S06:E11 - Flutter Brutter

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,151]

The problem is in the way he interacts with others to get what he wants. He emotionally manipulates his parents, damages their property, constantly hits on RD in a creepy way, takes total advantage of Fluttershy and doesn't care about anypony but himself. And the best part is that none of this is directly addressed at all. Yes he eventually stops, but only because his sister forced him to, not because he actually feels any remorse for manipulating others.

 

 

That's how some people have to learn, and I've seen that happen plenty of times in real life. It might seem like lazy writing, but sometimes when someone forces you to do something, it can really open the proverbial door, if you will.

[Jeric 46,834]

I could relate to Zephyr. I worry about my future a lot, and whether or not I’ll be a success.

 

 

It is indeed a strong fear. It doesn't always materialize the same way as it did in the episode, with the person giving up. 

 

My dream, my calling ... was medicine and science. It was my original goal. Life and my own head got in my way. I was in a really bad place after my first term in college. You see, my father passed away and those events shook me to my core. I was completely aware of my emotional state and I was no longer confident in my skills. I decided to follow in his dream for me as a way of honoring him ... but mostly because it was the easier route. I went on to major in Business with a concentration in Finance. I ended up not long after getting a Comp Sci degree, and finally finishing Graduate school. 

 

Business Business Business Numbers. :/

 

I was a success in life by every measurable metric. I had a family, a house, a well paying career, and multiple degrees. However, the longest held dream of mine wasn't followed because I thought I would fail and fail hard. It took me until my late 30's to finally realize that I was a fool. I took the easy path and didn't have faith in my own abilities. I have since taken steps to correct this as it is never too late. 

 

The moral is extremely applicable to me from the past. I may have still become a 'productive' member of society ... but by not fighting the fear of failure ... I lost a good chunk of my life to a career I was not meant for. 

[Cleverclover 1,525]

 

 

He was putting on a facade, that is all there is to it, he was acting that way to make himself feel better and to help him fake confidence and arrogance. 

 

 

Even if that's true, the bottom line is that the episode failed to give Zephyr a likable personality or a willingness to apply himself, and thus any attempt to get me to feel sympathetic towards him were utterly lost on me. 

 

When he started deliberately botching up his jobs, I knew from right there that Fluttershy was under no further obligation to do anything more for him. He had made his choice. He decided that he didn't want to work. Exactly what more did Fluttershy need to do? He was NOT her responsibility.

[Will Guide 21,325]

That scene between the Mane Pegasi and Zephyr in the forest mirrors my parents and me in real life:

(Black text are the same words and actions of both the Ponies and my real life.)

 

 

A frustrated Zephyr angrily wrecks his camp site after failing to start a simple fire/ A frustrated me angrily slams on the keyboard trying to finish a final essay for college class, but can't find the content needed. (In fact, as this episodes airs, I actually HAVE final essays due within the next week before college is out for the summer, and honestly, I've been doing horrible this semester; the worst I've ever done since being in college these past 3-4 years. I'm likely going to get a Final F grades on the classes I've taken this semester) Also, I'm worried I won't be able to find a job this summer. I had a part time job last summer, but it was given to me as part of a summer program that I'm now too old for.

 

Zephyr/Me: (sighs) I can't do this. I can't do anything (buries face in hooves/hands)

 

Shy/my parents: ​Zephyr/William, You're smart and talented. you could do anything if you just tried.

 

Zephyr/Me: And what if I give everything I have and still fail? Honestly, I think it's better not to try at all. (In my case, What if I have give everything I have on these upcoming final essays and still fail the classes? I think it's better not to finish the essays at all.)​

 

Dash/my parents: But then you won't ever do anything.

 

Zephyr/Me: I don't expect you two to understand. I mean when have you ever fail? You've literally helped saved Equestria a dozen times/Dad, you got a award for perfect service working for UPS for over 35 years. Debbie (My stepmom), you've graduated from college.

 

Shy/my parents: And I was worried that I'd fail everytime/ (Debbie shows a spreadsheet of her final grades throughout college; some of which were F's. Dad also reveals he got that award, even though he's been late for work once due to a freeway accident beyond his control) Sometimes you have to do things even though you might fail.

 

Zephyr/Me: But failing is the worst.

 

Shy/my parents: And quitting doesn't feel much better, does it?

 

Zephyr/Me: No.

