S02:E21 - Dragon Quest

[Eenohay 318]

I realize that, but it still doesn't work for me. When she first met Twilight she wouldn't even speak to her until she saw the "cute little baby dragon." Most anypony who is afraid of snakes or bears or whatever will be very afraid of even little/young ones. Would an arachnophobe ooh and ahh over a baby spider? No. If anything, the animal lover tends to be too unafraid, and will try to pet wild animals and stuff.

 

At least they are consistent with their inconsistency!

 

So basically you are just as scared of a baby lion than a full grown one?

 

 

It appears some people here are commiting the error of over analizing the episodes. When you do, you greatly exagerate the bad aspects while ignoring the good aspects, because apparently the show is so good for you that it isn't allowed to have any minor flaw.

 

The characterization certanly wasn't off. I mean, this is a cartoon, not a drama film. Characters are constantly exagerated. It's true that a regular person similar to Rarity wouldn't have had a red carpet for watching a migration, but this is a cartoon! Shall I remind you of previous episodes? A bird in the hoof, Rarity wore a dress to a casual meeting with the princess. Sure, it was the princess, but nopony else was dressed formal.

 

Rainbow Dash is always mean. Always. She has been mean to Fluttershy in Dragonshy and in Sonic Rainboom, and to Twilight several times, and don't you remember how she treated Fluttershy's animals? Speacilly tank? It sucks and that's why I dislike her, but you can't argue with canon, this is not the first episode where she makes fun of her friends.

 

 

And Kyronea about the dragons, of course they were all the same, they are supposed to be. This show is not about them, they just were there to symbolize a group, in wich EVERYBODY DOES THE SAME WITHOUT QUESTIONING, wich was what Spike was going to do.

 

 

Also, I like that they had Phoenixes because I assume that they were in a place outside Equestria, a place where dragons rule, and a place filled with mythological creatures, such as Dragons and Phoenixes. Probably Minotaurs too.

[RagingTwilight 101]

I personally really hated the teenage dragons. Then again, they were probably written so that I would hate them.

 

Overall, another solid episode, in my opinion. Decent plot, some touching parts, good music and good humor. Concerning all the Rainbow Dash drama: she'a always been kinda like that, as far as I can remember. She's brash and confident, sometimes to a fault. So while she probably did take it too far when teasing Spike about the apron, her true feelings came to light when she didn't want Spike to leave. I'd say Rainbow was genuinely concerned for Spike's well-being, illustrating nicely her Element of Harmony of Loyalty, in that she is outright devoted to the well-being of her friends, no matter what the stakes.

 

So with that, I was okay with Rainbow Dash's characterization in the episode. Parts of it did paint her in a negative light, but people have flaws - Rainbow Dash is no exception.

 

On another note: I have noticed quite a few places (here, Equestria Daily, Ponychan) where people have said they didn't like the episode, though their main reason seems to be none other than the writer - Merriwether Williams. I know Mysterious Mare Do Well was a weaker episode (and in my opinion the weakest,) but that doesn't automatically mean all her episodes are. I've actually enjoyed all of her other episodes (HWE, PYHD and DQ.) None of these I'd say are amongst the best of the series, but I'd still say they are quite good.

[Literally Snails 2,307]

I loved it when Rainbow dash got trampled by fluttershy

[DrOphthalmos 497]

Of the mane 6, I identify the least with Apple Jack and Rainbow Dash. That's why I am surprised that I am coming to RD's defense. I've read a few threads on here that are concerned with her acting like a jerk. When I re-watch the episode, what I see is Spike saying "Us dragons are a definitely a force to be reckoned with" while looking like this:

 

 

I think it was very RD of her to call him out on this. She laughed but she was basically laughing at the fact that he was making such claims while looking the way he was. Then of course Spike makes it worse by defending his apron since it guards against TOUGH blueberry stains.

 

I do not think Spike was that hurt by RD's ribbing. After all, an apron is something you can put on and take off (though being called "lame" was a bit harsh). I think Spike was much more hurt by what followed: Rarity saying he doesn't look like other dragons and especially Twilight saying he doesn't act like other dragons. It can hurt when you are called something you are not. But, it can also hurt if you believe you are something, and others tell you that you are not.

