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Yes. In It's About Time Twilight travels back in time by about a week, but she's only there for around one minute before being returned to her "native" time.

Oh right, I totally forgot about this episode (maybe because I don't like it), thanks. :)
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Unicorn magic. Hmm. I wonder how much magic the average unicorn knows. Pumpkin cake can teleport, walk through solid objects, break locks, and lift herself across the room, but Sweetie Bell can't lif

In Boast Busters Twilight states that most unicorns can only do a small number of spells, which directly relate to their special talent.   Sweetie Belle's problems notwithstanding, levitation seems

I know I'm gonna get a lot of hate for this but, I absolutely HATE the way the writers handled the way magic is portrayed! Hell, even flight for Pegasi. It's almost as if the creators are handicapping

Interesting list, but it will never be finished; too many edge cases. :) Sounds good anyway.

 

I know you're talking about Unicorns, but you could classify Pegesis and Earth Ponies with a sliding scale too. Rainbow is clearly far out on the flight envelope and Applejack is likely a superior farmer.

Edited by Nature's Spell
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Interesting list, but it will never be finished; too many edge cases. :) Sounds good anyway.

 

I know you're talking about Unicorns, but you could classify Pegesis and Earth Ponies with a sliding scale too. Rainbow is clearly far out on the flight envelope and Applejack is likely a superior farmer.

I don't think those particular cases have to do with magic though. More like physical strength and willpower and such.

 

 

But anyways, dies anyone have any thoughts regarding levels 4-6? That's where I've been having the most trouble.

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I don't think those particular cases have to do with magic though. More like physical strength and willpower and such.

 

 

But anyways, dies anyone have any thoughts regarding levels 4-6? That's where I've been having the most trouble.

It was proven in Twilight's Kingdom that pegasis fight and Earth Pony strength is all magic. Not to take anything away from your scheme.

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It was proven in Twilight's Kingdom that pegasis fight and Earth Pony strength is all magic. Not to take anything away from your scheme.

I know, but it can't really be put into level form since they don't have specific things they can learn...You just get stronger or generally "better" at what you do, whether it be flying or farming. Active (unicorn) magic is very different from passive magic, and is much more complex, hence the need for a level system.

 

Btw, I think the Earth Pony's abilities to farm is where their magic is, not their physical strength. That physicality just comes from the fact that they can't use magic or wings to cut corners in their work. Also, Tirek's power drained EVERYONE's physical strength, not just Earth ponies. :)

Although I may be mistaken. That was the impression I got from Hearth's Warming Eve.

Edited by AmberDust
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  • 3 weeks later...

Level 2:

-Rarity is really basic as far as unicorns go, and she can change the weather. Trixie summoned a storm cloud as well. I think any base unicorn can do so with enough training; doing it well is an entirely different issue.

 

Level 3:

-I think hatching a dragon egg is in the correct level. My guess is that Twilight knew the spell, but was right below the power requirement necessary to hatch, then the Sonic Rainboom shot her power level up and changed it from a hatchling to a full grown dragon. I don't think its outside the range of student's capabilities. Unless... was that an age spell? The spell did cause him to age rapidly, which is probably required for hatching dragon eggs in the first place. Is that why Celestia was so interested? Hmm...

 

Level 4:

-I think gravity alteration should be pulled down to level 4. The way Twilight talked about it, it seems like another one of those things that any unicorn in magic school should be able to use.

 

-charms, cloud walking, transfiguration and butterfly wings should be all level 4. Like gravity alteration, it seems like any student worth their salt in Celestia's school should know or be able to use these spells.

 

Level 7:

-I don't think i've ever seen anyone summon objects from thin air, outside of Inspiration Manifestation via dark magic. I'm not sure...

 

Extras:

 

-I think dark magic is too non-specific to place here. Especially since dark magic varies in scope(think alicorn amulet vs IM), mimics  and normal magical effects, and tends to come with ludicrous power boosts, it's too difficult to define. The best you could do is label instances of dark magic.

