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Questions regarding Magic after being promoted to Alicorn status


Ruudo Burei

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So, a friend and I were having one of our usual random discussions, and we somehow got to questioning how Magic works upon being promoted to an Alicorn.
 
Consider each race's innate abilities:

  • Earth Pony
    • Connection to the Earth (this is so vague...)
      • possibly Agriculture, like with Applejack's case?
      • possibly Sensing Random (Un-natural) Disasters, like with Pinkie's case?
      • possibly Sensing Life Energy, like with Tree Hugger's case?
    • (Implied) Innate Leadership skills
    • (Implied) Innate Physical Prowess
  • Pegasus
    • Flight
    • Ability to Walk on Clouds
    • Weather Manipulation
  • Unicorn
    • All forms of Active Magic
      • Levitation
      • Teleportation
      • Any manipulation of Life and Elements
      • Able to learn Spells that are innate to other races

First Question: When promoted to an Alicorn, do ponies obtain the traits of all other races?
When Twilight was promoted, she seemed to have obtained all Pegasi traits. Kind of hard to tell if she obtained any Earth Pony traits, because she has some leadership skills to begin with and can just use Unicorn magic to imitate other race's innate magicks.
 
As for Cadence, she was a Pegasus prior to being promoted. Cadence obtained Unicorn traits; but her obtaining Earth Pony traits are still somewhat in the air, as we don't exactly know what her traits were prior to her promotion.
(On a side note, how the crud did Cadence's Love Magic work, if she was a Pegasus prior to being promoted? All instances of her using it was by the Unicorn part of her magic.)
 
Second Question: I've looked into some fan speculation that Twilight and Cadence are pseudo-Alicorns. Unlike Celestia and Luna, who supposedly have all the powers of the three pony races, Twilight and Cadence only have added Pegasus wings or a Unicorn horn respectively. In addition, Faust has stated something along the lines of Twilight NOT outliving her friends, so extreme longevity is not with her and Cadence, probably. So, if they are pseudo-Alicorns, would that mean that they only get some but not all added abilities? In addition, would an Earth Pony being promoted technically be the closest to being a full Alicorn, because they'd be forced to have all the abilities of all three races?
 
Third Question: Because Magic is finite and draws on the user's stamina, how would the pony's magic be affected upon promotion to an Alicorn (or a pseudo-Alicorn)?
Would it be automatically increased for the new appendages you have? Would your magic be more difficult to distribute while using multiple race-specific magicks at once?
Gaming terms: Does your max MP automatically rise upon promotion, or does being promoted equate to learning a new skill that you don't have enough MP to use frequently and requires a manual raising of max MP through training before being able to be able to use both your old skills and new skills simultaneously?

 

P.S. Sorry, if this topic seems a little strange. I'm a bit of an over-thinker.  :squee:

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First question: I've never been convinced that earth ponies actually possess an innate form of magic (yeah I'm still calling bull since they didn't even bother showing Tirek trying to drain their "innate magic" during his conquest). I've chalked all of those earth pony characteristics to experience over the years due to generations of earth ponies working the land for years and communal based societies. 

 

If I recall, there was like something (maybe it is from the trading cards?) that suggests that alicorns are not actually a combination representative of all three pony races, but rather only just pegasus and unicorns. I think I vaguely recall something like this being posted on EQD related to the trading cards.

 

So I don't really see Cadance or Twilight as having ever acquired earth pony innate abilities ever.

 

Second question:  I never really noted about life-span longevity of the two royal sisters. That being said, I've never thought about it in that way about Cadance and Twilight being pseudo-alicorns or something to that nature if they have end up having a long life-span. Celestia and Luna IIRC, from the book of the two royal sisters (forgot the exact name), but I think they mention Celestia and Twilight weren't born as alicorns? Actually I think there is another thread with that exact topic questioning their origins. So why are Celestia and Cadance not expected to live as long as life? Beats me, I got nothing

 

Third question: That would be the most likely thought, but there's a reason why everyone is very up anti-Starlight with her magical levels and being able to duel match with Twilight during the season 5 finale.  I'd like to say so, but magic is a very fluid entity in mlp fim and lacking a fixed set of rules to make it more understandable (other than being plot devices)

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yeah I'm still calling bull since they didn't even bother showing Tirek trying to drain their "innate magic" during his conquest

 

I'm pretty sure there was a scene of Tirek implied to have drained the magic from the Earth Ponies at Appleloosa.

 

There is word he has gone after Earth ponies as well. Without their strength, they will not be able to tend the land.

Series canon says that Earth Ponies at least have an innate physical strength.

 

Earth Ponies have a magically ingrained connection to the earth that makes them better at working with plants and animals

Series creator basically says that they have an innate magic that allows them to be better working with agriculture and, I suppose, ranching.

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I'm pretty sure there was a scene of Tirek implied to have drained the magic from the Earth Ponies at Appleloosa.

 

Implied but not seen =/= to having actually occurred.  The fact that they went with implied but not shown is kind of annoying to me because it also gives off the impression that earth ponies weren't even considered a major 'threat' to Tirek's conquest and that all he needed to really do was just round them up in a jail for the time being. Who knows what he did with them in Appaloosa. 

 

 

 

There is word he has gone after Earth ponies as well. Without their strength, they will not be able to tend the land.

 

Vague statement from Celestia. But I get there's an implied strength and strong bond with the earth, but I also get the same kind of implications to generations of families of earth ponies having just tendered the land for years and having passed that knowledge down through generation and generation.  Could be just natural strength and muscle built up over the years just due to hard physical labour.