 

I guess what I am trying to say is that you should not judge Rainbow Dash too harshly. In that scene, though she is the one that started the teasing, she is not the one who hurt Spike the most. If one of your friends tried to claim that he's a badass while wearing an apron with a heart on it, wouldn't you be tempted to make a friendly comment and call them out on it?

[Emerald Flame 380]

I think people are being a bit too biased against Merriwether Williams. I used to be one of her biggest haters, since I wholeheartedly believe that The Mysterious Mare Do Well is the worst episode in this series, and that Hearth's Warming Eve isn't much better. I was shocked when I learned that she wrote Putting Your Hoof Down, which I enjoyed greatly. I got another pleasant surprise when I learned she wrote this episode. I think she's getting better at writing episodes to fit MLP's style, and she's not my least favorite writer anymore.

 

Also, I have to agree with everything DrOphthalmos said. How many of you can say you've never teased one of your friends before? I'm guilty, and other ponies are guilty as well. Light hearted teasing is one of the ways some people show they care, and Spike wasn't that bothered by the teasing, it was the defense that hurt him.

[hwrogers 168]

dear princess celestia

I believe your interpretation of my reaction is spot on...I was actually feeling pleased with the episode right up until I saw that name credit, and then I viewed the episode negatively after that.

 

While my reaction seems to have a lot of thought to it, in truth I should feel embarrassed over how biased it is, and ashamed of my own inability to see past who was writing the episode.

 

I will have to give the episode several viewings in the future before I can rate it honestly, and I apologize if I bothered anyone with my ranting and raving.

 

sorry, i couldn't help the joke lol, it's only in fun kyronea

 

i personally really enjoyed the episode even though my thoughts through most of it were "wouldn't it be easier to ask the princess?" and later "the red dragon they've seen before and demonstrated potential for civilised conversation. even if their previous meeting was not under the most pleasant circumstances couldn't the ponies at least have asked for a little help or information?" but again these things would have made a boring episode.

 

rarity's camo... in dragonshy she had a couple of stylish camo hats in standard green pattern, why the anti-camo? it was funny as she is a fashionista, but seemed kind of odd to me, i agree with AJ's reaction to it lol.

[RockinRarity 1,605]

This is definitely Merriwether Williams' best episode. Hands down. She seems to be getting better and I think that's something we should appreciate and not resort to bashing the episode just because she wrote it. Mysterious Mare-Do-Well was bad, Hearth's Warming Eve was OK, and Putting Your Hoof Down had good elements but overall something about it was off. This episode had me laughing a lot, and by the time it was finished, I was pleased with the overall product. Even if the writing itself wasn't that great, the animators did a good job at filling in for the writing, you know what I mean?

 

Best parts of the episode:

 

Crackle. Oh my gosh I still laugh every time I see him. Just thinking about him makes me laugh.

 

The phoenixes. They were awesome. So awesome. I loved watching them.

 

Other animation antics.

 

Rarity. She was over-the-top at the beginning, yes, but it didn't make me cringe. It made sense to her character for the most part, since dragons have found her charming in past episodes. And her line at the end for defending Spike was a bonus.

 

Fluttershy at the very beginning. When she dashed to the window, stopped, opened it gently, then dashed away was priceless.

 

I liked the Twilight/Rarity/Rainbow Dash trio also. It does make sense though, since I think the 3 of them /would/ be the most likely ponies to go after him, with the 4th probably being Apple Jack.

 

I say this is an episode worth rewatching. One of the better ones this season, I think.

[Lupus 127]

I really liked this episode. I wrote a great post about why it was so good, but left it on my desktop pc at home, so I can't post it, but yes, it was very good, even if it proves dragons are morons, and Spike is all about nurture over nature.

[Page.Turner 940]

I really, really love how they basically said flat out he didn't have to adhere to "dragon standards" and that no one cared if he was cute and wore aprons. Aside from the teasing from Rainbow Dash and Pinkie Pie, it gives a really good message that it doesn't matter who or what you are, what makes you happy is what matters!

 

I think the teen-aged dragons were a prime example of immaturity in young men. I'm not saying ALL teen boys are "jerky dragons" like that but it gives sight into peer pressure and how boys might struggle with trying to fit in since it is a whole different ballgame than with girls.