 

-I don't think we've seen "healing" magic, specifically, which is odd. It seems like something that should be taught to basic students on level 4... but we've never seen it being used, even when it would benefit somepony. Maybe there's some drawbacks to it? Maybe only medically related unicorns can use it? 

 

More suggestions coming later.

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@

I don't think the spell Twilight used to hatch Spike was an aging spell--they would have been WAY to difficult for an entrance exam...I think.

When I say dark magic, I'm mostly refering to what Sombra did to the Crystal Empire, or that one spell Celestia did as an example to Twilight.

I think Twilight has summoned things out of thin air before. :/ I know Trixie has, with the aid of the amulet.

As for healing magic, I just assume it'd be pretty difficult. I imagine of comes easier to ponies with healing-based cutie marks.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Honestly, I'm one of those people who hardly abides to the rules of the show (That Goes For Any Show, Really). If I want my Unicorns to have all the power in the world just from practicing and studying a few books, then gosh darn it, I'm gonna have my Unicorns to have all the power in the world just from practicing and studying a few books! Same goes with Earth Ponies having natural born super strength and super speed on land, and all Pegasi having the potential to create Sonic Booms!

 

I love the show, but like every other show, I just don't like some of their rules. That's why I Lucid Dream and write Fanfics.

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The Baby Unicorns have magical surges that can be stronger than the magic they have when they are fillies, so it explains why Sweetie Belle has weaker magic than Pumpkin Cake.

 

Also, you forgot level 100,000. The Elements of Harmony and Tree of Harmony.

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The Baby Unicorns have magical surges that can be stronger than the magic they have when they are fillies, so it explains why Sweetie Belle has weaker magic than Pumpkin Cake.

 

Also, you forgot level 100,000. The Elements of Harmony and Tree of Harmony.

I think I actually mentioned the elements and such. :o didn't I?
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This seems fairly plausible and very well thought out. I greatly approve. As for theories.

 

-I think Pound and Pumpkin are either that way because Rarity said their magic can be surprising at that age and will fade as they age, or . . . I don't know they're prodigies.

 

-Discord wouldn't even be on the scale. His magic isn't like unicorn magic. Unicorn magic is tied to the special talent of the unicorn in question, Discord's magic is entropy and chaos. It would be "off the scale" not because he's particularly powerful, but because his very nature makes that power indefinable.

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I don't think the spell Twilight used to hatch Spike was an aging spell--they would have been WAY to difficult for an entrance exam...I think.

Unless you subscribe to the whole "humility" exercise idea, but that's too much headcanon. I personally think its fine where it is, though.

 

I think Twilight has summoned things out of thin air before. :/ I know Trixie has, with the aid of the amulet.

I do believe in Magic Duel, Twilight summoned a parasprite, then got rid of it afterward. That's all that's coming to me, though.

 

As for healing magic, I just assume it'd be pretty difficult. I imagine of comes easier to ponies with healing-based cutie marks.

Considering that ponies rarely ever get sick, and heal by themselves at a ridiculous rate, i'd guess that'd at least explain why we've never seen nurse ponies use healing magic. It's entirely possible its just a special class all by itself.

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I think I actually mentioned the elements and such. :o didn't I?

I don't remember seeing it.

 

Oh, you did. I'm sorry. But the Elements of Harmony are far beyond a level 10.

Edited by Mountaineer28
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Unicorn magic. Hmm.

 

I wonder how much magic the average unicorn knows. Pumpkin cake can teleport, walk through solid objects, break locks, and lift herself across the room, but Sweetie Bell can't lift a broom. Twilight Sparkle could teleport relatively early in the series (unless I'm mistaken), and Trixie can pull off party tricks like manipulating ponies and things. Other unicorns in the series aren't seen doing much more than basic levitation and Rarity has that sort of gem x-ray vision, but is that all they can do? Or do they just not use magic often because they don't feel the need? Do they learn any magic in school?

Does magic require a sort of magical potency within a creature, or do spells just need to be studied and learnt?

 

I want to try and figure out what is considered and average amount of magic. What spells are basic, other than levitation, and what spells are reserved for the magically talented. A level system is what I'm after, (ranging from 0-10,) and I feel like this knowledge would be very helpful for a lot of writers out there. So, lets start with basics.

