Duality

Advanced Salem University OOC (Open)

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12 hours ago, Passion said:

I'm pretty sure this would be a matter of preference and personality. I can absolutely see more power-driven and control-mad characters remain absolutely ... racist, towards non-magic users due to the superiority they'd feel they possess.

I think Ley, if not for her family image, would be one such example.

The university would most definitely keep a tight rein on that sort of bigotry, though; it has its own public image to uphold.

12 hours ago, Passion said:

Y'see, the issue I see here is that in our world this works because there are quite effective ways of putting you down should you take your views to public. I'm not sure people would be just as happy, outside of online, to go out and tick off a person who can wipe you off of the ground of earth with one snap of fingers.

Sure, there are laws etc etc, but would you normally joke about or mock a man with a gun pointed at you?

To extend your firearm analogy, consider the American gun control debate. One side has guns almost by definition, and the other side has no guns almost by definition. Each side is quite aware of the other side's gun-possession status, but protest marches and public decries and online flame wars are still free and frequent, since the full force of the law prevents anyone on the one side from actually pointing a gun at anyone on the other side, let alone using it.

If anyone uses their magic to threaten or injure someone with no magic (in cases other than self-defence), they'll end up in null-magic cuffs faster than they can say 'abracadabra'. Bear in mind that the government employs a fair few mages itself, its existing weapon capacities aren't entirely useless against magic-wielders anyway, and mages are a tiny and legally controversial minority and would thus be wise to step on as few political toes as possible.

Edited by Duality
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16 hours ago, Duality said:

The university would most definitely keep a tight rein on that sort of bigotry, though; it has its own public image to uphold.

To extend your firearm analogy, consider the American gun control debate. One side has guns almost by definition, and the other side has no guns almost by definition. Each side is quite aware of the other side's gun-possession status, but protest marches and public decries and online flame wars are still free and frequent, since the full force of the law prevents anyone on the one side from actually pointing a gun at anyone on the other side, let alone using it.

If anyone uses their magic to threaten or injure someone with no magic (in cases other than self-defence), they'll end up in null-magic cuffs faster than they can say 'abracadabra'. Bear in mind that the government employs a fair few mages itself, its existing weapon capacities aren't entirely useless against magic-wielders anyway, and mages are a tiny and legally controversial minority and would thus be wise to step on as few political toes as possible.

Which brings up a question I asked earlier. What is the ratio of magic users to nons? How the world percieves them can be determined by how common they are. Is it one in four people? One in Ten? One percent? One in a million? 

Another thing to consider is ratio of pelijae to humans. The discrimination against non-humans might be as bad if not worse than against the enchanted. And more so, how are enchanted pelijae treated among their own, by nons and by human enchanted? 

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9 hours ago, Denim&Venom said:

Which brings up a question I asked earlier. What is the ratio of magic users to nons? How the world percieves them can be determined by how common they are. Is it one in four people? One in Ten? One percent? One in a million? 

Approximately one in a million (which works out to about seven or eight thousand worldwide, give or take). It's stated in the RP's intro.

9 hours ago, Denim&Venom said:

Another thing to consider is ratio of pelijae to humans. The discrimination against non-humans might be as bad if not worse than against the enchanted. And more so, how are enchanted pelijae treated among their own, by nons and by human enchanted? 

Judging from the cross-section of the university's populace represented by our characters, which I would consider a fairly reliable indicator for this question, it's about a half-and-half Pelajae-human divide overall, so not really much of a difference in how either of them are treated by the other. Pelajae and humans have coexisted for thousands of years, too, as per the intro, so I can't imagine much of a culture divide there with how they treat their mages.

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3 hours ago, Duality said:

Approximately one in a million (which works out to about seven or eight thousand worldwide, give or take). It's stated in the RP's intro.

I'd say they should be a bit more common. If we take into consideration fact that each government would want to have at least a number of them employed, then the existance of mage control factions and organizations you have mentioned... THEN take the age distribution into consideration and the fact that many of those could appear between commonfolk...

It would be hard to believe that Salem University would be as populated and grand as we are making it to be.

