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WiiGuy2014

Why the Unfair Character Bashing?

85 posts in this topic

I'll never understand why people do continue to bash on Characters who clearly got better (Zephyr Breeze, Starlight to some, Feather Bangs), and yet forgive Characters who did so much worse and acting like the worst they did is nothing compared to the bashed character (Discord mind raping the ponies in the past).I love Discord, but why are characters like him being treated better than Characters that did far less harm and actually got better as a person, like Zephyr?

At least Zephyr got better as time goes on, which is more than I can say for people like the Flim-Flam Bros., SvenGallop, and the Food Critic from S6's "Spice Up Your Life", all who never got better and stayed jerks! I understand the hate on the latter characters because they didn't change, but characters like Zephyr Breeze who overcome his insecurities and actually did something with himself continue to get the shaft! At least Feather Bangs accepted the fact that Sugar Belle chose Big Mac as her special somepony and moved on to other ponies who were interested in him. At least he didn't act like Gaston, who tried to kill the Beast because Belle loved him instead. Feather Bangs is morally better than Gaston by moving on with another and yet he get bashed like they're no redeeming qualities about him!

To me, it's very unfair to the character who actually learns a lesson and get morally better to be bashed like this by the viewers. It makes no sense. And I would like a straight answer as to why this unfair character bashing on any character like Zephyr Breeze or Feather Bangs exists.

Remember, This topic doesn't apply only to Zephyr Breeze and Feather Bangs; it applies to any character that seems to be unfairly bashed.

Edited by WiiGuy2014
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Especially Feather Bangs; unlike the others you mentioned, he didn't even do anything scummy in the first place.

Edited by A.V.
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Cause most people bash characters they perceive as shit, not the characters that do shitty things. They will rationalize, they will preach morals, but in the end it's all in personal preference.

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With characters there can be any number of reasons people dislike them. It's art so it's hard to call it unfair really. For example, when I saw this scene ..  

full.png

I instantly dismissed and disliked Rarity. In fact, that part of the episode is why I personally stopped watching the show way back in the day. Obviously I eventually changed my mind.

I've heard some say to me that they can't stand Rarity because she reminds them of a family member or classmate they don't like. That's fair to me. 

In the case of Feather Bang, the idea of a parody of a pop star is one thing, but a pop star that is often the target of ridicule by some makes the choice curious. Then you add in the whole concept of two characters fighting over a girl. These are fair reasons to dislike a character. Big Mac doesn't usually gets free pass from people that disliked FB. 

Zephyr was seen by some as a poorly crafted dig at Millennials and stereotypes surrounding them, so that is a perfectly understandable interpretation. 

I see Goat-Kun just replied. Yay for notifications. Great example to use. The guy isn't a fan of several characters that I like and he has his reasons. Here is the thing, he really does not need a bloody reason to dislike a character. Nobody does. It's art. If a character doesn't land for you, it's fine. 

The counter to this question is what I'm going to toss out here. Why is it such a big deal if someone doesn't like a character that someone else does? If I dislike Feather Bang, does it really harm anything for anyone. Enjoy the show your way and they will enjoy the show their way. 

21 minutes ago, Goat-kun said:

Cause most people bash characters they perceive as shit, not the characters that do shitty things. They will rationalize, they will preach morals, but in the end it's all in personal preference.

 

Oh hell dude. We agree on something. Help!

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That was my bad memory, sorry friend. You explained it to me, and also sorry that our talk partly led to this (albeit interesting since more people will weigh in) thread.

That said, there are people who will continue to dislike a character even after said character has been improved or somehow redeemed. There are just some that cannot like a character for one reason or another. I feel people are entitled to their opinions

Edited by Lektra Bolt
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While not a valid excuse in my mind, it comes down to entertainment value for some.

There’s evil and then there’s entertainingly evil. It can be a lot easier for some people to excuse an evil character if they have a lot of charisma. But an annoying jerk is always on the chopping block. Or heck, just being obnoxious can get a character loads of hate.