 

ALSO! I love, love, LOVE the ending! And the moral of the story. I think it will really touch base with kids who are adopted and know it because it kind of leans into the whole, "Biology doesn't make a family whole, love and support do". Y'know?

 

ACTUALLY: I have a thought... When that red dragon joked about Spike possibly being half pony, you know what I thought?

 

DRAGONBORNS FROM D&D

So... oh wow! I think I need to draw that now.

 

Or, I may be thinking of the half-dragons but still...

Edited March 20, 2012 by SkySong

[Rainbowdash23 2]

Very good

I liked the weird dragon, of course

Fluttershy's window exit I very much liked

And the whole episode pulled together well

And for some reason I feel like those dragons are going to be in future episodes

[hawkflame 3,308]

Rainbow Dash is always mean. Always. She has been mean to Fluttershy in Dragonshy and in Sonic Rainboom, and to Twilight several times, and don't you remember how she treated Fluttershy's animals? Speacilly tank? It sucks and that's why I dislike her, but you can't argue with canon, this is not the first episode where she makes fun of her friends.

 

 

And Kyronea about the dragons, of course they were all the same, they are supposed to be. This show is not about them, they just were there to symbolize a group, in wich EVERYBODY DOES THE SAME WITHOUT QUESTIONING, wich was what Spike was going to do.

 

I actually like Rainbow Dash being a bit of a jerk. It shows that they're not all perfect. And I think everyone has a Rainbow Dash type friend, where you genuinely love them but they're also kind of an asshole.

 

As for the dragons, they're really at the center of my main beef with the episode. They're so... generic. This plot has been done over and over again, where a nice guy tries to get in with the "cool" crowd by doing things that, frankly, they really don't want to do. A gazillion shows have done some variation on that plot, and I expected more of this show. Having them be more developed and actually likeable would have made for a more interesting struggle for Spike, and really would have spoken to his ideas on identity.

[Queen Cassie 3,057]

So, I have now given the episode a second watch, in an effort to view it without biases and without being super critical just because of who wrote it.

 

...

 

I take back almost every single bad word I said about this episode. Almost.

 

Rarity may have been acting over the top, but honestly she has acted over the top so much in the past that it isn't nearly as out of character as I initially attributed it being. In particular, near the end, when she says she'll rip the dragons to pieces if they harm Spike at all, I felt that was rather touching. Sure, she may have been the first pony amongst the Mane Six to kick a manticore in the face, but beyond that she really has shown she prefers to use her wits rather than her hooves in dangerous situations. And honestly I was laughing my head off at her using all those cutesy nicknames for Spike...it really is something she'd do, on purpose at that to tease him a little. She was having fun at his expense, and everypony present knew it.

 

Fluttershy continuing to show backbone after the events of Putting Your Hoof Down is a good thing. I still facepalmed at the gentle window opening bit, but it was an endearing one this time. If I had any complaint about that at all, it was how hard she stomped on Rainbow's ribcage...she could have seriously injured Dashie. I think Fluttershy was trying too hard there. (Or she just stepped on Dashie by accident. That certainly can happen.)

 

While the teenage dragons were still annoying a second time through, and I still couldn't tell them apart as characters beyond their visual appearance...truth is they're hardly the only characters with importance to the plot of individual episodes to be fairly one dimensional. Consider the Diamond Dogs, for example, from one of my all time favorite episodes. They were greedy little idiots, and stayed greedy little idiots. Their voices were a bit more distinct, which helped tell them apart a bit more, but really, they weren't any different. Nor was Prince Blueblood, or even Trixie for that matter. (I'm probably going to be seized by a horde of Trixie fans for saying that, but it's true. Trixie did not have much depth to her character in canon.)

 

And while I still think that Twilight, Dashie, and Rarity overreacted JUST a tad to Spike's declaration of staying there forever, given he's still a little kid, I understood it a bit better the second time. Again, though, if I should fault the episode honestly anywhere, it's the use of Rainbow Dash in this role instead of somepony else. Rainbow Dash has barely interacted with Spike at all and I find it questionable that she would care to quite the same degree that Twilight or Rarity would. That's not to say that she wouldn't care, but just that it seems to me someone else a bit more connected to Spike should have filled her role. I think Fluttershy may have been a better choice.

