spoiler Season 5 short rant

[Limeblossom 482]

First I admit that there are some good episodes like The Cutie Map and Slice of life, but that's where it stops. I know that every season has some flawed episodes or dis-likable characters. Unfortunately, this season has for me a record of flawed episodes and characters I don't like.

 

Look at what the writers did with Spike. They already made him less important in the second half of season 4, but season five was really unkindly to him. He could be childish sometimes, but he's helpful, loyal and kind. The Princess Spike episode didn't show that and portrayed him as untrustworthy and good for nothing.

 

That's not the only problem. Appleoosa's Most Wanted's Troubleshoes and other characters where a thorn in the eye. And thanks Dave Polsky for giving living ammunition for Starlight Glimmer's "equality".......... Not! What the hell did he smoke for his ideas? Crystal crack?

 

My rant could go on about the rest of S5's episodes, but maybe it's time to give the writers some direct criticism. This season they showed to be really flawed and Hasbro need to do something about it. I would suggest that they should:

- Hire writers who do give a shit about an enjoyable story and good characters (not buttholes. Yes, I'm looking at you Soarin).

- Fix Spike's destroyed character. Bring him back as he was in the first seasons with more positive sides and let him interact with the other ponies in a positive way. Remember his little and funny moments with Applejack? It really helped them both. And don't forget he also represents the male audience.

- Less screentime for the CMC, but especially Applebloom. She's a distraction in the interaction between Applejack and the others. And why where the CMC on the gala while Spike wasn't even brought by Twilight? Flawed writing again.

- Keep a record of what all happened in the episodes when you write one. That means no flip-flop episodes like Appleoosa's Most Wanted after releasing The Cutie Map.

- Make more episodes like Slice of Life. I really like Derpy, Doctor Whooves, the Lebowski ponies and others. They came over as positive.

 

I hope you all know what I mean with this rant. Call me overreacting if you want, but that doesn't change my opinion about the path the series is walking now. And I'm not planning to swallow more of that stuff.

[Will Guide 21,325]

Actually, Spike was there at the 2nd GGG. In MNFBKD, he can be seen in the middle of the Ballroom enjoying a sapphire cupcake.

[PROJECT: Simon 3,953]

Some I understand and some I don't~ '~' T^T But I totally understand, especially the 3rd one~! <3 =D=D=D  

[Guest]

I believe Starlight Glimmer's form of equality can be more associated to Hitler's idea of equality. AKA, destroy impure races, make all remaining the same to achieve true equality, etc. The idea is that she has a warped perspective of how to achieve equality.

 

That being said, season 5 is just "meh" to me. The Slice of Life episode was just utter garbage. Pandering at its worst. No solid story, no substance, just memes, memes, references, and memes. I prefer writing quality stories over memes. Let's have a lot less of Slice of Life, because it's just all about giving bronies what they want and not producing quality episodes which made the show popular in the first place. I am okay with the one existing, but no more please. The entirety of Slice of Life can be summed up by the scene of Octavia and Vinyl jumping over the shark on repeat. Except instead of jumping the shark they are standing on its back hopping up and down.

[SteveMorison 404]

Cutie Map

Tanks for the memories

Make new friends but keep Discord

Lost treasure of Griffonstone

Slice of life

Amending fences

Do princesses dream of magic sheep

Rarity investigates

 

All excellent episodes for me, this has been the best season so far imo.

[ponylaces 1,869]

Time to parse this, I guess.

 

- I have no idea what makes you think that the current writers don't give a shit about writing for the show. They're still making wonderful stories with great characters that you might be perceiving in the wrong way (Amending Fences, Cutie Map, Rarity Investigates, etc). Yes, they will sometimes fuck up. That doesn't mean the writers don't care about their job.

 

- I would agree with you, but how is Spike's character destroyed exactly? Didn't we already have some good moments with Spike in Do Princesses Dream of Magic Sheep and Castle Sweet Castle? But yes, he should be portrayed in a positive way more often.

 

- How is making the CMC have even less screentime going to help with anything? The CMC have potential for very interesting stories this season. I don't see how they're a "distraction" if they've only had small cameos and 2 out of the 15 episodes this season.

