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sunset shimmer: like or dislike, and why?


venelopi
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Accepting yourself for what you are, without need to change it. That's what I see in starlight. She's self-sufficient and in control of the self, perhaps even in control of others.

As for sunset. Her character is insecure. She's always looking for redemption and acceptance. I see that dependence on others as a weakness.

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1 hour ago, They call me Loyalty said:

Accepting yourself for what you are, without need to change it. That's what I see in starlight. She's self-sufficient and in control of the self, perhaps even in control of others.

I see the opposite of that in Starlight, she is deeply insecure - so insecure that her freakout over her friend leaving for university left her a twisted maniac; her dependence on her relationship with Trixie stops her giving THAT mare a pointed object lesson on not writing cheques your horn can't cash, and so forth. The S6 finale is as much about a transition within Starlight as about the changelings - and that she sees herself as defeated then rescued by Twilight (which is actually true of Sunset, but while Twi can get credit for putting her on a better path after Starlight accepted the cost of her revenge was too high, Spike has been a better mentor to Starlight than Twi has. Which is fine - what Starlight actually needed was emotional support and a chance to grow, and Twi gave her that freely.

 

1 hour ago, They call me Loyalty said:

As for sunset. Her character is insecure. She's always looking for redemption and acceptance. I see that dependence on others as a weakness.

Sunset was the Diamond Tiara of Celestia's school, both in Equestria and at Canterlot High. She felt entitled to an easy path to power, and when Celestia wasn't forthcoming with that, tried to steal that power from Twilight. In contrast to Starlight, she WAS defeated by Twi, and rather roughly - the Rainbow Bitchslap of Harmony was in full effect and left her literally in a smoking hole in the ground.  Twi (again!) offered her a better path, but it was the other girls of the EqG group that actually put that into effect, offering her the support she needed to get past the retribution she had earned from the rest of the school.  When that was threatened, she fled back to equestria for a fix, even facing up to her shame with Celestia to find a path back to her "safe place"

Interestingly enough though, when she is reset back to her first arrival by Wallflower, it is Princess Celestia she cries out to for help...

 

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On 1/21/2019 at 2:56 PM, CypherHoof said:

I see the opposite of that in Starlight, she is deeply insecure - so insecure that her freakout over her friend leaving for university left her a twisted maniac; her dependence on her relationship with Trixie stops her giving THAT mare a pointed object lesson on not writing cheques your horn can't cash, and so forth. The S6 finale is as much about a transition within Starlight as about the changelings - and that she sees herself as defeated then rescued by Twilight (which is actually true of Sunset, but while Twi can get credit for putting her on a better path after Starlight accepted the cost of her revenge was too high, Spike has been a better mentor to Starlight than Twi has. Which is fine - what Starlight actually needed was emotional support and a chance to grow, and Twi gave her that freely.

 

Sunset was the Diamond Tiara of Celestia's school, both in Equestria and at Canterlot High. She felt entitled to an easy path to power, and when Celestia wasn't forthcoming with that, tried to steal that power from Twilight. In contrast to Starlight, she WAS defeated by Twi, and rather roughly - the Rainbow Bitchslap of Harmony was in full effect and left her literally in a smoking hole in the ground.  Twi (again!) offered her a better path, but it was the other girls of the EqG group that actually put that into effect, offering her the support she needed to get past the retribution she had earned from the rest of the school.  When that was threatened, she fled back to equestria for a fix, even facing up to her shame with Celestia to find a path back to her "safe place"

Interestingly enough though, when she is reset back to her first arrival by Wallflower, it is Princess Celestia she cries out to for help...

 

thank you! this guy gets me: and thanks so much for sharing :-)

On 1/21/2019 at 5:20 PM, This Whomps said:

I like her a lot, easily the best thing to come out of EQG

true that :-)

23 hours ago, Key Sharkz said:

Hands down, fully agree.

me too!

On 1/21/2019 at 12:52 PM, They call me Loyalty said:

Accepting yourself for what you are, without need to change it. That's what I see in starlight. She's self-sufficient and in control of the self, perhaps even in control of others.

As for sunset. Her character is insecure. She's always looking for redemption and acceptance. I see that dependence on others as a weakness.

