight and as such draws a parallel between the characters that would make you think about Sunset as a character, who she is not what she is. The parallel alone can maybe reveal some things in the series future. This is speculation but what if Celestia picked Twilight Sparkle because she reminded her of Sunset Shimmer. Trying to fix another mistake in a round about way, yes this is speculation and not fact but due to that moment I can actually speculate with who Sunset is. In the first one there's nothing to speculate it's "Sunset goes emo, invades high school, wants to capture Equestria because of reasons unbeknownst to the viewer"..

Hmmm, wait are you trying to say that she's expanded upon in the second movie? Because yeah that's obvious, but it doesn't make her more fleshed out.

[Tilt 286]

Hmmm, wait are you trying to say that she's expanded upon in the second movie? Because yeah that's obvious, but it doesn't make her more fleshed out.

Expanding a character does make them more fleshed out. Because it adds more to the character and you learn a bit more about them. Fleshing out a character involves finding out what makes them tick and what their personality is like, we see that a TON in RR and just because a character rarely changes Emotion doesn't make them weak.

[Dulset Tarn 441]

Expanding a character does make them more fleshed out. Because it adds more to the character and you learn a bit more about them. Fleshing out a character involves finding out what makes them tick and what their personality is like, we see that a TON in RR and just because a character rarely changes Emotion doesn't make them weak.

I think we're confused here. Taking a barely fleshed out character and expanding upon them in the sequel by adding just the tiniest little smidgen of character, well... It fleshes them out more than they were before, but at the same time it doesn't mean the sequel fleshed them out more than the prequel did. She was still even flatter in RR than before, especially since most of the character we got in the first movie disappeared completely. When the character only has one mode, one goal, one way of responding to everything, and that's the total extent of their character, then they are a weak as shit character.

[Tilt 286]

I think we're confused here. Taking a barely fleshed out character and expanding upon them in the sequel by adding just the tiniest little smidgen of character, well... It fleshes them out more than they were before, but at the same time it doesn't mean the sequel fleshed them out more than the prequel did. She was still even flatter in RR than before, especially since most of the character we got in the first movie disappeared completely. When the character only has one mode, one goal, one way of responding to everything, and that's the total extent of their character, then they are a weak as shit character.

Please watch the language, but I agree unfortunately by your logic every character in RR was weak because really they all had one goal and one way of responding to everything, Fluttershy with her songs, Rainbow Dash claiming it was her band, Rarity and her Costumes each of those situations were also met with the same response arguing/dismissive. The movie made me question why they were even friends if they were that much at each-others throats constantly. 

 

I'll just leave with this, I believe that in RR, Sunset is more developed as a character than the original movie and that both films she is pretty bland but you just said that it did flesh out her character, that would mean she was more fleshed out than the original film. 

[NotoriousSMALL 1,984]

Hmmm, wait are you trying to say that she's expanded upon in the second movie? Because yeah that's obvious, but it doesn't make her more fleshed out.

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT That's exactly what fleshed out means

 

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fleshed+out

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/flesh+out

http://www.merriam-webster.com/top-ten-lists/top-10-commonly-confused-words-vol-2/flush-out-flesh-out.html

 

three sources

[Dulset Tarn 441]

I'll just leave with this, I believe that in RR, Sunset is more developed as a character than the original movie and that both films she is pretty bland but you just said that it did flesh out her character, that would mean she was more fleshed out than the original film. 

I'd love to hear you actually give some reason why you think she's more fleshed out. You know, point to places where we learn more about her, see how she responds to different situations, anything at all that makes it so that her character needs more than just one sentence to describe in its entirety. And then compare that to the first movie.

[Tilt 286]

I'd love to hear you actually give some reason why you think she's more fleshed out. You know, point to places where we learn more about her, see how she responds to different situations, anything at all that makes it so that her character needs more than just one sentence to describe in its entirety. And then compare that to the first movie.

I did, kitchen scene, we learned about her parallels with Twilight or are you not paying attention?

[Dulset Tarn 441]

I did, kitchen scene, we learned about her parallels with Twilight or are you not paying attention?

Well that's one, and it only shows exactly what we already know about Sunset. The scene only serves to call to attention what we already know about both characters and, as you said, the parallels between them. But nothing in the scene actually reveals anything.

 

Meanwhile, I could offer maybe 5 scenes from the first movie that actually flesh her out. And she's still cardboard in that one.

[Tilt 286]

Well that's one, and it only shows exactly what we already know about Sunset. The scene only serves to call to attention what we already know about both characters and, as you said, the parallels between them. But nothing in the scene actually reveals anything.

 

Meanwhile, I could offer maybe 5 scenes from the first movie that actually flesh her out. And she's still cardboard in that one.