 

- The writers usually don't know about what happened in past episodes when writing an episode. It would be great if they did to keep up the continuity, but it's too late now. It's not really affecting the episode anyway.

 

- More episodes with strange pacing, no solid story, constant references, and with a story that is all over the place? No thanks. And we already have a good amount of enjoyable new side characters this season, so the last thing we need is more fan pandering with ponies like Derpy or Doctor Whooves.

 

The Princess Spike episode didn't show that and portrayed him as untrustworthy and good for nothing.

 

He's a kid, for god's sake. It's no surprise that a kid would do something like that.

 

Sorry if I came off as aggressive. Just trying to get my point across.

lol I'm gonna regret posting this

[Megas 27,051]

- Not sure where you're getting at with Spike. He had a shitty episode, but he still has his moments, and it's not like they threw him to the sidelines or anything, they just haven't used him where he isn't needed.

- Not sure what the beef with Applebloom(and the CMC in general) is. Admittedly I don't care as much about her as I do the other CMC, and admittedly I get annoyed how her episodes deal with Cutie Marks more than every other CMC, but I don't see why they should limit her, and I think it's silly to assume that she gets in the way of Applejack's interaction with other characters. She's her sister for fuck's sake. And Spike WAS at the Gala from what I remember

- The writers are doing just fine. Some make good episodes, some make bad episodes, just like every other season. If episodes like Amending Fences and Rarity Investigates are any indication, they still give the show as much effort and heart as usual

- I really hope we never get another "Slice of Life" again. If the show ever does make it to a 200th episode, I hope it's an actual celebration of what made the show great and not another wankfest to every brony meme in existence. One SoL is more than enough

- Starlight Glimmer's view of equality doesn't have much a say on Appleoosa's Most Wanted. The latter's point was that Troubleshoe's cutie mark was never interpreted correctly

- The show hasn't put continuity as a main priority since S1. The writers even admitted that most episodes are self-contained stories

 

I haven't had much an issue with S5 aside from three episodes(SoL, AMW, PS). Then again, I'm fairly easy to please when it comes to this show. 

Edited September 20, 2015 by Kamina

[Guest]

I don't get why people are treating that Spike episode like they just murdered their first born son. It was a sub par episode, but it was not some giant character assassination.

[Mesme Rize 15,681]

I hope you all know what I mean with this rant. Call me overreacting if you want, but that doesn't change my opinion about the path the series is walking now. And I'm not planning to swallow more of that stuff.

 

Then, maybe you shouldn't watch it, i guess. I mean if you ask me, yes you overreact completly here. But you know what the Big Lebowski says "that's just like your opinion man."

 

Nobody forces you to watch the series, but at the same time, you can't force us to stop enjoying it.

[CastletonSnob 3,025]

Are there any good Spike episodes?

[Megas 27,051]

Are there any good Spike episodes?

A Dog and Pony Show, Secret of my Excess, Equestria Games, Power Ponies. Among others

Edited September 20, 2015 by Kamina

[CastletonSnob 3,025]

I think if anything, Spike has been coming along with the Mane 6 on their adventures more than ever this season.

[MAIKUN 262]

- Why the CMC are afraid of Discord?

- Fan VAs should've been in the 100th episode

[Carolina 212]

The only episodes I disliked this season were "Bloom and Gloom" (it's boring and I dislike the CMCs), "Appleoosa's Most Wanted" (aside from the CMC being so incredibly "meh" to me now, the story focused on clowns. I hate clowns) and "Slice of Life" (agree one hundred percent that it was just a lot of fan pandering and nods to various memes.)

 

"The Cutie Map" was definitely the best two-parter so far, "Castle Sweet Castle" was very heartwarming and had an awesome song, "Tanks for the Memories" actually made me like Rainbow Dash, "Make New Friends but Keep Discord" is the second funniest episode in the series to me (after "Maud Pie"), "Amending Fences" gave Twilight one of her better lessons in the series, "Do Princesses Dream of Magical Sheep" was awesomely surreal and "Rarity Investigates" was just fun all around.

