S09:E07 - She's All Yak

[ShootingStar159 2,155]

1 hour ago, Dark Qiviut said:

Nor have the RM7’s. Starlight’s role as guidance counselor and the others’ won’t likely be impacted until Episode 11 and mid-season finale, respectively. So far, the Young Six take over most of the spotlight, and given how new they are, that’s necessary.

The RM7 haven’t had a moment to do that, to take a bigger role in the running of Equestria. There hasn’t been an episode or subplot dedicated to the running of Equestria that they just haven’t had a role in for no explained or acceptable reason. You’re completely missing the point of my problem, which isn’t that Starlight hasn’t had an episode completely outlining her new role.

Starlight has had several missed moments to take a bigger role in the school and to build relationships with the students. She wasn’t there in Uprooted, and she wasn’t there for this episode either. If the writers were serious about Starlights future role, they would have had her plan the ball instead of Twilight.

1 hour ago, Dark Qiviut said:

A role that Starlight was introduced to last season on an interim basis, thanks to Discord’s mind games. Despite understandably losing her temper, she handled herself decently at the end and, apparently, held her own again while the others scavenged in Canterlot to breach SA’s security.

The difference between running someone else’s school the way they would want it, and running your own school according to your own plans and ideas is so fundamentally different, they can not honestly be compared to each other. Running a school by her own merits and abilities (Running activities like the spellvenger hunt, choosing permanent teacher, managing a curriculum)  is not something Starlight has any experience doing.

 

1 hour ago, Dark Qiviut said:

In Season 6, Starlight’s arc was at the height of its importance. DHX brought her into the central cast with the RM7, Discord, and the CMCs. She was included into that circle, and it was up to them to make it matter. Instead, after an early rush of episodes, Starlight was barely included in between Tail and Every Little Thing. At the time, plenty justifiably questioned whether she belonged or not. With how vulnerable her reputation was, S6 had to make a powerful statement and didn’t. They couldn’t get away with not including her, and not doing so was a gigantic mistake, which hindered To Where’s credibility as a whole. She came of S6 looking worse than before, and it took at least one season (and very smart roles for her) to fix it.

 Since then, that changed. Today her rep as a character is much improved, and canonically, she showed her worth in both the series and the school. We know what her status is and will be. Neither BotE nor Sparkle’s Seven needed to use her so much. So far, aside from maybe a background cameo here, DHX doesn’t need to include her at all.

You are confusing narrative purpose with meta purpose. Sure, there was a meta reason that Starlight should have been included more in Season Six. But there was never a narrative slot that they should have fit her into but didn’t. For example, it’s not like she has a love of sports that would have made her a great fit for Buckball Season. The only real reason they would have had to put her on the team is that she’s a unicorn, which isn’t all that compelling of a narrative reason.

With Starlight being picked to take control of the school, there’s a huge narrative need to make her significantly more involved in the running of a school that she’s going to be left alone to handle completely on her own. 

Edited May 12, 2019 by ShootingStar159

[StitchandMLPlover 930]

10 hours ago, Sepul-Coloratura said:

By the way, Equestria, especially Ponyville isn't a racist place to begin with, so it's not a special moment to have other creatures in a party or have cultural exchanges. (Equestria was built on non-racist principles to begin with.) That Twilight (and others or the show itself) deliberately paying extra attention about racial diversity lately is kinda odd honestly. Equestria does have mostly ponies, but nothing stopped them from having other creatures. Spike, a pony eating creature seems to have no problem growing up, Zecora has no problem with ponies after resolving the misunderstanding, Gilda seemed to have a flight camp with Dash and even while she was being rude to others, ponies were being nice and didn't treat her any different from other ponies. (Chancellor Neighsay would have never allowed the flight camp to have griffons and ponies together btw.) I wouldn't mind all of that if the fun of the show wasn't the expense for it.

A lesson about accepting other's race and culture was already done and done better in Bridle Gossip.

Yes this was something that bothered me about Season 8 and Season 9 in particular but is present in other seasons. Ponies are not racist by nature and every episode that covers racism in this show from "Bridle Gossip" to "Hearths Warming Eve" to later episodes feels wonky, unnatural and just off. Like they are trying to insert tendencies in our human world too forcibly into characters that weren't designed to function that way. Episodes like this do seem a bit like an attempt to stay "relevant" with other media being so concerned with diversity, inclusion and Micro aggression and it does not work except for the small moments where they acknowledge that most enemies on the show are non pony so the ponies might have grown more wary after the events of the movie etc.

10 hours ago, Dark Qiviut said:

That still doesn’t change the critique with Rarity’s character there. In Canterlot Boutique, she wanted to expand her empire without sacrificing its character and soul. Rarity is a creative-first character who strives to stick out and do her best. Sassy’s model was all about selling as many of the same outfit as possible, robbing the soul of her Boutique empire and turning her into an assembly pony. Rather than accept this model, she willingly risked the success of her business both in Canterlot and beyond. Quality and creativity matter.

That is a complete reversal of her characterization in Spice Up Your Life. Instead of assisting Pinkie’s idea and being themselves to stand out from the other clichéd restaurants, she told them to assimilate and worked to make them as soulless as the rest. Zesty Gourmand, albeit being hypocritical, rightfully called Rarity’s idea out as a blatant ripoff of the others. A pony like Twilight would fit her role more, since she lived in Canterlot for most of her life and adheres to a more standards-and-practices approach in some parts of her life.

