S07:E09 - Honest Apple

[FlareGun45 2,221]

2 minutes ago, Truffles said:

If it were a new crush, then I agree 100%. But this has been going on for 3+ years in Equestrian time. By now I would expect there to be a good amount of familiarity between the two of them that he wouldn't give a second thought to her thinking he was clingy. Now, if there's been some off-screen pushback by Rarity that we haven't seen, then it makes more sense. But if that's the case, then that's bad writing, IMO, because we have no idea that it happened.

I just don't want Spike to be perfect, that's all. He's shown so much improvement last season that I fear there's nothing he can do wrong without it seeming like a regression to a lesson he's already learned. In fact, I felt he was a little too perfect in "Gauntlet of Fire" and it hurt the episode a bit, even though it was still great overall. Just something to make him not quite a Dudley Do-Right, but still be a stand-up guy in most respects.

Granted, making him into a full-blown stalker is probably too much, but just acknowledging that his obsession with her is unhealthy would make for an interesting lesson and it would be better if it was tackled sooner rather than later. (Though I would submit he crossed the "unhealthy" line when it was revealed back in S5 that in he had a plush toy of her which he sleeps with. That's akin to a person dressing up a Barbie as the girl they like and taking it to bed with them every night. o_o )

A more of a reason for Spike to finally move on. I'm glad they're not just dropping the scenario, but he's gotta move on at some point. Season 8, I'm pretty sure this crush is going to be a thing in the past! The only reason it's still around is because the characters shouldn't change too much personality-wise before the movie.

[BastementSparkle 20,312]

5 minutes ago, Truffles said:

If it were a new crush, then I agree 100%. But this has been going on for 3+ years in Equestrian time. By now I would expect there to be a good amount of familiarity between the two of them that he wouldn't give a second thought to her thinking he was clingy. Now, if there's been some off-screen pushback by Rarity that we haven't seen, then it makes more sense. But if that's the case, then that's bad writing, IMO, because we have no idea that it happened.

I've known my best friend for years and I occasionally get worried about coming across as clingy despite no obvious pushback, sometimes I'll outright assume he thinks negatively about me despite no signs of such a thing. So, to me it's not too unbelievable that even after all this time he'd be worried about something like that. As Jeric pointed out though, that likely wasn't the writers intent.

8 minutes ago, Truffles said:

I just don't want Spike to be perfect, that's all. He's shown so much improvement last season that I fear there's nothing he can do wrong without it seeming like a regression to a lesson he's already learned. In fact, I felt he was a little too perfect in "Gauntlet of Fire" and it hurt the episode a bit, even though it was still great overall. Just something to make him not quite a Dudley Do-Right, but still be a stand-up guy in most respects.

Granted, making him into a full-blown stalker is probably too much, but just acknowledging that his obsession with her is unhealthy would make for an interesting lesson and it would be better if it was tackled sooner rather than later. (Though I would submit he crossed the "unhealthy" line when it was revealed back in S5 that in he had a plush toy of her which he sleeps with. That's akin to a person dressing up a Barbie as the girl they like and taking it to bed with them every night. o_o )

Fair enough. I think they've done overall a really good job with Spike the last two seasons, but I can understand the worry considering how hit or miss he was previously. Too often when the writers want to make Spike flawed they kind of go overboard with it.

[Dark Qiviut 22,173]

An annoyance, but the way it's set up is forced. Through how it's worded and implicated, she chose Hoity, Finish, and AJ as judges without asking them first and on whims without even a thought of a backup plan. It'd make much more sense if Rarity:

1. Decided to find AJ and ask her if she can take part first before making those posters and plans for her contest.
2. Asked another judge to review practicality and then turned to AJ when they either canceled or declined the invitation.

Quote

AJ: My closet's nothing but 20 versions of this hat.

Pretty sneaky of DHX to plug in a Somepony to Watch Over Me reference.

