Discord is the real Mary Sue

[cider float 2,535]

Yeah I know I'm going to get hate for this. But I feel that Discord should of just been left as stone or be depowered somehow. Like after Tirek took Discord's powers Discord did get them back but his powers are reduced significantly something like that.

 

I like his change of heart and how Fluttershy inspires him. His characterization is awesome I just don't like his overly Mary Sue nature. I mean Twilight isn't even that powerful despite what people think but Discord can do practically anything when the writers feel it's convenient to give him. Of course without his 4th wall powers he won't be able to do his comedic acts but honestly Pinkie Pie does just fine with the same level of wackiness. Discord is just Pinkie Pie but given way too much power.

 

I mean if Discord had merely unicorn level magic that would of been fine, he can still do his weird comedic antics with unicorn magic.

 

 

Prepped and ready for the flames.

[Little Red 1,529]

Eh. I feel like they're doing a lot of things right with his character-- I still find him very funny-- but yeah, he has become kinda a bit of a goody-two-shoes, if that's what you mean.

If you just mean he's super powerful and "perfect"... well... uh... yeah, I suppose you're kinda right. But he's still really funny to me.

[Blue Moon 6,336]

Nah, Mary Sue is a term that means the character is so perfect that they are boring and can't create a good conflict for the plot. Having a lot of power can be found in Mary Sue-type characters, but it's not a trait that automatically deems a creation a "Mary Sue."

 

Discord is not like that, so I don't consider him a Mary Sue. If anything, his powers have helped in creating interesting conflicts in his episodes. Also, he's the spirit of chaos and disharmony, so it would not make sense for his character to have average powers. As long as Discord isn't just whisking away conflicts with ease, I think he's fine with the power he has now.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Blue Moon

[Megas 27,052]

So are we just gonna start calling everyone a Mary Sue now?

[Antidaeophobia 299]

I consider Celestia as more of a mary-sue by far. She's perfect, everyone loves her, and the characters that don't love her are looked at as villains, or fools. She rarely gets angry, and she's just so sugary nice and wise, and besides the occasional joke, she really doesn't have a very distinct personality. At least Discord isn't loved by all, and he messes up quite often. He is pretty much a god too, so god creatures are always going to come off as being to powerful for their own good. But he has a great deal of dynamic and potential. Unlike Celestia, who really hasn't shown any growth since season 1. 
People use to say Q from Star Trek was a mary-sue, but people tend to think that when a character is super powerful, but Discord really doesn't fit the list needed for a mary-sue.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CommonMarySueTraits

So are we just gonna start calling everyone a Mary Sue now?

Thank You! I hate people that just throw that term out for anything they don't like. 

[Moonlight 7,279]

The term Mary Sue gets thrown around so much that it might as well just mean developed character.

[Moved to Elsewhere 11,328]

Okay, with all these threads lately, we might as well just go around calling everyone a Mary Sue. 

 

Well we're at it, lets just call Diamond Tiara a Mary Sue because of one out of context thing that happened for 2 seconds. 

[Blue Moon 6,336]

 

 

I consider Celestia as more of a mary-sue by far. She's perfect, everyone loves her, and the characters that don't love her are looked at as villains, or fools. She rarely gets angry, and she's just so sugary nice and wise, and besides the occasional joke, she really doesn't have a very distinct personality.

 

I wouldn't really go as far as saying everyone loves her; the only one who really adores her is Twlight, and she's basically a second mother to her. Everyone else mainly just respects her for the most part, and for good reason. The show rarely spends its time showcasing its characters going on about how great and wonderful Princess Celestia, and when it does; it is brief and it's usually Twilight doing it, which as said earlier; makes sense.

 

She's one of the rulers of Equestria, so it'd make sense that she'd want to keep up a good image. Also, she doesn't really have a whole lot of screentime, so it's hard to see her personality in full. She does have one though and does have moments of real emotion, and if she were given more screentime, It'd be easier to see. However, since she doesn't, it's not expected for her to have a more complex personality than she has now.

 

Oh, and she's not perfect; she's made plenty of dumb decisions and she lost in her fight with Chrysalis, and she didn't trust Twilight in the the second season season finale when she was trying to tell them what was going on with Chrysalis. So yeah, I don't think she's a Mary Sue either.

[cider float 2,535]

Nah, Mary Sue is a term that means the character is so perfect that they are boring and can't create a good conflict for the plot. Having a lot of power can be found in Mary Sue-type characters, but it's not a trait that automatically deems a creation a "Mary Sue."

 

Discord is not like that, so I don't consider him a Mary Sue. If anything, his powers have helped in creating interesting conflicts in his episodes. Also, he's the spirit of chaos and disharmony, so it would not make sense for his character to have average powers. As long as Discord isn't just whisking away conflicts with ease, I think he's fine with the power he has now.

I don't see why him having average powers would not make sense. Discord the character has been shown to be a bit too powerful. At any moment he could have taken Tirek out but Tirek used smooth talking and cunning to deceive him. If it wasn't for that Discord would have "Superman" Tirek flat out. Heck I would say even Superman doesn't stand a chance against Discord. The only things that stand in Discord's way is social and emotional handling.