 

Level 0. Every unicorn learns this, hooves down. Consider it a freebie:

Levitation (becomes more difficult with heavier/larger objects. Also, precision increases with level.)

 

Level 1. Nearly every unicorn learns these as they grow up:

•Breaking things or manipulating them with some precision

•Special talent (cutie mark talent. Could be more advanced for some)

•Lumos!

 

Level 2. Every unicorn should be capable of learning these, but won't necessarily use or be good at them. In school, think of it as a B-plus:

•animating objects to move on their own (see "art of the dress")

•weather manipulation (should this be higher level?)

prestidigitation minor tricks (light shows, changing colours, etc. Trixie uses a slightly more advanced version of this.)

 

Level 3. Slightly advanced. This is your entrance exam to Celestia's kindergarten, but adult unicorns should be able to pull these off easily with enough practice:

•hatching a dragon egg (thoughts?)

•Energy beam (weak, strengthens with each level)

•minor charms

 

Level 4. In my mind, this is where Twilight's power was at the beginning of the series. Maybe a little higher would be better, actually. So for levitation power, think of the Ursa Minor and the water tower. ...Anyways:

•Being able to somewhat control living creatures (make them float or stop moving momentarily)

•teleportation (minor. The farther you want to go, the more difficult it is)

•more advanced charms (want it need it)

 

Level 5. This is some impressive magic! Only those who dedicate themselves to magic should know these:

•Sturdy force fields/bubbles (more power=larger, sturdier)

 

Level 6. On second thought, maybe Twilight should start here instead. Level 5 and 6 spells are hard to place...think Twilight season 1 vs. Twilght season 2? Any thoughts?

•Time travel (limited)

•Reverse gravity (specific to a few small objects)

 

Level 7. Advanced, but not yet Alicorn-tier. This is where the Alicorn amulet might place you-- in addition to the corruption, of course:

•Summoning inanimate objects from thin air

•controlling the actions of ponies

•memory charm

 

Level 8. Sombra and Starswirl would go here. Unicorns who studied a lot of magic and are very powerful, but didn't have the right heart to advance to Alicorn tier. This is still about the same amount of power an "ascended Alicorn" might have:

•Age-altering spells

•Gender-altering spells

•Advanced dark magic

•Creating new magic

•Switching cutie marks (I feel like this should be level 7 instead)

 

Level 9: Celestia/Luna levels of power. Likely reserved for natural-born Alicorns. Twilight and Cadence are not this strong.

•Raising the moon/sun

•Teleporting to magical planes. (Think of Twilight's weird "princess memory zone")

•Entering ponies' dreams

•Cadence+Shining's love spell. Only successful because it was a combined effort.

•Transferring your power to someone else.

 

Level 10: Discord/Tirek level, as well as magical artefacts like the crystal heart and the elements of Harmony. No unicorn will ever reach this level.

•making/manipulating anything with ease and precision

•brainwashing

•travelling through/turning into an inanimate object

(Basically omnipotence and possibly omnipresence)

•Stealing magic

 

Unplaced:

Walking through walls (seemed simple enough)

Charms (want it, need it). (Estimated level 2-3)

Transfiguration (frog to orange, pony to Breezie, etc. probably medium/low level)

Magic beams (could probably vary in level. I imagine every unicorn could do them, to some extent)

Dark magic (is it high level, or just forbidden? Maybe both.)

Working Butterfly wings--(estimated level 3)

Cloud walking--(estimated level 3-4)

Healing

 

So, any thoughts? Do you want to add spells to the list, or help organize some? Do you have any theories regarding spell potency? Were you thinking of giving your OC a certain spell, but you want to know what level it is first?

What level is Twilight at currently?

What about Trixie?

How many levels does the Alicorn amulet bump you up by?

On a scale of zero to ten, is Discord level twelve?

Please leave your theories and suggestions below!

And big thanks to for all of your suggestions. :D

Its a good question baby cakes through us all off. I think your levelling is very believable though good job on that :)

True, but most ponies get their cutie mark when they're young, and if their talent is related to a spell, it's kind of a freebie. Think of Rarity. Her spell activated without her even noticing, nevermind trying. I put in it "level 1" because its something you learn early on, even if you don't master it right away.

