S07:E13 - The Perfect Pear

[Meeps 297]

Just now, Jeric said:

How old are we talking about? An average five year old cannot typically grasp certain realities of death anyway. It's kids of this age (not parents) that naturally connect death with sleeping since they haven't made the leap to more abstract ideas like permanence. In this case the parents are actually doing more damage in trying to explain something a child of that age cannot fully comprehend. Over-explaining to young children creates resistance to new ideas and concepts that may be challenging when they have the ability to grasp abstract concepts because they associate that with frustration. 

If we are talking about a 10 year old, an argument can be made that it's redundant. They have likely explored the concept of death internally, provided they were force fed it too young. 

Don't get me wrong, kids are often talked down to when they shouldn't be by media, but it's often because media creators are typically ignorant of childhood neurology and development. 

Anywhere from toddler age up to about 10 was what I saw. A few parents even walked out of the theater, although I only saw a couple of walk-outs in the 3 showings I went to (I know, I know...) but they were with younger kids.

The parent of one young boy went on about how it's not fair for a children's show to take out such a well known and liked character, which was interesting to me because death typically isn't very picky.

[Jeric 46,834]

Just now, Meeps said:

Anywhere from toddler age up to about 10 was what I saw. A few parents even walked out of the theater, although I only saw a couple of walk-outs in the 3 showings I went to (I know, I know...) but they were with younger kids.

The parent of one young boy went on about how it's not fair for a children's show to take out such a well known and liked character, which was interesting to me because death typically isn't very picky.

The older kids are more than capable of grasping death. The parents of the younger ones (the toddlers for instance) I get completely. 

I still have to explain to my nephew and (so far) two neices why their aunt Jessi isn't there, and they were at her memorial in January. It's a constant dialog and will be for a while. One even has taken to sleeping with with a picture of her under her pillow because she is afraid if it isn't there she will forget her and she will never come back. 

Our understanding of death, and it's realities, cannot be pushed on kids with the expectation that they will see it the way we will. A young child's way of grieving is so night and day from ours that it is heartbreaking in a different sort of way. 

Eventually if will inform their view on death in a unique way, but it takes time for concepts to properly coelesce around new budding revelations. 

[Meeps 297]

8 minutes ago, Jeric said:

The older kids are more than capable of grasping death. The parents of the younger ones (the toddlers for instance) I get completely. 

I still have to explain to my nephew and (so far) two neices why their aunt Jessi isn't there, and they were at her memorial in January. It's a constant dialog and will be for a while. One even has taken to sleeping with with a picture of her under her pillow because she is afraid if it isn't there she will forget her and she will never come back. 

Our understanding of death, and it's realities, cannot be pushed on kids with the expectation that they will see it the way we will. A young child's way of grieving is so night and day from ours that it is heartbreaking in a different sort of way. 

Eventually if will inform their view on death in a unique way, but it takes time for concepts to properly coelesce around new budding revelations. 

I suppose I digress. I grew up watching shows like Watership Down, and cannot remember a time when I was confused regarding death. But along that same vein, I had no one of great importance die on me at a young age, and have not had to deal with explaining to children what it is/how to cope with it. Your real-world experience makes it easier to understand why parents would be upset.

[Truffles 2,033]

Apologies in advance for straying off the topic of the episode for a bit....

9 hours ago, Music Chart Fan said:

I don't think I was ever a fan of Rugrats, even when I was ostensibly in the target demographic back in its heyday, so I personally would prefer explanations other than that one, haha.

I enjoyed it back in the day, and I -wasn't- their target audience, lol. It hasn't aged as well as some other shows I used to like, however, and the initial run I felt was better than the reprise. some years later

The episode that hooked me on it was "I Remember Melville," which, in a strange confluence of events here in how the latest posts have been on the topic of kids handling death, was an episode that dealt directly with Chuckie having to deal with the death of his pet bug. I was surprised a kid's show would be bold enough to handle such a touchy topic and not pull any punches. So I guess that episode alone brought about enough good will in me to follow the rest of the series until it ended.

 

5 hours ago, Meeps said:

I still remember the lava storm that followed the death scene in How to Train Your Dragon 2. While much more graphic, I was actually astounded at how many parents felt the need to explain to their children that "the character isn't dead, they just had to go away and the dragons will bring them back later." Seriously?!??

I have to admit the death in that film bummed me out about part 2. By the end of the film, it seemed like a pointless thing to do to that character. I thought maybe it would affect Toothless in some way and add to his development but by the end of the film he didn't seem to have any negative impact on his psyche.