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3 minutes ago, Passion said:

I'd say they should be a bit more common. If we take into consideration fact that each government would want to have at least a number of them employed, then the existance of mage control factions and organizations you have mentioned... THEN take the age distribution into consideration and the fact that many of those could appear between commonfolk...

It would be hard to believe that Salem University would be as populated and grand as we are making it to be.

That does make sense; I always suspected that my numbers were somewhat implausibly small. How many do you estimate there should realistically be? I can edit the intro.

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Either 50.000-80.000 worldwide, either 120.000-140.000. This would still make them a rare occurance, but would make it more realistic for University facilities to exist. We can assume that there aren't many magical Universities what would not create competition between them, apart from maybe y'know. Some annual University competitions on whose students are more skilled etc etc.

You could have like a 4 or so scattered over the world and they would cover for any travel expenses the students would have to make in order to reach the walls, since their numbers would be counted in thousands, not tens of thousands as with regular Unis.

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2 hours ago, Passion said:

Either 50.000-80.000 worldwide, either 120.000-140.000. This would still make them a rare occurance, but would make it more realistic for University facilities to exist. We can assume that there aren't many magical Universities what would not create competition between them, apart from maybe y'know. Some annual University competitions on whose students are more skilled etc etc.

You could have like a 4 or so scattered over the world and they would cover for any travel expenses the students would have to make in order to reach the walls, since their numbers would be counted in thousands, not tens of thousands as with regular Unis.

Actually, the University is the only one of its kind. A global hub of magic, so to speak, hence the vast array of curious characters who frequent its corridors. Would that affect your estimated number of mages?

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1 hour ago, dragon4111 said:

@Duality@Passion@Buck Testa

So umm yeah remember when Ghalan said about calling in odin? yeah have you ever heard of a kinetic bombardment?

Wasn't Zeus the name of the 'long rod' you mentioned he had in place orbiting the Earth? If you want to implement a giant doohickey in space that enables Ghalan to smash people with either the rod itself or gravity waves from said rod (whichever is the case), then we need to talk about how he got it up there, plus possibly what makes it not-OP. :please:

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@Duality

A tungsten rod.and for that I am thinking it's more last resort since it'll draw most of his magical aura just to call it down from orbit. Yes Hmm Well could have been up there from a faulty space station or something. Also considering the widespread damage it would cause, it is very situational. For when things are desperate and FUBAR.

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@dragon4111 limits on what characters can do helps with creativity imo. Dru is very powerful, however it is mitigated by how young, inexperienced, and maldeveloped that magic is. Her range, while very large, is nowhere near reaching anything resembling orbit. It's also further brought down to the fact that she only knows how to actively manipulate plants she is near, mostly that she can see. And now that shes going to be brought down to 1% of her power, she'll need to lean into her studies and be creative with how she uses her magic.

Having a range so great that you can affect things from orbit is a bit crazy for someone who is supposed to be a janitor. Be powerful sure, but think of ways to limit him and have downsides to the power as well. 

Edited by Buck Testa
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I have to agree with Buck. To activate the rod at any given point would mean Ghalan would be able to manipulate objects in orbit with his own will down from earth. If he used technology, it would have to be precoded and couldn't really use his power as catalyst due to range it would be away from him.

Which mage controlling agency would allow him to place such weapon in orbit and how come no government would object :P ?

 

That being said, how do we even classify kinetic energy? Wouldn't energy blast of sheer will be allocated under telekinesis?

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@Passion@Buck Testa

-Points to the post above yours- I will have it bring him down to a 5%. Heh atleast I'm not saying he pulls an asteroid from the asteroid belt that would be suicidal. Plus I was thinking it's more of a death or glory attack.

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13 hours ago, dragon4111 said:

@Duality

A tungsten rod.and for that I am thinking it's more last resort since it'll draw most of his magical aura just to call it down from orbit. Yes Hmm Well could have been up there from a faulty space station or something. Also considering the widespread damage it would cause, it is very situational. For when things are desperate.