 

The ending did still feel a bit underwhelming, but it's fairly decent. While we don't have a real concept of just how far Twilight teleported them, and I'm not sure she'd have been able to teleport them that distance, I still like the way they went about it...I didn't notice it the first time, but Twilight almost collapses there at the end...not quite enough in m opinion for the effort she just expended, but it's still good that was acknowledged.

 

I'm glad that Spike decided to save the phoenix egg. That was a good move on his part, because while he may be a little kid, he's a good kid at heart. I honestly hope we see Peewee again in the future.

 

And while I do still feel that there was a bit of a wasted opportunity when it comes to the whole dragon issue, in truth there's nothing keeping them from exploring it further in future episodes. In this regard it's my fault for trying to ask a bit too much out of the world-building for this show when it is, ultimately, targeted at a young demographic. We may be massive, but we're still a periphery.

 

This episode was better in almost every sense than I originally gave it credit for. I chose to be biased over being fair, which not only embarrasses me, but insults Merriwether Williams' writing ability, when she is a good writer. I offer my sincere apologies to Ms. Williams, and I will not be holding your writing credit against any future episodes.

[Espionage 113]

I find the lack of Fus Ro Dahs! or Arrows in the knee jokes disturbing.

[Replicant 113]

Could this be the first episode in which Twilight actually remembered that she can teleport when she needed to?

 

Loved the episode, but it seemed a little abrupt how they all run away at the end. I was expecting one of the adult dragons to step in and yell at the teenagers for their misbehaviour.

 

Judging from the behavior of the other dragons we've seen on the show, they probably wouldn't have scolded the teenage dragons... After all, selfish behavior accelerates a dragon's growth, and being strong and terrifying seem to be valuable traits.

 

Also, I'm okay with the sudden fleeing because I can stretch to say that it showed how gutsy Spike was to stick around the teenage dragons. He could've just bolted when it was established that they basically just wanted to mess with him / beat him constantly / etc, but finding himself was more important.

[DrOphthalmos 497]

That's not to say that she wouldn't care, but just that it seems to me someone else a bit more connected to Spike should have filled her role. I think Fluttershy may have been a better choice.

Bravo. I loved your new unbiased analysis.

 

Just one thing... Fluttershy filling the role? If she stomped on RD's ribcage in an effort to get out of just LOOKING at a dragon migration, what makes you think they would have been able to talk her into getting into a dragon suit to get that close to an entire group of dragons? Fluttershy's dragon phobia would have made that next to impossible for her.

 

Rainbow Dash is loyalty. Spike is a friend. And even if he wasn't, then he is a friend of a friend. Rainbow Dash has guts and does not leave her friends hanging. Her going was definitely plausible.

Edited March 24, 2012 by DrOphthalmos

[Queen Cassie 3,057]

Bravo. I loved your new unbiased analysis.

 

Just one thing... Fluttershy filling the role? If she stomped on RD's ribcage in an effort to get out of just LOOKING at a dragon migration, what makes you think they would have been able to talk her into getting into a dragon suit to get that close to an entire group of dragons? Fluttershy's dragon phobia would have made that next to impossible for her.

 

Rainbow Dash is loyalty. Spike is a friend. And even if he wasn't, then he is a friend of a friend. Rainbow Dash has guts and does not leave her friends hanging. Her going was definitely plausible.

 

You're right of course. Even if Rainbow Dash doesn't think too much about Spike, or sees him as something like annoying little brother, he's HER annoying little squirt to rag on and no one else's. Loyalty in full force.

[Forlong 1,725]

I like what they did with the dragons. They look cool, sound cool, and are complete jerk (AKA: cool).

[Gestalt 17]

My least favorite episode....not a bad episode...just my least favorite, for the following reasons:

 

1) Spike was girly-fied for the sole purpose of our entertainment...never before does he act this way so profoundly.

 

2) No dragon on-screen is Mature, save spike, i was hoping he would have spoke with an elder of some sort.