But the point stands that it fleshes her out, I'm not sure what more you want too be honest. It's a scene, it fleshed her out more meaning she is fleshed out more. I'm done here.

[NotoriousSMALL 1,984]

see how she responds to different situations

She offered to help twilight up when she returns, showing that she holds no grudge towards her.

She is often harassed by the constant reminders of what she did at the fall formal

She tries to stand up to the dazzlings, but they get the jump on her

She tries to stop rainbow dash from revealing their pony power or whatever by tackling her, causing a negative reaction from the group and she explained how she was only trying to help, and got angry when trixie accused her of being jealous

She stood by as her friends argued around her because she didn't think it was her place when she knew so little of friendship

She finally got the courage to stop her friends from arguing and patched up the group, and also turned the tide of the battle against the dazzlings

[jolliapplegirl 6]

Well, for one thing, she is a lot more interesting in this movie. She isn't just a stereotypical bully character out for popularity. she is a person who has seen the error of their ways and is trying desperately to make up for it. We see that she is honestly regretful of her past deeds and we can't help but root for her in her attempts to become a better person. Not only that, but we actually get to see that Sunset Shimmer HAS a personality. In the first movie, she was a cardboard cutout with a fairly simple reason for being there. In Rainbow Rocks, we see how nice and funny she can be when she isn't bogged down by what i can only assume is a a inferiority complex. When she and Twilight are talking, you can see how sad she is about her own past mistakes and how it weighs down on her now. How the way people distrust her, makes her more withdrawn, which i believe is why she doesn't say anything to the human heroines when they fight. Her opinions, throughout the movie, have been tossed aside by everyone. She probably felt scared to talk to friends she had just made about such inner circle (Can't think of a better word) issues.

 

Secondly, She is adorable!

[KatonRyu 1,026]

For me, in the first movie she was just a bland antagonist who didn't have much going for her. In the second one, she's trying to gain acceptance from both her new friends and the people she'd brainwashed in the first movie.

 

In RR, I see that she's having a hard time adjusting to her new lifestyle because she's never known friendship despite the fact the people offered it to her. She realizes she can't do everything by herself, but she doesn't quite know how to talk to her friends yet either. I think the struggle she faces with that is portrayed rather well. Everything she's experiencing, from the events themselves to the accompanying emotions, seems more or less as I'd expect.

 

One could say that because of that she's rather one-dimensional, but personally I feel that's mainly because Sunset is a rather extreme character. When she was evil, she thought she was above everyone else, including Celestia, but reformed she feels everything she does might be out of line. I attribute this to an overcompensation in regards to who she used to be and I think that given time she'll find her balance.

 

She still has a bit of bitterness inside her as evidenced by the line "It must be nice always having people come to you to solve their problems instead of waiting for you to cause one", the delivery of which began with a rather forced lightheartedness but ended with a definite, bitter undertone.

 

Of course, all of these things are simply things I see and they're nothing more than my opinion. I've read the whole debate between Dulset and Tilt and I think both have valid points. It all depends on your point of view.

[Dulset Tarn 441]

Same reason why people loved Luna in season 1. No seriously it's exactly the same.

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,151]

Same reason why people loved Luna in season 1. No seriously it's exactly the same.

 

Eh, I wouldn't say that. I was never much a fan of season 1 Luna, whereas Shimmer's in my top five at this point.

[Henny Penny Benny 936]

Personally, I love her because even when she started off as a villain, she wasn't really evil, but she was deeply broken inside and had never learned that friendship was actually important. But then she saw how powerful friendship was, and how important it is in and of itself, and she genuinely recognized how wrong she had been.

 

In short, because she had a great turnaround.

[Lordav 3,426]

Eh, I wouldn't say that. I was never much a fan of season 1 Luna, whereas Shimmer's in my top five at this point.

Huzzah... Hoist the Flag Brother!

 

Personally, I love her because even when she started off as a villain, she wasn't really evil, but she was deeply broken inside and had never learned that friendship was actually important. But then she saw how powerful friendship was, and how important it is in and of itself, and she genuinely recognized how wrong she had been.

 

In short, because she had a great turnaround.

That there is just a perfect explanation why

 

 

Sunny > Luna

 

(for me at least)

 

[Sazama Ichida 2,352]

Before Rainbow Rocks she didn't have very many fans. But after Rainbow Rocks I can easily see why people like her. I was always a fan of her even before she reformed.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Asbel Lhant

[Lordav 3,426]

Before Rainbow Rocks she didn't have very many fans. But after Rainbow Rocks I can easily see why people like her. I was always a fans of her even before she reformed.

Evil Sunny

 

Well she was pretty cute anyway... BUt honestly.... i mean reformed... how...can u say no?

[Stardust Balance 7,716]

Boring and cliche "villain" in the first movie. Most (if not only) developed character than the rest in the second.