I can't really understand where youre coming from with this, but thank you for sharing:

I don't think that dependence on others is a weekness, well, at least, not to much of it:

but sunset has sertanly moved on from that stage in her life, as she helps sci-twi get over it as well, and sunset totally sees that they forgave her.

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There are two legit characters in EQG. Human Twilight, and Sunset Shimmer. That's why she's my favorite character of EQG. There aren't much options to choose.

The biggest difference between Starlight and Sunset is depicted clearly when they first meet in Mirror Magic. Sunset acts responsible, Starlight doesn't (doesn't matter that it turns out to be ok because both of them don't have a clairvoyance to see the future. their set of principles are different.) Also, Sunset's reformation and connection with her friends was told throughout the story. We actually see sunset EARN the place she is right now, but for Starlight, that place is offered by Twilight while we don't see her earning it. (and we also see Twilight isn't able to stop her, and Starlight doesn't have anything to lose by accepting her offer. she needed friends to soothe her insecurities after all. more of a beneficial choice than just because it's a right thing to do.)

We have been put in Sunset's position right away when she is first introduced as a character at Rainbow Rocks (I don't consider any of the first Equestria Girls' characters or stories as a legit thing because it was that awful), but we don't go there when it comes to Starlight. Starlight was fully introduced first as a villain and we don't see a convincing transformation (and a convincing backstory as well). We get into that level of position until season 6 finale. (in No Second Prances, we don't see her making right choices - well, she won't just watch her friend ridiculously kill herself in front of her?) But season 6 finale doesn't feel like her reformation either. She's more utilized as a powerful unicorn than a sympathetic character not only in that episode, but in the show in general.

After all, Sunset is a way more better person (and a pony) than Starlight. If you choose one of them babysit your child, who would you choose? Or even asking them for anything? Starlight has many flaws and it's not a good way to gain sympathy. It's a character's strength (despite the weakness) that is. In equal conditions, I would always choose a better character in a story to root for. After all, Starlight is created as a bypass to create a character like Sunset Shimmer but not to provoke fans who hate everything related to Equestria Girls.

More importantly, Sunset is more interesting than Starlight. Starlight has to be paired with more interesting characters (Maud, Spike, Trixie, even Sunset), so she doesn't have to drive the story by her own or be alone in the screen more than a minute. She is even more interesting when changed to other characters. When we need a magically strong but socially awkward unicorn as a protagonist, we can use Twilight. If we need a voice of conscience for Twilight, we can use spike. If we need a voice of reason, we can use Applejack. If we need a third perspective who looks outside of the box, we can use Spike, Pinkie Pie, Maud Pie. If we need a reformed villain, well, that's the last thing lacking in MLP.

And right now, Starlight is a pain in the arse for the writers for FiM (season 8 proves this), Sunset is the hope and future of EQG. I used to like Starlight and detested everything EQG, but it's switched now. Starlight doesn't have a proper development that makes her deserve all her screentime. Now I have higher expectations for the new EQG shorts than season 9. There are many reasons for it, and clearly the main character is one of them.

If you like Starlight, no problem. That doesn't mean you are illogical or have bad morals. It's just you might have different reasons with me.

Edited by Sepul-Coloratura
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Sunset is awesome. I can relate to a lot of the things she has gone through and can respect her efforts to improve herself and become accepted. There are moments where she does lose her cool and lash out - which I have full experience with. Is it a flaw? Of course. But, I feel that it adds more character to her.

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15 hours ago, Sepul-Coloratura said:

There are two legit characters in EQG. Human Twilight, and Sunset Shimmer. That's why she's my favorite character of EQG. There aren't much options to choose.

The biggest difference between Starlight and Sunset is depicted clearly when they first meet in Mirror Magic. Sunset acts responsible, Starlight doesn't (doesn't matter that it turns out to be ok because both of them don't have a clairvoyance to see the future. their set of principles are different.) Also, Sunset's reformation and connection with her friends was told throughout the story. We actually see sunset EARN the place she is right now, but for Starlight, that place is offered by Twilight while we don't see her earning it. (and we also see Twilight isn't able to stop her, and Starlight doesn't have anything to lose by accepting her offer. she needed friends to soothe her insecurities after all. more of a beneficial choice than just because it's a right thing to do.)

