vgmaster9

Something I truly feel is missing from the fandom

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Without a doubt, this fandom is full of creativity, from art, fics, comics, music, games, and of course, animations. The fandom has pretty much been involved in just about every possible form of media.

However, I feel that there's something that the fandom hasn't delved into enough, and that is hand drawn, frame by frame animation. 98% of the animations uses the show's style, which is basically animated with rigged puppets. Frame by frame on the other hand, looks way more fluid and expressive. While it's good to keep the spirit of the show, it would be nice to go above and beyond in terms of animation style. Even though the characters in the movie, look smoother, I still believe that they are still rigged. The best example of a fanimation that doesn't use the show's style is Lullaby for a Princess, and even some parts of that are rigged. Here's a few examples of frame by frame animation.

494980__safe_artist-colon-jessy_oc_oc+only_oc-colon-palette+swap_animated_dancing_earth+pony_pony_solo.gif

640020__safe_artist-colon-jessy_oc_oc+only_oc-colon-skybreaker_animated_mig-dash-25_monochrome_original+species_plane_plane+pony_pony_solo.gif

1388846__safe_artist-colon-light262_nightmare+moon_animated_gif_glowing+horn_helmet_magic_monochrome_simple+background_sketch_solo_wip.gif

720771__safe_artist-colon-pikapetey_oc_oc+only_oc-colon-the+living+tombstone_animated_drawing+counter_frame+by+frame_gravestone_not+trolling+you+guys_p.gif

large.gif

large.gif

398084__suggestive_artist-colon-ajin_oc_oc+only_oc-colon-spearmint+splash_oc-colon-wind+driven_animated_attempted+cunnilingus_bait+and+switch_bedroom+e.gif

862965__safe_artist-colon-deannart_twilight+sparkle_alicorn_animated_chair_computer_cute_eyes+closed_female_frown_laptop+computer_leaning_mare_parody_p.gif

Now, just imagine a full animation with that kind of movement. Yes, I understand that it takes lots of time to make, but it would look utterly amazing in the end.

Edited by vgmaster9
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I bet the reason people don't make more hand drawn animations is because of how long it can sometimes take to make a hand drawn animation, you have to draw out every individual frame and make sure the movement is fluid and smooth and not choppy or too jumpy. I think most people just don't really have the patience to put that much time and effort into that particular style of animation when there are alternative methods of animating things that are much quicker to get done and are easier to create in the fist place. 

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I agree, but because it's so difficult and time-consuming there's so little of it. You can try to multiply by adding more people to the drawing mix, but then you need someone to coordinate the different drawing styles and make sure they all match from frame to frame and from scene to scene - there's a reason why traditional animation is as rare as hen's teeth nowadays, and economics, whether we're talking about time or money, is the main reason.

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FbF might have more appeal if it's content wasn't so suggestive or grotesque.

Personally, I would definitely support creative efforts of this kind of media if it followed the dedication and respect as Lullaby for a Princess.

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Well, there ain't a magical device that makes that work easier and less time consuming :dash: . I've seen a couple I love but........ I'm not allowed to share those :D 

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Well if the fandom can't excel at it, then hopefully G5 will use that use this style of animation, going from the simplicity of G4 to a new complexity.

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just wnat to say I absolutly adore that one of Tombstone! Got a weakness for walk cycles.

Heck I attempted to do hand drawn and puppet rigs myself - personally I favour the hand drawn one, it was easier ( for me) to understand and work at it than to fiddle around with rigs and functions on the other.

My sister animates in her spare time and has done a mix of both, but I think she uses the puppet rigs a bit more for the MLP work.

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Yeah some of the super advanced animated anime feature films that were made during the 1980s actually primary used hand drawn character and object cut outs that were laid out over extremely detailed watercolour background artworks and often they had several detailed watercolour scene objects that were rigged but still it was extremely time consuming to draw and create those watercolour objects and backgrounds in the first place. So basically something like 2-5 years of work would go into creating one of those films but now with more modern technology not really anyone wants to spend six months to a couple of years independently creating a five minute long frame by frame fan animation. So yeah something like Lullaby for a princess would of probably taken 3-6 months of non stop work to make and it's extremely hard to keep persistent on a project like that for that long when your alone on the project. :)

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On ‎1‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 7:10 AM, Techno Universal said:

Yeah some of the super advanced animated anime feature films that were made during the 1980s actually primary used hand drawn character and object cut outs that were laid out over extremely detailed watercolour background artworks and often they had several detailed watercolour scene objects that were rigged but still it was extremely time consuming to draw and create those watercolour objects and backgrounds in the first place. So basically something like 2-5 years of work would go into creating one of those films but now with more modern technology not really anyone wants to spend six months to a couple of years independently creating a five minute long frame by frame fan animation. So yeah something like Lullaby for a princess would of probably taken 3-6 months of non stop work to make and it's extremely hard to keep persistent on a project like that for that long when your alone on the project. :)

Well now with software like Toon Boom Harmony and TVPaint, hand drawn animation can all be done digitally.