 

And just like how people here seem to like characters to develop and mature, that would mean Discord would also develop and would no longer be restrained by social and emotional handling meaning he could just go up and snap his fingers and every MLP villain gone in a flash. Boring.

 

As for Celestia she's not powerful. She can't move the sun and moon as she pleases they still move in their respective paths and she hasn't shown any other power except for shooting lasers from her horns just like any other unicorn and flying like a pegasus. She has a lot of limitations compared to Discord.

 

 

If Discord's social skills developed this would of been the entire episode.... Discord snap his fingers and Tirek is back in Tartarus. A total of 2 minutes and 15 seconds of an episode. Excellent we all like short episodes right?

Edited May 27, 2015 by cidershield

[Antidaeophobia 299]

I don't see why him having average powers would not make sense. Discord the character has been shown to be a bit too powerful. At any moment he could have taken Tirek out but Tirek used smooth talking and cunning to deceive him. If it wasn't for that Discord would have "Superman" Tirek flat out. Heck I would say even Superman doesn't stand a chance against Discord. The only things that stand in Discord's way is social and emotional handling.

 

And just like how people here seem to like characters to develop and mature, that would mean Discord would also develop and would no longer be restrained by social and emotional handling meaning he could just go up and snap his fingers and every MLP villain gone in a flash. Boring.

Because he's not mean't to be weak, he's meant to represent a real threat to everyone. Even after being reformed, he still is a threat, and they still don't trust him. He wouldn't be a proper threat if he was weak.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Antidaeophobia

[Blue Moon 6,336]

I don't see why him having average powers would not make sense. Discord the character has been shown to be a bit too powerful. At any moment he could have taken Tirek out but Tirek used smooth talking and cunning to deceive him. If it wasn't for that Discord would have "Superman" Tirek flat out. Heck I would say even Superman doesn't stand a chance against Discord. The only things that stand in Discord's way is social and emotional handling.

 

And just like how people here seem to like characters to develop and mature, that would mean Discord would also develop and would no longer be restrained by social and emotional handling meaning he could just go up and snap his fingers and every MLP villain gone in a flash. Boring.

Yes, he could have done those things, but his personality got in the way of him fully utilizing his powers. This is what makes him an interesting and complex character. It also gives him room to develop, which he has been doing since his reformation.

 

Characters don't need to be restrained by physical factors to be good characters. Emotional factors can be much more interesting when it comes to giving a characters flaws and restrictions. Discord has shown no problem with character development, even with his powers, and since he's never just whooshed away a villain, I don't see a problem. In fact, Tirek was more powerful than Discord in the season four finale once he had obtained more power, so no; Discord can't just get rid of any villain in a flash.

[cider float 2,535]

Because he's not mean't to be weak, he's meant to represent a real threat to everyone. Even after being reform, he still is a threat, and they still don't trust him. He wouldn't be a proper threat if he was weak.

But just like how all the other ponies changed he will develop and become more stable eventually. He won't be deluded by any smooth talking from Tirek or be lured into any evil schemes anymore.

 

 

 

Yes, he could have done those things, but his personality got in the way of him fully utilizing his powers. This is what makes him an interesting and complex character. It also gives him room to develop, which he has been doing since his reformation.

 

Characters don't need to be restrained by physical factors to be good characters. Emotional factors can be much more interesting when it comes to giving a characters flaws and restrictions. Discord has shown no problem with character development, even with his powers, and since he's never just whooshed away a villain, I don't see a problem. In fact, Tirek was more powerful than Discord in the season four finale once he had obtained more power, so no; Discord can't just get rid of any villain in a flash.

 

That can be debated. If you remember Discord wanted a friend. When Tirek offered his friendship and even gave him a present (that amulet), Discord was too distracted by his emotions and the shock of being betrayed to even raise his fingers to snap Tirek out of existence or send him to another dimension.

 

After that ordeal Tirek won't be tricked by the same lies... because you know characters in this series develop as others say. They don't fall under their weaknesses again.

Edited May 27, 2015 by cidershield

[BastementSparkle 20,310]

A character being very powerful doesn't automatically make them a Mary Sue. Discord still got manipulated by Tirek, still got sick from that worm in that one episode, still got overly jealous of Tree Hugger. He's incredibly powerful magically, but he still has plenty of personality faults and weaknesses.

 

 We don't need to strip him of most of his magic, part of what makes him fun is all the insane stuff he can do with his reality bending powers.

[cider float 2,535]

A character being very powerful doesn't automatically make them a Mary Sue. Discord still got manipulated by Tirek, still got sick from that worm in that one episode, still got overly jealous of Tree Hugger. He's incredibly powerful magically, but he still has plenty of personality faults and weaknesses.

 

 We don't need to strip him of most of his magic, part of what makes him fun is all the insane stuff he can do with his reality bending powers.

Well from my previous posts I was just talking about how Discord wouldn't fall under the same mistakes again because "character development."