 

With regards to how many spells a unicorn can learn, I feel like you're thinking too much in terms of D&D. (Spells per day and an arcane pool that can "run out".)

I feel like any pony who's interested enough in magic can learn any spell they want, so long as they put time and effort into it. The higher level a spell is, the more difficult it is to perform/control. That's the idea I had in mind.

I think limiting the number of spells a unicorn can use is silly. Sure, they can only memorize a few, but they should be able to use any spell within their range of power if they get a hold on the instructions.

 

I feel like magic should be treated like any other skill. The more you use it, the easier it becomes to perform and memorize. Some require strength and concentration, like acrobatics, and some require muscle memory, like cat's cradle! :P

It figures the more you practice at a skill the better you get at it : but it seems just to make things easier in most cases like Rarity's levitation it would be much harder to create clothes with just hooves.

Baby Cakes was just a freaking bitch to continunity, I don't take any of that episode into consideration, they just made the babies use magic just for plot convenience.

Agreed it was a really bad call on the writer's part.

Edited by SiriusDusk
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I don't really take Pumpkin Cake's abilities that seriously, since they conflict with continuity since ponies such as Sweetiebelle are still learning the most basic of magic. I lump that in with Pound Cake's flying ability, since Scootaloo's still learning how to fly. As comic relief characters, I can accept that they would show exceptional talent in areas where older ponies are struggling, but I treat them as exceptions to the rule.

 

Otherwise, I think that's a great list. I would say that transfiguration is level 5 magic since Twilight was working on mastering it early on in the series as part of her studies, but it's doubtful that changing fruit to different fruit is remotely advanced as far as transfiguration spells go. I would assume that different types of spells are their own discipline within the larger field of magic and there are beginner spells and advanced spells within those fields, and everything in between.

 

I actually picture the discipline of magic as Harry Potter-esque. I believe all unicorns have the capacity to be capable magic users and all of them seem to have a basic understanding of levitation. However, I also believe some are more talented at magic than others and because the discipline is fairly academic there is a great deal of dedication involved to becoming the best of the best even for those who have a strong aptitude for it.

 

It does seem like most unicorns aren't that dedicated to it, but why should they be? It's a talent that is unique to unicorns, but it's only one of many options available to them, and they can find their calling elsewhere, just like there are pegasi like Fluttershy who aren't that into the art of flying and earth ponies like Pinkie Pie who aren't all about growing things. A unicorn like Rarity doesn't need to be the best magician because she's a seamstress and fashion designer, so it makes sense for her to learn spells in the levitation field that make her life easier, but it's doubtful that she would need to go much beyond that, and that doesn't make her any less of a unicorn.

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  • 1 month later...

I know I'm gonna get a lot of hate for this but, I absolutely HATE the way the writers handled the way magic is portrayed! Hell, even flight for Pegasi. It's almost as if the creators are handicapping ponies who aren't lucky enough to be part of the Mane 6 and have all the extra abilities. If you're a Unicorn and you have the ability to perform magic, you should have the ability and the potential to perform any kind of magic you desire if you study and train hard, like Twilight. But, you're telling me that since their Cutie Mark literally dictates their life, they can't become a strong magic user?

 

Bull... Shit!

 

If you have the ability to perform magic you should, like most other people would think, have the ability to augment and expand your arsenal of magical abilities. If you can't do that, what exactly is the point of being a unicorn?

 

The same goes with the Pegasi. Even though Rainbow Dash's Cutie Mark represents speed (I Think) why does it seem that she's the only one that can actually fly fast and create sonic booms? One would think that other Pegasi could do this same thing if they train enough, but the writers seem to be hell bent on handicapping every pony who isn't a part of the Mane 6, as I said earlier.

 

I really REALLY hate the a lot of the concept that gravitates around Cutie Marks. Just because your special talent is a certain thing DOESN'T MEAN YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING ELSE!!! 

 

Just take Rarity for example!