 

Boy. Writing this up took so long, I can't believe it's past 10 a.m. and I still haven't finished watching the episode. I'll stop here.

 

Wait, this episode had a song!? I can't believe my above posting delay me hearing it!

Edited June 6, 2016 by WiiGuy2014

[Valeska 184]

Overall, I really enjoyed the episode. I was laughing and cringing at the same time. I know a lot of people are saying they hate Zephyr but I feel like he has a lot of potential once he decides to put his mind time something worthy of his time and energy. NOT making other creatures do the work for him. I also really enjoyed how the writers has Rainbow Dash be involved in the episode. Not to mention her reactions to Zephyr hitting on her. Priceless! 

[Roughshod 719]

That's how some people have to learn, and I've seen that happen plenty of times in real life. It might seem like lazy writing, but sometimes when someone forces you to do something, it can really open the proverbial door, if you will.

Well he didn't learn enough. He learned how to do things for himself and so by default has stopped being a total douche to others around him. But no personal effort was put into treating others better for its own sake that I could see. Before he was an obnoxious narcissistic moocher. Now they just took out the moocher part. This was a very poor lesson in friendship if it even was one.

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,151]

 

When he started deliberately botching up his jobs, I knew from right there that Fluttershy was under no further obligation to do anything more for him. He had made his choice. He decided that he didn't want to work. Exactly what more did Fluttershy need to do? He was NOT her responsibility.

 

 

You're right; he wasn't, but I really don't think that was the overall point. The main point was that Fluttershy chose, out of her own free will, to help him and in Dark Souls fashion finally broke through the wall. The end of the episode shows that he still has a bit of a road to go, and the 'baby steps' remark shows that, but it shows that a helping hand can sometimes go a long way.

 

Fluttershy didn't have to help, and she probably shouldn't have, but in the end it worked out...for now.

[Buck Testa 5,503]

Man they did not waste time making fanart for this guy. 

 

[Stardust* 3,302]

Even if that's true, the bottom line is that the episode failed to give Zephyr a likable personality or a willingness to apply himself, and thus any attempt to get me to feel sympathetic towards him were utterly lost on me. 

 

When he started deliberately botching up his jobs, I knew from right there that Fluttershy was under no further obligation to do anything more for him. He had made his choice. He decided that he didn't want to work. Exactly what more did Fluttershy need to do? He was NOT her responsibility.

 

I agree with you on the point that he made his own bed now he needs to lie in it. But think about your own son/daughter/brother/sister. And once she "kicked" him out and he was self loathing in the forest she did go after him, but it wasn't the same type of help that she was doing before. She was encouraging him to do what he originally wanted to do, mane therapy. 

 

She was no longer trying to help him, but more trying to get him to help himself. 

 

Yes, he is still living at home, but he now has a "degree" in "mane therapy" and he has a job. So he isn't necessarily freeloading any longer. 

 

And we hope that this is the case, he better know that if he tries that stunt again, Fluttershy will be there to lay down the law lol

Edited June 4, 2016 by Stardust*

[Varrack 1,080]

It was great how Fluttershy was assertive in this episode and taught her parents to stand up for themselves. I'm glad the writers didn't forget about how she learned to be assertive back in season 2.

 

Zephyr has a big ego and even flirted with RD, which I found interesting.

 

The song was alright, kinda cheesy though.

 

I think it was wrapped up pretty good, with Zephyr graduating and finding his ambition.

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,151]

Well he didn't learn enough. He learned how to do things for himself and so by default has stopped being a total douche to others around him. But no personal effort was put into treating others better for its own sake that I could see. Before he was an obnoxious narcissistic moocher. Now they just took out the moocher part. This was a very poor lesson in friendship if it even was one.

 

I disagree; it just shows that sometimes it takes a long time for a person to completely change. The 'baby steps' remark is a nice call-back to the Breezies episode in that not all solutions will work 100% of the time. It takes effort and patience to make a full turn-around.

 

Now, I do sympathize that you didn't feel any emotional connection to Zephyr. Honestly I didn't either, but he was relatable in a sense as I have seen plenty like him in my life. The thing that really make the episode shine for me was Fluttershy, and how she really dealt with the problem. In a sense...I can relate to her in this situation.

[Will Guide 21,325]

By the way, near the episode's end, Rainbow was going to say something to the Shy parents, but Fluttershy cut her off. Does anyone knows what Dash was going to say? I feel I'm missing something.