 

I rather liked "Princess Spike," "The Lost Treasure of Griffonstone," "Canterlot Boutique" and "Party Pooped," as well, even though they aren't my favorites of the season.  And it's looking like the next couple of episodes should be good, too (aside from the CMC one, which, ehhh). 

[Shikilicious 69]

I believe Starlight Glimmer's form of equality can be more associated to Hitler's idea of equality. AKA, destroy impure races, make all remaining the same to achieve true equality, etc. The idea is that she has a warped perspective of how to achieve equality.

 

That being said, season 5 is just "meh" to me. The Slice of Life episode was just utter garbage. Pandering at its worst. No solid story, no substance, just memes, memes, references, and memes. I prefer writing quality stories over memes. Let's have a lot less of Slice of Life, because it's just all about giving bronies what they want and not producing quality episodes which made the show popular in the first place. I am okay with the one existing, but no more please. The entirety of Slice of Life can be summed up by the scene of Octavia and Vinyl jumping over the shark on repeat. Except instead of jumping the shark they are standing on its back hopping up and down.

 

I rather would compare Starlight Glimmer's ideology - happiness through equality - with communism than with nationalsocialism.

 

She doesn't ever state to want to purge Equestria from griffons, dragons or any other race.

[Buck Testa 5,503]

I actually like this season quite a bit and I like the direction the characters are going, especially Fluttershy. The people I see who tend to dislike the "direction" the show is going tend to be those that worship season 1 as the best and decry anything not from the holy "Faust" 

 

I'll tell you Season 1 is probably one of my LEAST favorite seasons out of the five, tying with season 3 in my book. 

 

I do agree on the spike thing though, but lets face it he's been distroyed since the beginning, and no matter how much potential he has they are going to just use him as a plot punching bag. 

[CastletonSnob 3,025]

Any chance for Spike to be better used by the writers in S6?

[Conred 274]

I actually like this season quite a bit and I like the direction the characters are going, especially Fluttershy. The people I see who tend to dislike the "direction" the show is going tend to be those that worship season 1 as the best and decry anything not from the holy "Faust" 

 

I'll tell you Season 1 is probably one of my LEAST favorite seasons out of the five, tying with season 3 in my book. 

 

I do agree on the spike thing though, but lets face it he's been distroyed since the beginning, and no matter how much potential he has they are going to just use him as a plot punching bag. 

I like both the direction of Fluttershy and Discord in this season. Fluttershy is more assertive, Discord more emotional and relatable.

[MLPFanatic34 3,234]

I for one love this season so far and I don't think the writers don't care about the show, the characters have gotten fantastic and still are and as for Spike, he's always been my favorite male character and I loved the episodes involving him as the lead.

[Captain Trek 32]

If you're going to create a comprehensive rant about all of season 5, doesn't it behove you to actually talk about all of season 5 and not just mention two episodes you liked and two episodes that you didn't?

First off, maybe you didn't notice, but bad Spike and bad CMC episodes are nothing new. I won't waste my breath talking about Princess Spike, because all know how worthless that episode is, but I honestly didn't actually think Appleoosa's Most Wanted was that bad. I'll grant it by no means lit the world on fire, but really, I think your interpretation of the episode and how it relates to Cutie Map is really pushing it when the thrust of that episode was not that Troubleshoes' cutie mark was bad or indicated something bad, but rather that Troubleshoes himself was a moron who couldn't figure out what it was supposed to mean. If you recall how Cheerilee interpreted her cutie mark, awkward, inventive, and just plain incorrect interpretations of one's cutie mark are nothing new. Also nothing new is one's talent being different from one's passion. Rarity's talent is actually prospecting for gemstones. But her passion is fashion. And when you look at ponies like Applejack, whose specific talent is growing apples and yet is a dab hand at absolutely everything and anything related to life on the farm, it's always been pretty clear that a pony's talents begin, rather than end, with their cutie mark. Therefore, Troubleshoes having trouble understanding his place in the world in no way goes against anything that has previously been established.