 

Ya see, this is why I usually don't like Cannon when it comes to things like this. It's stupid. A Cutie Mark shouldn't dictate a pony's life and effectively put limits on it. They should be able to practice, study, and execute whatever maneuvers they damn well please.

 

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm gonna go eat some Shrooms.

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Well every generation has its genius and the mane 6 are exactly that-the best at what they do. We know for a fact that Equestrian history is full of magically gifted Unicorns, but Twilight is a once in a generation genius. The Einstein of Magic. I could love and study physics my whole life and never become Albert Enstien because working hard is never enough.

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Ya see, this is why I usually don't like Cannon when it comes to things like this. It's stupid. A Cutie Mark shouldn't dictate a pony's life and effectively put limits on it. They should be able to practice, study, and execute whatever maneuvers they damn well please.

 

Handicapping? I have a feeling you mean the opposite, right? Like, they're under-compensated ability-wise?

 

I understand where you're coming from, and I agree that a cutie mark shouldn't limit your talents, but I don't quite agree with this statement...simply because, well...it isn't the case. (and it isn't what we're talking about here.:P)

This limitation of power ISN'T canon, and ponies AREN'T canonically limited by their cutie marks. If everyone except the mane six was weak/unspecial as could be, we wouldn't have the Wonderbolts, Trixie, Sunset Shimmer, or any of the other "rival" characters.

Aaanyways...

The purpose of this list is to try and estimate some sort of level system as close to canon as possible.

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Well every generation has its genius and the mane 6 are exactly that-the best at what they do. We know for a fact that Equestrian history is full of magically gifted Unicorns, but Twilight is a once in a generation genius. The Einstein of Magic. I could love and study physics my whole life and never become Albert Enstien because working hard is never enough.

If you study a certain thing, like physics for example, your whole life and have a passion for it (Technically, Even If You Don't Have A Passion For It) of course you'll become as smart as Albert Einstein. Hell, you might even Surpass him. There is almost no limit to the human, or in this case pony, brain and body. It's you who set your own limits, so it's up to you to surpass them.

Edited by Psycho Warp
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In the beginning of Baby Cakes, it is pointed out that baby unicorns get magical surges that come and go. Why do people keep forgetting that?! That's why Pumpkin Cake could do all that later in the episode. I really don't like it when people don't pay attention to exposition.

Edited by WiiGuy2014
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Just adding an aside from the season 5 premier

 

Based on her cutie mark, Starlight Glimmer's special talent is her cutie mark stealing spell. But as she states, she spent years studying it, implying that she didn't create it or just suddenly learn it like Rarity did with the gem-finding spell. This leads me to believe that she may have began studying the spell before she got her cutie mark and recived her cutie mark upon mastering it or at least using it sucessfully at least once.

 

Edited by GrifCannon
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If you study a certain thing, like physics for example, your whole life and have a passion for it (Technically, Even If You Don't Have A Passion For It) of course you'll become as smart as Albert Einstein. Hell, you might even Surpass him. There is almost no limit to the human, or in this case pony, brain and body. It's you who set your own limits, so it's up to you to surpass them.

Someone may surpass him, but not everybody will. There are always limits: time, money, ability, luck, mental focus, etc. I still don't see what the writers did wrong.

Edited by Nature's Spell
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Twilight is probably an 8 or an 8 and a half. As she wasn't born with the duties to control the sun and stars, she doesn't know the spell for it. However, what makes her especially dangerous is the fact that she made new magic and that she has whipped up spells on the fly for certain situations. Even without her Alicorn magic, twilight was able to crush Tirek like a bug once she recognized the magic of friendship that burns inside of her. So I'd guess that magic comes from their personality and their willpower, Twilight being an Ironclad wall of discipline and love, whereas Trixie Lulamoon is full of deceit and trickery, and Rarity is actually really rather flighty. We have never seen Rarity attempt to study/learn magic, so we don't know where she lies on the power train. You forgot level 11 on the magic scale, and that's Pinkie Pie. Pinkie has done the impossible time and time again. such as being faster than Rainbow Dash, walking on the roof, and what not. 

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