Edited by vgmaster9

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11 minutes ago, vgmaster9 said:

Well now with software like Toon Boom Harmony and TVPaint, hand drawn animation can all be done digitally.

Yeah like in the anime movies from the late 80s they probably used early computer animation like the backgrounds would be painted traditionally still but they would be digitised and different background objects could be rigged to create a scene where a character is riding on a motorcycle away from a city. However the characters and moving objects themselves would be completely digitally animated and that was using the earliest computer animation technology that was available. :)

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There is absolutely no substitute for great hand drawn animation! Granted, the digital tools and methods are quicker and more cost effective for studios, but hand drawn is a beautiful, disciplined (and sadly disappearing) art form that should not be abandoned because it takes more effort. When I look at the ultra-expressiveness of squash and stretch animation like the examples shown, my heart literally starts pounding with excitement. That comes from true art touching the soul on a deep level. Digital art can be beautiful too and certainly has a place, especially if it can produce the same kind of living soul that hand drawn art creates, but unfortunately it seldom does. It would be unfortunate if hand drawn art became lost to the world because we got to complacent and started relying on computers for too much. Hand drawn animation took decades to perfect and is responsible for so many classic works of art. I hope it continues, in fan art if not on a major commercial scale. I want digital tools to continue broadening the spectrum as well, but let's keep ALL of the tools active. That way we get the best of all worlds.  

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On ‎1‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 10:51 PM, Dreambiscuit said:

There is absolutely no substitute for great hand drawn animation! Granted, the digital tools and methods are quicker and more cost effective for studios, but hand drawn is a beautiful, disciplined (and sadly disappearing) art form that should not be abandoned because it takes more effort. When I look at the ultra-expressiveness of squash and stretch animation like the examples shown, my heart literally starts pounding with excitement. That comes from true art touching the soul on a deep level. Digital art can be beautiful too and certainly has a place, especially if it can produce the same kind of living soul that hand drawn art creates, but unfortunately it seldom does. It would be unfortunate if hand drawn art became lost to the world because we got to complacent and started relying on computers for too much. Hand drawn animation took decades to perfect and is responsible for so many classic works of art. I hope it continues, in fan art if not on a major commercial scale. I want digital tools to continue broadening the spectrum as well, but let's keep ALL of the tools active. That way we get the best of all worlds.  

Umm, the gifs you saw above ARE digital. Just because it's hand drawn doesn't mean it's drawn on paper, it can be also drawn on Wacom tablets.

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1 hour ago, vgmaster9 said:

Umm, the gifs you saw above ARE digital. Just because it's hand drawn doesn't mean it's drawn on paper, it can be also drawn on Wacom tablets.

It's irrelevant whether it's on paper or a Wacom. The important fact is that it's a hand made drawing rather than a template of a figure that's manipulated in the machine. Hence the greater expressiveness.

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Hand-drawn animation is probably really expensive, and I'm not sure how big the show's budget actually is. Wikipedia lists the movie's budget as 52 million USD, but I'm awfully skeptical of that, because that's higher than what's listed for The Lion King, so I'm not quite sure why they would default to ToonBoom puppets if they could get away with hand-drawn.

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Well, looking at the inflation, Lion King's $45 million budget would translate to about 74 in today's dollars. Plus, Disney had, at that time, other traditional animation studios with the corresponding infrastructure, which also helped bring costs down.

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Well looks like there's someone who is willing to do this kind of animation. It's just a rough, but it's a great start.

 

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I've made hand drawn animations and they require quite a bit of dedication. Doing a full 24min hand drawn animated episode alone is pretty insane and I don't think there are people who would be willing to do that without any compensation. And even with compensation the task takes a lot of time and and a lot of effort.

Compared to rigged animation it's like building a 10 000 pieces puzzle where the rigged one has like 50 pieces 

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On 8/6/2018 at 6:53 PM, vgmaster9 said:

Well looks like there's someone who is willing to do this kind of animation. It's just a rough, but it's a great start.

 

WOW... this feels like something I'd expect to see in the extras on a Disney DVD.

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