[King of Snake 54]

Well that was fantastic, so I came on here fully expecting everyone to hate it like they always do when I love an episode. I'm not surprised therefore that the episode isn't doing well in the poll above - though I've noticed that the comments section is much more positive. That was an excellent 22 minutes of slapstick and character-based comedy. Rarity's guitar solo was fantastic. Wonderful to see Hoity Toity and Photo Finish making proper appearances. I've always thought these two characters were criminally underused. I believe this is the first time since season 1 that Hoity Toity has appeared. And I know Photo Finish makes occasional appearances (she's in the opening titles nowadays of course) but this is her first speaking role (not including Equestria Girls) since the first season. This was everything I want from an MLP episode. All in all a great debut from this new writer, Kevin Lappin. Also: Photo Finish showing her eyes for the first time and a pony with a spider cutie mark!

Applejack and Rarity get a lot of episodes together, don't they? Which is strange since they're light years apart in terms of personality. Still, I'm not complaining since their my two favourite characters out of the mane six.

Another thing: this was the second time this season that Countess Coloratura has been mentioned. Is this leading up to another appearance? I hope so.

Edited May 14, 2017 by King of Snake

[Oleks 1,983]

It was a decent Rarijack episode in my opinion. Way better than the one from the last season or the one from S5. And yes, I qualify Rarijack episodes as a subclass of MLP episodes, don’t judge me.

I really liked the lesson they tried to teach the audience – you have to choose words when expressing your opinion about the results of someone’s hard work, even if you don’t like them. That’s why I try to be careful when talking about episodes I dislike – I know how much work is usually put into them.

As for the characters: Rarity – I liked how she taught AJ her lesson, very nice trolling; Applejack – she was over the top at some moments, which was strange; Pinkie Pie – Pinkie Pie: Photo Finish – finally she is back with a speaking role (although it’s a shame Powder Rouge wasn’t with her); Hoity-Toity – was there: the newbie designer ponies – they had another goth pony – good, put her in an episode with Moonlight Raven. 

All things considered, this episode should have been made solely for the guitar scene. Before I saw it I thought “my jaw dropped” was a figurative expression.

Spoiler

 

[Ganondox 899]

This one drove me to laughter multiple times, between Pinkie's out-of-tune strumming versus Rarity's neoclassical shredding (whelp, there goes a fanfic a wrote ), and the irl-youtube-comments with Strawberry and Applejack. Much better than I was expecting from the mediocre synopsis. Also, Assholejack needs to become a thing. 

Edited May 14, 2017 by Ganondox

[Daring_Do 552]

4 hours ago, Goat-kun said:

Oh look, Pinkie got her brains back. She should really ease on those moon flower seeds. Anyhow, I'm completely on the side of utility. Buck bourgeois fashion, hail plebeian functionality! I don't like apples either. Still doesn't make AJ's argument any less valid. Fashion is ludicrous since it is a dysfunctional and completely self-serving art for rich folk. Different kinds of fruit are not since you can still eat your preferred kind, plus they are a part of the ecosystem that exists with or without us. To state that two sides of an argument will always be equal to one another is sophistry. That said, people have the right to choose their own poison.

 

You're sounding an awful lot like a commie.

[Dark Qiviut 22,173]

Maybe a little dramatic, but that was dumb of Apple Bloom to fold her cowcolt hat so far down like that and keep it down with that scarf. Given her history of watching Applejack buck those apples, she oughta know that it wouldn't work. This contrivance could've been way more subtle than that.

[Ganondox 899]

3 hours ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

Being only about 4 minutes in, I haven't finished watching the episode yet, but I agree with Mesme here about not caring how fashionable my clothes are. As long they keep warm during the winter, cool during the summer, and carry my everyday pocket items (keys, wallet, phone, etc.) I don't really care what I wear! 

Of course, I will dress in nicer clothes when doing more professional stuff like job interviews. 

If I could sum up the conflict of this episode using tropes, I'd say it's "Awesome, but Impractical" vs."Boring, but Practical" , and maybe "Simple, but Awesome" might be brought up here! 

Well, back to the show!

Cool! Hoity Toity and Photo Finish have finally spoken since Season 1!

Hey! I think this is the first time we've seen Photo Finish's eyes behind those shades: Purple!