 

3) Spike runs away at the end...I get its only a 22-minute episode and only so much can be covered in it...however, "you fight for what is right!" and smashing pheonix eggs is certainly wrong and even if spike was destined to lose...standing for whats right in the face of evil takes heart.

 

Perhaps I excpected to much out of this one, but nonetheless, the exchanges between TW and RD where hilarious

[Sunny Fox 5,929]

My least favorite episode....not a bad episode...just my least favorite, for the following reasons:

 

1) Spike was girly-fied for the sole purpose of our entertainment...never before does he act this way so profoundly.

 

2) No dragon on-screen is Mature, save spike, i was hoping he would have spoke with an elder of some sort.

 

3) Spike runs away at the end...I get its only a 22-minute episode and only so much can be covered in it...however, "you fight for what is right!" and smashing pheonix eggs is certainly wrong and even if spike was destined to lose...standing for whats right in the face of evil takes heart.

 

Perhaps I excpected to much out of this one, but nonetheless, the exchanges between TW and RD where hilarious

 

Well, discretion is the better part of valour - a saying which essentially boils down to "pick your battles." And in fact, telling a child that they should "fight back against the bullies" is problematic and can be counter-productive in many cases. After all, the follow up to "don't take candy from strangers" is not generally "kick them in the knees" but "run away and find a responsible adult to help you" instead. Spike and the three ponies were no match for the three nigh-invulnerable, fire-breathing dragons, so running away was entirely in order. Although, the adult in the equation is missing, so the analogy breaks down a bit, but still.

[SBaby 660]

I will say one thing about this episode. It reminded me alot of Teela's Quest from the original He-Man. He has almost the exact same motive for leaving (he wants to find out more about who he is and where he really came from).

 

As for the whole 'run away thing' with the Phoenix egg, it makes sense to D&D players.

 

Granted, if it was me, I would've at least said something to the parents as I was running. I'd be like, 'Hey! Hey, PHOENIIIIIIIIIXES!!! HEY, THEY'RE TRYIN' TO KILL YOUR KIIIIIDS!!! YOU MIGHT WANNA GO OVER THERE AND DO SOMETHIN' ABOUT IT!!! I WOULD, BUT WE'RE LIKE, LITTLE AND THEY'RE BIG!!! THEY GOT BIG TEETH, AND BREATHE FIRE, BUT YOU GUYS EAT FIRE, SO... JUST KIND OF FIGURED YOU'D WANNA KNOW!!!'.

Edited September 22, 2012 by SBaby

[Gestalt 17]

Well, discretion is the better part of valour - a saying which essentially boils down to "pick your battles." And in fact, telling a child that they should "fight back against the bullies" is problematic and can be counter-productive in many cases. After all, the follow up to "don't take candy from strangers" is not generally "kick them in the knees" but "run away and find a responsible adult to help you" instead. Spike and the three ponies were no match for the three nigh-invulnerable, fire-breathing dragons, so running away was entirely in order. Although, the adult in the equation is missing, so the analogy breaks down a bit, but still.

Well, as i said, you can only look into a 22-minute episode so far...certain aspects such as the elder dragons and an action scene would not have fit into the time constraints (although it is certainly plausible)... which is why i propose we petition for a full length mlp movie :3

[Dr.McDoom! 19]

Twilight could've handed them their asses if she really wanted to, but there just wasn't enough time.

I tend to disagree. Twilight isn't highly proficient in combat magic and wouldn't have enough "Mana Points" to handle three teenage dragons alone. She'd only stand a chance if aided by Rarity and Rainbow.

[Swit Swat 536]

It was creepy. Good though.

[SBaby 660]

I tend to disagree. Twilight isn't highly proficient in combat magic and wouldn't have enough "Mana Points" to handle three teenage dragons alone. She'd only stand a chance if aided by Rarity and Rainbow.

 

Fully grown, I'd agree. But they were juvenile Dragons. She was able to take out hundreds of Changelings before running out of steam. Three juvenile Dragons would be a fight, but they would be doable, especially with the others there with her.

[Dr.McDoom! 19]

Possibly, but with low morale provided by Spike, they'd be bound to retreat. Why doesn't Spike have a few gimmicks of his own? It feels like he's the "obligatory one black man" in this feminazi ruled world.