 

Maud is a nice example of an earth pony with extreme strength. But I always found it funny during that first episode with AJ and Rainbow Dash playing competition during Fall Weather Friends, and AJ ends up losing to RD at hoof-wresting. Hoof-wrestling! - How did she lose that?! I had my money bet on AJ to win that.  But Maud is one earth pony who is gifted with strength. Other earth ponies I'm not so convinced. Cheerilee doesn't strike me as the type to be into heavy-lifting. There could be an innate strength aspect for earth ponies, but I've yet to be convinced of it's existence (Not really arguing here, just throwing my speculations out).

 

 

 

Earth Ponies have a magically ingrained connection to the earth that makes them better at working with plants and animals

 

I'm actually more curious to know what direction the series would've gone in had Faust been able to stay on as series director.  I get the feeling that Faust had the basis of earth pony innate abilities planned out long ago, and it wasn't really changed when we got to Tirek by the fourth season.   I'm not sure how far her influence goes beyond season four, but it probably hasn't changed since her genesis.  But it also seems like they didn't follow up with this after her leaving, to expand upon this idea because I feel it was never really fleshed out.  It could be there, an innate strength and special bond with the earth, I just might not really see it.

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(edited)

Vague statement from Celestia. But I get there's an implied strength and strong bond with the earth, but I also get the same kind of implications to generations of families of earth ponies having just tendered the land for years and having passed that knowledge down through generation and generation.  Could be just natural strength and muscle built up over the years just due to hard physical labour.

Consider the entire quote now:

 

Tirek has stolen enough magic that he now has the strength to steal flight as well. Without Pegasi to control the weather, there will be no rain in Equestria. There is word he has gone after Earth ponies as well. Without their strength, they will not be able to tend the land.

Well, then.

Does this mean that we should get implications of generations of Pegasi being able to fly and manipulate the rain passing down that knowledge through generations and generations? Answer is "no".

 

Celestia said this during her exposition to Twilight, and she treats these traits as part of their magic. It's obvious that the Pegasi's ability to fly is part of their magic, as they drop like rocks once Tirek steals their magic. By looking at the entire quote, it's easy to see that it's not some sort of passed down technique or knowledge or some kind of adaption that Pegasi can fly and manipulate weather and Earth Ponies are strong and good at agriculture by default.

 

...Just giving my points using the show's own words and visuals.

Edited by Ruudo Burei
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Consider the entire quote now:

 

Well, then.

Does this mean that we should get implications of generations of Pegasi being able to fly and manipulate the rain passing down that knowledge through generations and generations? Answer is "no".

 

Celestia said this during her exposition to Twilight, and she treats these traits as part of their magic. It's obvious that the Pegasi's ability to fly is part of their magic, as they drop like rocks once Tirek steals their magic. By looking at the entire quote, it's easy to see that it's not some sort of passed down technique or knowledge or some kind of adaption that Pegasi can fly and manipulate weather and Earth Ponies are strong and good at agriculture by default.

 

...Just giving my points using the show's own words and visuals.

 

Not what I was getting at, but that's due to me not actually stating some other important detail earlier. More to the point, I don't actually perceive the innate earth pony connections that have been stated in the show as being something specifically unique to earth ponies. Having spiritual connections to the earth or possessing tremendous strength doesn't feel like a tangible characteristic that I can easily find consistently across all earth ponies. It's very inconsistent and as a result, I don't consider it as being innate abilities specifically unique to earth ponies. 

 

Pegasus on the other hoof, all seem to have the ability to walk/sit on clouds with ease and without any trouble. Every single Pegasus seems to have this innate ability that is actually noticeable. Same thing with weather manipulation. There hasn't been a pegasus that hasn't been able to display these characteristics.

 

Every unicorn has been able to demonstrate the most basic magical spell, and that is levitation.

 

Put another way:

I'm implying that I don't believe earth ponies are born with a uniquely magical innate ability to be naturally good at nature related occupations. That's in contrast to their peagsus and unicorn cousins, who do seem to born with other secondary magical innate abilities. 

 

Twilight during the episode of Applebuck season, was able to single-handedly pick all the apples from a row of trees all on her own.  The Flim Flam brothers were able to demonstrate that they could produce a machine that could handle making apple cider with ease (when it was within the machine's limit). On a theoretical level, a high level magical unicorn could easily complete the same tasks that a farming earth pony family could do, in less numbers and with less labour. That basically says manually labour can be superseded by magic and machine.. However, that's just looking at results and not really looking at innate abilities or anything.     

 

Another way is this, Pinkie pie's special sense is a trait specifically unique to her, but to no other earth pony.  Maud would be an excellent example of an earth pony displaying these supposed innate magical abilities but, I haven't really seen any other earth pony that is close to Maud's physical skill or her interest in the earth in some way.  Those two characteristics listed with Pinkie and Maud seem unique, but only unique to them and not to the rest of earth pony population. Actually going back to that one episode when the mane cast fell under Twilight's attempt to fix up Starswirl the bearded's spell in Magical mystery cure, IIRC Pinkie Pie ended up getting Applejack's cutie mark. And Pinkie Pie was terrible at trying to manage and tend to the Apple family farm.... which now thinking about it.... is really ironic since she grew up originally on a rock farm. Then again, what they do on a rock farm isn't really the same as tending to a farm. That's why I'm not really convinced about what Celestia said.  When Tirek went on his conquest, he could've drained their stamina. But it wasn't even shown what exactly he did to them, so it's bit of annoyance to me (for other reasons).  I could theorize that Tirek drained earth ponies of their stamina or will to fight back. If so, it might have the same results that Celestia was saying earlier that they don't have the strength to tend to the land.  But I don't really see it as them being drained of some innate magical ability where they are naturally gifted in agricultural production. That's just my perceptions and thoughts.

Edited by pony.colin
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