If he can yank random giant rods out of orbit with his powers, he can also yank anything of less than the rod's mass out of orbit. There's no reason his powers would affect tungsten any more than, say, satellite materials. On a similar note, 'orbit' is several miles above the Earth's surface, which would imply he can strongly affect things with his magic from miles away.

27 minutes ago, dragon4111 said:

@Passion@Buck Testa

-Points to the post above yours- I will have it bring him down to a 5%. Heh atleast I'm not saying he pulls an asteroid from the asteroid belt that would be suicidal. Plus I was thinking it's more of a death or glory attack.

If this rod is large enough to survive reentry into the atmosphere and still hit the ground hard it would be just about suicidal anyway. This theoretical rod would hit the ground at more than five miles per second - its actual weight does not change this number. An asteroid from the asteroid belt would hit the ground at less than that speed, in fact, due to its less streamlined shape slowing it down more as it passes through the atmosphere. Also, if he's capable of pulling asteroids out of the asteroid belt that would imply that he can affect things with his magic from 350 million kilometres away, which is an exceedingly large number of miles and far further away than anything on, under, or above the face of the entire Earth.

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@Passion@Buck Testa@Duality

Have you heard of project thor? the rods are made from tungsten. but if you want I can  have him forget about the whole thing if it causes problems.

here's a picture of what the rod looks like.

main-qimg-c0039b066f316010a21800006e8e0f

Edited by dragon4111

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2 minutes ago, dragon4111 said:

@Passion@Buck Testa@Duality

Have you heard of project thor?

Yep, I have, but if Ghalan was powerful enough to use such a weapon, he'd be utterly OP, unless you have a specific idea (and explanation) for some sort of special link that he has to this particular rod and nothing else to enable him to use his powers more effectively on it. Bear in mind that no government is going to give exclusive control over a tactical space weapon to any single individual, let alone a janitor with a short temper (no offence).

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@Duality

Hmm good point on that duality. And honestly I would think that he would know not to use it considering the damage it could do. and for him to actually call it down? it would cost him quite alot of his magical aura. and as I have said it's more situational. but if you want we could just retcon it?

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22 minutes ago, dragon4111 said:

@Duality

Hmm good point on that duality. And honestly I would think that he would know not to use it considering the damage it could do. and for him to actually call it down? it would cost him quite alot of his magical aura. and as I have said it's more situational. but if you want we could just retcon it?

If there's no plot-oriented reason for him to have it, I would prefer a retcon, if that's okay with you. :rarity:

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18 hours ago, Duality said:

Actually, the University is the only one of its kind. A global hub of magic, so to speak, hence the vast array of curious characters who frequent its corridors. Would that affect your estimated number of mages?

 

21 hours ago, Passion said:

I'd say they should be a bit more common. If we take into consideration fact that each government would want to have at least a number of them employed, then the existance of mage control factions and organizations you have mentioned... THEN take the age distribution into consideration and the fact that many of those could appear between commonfolk...

It would be hard to believe that Salem University would be as populated and grand as we are making it to be.

 

If that's the only one, and out of those 10,000 only say 2500 still need to be taught then I guess one school would work. But then the world would be different. Each magic user would be treated like a god or demon. There would be few enough for a government cover up. And society would still be the same as ours. 

I guess we should be asking how different do we want this world to be? That'll determine how many magic users would populate it. Do we want an x-men style world with a sizable minority? Something like Ancient Magus Bride, RWBY or Maboraho where magic is super common? Harry Potter or Mage: The Awakening where it's rare enough to be hidden? 

What kind of a world do we live in? 

 

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48 minutes ago, Denim&Venom said:

If that's the only one, and out of those 10,000 only say 2500 still need to be taught then I guess one school would work. But then the world would be different. Each magic user would be treated like a god or demon. There would be few enough for a government cover up. And society would still be the same as ours. 

I guess we should be asking how different do we want this world to be? That'll determine how many magic users would populate it. Do we want an x-men style world with a sizable minority? Something like Ancient Magus Bride, RWBY or Maboraho where magic is super common? Harry Potter or Mage: The Awakening where it's rare enough to be hidden? 