We have been put in Sunset's position right away when she is first introduced as a character at Rainbow Rocks (I don't consider any of the first Equestria Girls' characters or stories as a legit thing because it was that awful), but we don't go there when it comes to Starlight. Starlight was fully introduced first as a villain and we don't see a convincing transformation (and a convincing backstory as well). We get into that level of position until season 6 finale. (in No Second Prances, we don't see her making right choices - well, she won't just watch her friend ridiculously kill herself in front of her?) But season 6 finale doesn't feel like her reformation either. She's more utilized as a powerful unicorn than a sympathetic character not only in that episode, but in the show in general.

After all, Sunset is a way more better person (and a pony) than Starlight. If you choose one of them babysit your child, who would you choose? Or even asking them for anything? Starlight has many flaws and it's not a good way to gain sympathy. It's a character's strength (despite the weakness) that is. In equal conditions, I would always choose a better character in a story to root for. After all, Starlight is created as a bypass to create a character like Sunset Shimmer but not to provoke fans who hate everything related to Equestria Girls.

More importantly, Sunset is more interesting than Starlight. Starlight has to be paired with more interesting characters (Maud, Spike, Trixie, even Sunset), so she doesn't have to drive the story by her own or be alone in the screen more than a minute. She is even more interesting when changed to other characters. When we need a magically strong but socially awkward unicorn as a protagonist, we can use Twilight. If we need a voice of conscience for Twilight, we can use spike. If we need a voice of reason, we can use Applejack. If we need a third perspective who looks outside of the box, we can use Spike, Pinkie Pie, Maud Pie. If we need a reformed villain, well, that's the last thing lacking in MLP.

And right now, Starlight is a pain in the arse for the writers for FiM (season 8 proves this), Sunset is the hope and future of EQG. I used to like Starlight and detested everything EQG, but it's switched now. Starlight doesn't have a proper development that makes her deserve all her screentime. Now I have higher expectations for the new EQG shorts than season 9. There are many reasons for it, and clearly the main character is one of them.

If you like Starlight, no problem. That doesn't mean you are illogical or have bad morals. It's just you might have different reasons with me.

I can totally realate. if you think you heared the whole sunset reformation story, then you don't even mlp comics, bro!

there was this on comic (link to it fully voiced here)

that shows even more of all the things sunset had to so to earn her place as a main and good charecter.

but starlight?

nope! 

 

5 hours ago, Cash In said:

Sunset is awesome. I can relate to a lot of the things she has gone through and can respect her efforts to improve herself and become accepted. There are moments where she does lose her cool and lash out - which I have full experience with. Is it a flaw? Of course. But, I feel that it adds more character to her.

hey! when she had the freakout in friendship games: it was totally o.k: everyone thinks it was wrong. but really! sci-twi allmust really hurt all of sunset's friends, and she thinks that a simple apolozie can fix it?

sunset did good when she got mad.

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24 minutes ago, Bas said:

Couldn't the same be said about Sunset at the end of EQG?

sunset wasn't mad: o.k, she was mad with power, but I meant that she was angry.

in the first eqg movie, sunset was mad with power, and she was blinded by her hate for princess twilight, and she wanted to be an alicorn too.

she know these ponies, she know the people that she had menipolated. she got mad about the whole alicorn thing and did what she did for her benefit alone.

in friendship games, sunset was in a different place: she had friends, that had given her a fresh start.

when she is trying to be a good friend, keep all of the magic under control and get use to the fact that there is a sci-twi, and that she is taring the dimension apart in the middle of the games, almost killing a lot of people in the process,

you might give her some slack when she freaks out: she can't be perfect: and with someone she doesn't know that looks like someone she does know trying to use the magic that sunset was suppose to keep in check but couldn't, I think its a good reason to get mad (angry)

see, she was mad no for her own benefit, but for the satiety of herself, her friends, canterlot high, crystal prep, and sci-twi herself:

its like a mom is trying to warn there child not to play to much video games, or he will miss out on his life and responcebilities

but this time the mom (sunset) was trying to prevent anything bad happening to anyone, wich, what do you know, actually did happen, when two demons were almost tarring two dimensions apart.\

even if her friends did show her that she migth of went to far, she is allowed to not be perfect (if its eqg dosen't mean its flawless)

hey, don't we all get mad (angry) over the silliest of things sometimes, and then regret it?