I guess for that reason alone and because MLP really isn't a serial with a continuing story between episodes I really don't want to see them kill off any main characters in the show. It would seem senseless in the show's current design and tone.

[Meeps 297]

6 hours ago, Truffles said:

I have to admit the death in that film bummed me out about part 2. By the end of the film, it seemed like a pointless thing to do to that character. I thought maybe it would affect Toothless in some way and add to his development but by the end of the film he didn't seem to have any negative impact on his psyche.

Without trying to hijack this thread, I did find this to be very strange myself. You'd think an event like that would have a bigger impact on the characters who lived and interacted with the person in question on a daily basis, but nope. The story kind of moved right along!

[Stickman, The Legend 303]

Overall, I just saw the plot, but again, overall, It's the episode we've all been waiting for, other than A Royal Problem. I have a feeling we'll be seeing more of Applejack's parents in the future. To that, I say!

[Kyoshi Frost Wolf 40,207]

As I have stated before, I love this episode, the more I watch it, the better it gets.

The thing is, the more I watch it, I also feel more and more sorrow for Grand Pear. He was so wrapped up in his own hatred and the feud that he missed so much with his family, including his daughter whom we can assume is no longer alive. That is pretty brutal to think about. The excellent voice acting really helps this too. This might be obvious because it is in the episode's credits, but Grand Pear is voiced by William Shatner, this is the role they hinted at before. I found that quite surprising as it was a character I never would have expected, but he nailed it. He did a fantastic job at expressing the character, both in the flashbacks and in his older age.

Grand Pear might actually be my favorite part of the episode for the reasons above. The fact that the episode is able to make me feel sadness for Grand Pear so much is a testament to how good it all is.

[Jeric 46,834]

6 hours ago, Kyoshi said:

As I have stated before, I love this episode, the more I watch it, the better it gets.

The thing is, the more I watch it, I also feel more and more sorrow for Grand Pear. He was so wrapped up in his own hatred and the feud that he missed so much with his family, including his daughter whom we can assume is no longer alive. That is pretty brutal to think about. The excellent voice acting really helps this too. This might be obvious because it is in the episode's credits, but Grand Pear is voiced by William Shatner, this is the role they hinted at before. I found that quite surprising as it was a character I never would have expected, but he nailed it. He did a fantastic job at expressing the character, both in the flashbacks and in his older age.

Grand Pear might actually be my favorite part of the episode for the reasons above. The fact that the episode is able to make me feel sadness for Grand Pear so much is a testament to how good it all is.

His story is so extraordinarily tragic, and actually one that can be applied universally. Not everyone will find that perfect match, but almost everyone will face a choice in their lives that can lead to regret. 

[Equus 91]

I bawled like a baby. Didn't even make it to the song before the waterworks began, and by the end of it I was left staring at my laptop screen in absolute shock for several minutes. Then was up until 3am sharing feels on local poni FB groups with others who had seen it, and the reaction was pretty much universal.

Song - best of the entire show for me. I cannot listen to any part of it without sobbing even if just the audio without the clips.

Episode - best of the entire show by far for me. Heavier than warehouses full of bricks and sweeter than the world's honey reserves. Seven years of emotion crammed into 22 minutes.

Characters - Pear Butter is now my favorite character on the show. Such a sweetheart and their romance is SO ADORABLE JUST WOW

I've been in the fandom since May 2011, over six years. I've teared up just a little before but all the episodes before and all the fan content combined can't come close to hitting me as hard as this episode did. Congrats, a pony episode finally made me cry rivers.

And that's from someone who both isn't an AJ fan and still has both parents living.

[Buttonmash1973 1,024]

That was just an OK episode

Edited July 2, 2017 by Buttonmash1973

[Ganondox 899]

On 6/24/2017 at 6:47 AM, Truffles said:

The idea that they were communicating ala "Rugrats" had crossed my mind as well, and in fact was my initial thought. But I liked @Jeric's narrative theory so much I've adopted it as my headcannon for that scene.

Though I can't entirely discount the possibility that the story being told was accurate and that they really were toddler sweethearts. 

Hmm, I'm going to have to go back and watch that episode to see if there's a specific statement as to how they are related to one another as cousins. That would definitely mean Bright had siblings if they're first cousins!

Plus I don't need much of an excuse to go watch Huffy the Magic Dragon get some respect by the buffalo again. 

I guess technically they might not be first cousins, but I think that's the intended explanation. 

[Star Petal 215]

wow...the first time I have ever seen one of these without anypony voting it a 1 or a 2. 