Ultimately, I really don't see how the CMC convincing Troubleshoes to look at his situation from a new perspective and turn his supposed weakness into an advantage is in any way giving Starlight ammunition. If anything it demonstrates just the opposite... demonstrates just how hollow Starlight's philosophy truly is... because by pushing for the big win instead of taking the easy way out and unmarking him that Starlight would, the CMC brought Troubleshoes far, far more happiness than Starlight's methods ever could have. Life may be hard, but that doesn't mean mindless conformity is the answer. You have to, so Appleoosa's Most Wanted argued, find the thing that makes you unique no matter how long or far you have to look. That's not really an unhealthy message to be sending.

In any case, bad Spike and CMC episodes are in no way an indication that the writer's have stopped giving a shit. By that logic, the writers would have had to have never given a shit to begin with. This is especially true of Dave Polsky, seeing as he wrote for season one, and was an absolute juggernaut in season 4, writing three great and two decent episodes. Your point about wanting to see Spike not suck as much is fair enough, but again, that's not a criticism that is unique to season 5.

In other words, I'm really not seeing your point here. How exactly do your criticisms of two particular episodes prove season 5 is a bad season overall?

 

I actually like this season quite a bit and I like the direction the characters are going, especially Fluttershy. The people I see who tend to dislike the "direction" the show is going tend to be those that worship season 1 as the best and decry anything not from the holy "Faust",

 

This is honestly a bit (a lot, really) of a reach when, in truth, Limeblossom has barely expounded on why he generally hates season 5 in its entirety at all. Again, (s)he took heavily disputable umbrage with two of its episodes (while praising two others) and left it at that. You could be right, obviously, but you're still making an unfounded assumption about Lime's position.

Edited September 21, 2015 by Captain Trek

[Guest]

 

 

I actually like this season quite a bit and I like the direction the characters are going, especially Fluttershy. The people I see who tend to dislike the "direction" the show is going tend to be those that worship season 1 as the best and decry anything not from the holy "Faust" 

 

I dislike the direction they are going with season 5 and I actually dislike Faust completely. My reasoning for disliking the new season is that it feels like they want to go for this big overarching adventure, instead of just random sitcom humor. I liked the days where the episodes were centered around small issues, but now it's all "We have to save the entire kingdom by finding an ancient artifact to restore their pride." Every other episode is all "Okay rangers, Zordon is sending us to this part of the world to restore friendship." Restoring or spreading friendship now has become a "quest" instead of something that is achieved from humorous antics.

 

I feel the BEST episodes in season 5 are the ones where we pretend the map doesn't exist and instead we just focus on having some good clean fun. I feel that the magic which made me like the show in the first place is being siphoned out to create a more "actiony" and "big" show that will appeal more towards the older fans. I don't want power rangers in my MLP, I want MLP in my MLP. Not to mention in the finales their emphasis on fight scenes now is getting insane. Full on DBZ half the time. I do not want DBZ in my MLP.

 

I just want cartoon horses getting into shenanigans, making funny scenarios and breaking out randomly into song. When you change a show's dynamic so drastically, you run the risk of a lot of fans being turned off.

[CastletonSnob 3,025]

What are the rankings for the episodes so far?

[Buck Testa 5,503]

 

 

"Okay rangers, Zordon is sending us to this part of the world to restore friendship." Restoring or spreading friendship now has become a "quest"

 

"Alpha, Rita has escaped, Recruit a team of pastel colored ponies with friendship!"

 

Sorry loved that visual, got me giggling XD

 

On to your point: I did say "tend to be" when it came to the season one'ers, I avoid absolutes as much as possible since there is always exceptions to the rule. I don't think the show has put as much emphasis on fighting as you say though, sure the finale and the premier were pretty bombastic but over all this season has been pretty chill and filled with slice of life. In fact aside from the episode titled "slice of life" I don't recall there being much at all in the way of fighting this season beyond the premier.  

 

I personally think the cutie map is a great plot device with a lot of potential, because it allows for exploration of the land of equestria and beyond and for all kinds of new stories the previous models like the friendship letters and Celestia sending them on missions couldn't do. It doesn't require the exposition dump the afore mentioned ones did just to explain WHY they are doing what they are doing. I'm curious as to what is pulling the strings for the cutie map though, what is giving it the coordinates that need them and what tells it to decide on which ponies actually go? In universe wise I'm surprised Twilight outright trusts it as much as she does. 