just a natural phase to a human (and some say that its not realistic..... well, color skin: pink, but still realistic! :-)

(hope you like this conversation so far: I really like it)

*sorry its long but I wanted to be clear: sometimes with my friends, I'm not 100 persent clear and I don't mean to attack no one but instead have a happy conversation*

Edited by venelopi
apolozie and explination
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I like Sunset... but I also acknowledge that’s an easy thing to do. There is not a single thing about her (the character, not the writing) to dislike. Borderline perfect, and the few flaws she does have are never used in a way that creates conflict or makes her look bad.

She’s EQG’s golden goose, and Hasbro and the writers are extremely careful not to do anything to ruffle the feathers of their money making character. 

I like her, but I want it to be harder to like her. I want her to be a more human character, not a superhero. I don’t think she fits in with the rest of the girls with all their flaws and insanity.

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  • 4 weeks later...

I think Sunset is a great character. Yes she started as a cartoony (no pun intended) school bully being mean to everyone just because she can and everyone turns a blind eye to it. After her fall, she started at rock bottom, a piriah at school and everyone she knew. Her new “friends” risked their reputations to give her a chance but everywhere she looked she was reminded of who she used to be. 

Throughout Rainbow Rocks, she had no voice because she was burdened by her guilt and she didn’t feel it was her place to judge people when she knew they were doing bad things like her friends not addressing their problems until it was too late. She was afraid of being pro-active against the Dazzlings. Until wasn’t until the end that she found her voice and sang with her friends to defeat the Dazzlings. 

In Friendship Games, she had more confidence and a voice but she was being too pro-active and placing the burden of solving the magic problem on herself. She was also letting her old traits like anger show like when she lashed out at Sci-Twi. She knew what it was like to be awept up by something she didn’t understand and have it end badly. Just because it was wrong for Twilight to mess with magic didn’t mean it was right for Sunset to lash out at her.

I would t have expected it but I’m glad she became friends with Trixie.

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  • 1 month later...

I like Sunset. She went through a proper redemption. At the end of Equestria Girls, she is forgiven by Twilight and the human mane 5 but she still had to deal with the fallout at the school. She had to earn the respect of the school again. Over time, she was welcomed back into the school society and became a part of the Human Mane 6. She reached out to Sci-Twi when she needed her. Sunset is a great character and I loved to see where she goes in the future.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Just got turned on to FiM and EG thanks to my kid.  Sunset has a lot of depth, and an allegory of her own. Ironically she's more human than others in the world as she chose the dark path before realizing her faults.  In a sense she resembles humanity in its own, going through our dark times before finding light.

After the defeat of her demonic form, she sought atonement for her actions and misunderstandings [of magic].  She became a good friend and a crucial asset to the EG timeline.  From what I gather she is the 7th Element after watching Everfree, Empathy.

I like Sunset a lot and she has given guidance to her friends based on her past and experience with magic.  Too bad G4 is coming to a close including EG.

 

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40 minutes ago, Mongo said:

Just got turned on to FiM and EG thanks to my kid.  Sunset has a lot of depth, and an allegory of her own. Ironically she's more human than others in the world as she chose the dark path before realizing her faults.  In a sense she resembles humanity in its own, going through our dark times before finding light.

After the defeat of her demonic form, she sought atonement for her actions and misunderstandings [of magic].  She became a good friend and a crucial asset to the EG timeline.  From what I gather she is the 7th Element after watching Everfree, Empathy.

I like Sunset a lot and she has given guidance to her friends based on her past and experience with magic.  Too bad G4 is coming to a close including EG.

 

Not sure they have said either way regarding EqG - It's been patchy anyhow though, since the movies - mostly shorts, with some normal episode-length "specials" that filled in the gaps a bit better. 

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  • 10 months later...

Sunset Shimmer is a perfect character. She makes the audience love her, because she has issues and problems that she is willing to overcome. She is hot. She is reformed.

I feel like she would sometimes be a better character (pony) in Equestria (FIM) than in Equestria Girls.

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