This is actually the core trope of the episode: You Keep Using That Word

3 hours ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

Heh! the strawberries vs. apples thing was a nice way of showing how different people have different tastes! Personally, these are the 5 fruits I love to eat from best to good, but not the best: Strawberries, grapes, apples, oranges, bananas. 

Heck, I find Spinach disgusting, but adore broccoli! Even though I hate spinach, I cheer every time Popeye uses it to give himself a boost to knock the living daylights out of the bad guy!

OMG, your taste in fruits and vegetables is the worst, so incredibly plebeian, wtf is wrong with you?  

Actual best fruits: 

1. Siriguela

2. Figs

3. Kiwi

4. Pears

6. Strawberry 

Best vegetables:

1. Celery

2. Okra 

3. Cabbage

4. Carrots

5. Cucumbers

[Jeric 46,834]

Celery is phenomenal with hummus and beads of goat cheese ... ants on a log style! Also this thread is officially celery celebration thread! 

Second watch, I still laughed heartily at a few scenes. Twas good Rarijack. 

"Take it all down" reminded me of my "Shut It Down" Rarity meme I posted as MLPF sunsetted and became MLPF 2.0

[Dark Qiviut 22,173]

*sees that pony wearing the disco ball vest*

o__O

Okay, how the hay can anyone walk around or sit in that? That's fallout shelter clothing!

[Goat-kun 2,498]

4 hours ago, Dark Qiviut said:

You're wrong. To a lot of people, fashion is also an extension of their creativity and/or personality. Rarity sees fashion from a graphic designer perspective. Not just how it's designed, but how it speaks to people and how it connotates. Fashion is her gateway to creativity.

You are not wrong in a vacuum. I am sorry but that is not the fashion I see when I look at what Rarity has been creating. Is it an expression of someone's personality? Yes. Everything can become an expression of someone's personality. Alongside creativity, these are neither bad nor good. Their interpretations are a different matter. Fashionistas tend to forget that such art shouldn't upstage function. After all, clothing is considered a necessity in many conditions. Thus AJ's stance is not only expected but completely reasonable. There are not many people among us who want to buy clothes just because they fancy them.

4 hours ago, Jeric said:

Please elaborate on how fashion is dysfunctional. If I wear a dress shirt, it serves a function as clothing no matter the designer or stitching. Because it's tailored well and branded with a big name does not remove it's functionality. 

Also, fashion crosses socio economic lines, so I don't know what you mean by that.

You've already answered your own question. It's not fashion. It's function. The true beauty of attire is hidden in purpose and in how well it performs. Of course, I am not against customization for the sake of superficial beauty or expression of personality; however, if beauty and expression are its primary purpose, or if they impede a function of work attire, then the world of fashion should get a clue and stop taking itself so seriously. It is no secret that Rarity is not my favorite pony, her convictions worthless in my eyes. Still, she is a decent FIM character. So don't mind me and move along.

49 minutes ago, Daring_Do said:

You're sounding an awful lot like a commie.

Oh, the situation is far, far worse. I'm a right-winger.

[碇 シンジン 27,427]

good episode tough AJ was bit too rough at times I think 

[Luminance 2,181]

Rarity shredding that guitar was unexpectedly great!    

[Ganondox 899]

3 hours ago, Truffles said:

If it were a new crush, then I agree 100%. But this has been going on for 3+ years in Equestrian time. By now I would expect there to be a good amount of familiarity between the two of them that he wouldn't give a second thought to her thinking he was clingy. Now, if there's been some off-screen pushback by Rarity that we haven't seen, then it makes more sense. But if that's the case, then that's bad writing, IMO, because we have no idea that it happened.

I just don't want Spike to be perfect, that's all. He's shown so much improvement last season that I fear there's nothing he can do wrong without it seeming like a regression to a lesson he's already learned. In fact, I felt he was a little too perfect in "Gauntlet of Fire" and it hurt the episode a bit, even though it was still great overall. Just something to make him not quite a Dudley Do-Right, but still be a stand-up guy in most respects.