[Guest]

 

 

"Alpha, Rita has escaped, Recruit a team of pastel colored ponies with friendship!"

 

 

"BRAVO TEAM. HORSE AND DRAGON MEET US AT ALPHA POINT."

 

 

 

In fact aside from the episode titled "slice of life"

 

 

That's another gripe I had. It felt like the show became made by the fans and not for the fans. There is gentle nods, then there is handing the show over and saying "here, make what you want". A good studio should be able to tell us what we want, not just let the fans take control over the show.

 

 

 

I personally think the cutie map is a great plot device with a lot of potential,

 

Agreed, I just feel they are using it poorly. Instead of it being used to increase the antics and show us more of the land, it's more about being a commanding and foreboding entity always watching over and pulling the strings. The map has become the master of all episodes in that it can decide what direction to force an episode to go and can even eliminate characters from the script. "Sorry guys, map says that Applejack has to go alone." It wasn't as big a deal at first, but now so many episodes are completely controlled by the map to where the map more or less is becoming the only thing that matters.

 

Can you deny that you miss the days where the problems were "I have 2 tickets and 5 friends, let the humor commence". Even season 2 which had a bigger focus on an overarching story than the first season still found a way to keep the antics involved. Discord was less of a serious villain who was there to smash all friendship, he was used to ENHANCE the humor and antics. But then you get people like Sombra... He is not about enhancing the antics, he's just evil. Same thing with the monkey dude from season 4... Just plain evil. Starlight Glimmer, she's not as evil, misguided sure, but still no enhancement of that humor element. I found those episodes to be far too serious. These villains are all about doing something big and nasty. Sure Nightmare Moon was like that too, but remember at the time the first two episodes were some of the least popular.

 

Season 2's opening was far superior to season 1 because they learned how to turn that serious plot point into one that was more humorous while maintained an important feel. Discord wasn't really that "evil", he was fun loving. He wasn't trying to take over Equestria, he just wanted to make it chaotic and hilarious. After Discord it sort of felt like all of their villains are after something so serious and sinister. Like they totally forgot what made people love those premieres and finales.

[Captain Trek 32]

Well, I feel a bit like the Reliant ominously closing in on the Enterprise right now, but... Key, this needs to be said...

 

 

First of all, by complaining about how the show has been sprinkling epic adventure set pieces amid the sit. comedy, you're complaining about something that has always been, rather than this being a new direction the show has recently taken as you claim. A while back, a friend of mine described the bulk of Friendship is Magic as depicting what adventurers do with their time when there aren't any dragons that need slaying, and I thought that was very apt. Most of the episodes are slice of life focused, sure, but every once in a while we knuckle down and go on a big adventure. I mean come on, the words "big adventure!" are right there in the theme song! 

 

Then there's the fact that you are massively overstating the amount of influence the Cutie Map has actually had. Even if I agreed with you that this pony equivalent of Zordon was being mishandled, the fact is that, to date, only one episode in thirteen has actually involved the map (two in nineteen counting episode 16 to 21, which aren't out yet, but we know their contents). It honestly concerns me that you can look at something that's been used exactly once in the half a season after it was introduced (or twice in the first two thirds counting episode 16) and then turn around and claim the map is dominating everything and has become the only thing that matters. Something that's used barely once in every ten episodes is hardly dominating anything.

 

Morever, how is the map saying, "go and deal with these gryphons!" really any different from Twilight getting a letter from Celestia saying, "go and deal with this dragon!" in Dragonshy? Again, there have always been episodes where Twilight (or other members of the Mane Six) has been acting an official capacity of some kind.

 

I feel the BEST episodes in season 5 are the ones where we pretend the map doesn't exist and instead we just focus on having some good clean fun.