And while probably generalizing, I feel a small part of the hatred of characters like Zephyr and Trenderhoof stems from them DARING to have a thing for some viewers’ “waifus”.

How DARE he flirt with MY horse goddess!! *clutches plushie in rage*

Edited by ShadOBabe
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2 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

How DARE he flirt with MY horse goddess!! *clutches plushie in rage*

That's plushie abuse! D:

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6 minutes ago, Jeric said:

That's plushie abuse! D:

Remember people: Take care of your plushies.

f03afd684ca8c12dfda499568c2f231e--little

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So far, this topic is handled much better than the last time I made a topic about this subject. I may not agree with all of you who answered. But at least the answers are being civil compared to other topics with a similar question.

Thank you.:)

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20 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

Remember people: Take care of your plushies.

f03afd684ca8c12dfda499568c2f231e--little

Aw but then if I do that with my plush too much something bad will happen. A box is safe for the plush and keeps the plush clean of dust, even though I'm not a kid. My plush only comes out for conventions

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Ya know I think people bash unfairly on characters simply because they can and they may just find that certain character irritating when they are on screen. I'm sure some people have actual reasons for disliking and therefore giving a certain character hate, but I'm sure there are others out there who just don't like a certain character simply for the unknown reason of just not really liking a character. Basically what I'm saying is that some people will just hate things to hate things, while others will have reasons for hating things.   

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2 hours ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

I'll never understand why people do continue to bash on Characters who clearly got better (Zephyr Breeze, Starlight to some, Feather Bangs), and yet forgive Characters who did so much worse and acting like the worst they did is nothing compared to the bashed character (Discord mind raping the ponies in the past).I love Discord, but why are characters like him being treated better than Characters that did far less harm and actually got better as a person, like Zephyr?

At least Zephyr got better as time goes on, which is more than I can say for people like the Flim-Flam Bros., SvenGallop, and the Food Critic from S6's "Spice Up Your Life", all who never got better and stayed jerks! I understand the hate on the latter characters because they didn't change, but characters like Zephyr Breeze who overcome his insecurities and actually did something with himself continue to get the shaft! At least Feather Bangs accepted the fact that Sugar Belle chose Big Mac as her special somepony and moved on to other ponies who were interested in him. At least he didn't act like Gaston, who tried to kill the Beast because Belle loved him instead. Feather Bangs is morally better than Gaston by moving on with another and yet he get bashed like they're no redeeming qualities about him!

To me, it's very unfair to the character who actually learns a lesson and get morally better to be bashed like this by the viewers. It makes no sense. And I would like a straight answer as to why this unfair character bashing on any character like Zephyr Breeze or Feather Bangs exists.

 

First of all, don't take other people's opinions so personally. This starting post ^^ is very aggressive and implies a lot of emotional frustration, so please put it behind you man.

Characters in stories are best thought of as devices for plot. The villains and other sorts of trouble-makers are tools to create interest, drama and conflict. Discord was designed to be unpredictable and unsettling. Zephyr Breeze was designed to be annoying and stereotypical. Feather Bangs was designed to be smooze beta-male that had 'all the right stuff' and abused it (we all know one).

They are all supposed to be disliked. If they were not dislikeable, we wouldn't root for the protagonists to change them or reset/resist their actions. This is not to say that they cannot be attractive or compelling, like Darth Vader for instance. We can enjoy the villainy of Vader and still root for his defeat. Some villains are loved for no other reason than they are so dislikeable, like the Joker. He's so ridiculously evil its hard not to feel compelled to enjoy him in stories because of all the interest and drama he inspires.

Some villains/antagonists are not designed well, and these are the empty 'MUHAHAHA' types that are hated because of that fact - they're just not interesting, or they weren't involved in an interesting scenario or scenarios.