[Roughshod 719]

When he started deliberately botching up his jobs, I knew from right there that Fluttershy was under no further obligation to do anything more for him. He had made his choice. He decided that he didn't want to work. Exactly what more did Fluttershy need to do? He was NOT her responsibility.

Right. He didn't just try and fail out of fear. He wanted to fail so he wouldn't have to bother even trying. Why would I want to like somebody with that kind of character? This episode totally revolved around him and ultimately he was the only one who benefited from it at everypony else's expense.

[Buck Testa 5,503]

By the way, near the episode's end, Rainbow was going to say something to the Shy parents, but Fluttershy cut her off. Does anyone knows what Dash was going to say? I feel I'm missing something.

They said "After years of Pining for him, it must be really satisfying to see him on the right track"

 

Rainbow Dash: Distraught horse noises 

[BlackWater627 700]

The episode opens with the conflict of fluttershys brother unable to support himself, and living at home. Most of the episode is spent reinforcing the fact that Zephyr is an unemployable douche. Rainbow Dash, and fluttershy sing at him, so he graduates, and gets a degree in "mane therapy". Episode ends with him still living with his parents. And conflict resolved.

 

Also, where does Rainbow Dash have room to criticize anyone for taking naps, as we have frequently been shown her doing just that ( although, in all fairness, Dash probably was taking a well deserved rest after a hard half day of work)

Good point about Rainbow. Her napping habit goes all the way back to Applebucking Season. Even if she did a hard half day of work, she did know that her friends needed help with the apples. So...yeah. There's room for argument there. 

 

On another note, this episode brings something else to the discussion. What about employment in Equestria? We have little to no information of how the mane6 got into their positions or even if they have jobs at all. So that could be a very big double standard. We can of course get into discussing how Twilight might have been a paid librarian or Pinkie might have worked for the Cakes and, yes, Rarity obviously runs her own business. But what about how they got to that point and how what they do is "enough to support themselves." I'm sure all of this is kept vague in the show because of the target audience, but that's never kept us from digging in before! 

[Jeric 46,834]

 

 

Exactly what more did Fluttershy need to do? He was NOT her responsibility.

 

One could argue that being responsible for someone, feeling responsible for someone, and having familial empathy are all different things. 

By the way, near the episode's end, Rainbow was going to say something to the Shy parents, but Fluttershy cut her off. Does anyone knows what Dash was going to say? I feel I'm missing something.

 

"You're peeving me off momma Shy!"

 

*gasp

[baba_booey 4,299]

Ehh..

I'm not too sure about this one. It was nice seeing Fluttershy's family and all, but there were tons of pacing issues, the humor was a bit mixed bag and I wasn't much for Zephyr as a character. Maybe I need to rewatch this one, but it was average at best.

 

Is it wrong to say that Zephyr reminds me of McJuggerNuggets?

Good to know I wasn't the only one that got that idea

[Will Guide 21,325]

That last line about not being able to find a place is actually true here in America.

 

"For the first time in modern history, more 18-to-34-year-olds live with their parents than in any other living arrangement, according to a Pew Research Center report released Tuesday" (Bahrampour).
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/social-issues/young-people-more-likely-to-live-with-parents-now-than-any-time-in-modern-history/2016/05/24/9ad6f564-2117-11e6-9e7f-57890b612299_story.html

[Jeric 46,834]

 

 

But what about how they got to that point and how what they do is "enough to support themselves." I'm sure all of this is kept vague in the show because of the target audience, but that's never kept us from digging in before!

 

 

Rarity and AJ are pretty much covered (how Rarity got her first boutique is the only major question for her). It would be interesting to see how Fluttershy, Pinkie, and RD came to their jobs. Twilight ... there is a Friendship Tax!

[BastementSparkle 20,312]

Not sure what to say about this one really. I thought it was a good episode. But it just crushed my confidence and made me feel terrible again.

 

 That cave scene? Yeah, that's going to be me, but I'm not going to get out of it, I'll just curl up and die there.

 

Moral only applies to people who aren't sub-human filth.

[Jeric 46,834]

That last line about not being able to find a place is actually true here in America.

 

"For the first time in modern history, more 18-to-34-year-olds live with their parents than in any other living arrangement, according to a Pew Research Center report released Tuesday" (Bahrampour).