Granted, making him into a full-blown stalker is probably too much, but just acknowledging that his obsession with her is unhealthy would make for an interesting lesson and it would be better if it was tackled sooner rather than later. (Though I would submit he crossed the "unhealthy" line when it was revealed back in S5 that in he had a plush toy of her which he sleeps with. That's akin to a person dressing up a Barbie as the girl they like and taking it to bed with them every night. o_o )

Considering with last episode we got an example of where to go with a mutual romantic relationship, this is a good place for showing people what to do when it's unrequited. Really something that's important to be teaching people nowadays. 

[Dark Qiviut 22,173]

1 hour ago, Goat-kun said:

I am sorry but that is not the fashion I see when I look at what Rarity has been creating.

Rarity creates a fashion as an extent of her creativity, but she also understands how well they should not only feel and look, but function, too. Episodes like Suited for Success, A Canterlot Wedding (where she adjusted Dash's clothing to make it lighter and looser), Suite & Elite, RTM, Investigates, and Canterlot Boutique show how much she gets it. Episodes that show the exact opposite hurts her characterization.

1 hour ago, Goat-kun said:

There are not many people among us who want to buy clothes just because they fancy them.

Doesn't make the fashionista's perspective worthless. Those like Rarity analyze fashion through a creative perspective, and that's really crucial in today's world. As someone with a creative background, I can really relate to that.

1 hour ago, Goat-kun said:

It's not fashion. It's function.

Function IS a part of fashion. It isn't its own category. Function (not simply physical, but spiritual, too, if applicable) are crucial in a lot of cultures. Clothing worn by many Native-Americans/Indigenous Peoples past and present are very symbolic and speak to them personally; many of their dance costumes and accompanying dances date back generations. Many Muslim women wear hijabs in respect of their religion and practices. To millions of people (either the designer, wearer, or both), fashion is a major representation and extension of their identity.

1 hour ago, Goat-kun said:

It is no secret that Rarity is not my favorite pony, her convictions worthless in my eyes.

Then you don't understand Rarity at all, and I suggest better understanding of her best qualities next time.

Edited May 14, 2017 by Dark Qiviut

[Thrond 3,257]

This sure is a Rarijack episode. 

[Will Guide 21,325]

1 hour ago, Ganondox said:

This is actually the core trope of the episode: You Keep Using That Word

OMG, your taste in fruits and vegetables is the worst, so incredibly plebeian, wtf is wrong with you?  

Actual best fruits: 

1. Siriguela 

Best vegetables:

2. Okra 

Why is the trope, You Keep Using That Word, a central trope to the episode?

Also, I never heard of "Siriguela" or "Okra" ever in my life!

[Ganondox 899]

1 hour ago, Goat-kun said:

You are not wrong in a vacuum. I am sorry but that is not the fashion I see when I look at what Rarity has been creating. Is it an expression of someone's personality? Yes. Everything can become an expression of someone's personality. Alongside creativity, these are neither bad nor good. Their interpretations are a different matter. Fashionistas tend to forget that such art shouldn't upstage function. After all, clothing is considered a necessity in many conditions. Thus AJ's stance is not only expected but completely reasonable. There are not many people among us who want to buy clothes just because they fancy them.

You've already answered your own question. It's not fashion. It's function. The true beauty of attire is hidden in purpose and in how well it performs. Of course, I am not against customization for the sake of superficial beauty or expression of personality; however, if beauty and expression are its primary purpose, or if they impede a function of work attire, then the world of fashion should get a clue and stop taking itself so seriously. It is no secret that Rarity is not my favorite pony, her convictions worthless in my eyes. Still, she is a decent FIM character. So don't mind me and move along.

Oh, the situation is far, far worse. I'm a right-winger.

I think the point you're missing is that function IS important, and that's why Rarity chose Applejack, but she went WAY too far, and started criticizing everything she didn't like even if they had only minimal impact on function.  

[Dark Qiviut 22,173]

>mare explains that how the wind and bird's song harmonizes inspired her dress in an ear-piercing, stereotypical valley girl accent

>lowers low earphone volume

Ouch.