Therefore, I can understand why Zephyr may not be well received - his level of interest is just not on the same level as Discord or others.

Some of it is personal opinion, and some of it is purpose (plot usage), and I'm afraid some of it is the skill of the writer/creator. Moreover, some characters just don't have that 'magic' that makes them as compelling as others. So people simply gripe or complain or put them down because, well, they don't like them. And they don't have to.

None of which should make you upset. ^_^

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I dunno, I felt Zephyr deserved a lot of the heat he got. He spent most of his episode just being an unpleasant asshole and then gave a sob story about how he's always in Fluttershy's shadow in an attempt to garner sympathy and excuse his actions(except Big Mac also did this last season and did it much better to boot). If he had actually tried and simply screwed up it might have worked, but that's not how the episode went

I do agree with Starlight and Feather Bangs. Though Feather Bangs also has the displeasure of being based on one of the most hated pop singers in recent memory

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Almost any character in the show can fit the equation well! Sometimes it's just fun bashing a character! That doesn't always mean we don't like them. Zephyr is a good character, and is meant to be unlikable to a respect, but also liked because they fit well in a situation! :D

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20 minutes ago, Kiryu-Chan said:

I dunno, I felt Zephyr deserved a lot of the heat he got. He spent most of his episode just being an unpleasant asshole and then gave a sob story about how he's always in Fluttershy's shadow in an attempt to garner sympathy and excuse his actions(except Big Mac also did this last season and did it much better to boot). If he had actually tried and simply screwed up it might have worked, but that's not how the episode went

I do agree with Starlight and Feather Bangs. Though Feather Bangs also has the displeasure of being based on one of the most hated pop singers in recent memory

And not because he's voiced by some other waifu thief who, curiously, has yet to be mentioned here :dash: ? Seriously, why is Flashy hated? why not instead fill holes like you did with background horses who weren't supposed to have personalities in the first place? Because he was after two waifus :D 

 

Same could be said about McFlurry in her debut episode, but thankfully was mostly died down with A Flurry of Emotions, where she won over many

Edited by Steve Piranha
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Why is what others like or think such a huge issue? It is like opinions are not even supposed to be a thing sometimes. You say these characters got better... umm... exactly how? Zephyr spent his entire episode being a twat and doing his damnedest to make sure we all knew it, only to get over himself in the last 5 minutes of the episode... not exactly something that is going to make up for the other 18 minutes of infuriating aggravation filled life I will never get back. Zephyr sucks, it is what it is. I cannot stand the dullard. But it does not bother me if others think he is the greatest character to ever grace the screen. Like any character he has the opportunity to star in a future episode that will blow everyone away... but for now he just makes me grit my teeth and want to lock the episode in a vault.

Feather Bangs is just a one shot Beiber character made to be the star of an episode long gag. He did not learn anything at the end.. he just sort of was like "Oh... the joke is over, guess I am to". No personality or qualities except those built around a very, very long running joke that some appreciated, while others did not.

At the end of the day, people bash characters they don't like. You still get people bashing members of the Mane 6, the princesses, Spike and pretty much anyone or anything that has spoken a word in the show all because they just don't like them for whatever reason. They don't have to justify it, they don't have to explain it and they most certainly do not need to be apologetic about it. 

1 hour ago, Jeric said:

Enjoy the show your way and they will enjoy the show their way. 

^ This

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to be fair, starlight is a fan favorite now. only very hardcore haters still hate on her.

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52 minutes ago, GrimGrimoire said:

Why is what others like or think such a huge issue? It is like opinions are not even supposed to be a thing sometimes. You say these characters got better... umm... exactly how? Zephyr spent his entire episode being a twat and doing his damnedest to make sure we all knew it, only to get over himself in the last 5 minutes of the episode... not exactly something that is going to make up for the other 18 minutes of infuriating aggravation filled life I will never get back. Zephyr sucks, it is what it is. I cannot stand the dullard. But it does not bother me if others think he is the greatest character to ever grace the screen. Like any character he has the opportunity to star in a future episode that will blow everyone away... but for now he just makes me grit my teeth and want to lock the episode in a vault.