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/social-issues/young-people-more-likely-to-live-with-parents-now-than-any-time-in-modern-history/2016/05/24/9ad6f564-2117-11e6-9e7f-57890b612299_story.html

 

This is not uncommon in other nations as well, in fact this was the norm throughout most of history for a household to have multiple generations. Post 50's society changed a lot here in the US. 

[Stardust* 3,302]

That last line about not being able to find a place is actually true here in America.

 

"For the first time in modern history, more 18-to-34-year-olds live with their parents than in any other living arrangement, according to a Pew Research Center report released Tuesday" (Bahrampour).

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/social-issues/young-people-more-likely-to-live-with-parents-now-than-any-time-in-modern-history/2016/05/24/9ad6f564-2117-11e6-9e7f-57890b612299_story.html

 

It's embarrassing to admit... but I am one of those... I'm no freeloader by any means, I take care of the house/garden and make dinners. But trying to find a job with my stupid HR degree with little "office" experience is very frustrating. Trying to get into anything is a full time job as it is. 

[Zantetsuken 364]

So we have another Dave Rapp episode on the table... lets just say I wasn't exactly... happy... with the choice of writer for this one. For those of you that don't remeber, don't want to remember for obvious reasons, or just don't care, well then let me jog your memory. Dave Rapp's debut episode was the horrible disaster known as Newbie Dash, which as of writing this, is the worst episode in the history of MLPFiM according to my personal rating chart with a 3/10. Let's just say Mr. Rapp didn't exactly make a good first impression.

 

So was this episode any better? It was ok, I liked it all well enough. The only thing I see issue with is that I believe that Fluttershy was a bit too aggressive at some parts. Dave (this can also be applied to the fox bros) just seems to want to write the episode he wants while putting established character traits of certain characters on the backburner or in the case of Newbie Dash, disregarding them completely. This episode doesn't have a lot of that but it still has a little bit and I wanted to point is out as it's something I'm starting to notice.

 

One thing that would have made this episode great is the moral... is what i would have said if just a few lines of dialogue were changed. We have Zephyr not doing anything because he doesn't want to fail which is ok to a point. However, I have a feeling this episode would have had much more of an impact if Zephyr tried his best multiple times and still failed, bringing him down to the point you see in the episode. The way it's presented in the episode makes it so Zephyr never tried or tried a little but didn't give his all which just makes him look like a lazy fuck who doesn't care. He could have been made into a much more respectable character by actually trying and still failing (though there may be an episode where that had been done already, not sure right now). I have been in this situation so this moral hits real close to me but I have always ALWAYS tried at whatever I have been presented with and those failures have pointed me in the direction of what I actually want to do in life.

 

This episode would have been one of my favorites if it was set up better but its still enjoyable. so 7/10 

 

As for Mr. Rapp... Nothing can forgive Newbie Dash NOTHING, and I believe this person still has a loooooooooong way to go with writing characters in character, but this episode is at least a step in the right direction. 

[Jeric 46,834]

It's embarrassing to admit... but I am one of those... I'm no freeloader by any means, I take care of the house/garden and make dinners. But trying to find a job with my stupid HR degree with little "office" experience is very frustrating. Trying to get into anything is a full time job as it is. 

 

 

Both my kids (16 and 15 at the moment) have open invitations to stay at casa Jeric until they establish themselves for this very reason. It is not as easy these days to jump start a career unless you are in some very specific fields. 

[Cleverclover 1,525]

She was no longer trying to help him, but more trying to get him to help himself. 

 

She was always trying to get him to help himself. But what really irks me is that when she kicked him out, she had to go to him to finally get him motivated to help himself. What SHOULD have happened is that Zephyr should have gone back to Fluttershy, admitted how much of an ass he was for spitting in the face of all of her efforts to help him, and then finally said that he was ready to actually make an effort to help himself. 

 

That action alone is what utterly makes the moral terrible. It's blatantly stating that it's YOUR responsibility to bend over backwards and get your family members on the right track, regardless of how much it inconveniences you, or how little they appreciate you for what you're doing for them. 

 

Seriously, this is almost just as bad as Rarity and Pinkie going back to make nice with Fluttershy after she had literally crapped all over their passions in Putting Your Hoof Down. Exactly what reason did they have to do this? Fluttershy should have gone to them to apologize. 

 

 

 

and having familial empathy are all different things. 

 

 

Unfortunately, "familial empathy" is often used as an excuse for enabling. 

Edited June 4, 2016 by Cleverclover