I'm with Applejack on this one.

[Ganondox 899]

13 minutes ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

Why is the trope, You Keep Using That Word, a central trope to the episode?

Also, I never heard of "Siriguela" or "Okra" ever in my life!

You know what the trope name is a reference to, right? Now watch the episode again and see if you can catch it. 

Siriguela is a Brazilian fruit that's extremely hard to get a hold of because not only are they rather obscure, they don't ship well. Even in Brazil you won't find them in your super markets. It's basically this kinda generic looking small orange fruit that's just a thin layer of the most delicious flesh over a massive seed. Okra though is a fairly common vegetable in the US, you just need to need to eat the right sort of cuisine, I think in terms of American cuisine soul food uses it a lot, but it's also used a lot in Indian and Ethiopian cooking. It's basically this seed pod which is cut into hexagonal slices. It's best eaten fried and salted, which is probably why it's one of the best vegetables. 

5 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

>mare explains that how the wind and bird's song harmonizes inspired her dress in an ear-piercing, stereotypical valley girl accent

>lowers low earphone volume

Ouch.

I'm with Applejack on this one.

I really liked her design, but once she opened her mouth I couldn't stand that horse. Worst voice really needs to be retired. 

_

Just noticed some fridge brilliance in this episode: Applejack complaining about the clothes being all black IS a practical complaint, because that would get really hot in the sun really fast. 

Edited May 14, 2017 by Ganondox

[Dynamo Pad 10,777]

At first, I wasn't sure what to really think of the episode. However, after watching the episode again, I can truly say that I liked the episode. It's great to see Photo Finish and Hoity Toity again. It felt like we haven't seen them in such a long time. So, it feels refreshing to see the two of them making a reappearance. Lily Lace, Star Streaker and Inky Rose were nice additional characters. Their designs and personalities were also pretty interesting as well. It was also interesting to see Applejack being a judge and the "What?" joke was pretty funny. I loved it when Rarity started to play the guitar. I could understand Applejack's opinion when it came to things like the multiple buttons on the outfit. Although, some things, like the feather hat didn't really need to be changed. I like how Rarity had Strawberry Sunrise help Applejack learn what the problem was. All in all, I liked the moral and I thought the episode was okay. I'm looking forward to what comes next in this season.   

[Mesme Rize 15,681]

1 hour ago, Dark Qiviut said:

*sees that pony wearing the disco ball vest*

o__O

Okay, how the hay can anyone walk around or sit in that? That's fallout shelter clothing!

I thought that too. Maybe she tries to be a living Katamari.

 

[Dark Qiviut 22,173]

10 minutes ago, Ganondox said:

I really liked her design, but once she opened her mouth I couldn't stand that horse. Worst voice really needs to be retired. 

That joke would've worked far better if she sounded smarter, didn't drag her reasoning out, and had a voice that didn't feel faker than Shadow the Hedgehog.

[digit112 89]

This episode takes a really interesting angle, I think. It's actually just the lesson of how you shouldn't care about what other people think, but from the point of view of the judge. Instead of the designers learning that their opinion of their own work is what matters most, we have Applejack learning that her opinion isn't really what matters. The designers do care about her opinion, but in the long run, its the designers' art, not hers. Along those lines it's also about damn time they got around to the Honesty problem. They managed to go 6 seasons without bringing up the fact that being to honest can be a problem, but they did it, and explained/resolved it wonderfully.

It's actually really cool because it also parallels Twilight's story arc. Twilight was a student, but became a teacher to Starlight and, even now, still learns new lessons. And here we have Rarity. Remember when she was the one competing in the fashion shows? Back when Photo Finish and Hoity Toity were first introduced. Well now shes putting on the shows herself. I think that is a wonderful reminder of how the show really is evolving over time, and at a steady pace. It's one of the reasons I personally love mlp over any other random little girls' shows.

Plus, it's always good to know that mane 6 characters still have lessons to learn, so we don't just have to have CMC and Starlight the entire season.