[Antidaeophobia 299]

But just like how all the other ponies changed he will develop and become more stable eventually. He won't be deluded by any smooth talking from Tirek or be lured into any evil schemes anymore.

No, but he might decide one day, and convince himself that taking over Equestria might be for the good of his friends. Just like he convinced himself that sending Trehugger to another reality was alright, and Fluttershy would be ok with that, and things would return to normal and help his friendship with her. Discord is really emotionally stunted, and immature. He's never thought of anyone but himself, but when he does think of other people besides himself, it's still in a selfish context. I don't see him betraying the mane 6 by being talked into it like with Tirek, but I do think he might decide he could do a better job keeping Equestria safe, or even doing something stupid that might plunge Equestria into war. He has room to develope and still surprise everyone. Just because he's nicer now doesn't mean he's not still a selfish dickhead, and doesn't mean he doesn't have room to improve and grow. Being physically stunted by lowering his magic isn't going to develope or improve his character. Besides, seeing a truly strong character, capable of wiping out his enemies (which Discord can't as shown by Tirek), is more interesting seeing them amending themselves because they choose to, rather than by threat because they are weaker. 

[Sapphire Lightning 784]

Q is not a "Mary Sue"

 

DIscord = Q

 

Therefor Discord is not a "Mary Sue".

 

*Drops the microphone*

[BastementSparkle 20,310]

Well from my previous posts I was just talking about how Discord wouldn't fall under the same mistakes again because "character development."

 

Well then, have him be beaten in other ways. Say a villain who's sort of like his opposite, very orderly, with magic that can counteract Discord's Chaos. Or a villain who can manipulate his own magic against him. Plenty of new villains that could still beat him in some way.

 

 Or, just don't have him in one of those episodes, he could be off doing something else and never be informed of what's going on, so he doesn't interfere. It's not like he has to show up for every crisis.

 

 And as for Slice of life episodes, his development can continue like normal with his powers.

[cider float 2,535]

Well then, have him be beaten in other ways. Say a villain who's sort of like his opposite, very orderly, with magic that can counteract Discord's Chaos. Or a villain who can manipulate his own magic against him. Plenty of new villains that could still beat him in some way.

 

 Or, just don't have him in one of those episodes, he could be off doing something else and never be informed of what's going on, so he doesn't interfere. It's not like he has to show up for every crisis.

 

 And as for Slice of life episodes, his development can continue like normal with his powers.

The thing is it's just dumb to keep making villains that have to be cosmic level into a show about ponies to be a chance against the side of good with Discord in the pocket to use. Discord should of just been stone or be depowered somewhat to about an alicorn or unicorn level.

Edited May 27, 2015 by cidershield

[Venomous 18,813]

Hmm... I don't thnk that Discord is a Gary Su

[BastementSparkle 20,310]

The thing is it's just dumb to keep making villains that have to be cosmic level into a show about ponies to be a chance against the side of good with Discord around. Discord should of just been stone or be depowered somewhat to about an alicorn or unicorn level.

 

They don't necessarily have to be cosmic levels of power though. They could be weaker, but just have a specific skill that Discord can't fight off.

 

 He got sick from the worm in Three's a crowd. Legitimately sick. Who's to say that's his only weakness?

[A Black Circle 1,585]

It's not that he has this power, he's just so much of a troll that he thinks using it would take the fun out of life.

 

Why nuke the earth

 

When you can make everyone bark like a dog whenever they say "that"?

[Lambdadelta 1,462]

I agree with OP. Discord is too powerful. He can defeat any future threats in equestria by a snap of finger, and it wwould be boring

There 3 ways to solve:

- Nerf him or ban him completely (stone him, put him on the bus...)

- More powerful villain (control time/fate powers, Starwirl-like or even something can compete element of harmony..)

- Weaker villain but gain higher advantage (some unlucky situation, nasty villain with crazy-prepared...)

Solution 2 and 3 are more awesome than stone him )

Maybe i watch too much anime...

[Luna the Great of all the Russias 2,690]

Is term "Mary Sue" is becoming an overused and increasingly misunderstood term? I don't see how he's ideal as a character.

[The Coffee Pony 1,390]

Is term "Mary Sue" is becoming an overused and increasingly misunderstood term? I don't see how he's ideal as a character.

 

Yeah it is. So far I've seen the following characters being called out for being a Mary Sue

 

Twilight Sparkle

Cadence

Fluttershy

Pinkie Pie

Rainbow Dash

Discord

 

Am I missing anyone?

 

Anyway yeah the label is being so misused to the point where I, very reluctantly, have to agree with Jerry Peet that the term has become fancy internet speak for "this character I don't like". I still have huge issues with that video.

[cider float 2,535]

Is term "Mary Sue" is becoming an overused and increasingly misunderstood term? I don't see how he's ideal as a character.

Mary Sue is the correct term to describe Discord. Snap your fingers and change whatever you want. He just wishes it and it happens. Captain America is perfect morally and completely incorruptable yet he is not known as a Mary Sue. Galactus, Hulk, Phoenixx and Discord are Mary Sues.