Feather Bangs is just a one shot Beiber character made to be the star of an episode long gag. He did not learn anything at the end.. he just sort of was like "Oh... the joke is over, guess I am to". No personality or qualities except those built around a very, very long running joke that some appreciated, while others did not.

At the end of the day, people bash characters they don't like. You still get people bashing members of the Mane 6, the princesses, Spike and pretty much anyone or anything that has spoken a word in the show all because they just don't like them for whatever reason. They don't have to justify it, they don't have to explain it and they most certainly do not need to be apologetic about it. 

^ This

I think we have very different opinions on what bashing means. Having a negative opinion on something isn’t bashing. Expressing a negative opinion isn’t bashing. Constantly bringing up how much you hate something, even when it’s off topic, distracting, or unnecessary, and doing it over, and over, and over again is bashing, and thankfully, I don’t see it very often on here. It’s far more common on EQD or derpibooru. 

I don't care if you have a different opinion than I do, sometimes it can even be fun to discuss those differences. It’s when you can’t keep your opinion to yourself when it isn’t called for, or using that difference of opinion as a character attack. For example, there was a recent poll on EQD about who was the best character of Season Seven, and Starlight’s won the poll with almost 50% of the vote. One of the top rated comments was, believe it or not, that the reason Starlight won was because everyone who had the “proper opinion of her and the show” stopped watching years ago. That’s character bashing, and it’s not something I’m going to just excuse away as a difference of opinion.

Edited by ShootingStar159
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Zephyr is hated because he's a combination of two stereotypes (the diva and freeloader, the latter attached to Millennials) who's written to be some sympathetic character despite treating others atrociously. The episode tries to build up the idea that ZB is afraid of failure, but it's communicated very poorly. Zephyr sleazily copped his way out of performing even the simplest of tasks, rather than try and fail so much that he was about to quit. His plot twist makes no sense, and his moment of triumph wasn't earned.

48 minutes ago, GrimGrimoire said:

Feather Bangs is just a one shot Beiber character made to be the star of an episode long gag.

There's more to that. Feather Bangs is a parody of Bieber back when he was still a kid, and his whole "personality" was a one-note stereotype of a boy band. The gag is cheap, archaic, and only interfered in the story.

3 hours ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

(Discord mind raping the ponies in the past)

Bad comparison. When Discord warped their minds, he was a cerebral villain and knew how to push the right buttons to affect their psyches. His character was creative, hilarious, and terrifying. If it weren't for his hubris, he might've beaten the M6. Before Starlight, he was the most engaging villain of the series.

53 minutes ago, Steve Piranha said:

Seriously, why is Flashy hated?

Because he's a quarter-dimensional stereotype whose only purpose is to be Twilight's crush. He has no personality at all, yet is taken seriously, especially in EQG1. It has nothing to do with this obnoxious, dated "waifu" logic. The background characters are there only to fill the background, make the world they live in interesting, and traditionally don't impact the story at all. Ironically, the seconds' worth of Derpy/Flash has much more chemistry than FlashLight in all the films combined.

20 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:

One of the top rated comments was, believe it or not, that the reason Starlight won was because everyone who had the “proper opinion of her and the show” stopped watching years ago. That’s character bashing, and it’s not something I’m going to just excuse away as a difference of opinion.

I know exactly what you're talking about. The fact that he accused those who like SG as being false fans is elitist to the core. There's no proper way of enjoying the show or being a brony, period. Bash SG for her poor performances? Fine. But don't drag her fans into it and suggest they're lesser humans for liking her.