What kind of a world do we live in? 

It's a lot like the X-Men world, I'm thinking, since there are actually very few mutants relative to 'normal' people in that universe. About enough mutants/mages on Earth to fill a powerful international school, an alternative faction or two, and a few governmental shoes to boot, while still having a small number of them living independently of any major organisation. Mutants were a small enough minority to be kept hidden for a good long while by the Xavier guy and co., while still being powerful enough that they caused some serious political controversy when they came to light. Fortunately for the mages in this world, though, they came out from hiding to save the world from the encroaching daemon realm, so the government and public are significantly more inclined to trust them in general than they are in the X-Men world.

Edited by Duality

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1 hour ago, Duality said:

It's a lot like the X-Men world, I'm thinking, since there are actually very few mutants relative to 'normal' people in that universe. About enough mutants/mages on Earth to fill a powerful international school, an alternative faction or two, and a few governmental shoes to boot, while still having a small number of them living independently of any major organisation. Mutants were a small enough minority to be kept hidden for a good long while by the Xavier guy and co., while still being powerful enough that they caused some serious political controversy when they came to light. Fortunately for the mages in this world, though, they came out from hiding to save the world from the encroaching daemon realm, so the government and public are significantly more inclined to trust them in general than they are in the X-Men world.

Honestly the whole mutant hate thing never really made sense in the Marvel universe.

"Spiderman, Captain America, Thor? Oh those guys are cool, but FUCK those muties man!"

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4 hours ago, Buck Testa said:

Honestly the whole mutant hate thing never really made sense in the Marvel universe.

"Spiderman, Captain America, Thor? Oh those guys are cool, but FUCK those muties man!"

It was an allegory for racial inequality in the 60s. But in cannon, the widespread belief is that those hero's are either aliens or enhanced humans. Mankind getting stronger through cooperation or innovation. Mutants obviously, were born with power, having done nothing to earn it. Most importantly though, they represent evolution. Homosuperior. The gradual end of the human race. So it's part envy, part paranoia on survival. 

Or if you go by the Ultimate series, it's all due to an ancient organism called sublime that's part of all life on earth, and it fears mutants. So it manipulates humanity to hate mutants. 

6 hours ago, Duality said:

It's a lot like the X-Men world, I'm thinking, since there are actually very few mutants relative to 'normal' people in that universe. About enough mutants/mages on Earth to fill a powerful international school, an alternative faction or two, and a few governmental shoes to boot, while still having a small number of them living independently of any major organisation. Mutants were a small enough minority to be kept hidden for a good long while by the Xavier guy and co., while still being powerful enough that they caused some serious political controversy when they came to light. Fortunately for the mages in this world, though, they came out from hiding to save the world from the encroaching daemon realm, so the government and public are significantly more inclined to trust them in general than they are in the X-Men world.

So when did this daemon invasion happen? And how have the world's religions not have a record increase in attendance considering that hell is now real? 

 

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4 hours ago, Denim&Venom said:

It was an allegory for racial inequality in the 60s. But in cannon, the widespread belief is that those hero's are either aliens or enhanced humans. Mankind getting stronger through cooperation or innovation. Mutants obviously, were born with power, having done nothing to earn it. Most importantly though, they represent evolution. Homosuperior. The gradual end of the human race. So it's part envy, part paranoia on survival. 

Or if you go by the Ultimate series, it's all due to an ancient organism called sublime that's part of all life on earth, and it fears mutants. So it manipulates humanity to hate mutants. 

So when did this daemon invasion happen? And how have the world's religions not have a record increase in attendance considering that hell is now real? 

 

Oh I know what it is supposed to represent, but it really doesn't work when you think about it. In fact the Ultimates version makes a bit more sense. But I digress 

Also that is a good Question. What is the state of religion in the game?

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6 hours ago, Buck Testa said:

Also that is a good Question. What is the state of religion in the game?

How does the pelijae half of the populace react to Christianity and Islam, considering they have very human deities and the concept of mankind being the ones who were made in gods image? 

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