 

So... most of them? Episodes 3, 5, 6, 7, 9, 10, 11, 12, and 14 were solely focused on slice of life. And whilst some measure of adventure related stuff did happen in 4, 13, and 15, only episode 8 (Griffonstone) actually involved the map. I'd hardly call that "every other" episode. Counting 16 to 21 only weakens your argument further, since that gives us one map episode and another five pure slice of life episodes.

 

Indeed, let's quickly look at how many times the Mane Six dealt with something that posed a threat to a significant portion of the kingdom (at least one town or city) in each season, shall we?

 

Season 1: 1&2, 6, 7, 10, 21

Season 2: 1&2, 8, 10, 20, 25&26

Season 3: 1&2, 3, 5

Season 4: 1&2, 4, 23, 25&26

Season 5: 1&2, 8, 9

 

Well gee, it's almost like the number of significant threats is comparable from season to season, usually consisting of the season opener, season finale, and a couple of other adventures here and there amid the remaining 22 episodes...

 

Can you deny that you miss the days where the problems were "I have 2 tickets and 5 friends, let the humor commence".

 

In the words of Jean-Luc Picard, most certainly I deny it. Even ignoring the fact that a lot of people (although I'm not one of them) don't actually like Ticket Master very much, I fail to see how we aren't still in those days. "I don't want my pet to go to sleep for the winter. Let the humour commence". "I want my friends to redecorate my home. Let the humor commence". "I want to make up for neglecting an old friend but she won't have a bar of it. Let the humor commence". See what I mean?

 

As for the villains, first of all, the DBZ thing only happened once. Sure it was a bit indulgent, but I think we can allow the writers and animators to have a bit of fun and make things bigger and more epic just for the season finale, don't you? And even then it's not universal. Magical Mystery Cure didn't have anything like that and the season openers have all been comparatively restrained. And Discord, who you claim to like, was the villain for two of the five of them. But in any case, having a more epic story for the opener  and finale makes perfectly good sense, even in a comedy show. And the numbers don't lie, either. Going by the IMDB scores, Canterlot Wedding and Twilight's Kingdom are among the most well-loved episodes of all, so your whole "forgot what made people love these" argument doesn't hold any water. And yet Crystal Empire gets somewhat lower scores, so conversely it's also clear people aren't just lapping the epic stories up just because they're epic.:

 

http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt1751105

 

Additionally, dark villains have been a staple of MLP since the beginning, to the point where the My Little Pony and Friends era villains from the 80s were actually darker than than the "dark" villains of our current times. G4 Tirek might have sucked up a bunch of magic and turned into a giant (who didn't even go on to cause any property damage, I should stress), but I'm just saying he never literally chained ponies up with unpadded metal collars... In fact, pony enslavement (including putting fillies in unpadded metal collars) happened multiple times in the 80s cartoon, and was a lot more hardcore than it was depicted in A Dog and Pony Show.

 

Not only that, but if you count the comics, the heroes were more hardcore in G1 as well. Unlike Celestia, Majesty straight up murdered her enemies by transforming them into inanimate objects on multiple occasions and G1 Applejack accidentally killed an evil wizard in the G1 comics as well when she ran into his throne in the dark and knocked him down a fissure. The latter was also the comic where it was revealed that the glimmer-eyed ponies had been rendered blind by being forced to work in a gemstone mine with no light, and then when Applejack smashed the jewel wizard's throne the gemstones the throne was encrusted with flew into their eye sockets like so much pipe bomb shrapnel and this somehow restored their sight and gave them their famous gemstone-shaped irises. I'll happily provide links if you think I'm kidding you, by the way. This really happened...

But anyway, I'll wrap this up before I get too far off-track. In the end, I just don't see your point with regards how the show has 'changed direction' (season 5 has, counting 16-21, so far had only two overarching story episodes apart from the opener and finale, whereas season 4 had four key episodes, two Equestria Games episodes, and one episode that was both), I don't see your point with regards the the Cutie Map supposedly 'dominating' the proceedings, and even if having epic finales that are slightly more serious but still comedic (as opposed to the purely comedic slice of life episodes you seem to prize) than usual does go against your grain, that still, as I have demonstrated, leaves the overwhelming majority of each season, including season 5, available for you to enjoy.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Captain Trek