Edited by Dark Qiviut
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I find Zephyr Breeze hilarious, but his main issue is that not all of his bad behaviour is properly addressed. We see him harassing Rainbow Dash, and we also see him breaking his parents' stuff, and he neither gets his comeuppance for that nor seems to learn not to act like that. The conundrum for me is that this sliminess is also most of why I find him funny (in the same vein as, say, the characters on Archer). I suspect he would be better received if those jokes were better suited to his character arc, or if the episode's plot did more to address that behaviour. 

Feather Bangs is just kinda boring. As a gag, he mostly plays as a cheap, dated parody, and I don't find that very entertaining, so it doesn't really compensate for his bad behaviour. At least he gets some moderate comeuppance, but I'm not really interested enough in him for that to mean anything to me. 

I have numerous issues with Starlight, but chief among them are 1. her constant self-pity feels unearned, 2. her interests and character traits are inconsistent on the rare occasion that she even has any, and 3. her frequent misdeeds don't really feel appropriate to her position in the show. Predominantly I just feel like the show is assuming I care about her without working to make me care, and as a result I find her mostly boring. 

Edited by AlexanderThrond

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14 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

Predominantly I just feel like the show is assuming I care about her without working to make me care, and as a result I find her mostly boring. 

I’m not sure I agree with this mindset, is it the writers job to write a good character, or to try and make everyone like every character? It isn’t realistic to assume we are all going to love every character, and it’s even less realistic to think the writers will change the way a character is written because not everyone likes them. If you don’t like a character, but know many other people do, why do you assume the writers are even writing her character with you in mind?

Edited by ShootingStar159
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5 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:

I’m not sure I agree with this mindset, is it the writers job to write a good character, or to try and make everyone like every character? 

I should rephrase. I feel like she's never quite been made into a good character, and yet the writers continue to assume we're invested in her anyway. What are her interests? What does she do in her spare time? What are her goals in life? How does she fit into the world around her? What distinguishes her from the rest of the cast? On many occasions, I don't feel like those questions are even considered. Or maybe it's just that I find those answers unsatisfying, in which case I don't know what to do. 

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4 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

and yet the writers continue to assume we're invested in her anyway

...is that assumption wrong? Even if Starlight has a larger group of people unhappy with her, everything I’ve seen points to her being a fandom favorite, well liked by the majority. Which kinda bring me back to my original point, they know they can’t satisfy everyone, so why would they change her character drastically to try?

Im sure you would find many of Starlights fans, myself included, who are interested in seeing the points you brought up addressed, we just don’t see any reason to rush to those answers as they aren’t ruining her for us.

As for what you should do, I don’t think you have to do anything. If you aren’t happy with her character, the only way to change that is to just stop caring about the problems you have with her, and that isn’t exactly something everyone can do. If you don’t like Starlight, it’s fine. I’ve known for a long time now you don’t care for her, but you’ve never been rude or pushy, so it’s never really bothered me. I hope they can continue to grow her character in ways you’ll come to appreciate, but it doesn’t bother me if she never really grows on you either. To put it bluntly, it really is just a difference of opinion.

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44 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

It has nothing to do with this obnoxious, dated "waifu" logic.

I don't disagree that Flash is dull, but if you're trying to suggest that there are NOT any viewers that freak out because their horse-crush is getting shipping fuel with another character, then I have some disappointing news for ya buddy. They exist. And it's sooo annoying.

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19 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:

As for what you should do, I don’t think you have to do anything. If you aren’t happy with her character, the only way to change that is to just stop caring about the problems you have with her, and that isn’t exactly something everyone can do. If you don’t like Starlight, it’s fine. I’ve known for a long time now you don’t care for her, but you’ve never been rude or pushy, so it’s never really bothered me. I hope they can continue to grow her character in ways you’ll come to appreciate, but it doesn’t bother me if she never really grows on you either. To put it bluntly, it really is just a difference of opinion.

It's mostly frustrating to me because I thought she had a lot of potential in season 6, and genuinely quite enjoyed her in a couple episodes - particularly the two-parters. Alas. 

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