It was probably the most heart warming episode ever. The only thing I wish they covered was how they died. I don't think we will ever know. 

[Hierok 11,829]

I am still wondering why Granny never saw that tree. I think it would be better if Granny showed that tree to them. 

[Queen Cassie 3,057]

Both my Harold and I were crying pretty hard by the end of this episode. Both of us agreed it was the best in season seven so far and possibly the single best episode of the show period.

The emotional maturity of this episode was something we haven't seen in a long time, if ever, on this show. We've had tiny bits and pieces of it scattered here and there--Granny Smith's story in Family Appreciation Day comes to mind--but not for a full episode. Pear Butter and Bright Mac are also easily my favorite pair of Mane Six parents, because while Fluttershy's were, well, shy, and Rainbow's too exuberant, PB and BM were just plain wonderful.

And they're dead. They're dead, they died. It's what everyone's thought from the beginning but never did I expect that the show would ever actually confirm it. Oh we had a sense of it in the show ever since those twin stars from Apple Family Reunion all the way back in season three, and again in what Applejack said to Apple Bloom at the end of The Fault in Our Cutie Marks (and then their failure to appear entirely in Where the Apple Lies) but I just didn't think they'd go so far as to say it outright. And although they did not specifically say the words "they're dead" they did in just about every other way.

I have not yet rewatched the episode because I don't want to spoil myself on it too soon, but it was so touching. I had never expected a straight ship in this show would garner my interest and appreciation this much, and yet I cried for their love during the whole series of events.

And holy damn did William Shatner do a hell of a job in his guest appearance! I didn't even realize that was him, probably because I like everyone else bought into the whole idea that Shatner can only ham things up even though that's not true.

Bright Mac (is his full name Bright Macintosh or is it literally just Mac?) having Apple Bloom's colors makes me hope that when she grows to be an adult, Apple Bloom will be the same size as her father and brother. I've been hoping for that for a long time but I really hope it now.

Pear Butter was just, god she was such a wonderful character and it's a shame we will never get to see her again. (She was so gorgeous too... you were a lucky stallion, Bright Mac, because daaaaaayum.) At least, we won't unless DHX is allowed by Hasbro to show us how they died, and uh, I don't think that's gonna ever happen.

Regardless it's become my new favorite episode, like, ever.

[KatonRyu 1,026]

I really liked seeing AJ's parents. I liked seeing their relationship progress as they got older, and hearing the interactions the other ponies had with them. Pear Butter's song was also absolutely amazing and it gets even more points from me since she was strumming that guitar left-hooved. While I'm reasonably sure we're never going to find out how they died, it was still really cool to see them, and to hear about the traits they passed on to their children. This might well be one of my favorite episodes in the series.

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,151]

@Dark Qiviut

Considering this upcoming airdate this topic has been moved.

[Buttonmash1973 1,024]

So the hiatus is over, and next week a brandnew episode.

[Batbrony 15,994]

*deep breath* It's no secret that pretty much each and every one of us has been holding onto our plots with the greatest of anticipation ever since we heard this episode's synopsis.  For me, this episode even takes on new, personal meaning as I now have a girlfriend who I am very much in love with (and who very much loves me back); I hope that added element makes this episode even more delightful than it already should prove to be.  This could be one of those special, show-changing game changer episodes people, possibly even in the range of "best-episode-ever" territory, so let's just sit back and enjoy it for all it's worth.  Strap yourselves in, folks.  Here. We. Go. 

[Jeric 46,834]

Its going to be a blast seeing the opinions of those that waited. Since the early release I've seen this about five times and it has been solidified as my favorite episode of the series. 

[Batbrony 15,994]

Oh boy, I can tell they're already setting us up for some SERIOUS feels.  Goodness gracious me... 

[Props Valroa 25,949]

Hm. I watched it in its entirety finally. I loved it and I also shed a few tears towards the end. Some parts were also funny like when they tried to hide the pear jar. 

[Batbrony 15,994]

Ohhhhhhhhhhhh, Buttercup, that explains a lot.  Also, dat meet-cute... holy shit, dat meet-cute.   

[PoisonClaw 8,153]

I'm dying from the adorable sweetness here. I can already see why this is the breakout episode this season.

[Batbrony 15,994]

    

Holy. Shit.

I gotta learn that song for my girlfriend, ASAP!!! 

[Sparklefan1234 161,573]

I'm *not* crying! I...I just have something in my eye. 

Edited August 5, 2017 by Sparklefan1234