In that episode, we saw a complete line of thinking that made her eventually believe that the only way to succeed there is to be the popular aristocrat (thank Jet Set and Upper Crust for this), which the episode actively showed to be in the wrong. When she had to choose between sticking up for her friends and their un-Canterlotty partying or retaining her reputation in high Canterlot society, she chose to do what’s right: defend her friends and call them the most important ponies she knows. She sacrificed her status for them.

The customers expect R4Y to be open, not no character.

Bridle Gossip handled the subject of racism really poorly. Everyone in Ponyville treated Zecora like shit and spread rumors around her just because she scared them, implicating that all racism in real life happens from fright while ignoring the hatred and superiority aspects. The fact that Twilight, who stuck to her guns, shunned a book due to a crummy cover and gave in really hurt her character there. The episode simplifies and whitewashes a very serious subject.

I still respectfully disagree on "Spice Up Your Life". Rarity started off wanting to succeed in fashion like you say but then wanted to conform to Canterlot tastes for the attention in high society she felt she deserved socially and gain a status, until the very end of "Sweet and Elite". She wanted Coriander to gain social status too. I don't think Rarity viewed a restaurant as a creative pursuit at that time. She was also friends with the restaurant reviewer and had probably been influenced by her. I DO agree on your comment about Bridle Gossip however. I did not like how the writing handled racism in that episode at all like I said to the other person.  

[qwerE 95]

This was an ok episode. Yona talking like Rarity was the funny part for me. Her dacing was cute, too.

10 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

Sure, but this particular episode mostly just follows the formula of: person tries to fit in -> others encourage them to fit in -> person embarrasses themself -> person is told they should just be themselves. Only difference is that this version has a vague racial charge that the episode doesn't actually explore in much detail.

I agree. Although I mostly liked the episode, people who say that the lessons are too repetitive certainly have a point. I know the lesson 'be yourself' is important, especially to kids who are prone to suffer from peer pressure. However, the last episode 'common ground' already covered the same issue and having the same lesson twice in a row seems excessive.

This lesson also undermines the importance of trying to learn new things outside your comfort zone. Being yourself is obviously important and all, but Yona being punished (as in, punished by the storywriters) for trying to learn a pony dance seems absurd. I thought it was really sweet of her to practice hard to learn a new pony culture, and really felt happy for her when she finally mastered the moves. But after all that work, she messes up and embarrasses herself because of her dress. I couldn't help but feel that was a bit unfair.

Being yourself is important. But how do you know what you are if you don't try out things that you don't know? It is entirely possible that Yona turns out to be a Yak who likes pony dance, and foods like cupcakes. I know this isn't the intended effect, but this story may subconsciously reinforce the idea that Yona should do things that Yaks do, because she belongs to that group. When I saw Yona in her dress with everyone saying she looked weird, it kind of reminded of me as a brony. Other creatures may think Yona looks weird, but I don't think that should stop her from trying pony things.

[Thrond 3,257]

On 5/11/2019 at 2:12 PM, Sepul-Coloratura said:

Well, we can't show buffalos scalping ponies to show the true violent nature of the history of American Indians in Over a Barrel. Or show the brutal nature of bullying, war, enslavement, brainwashing, capitalism, mental abuse, abuse of power, death, power struggle, guilt, anxiety etc. Bridle Gossip showed one aspect of racism, and it wasn't about all the reasons why. It was not a solid episode, but still way better than She's All Yak.

I think I still liked this one more; both episodes are depressing, but this one is less contrived, at least. But at least in “Bridle Gossip” we see the ponies learning from their mistake. This one is just like, oh yeah, the mane six have racial prejudices. We don’t see them struggling with that stuff, so they’re now permanently harder to relate to, all for an oversimplified moral. There are a lot of reasons why cultural assimilation is problematic, but those are too complicated for this show so it opts for secondhand embarrassment instead. We know that telling Yona how to speak is a micro-aggression, but why is it a problem for her on-screen? The reason is generic. People need to stop praising this show for being ambitious when the execution is so simplistic.

14 hours ago, qwerE said:

This lesson also undermines the importance of trying to learn new things outside your comfort zone. Being yourself is obviously important and all, but Yona being punished (as in, punished by the storywriters) for trying to learn a pony dance seems absurd. I thought it was really sweet of her to practice hard to learn a new pony culture, and really felt happy for her when she finally mastered the moves. But after all that work, she messes up and embarrasses herself because of her dress. I couldn't help but feel that was a bit unfair.

Being yourself is important. But how do you know what you are if you don't try out things that you don't know? It is entirely possible that Yona turns out to be a Yak who likes pony dance, and foods like cupcakes. I know this isn't the intended effect, but this story may subconsciously reinforce the idea that Yona should do things that Yaks do, because she belongs to that group. When I saw Yona in her dress with everyone saying she looked weird, it kind of reminded of me as a brony. Other creatures may think Yona looks weird, but I don't think that should stop her from trying pony things. 

She can try as many pony things as she wants, but she shouldn’t be forced to abandon her culture’s way of dressing and speaking just because she thinks certain things are expected of her. Does she really want to explore her identity, or is her nervousness being exploited by people who think their ways are better?

Edited May 12, 2019 by AlexanderThrond

[Sepul-Coloratura 756]

1 hour ago, AlexanderThrond said:

I think I still liked this one more; both episodes are depressing, but this one is less contrived, at least. But at least in “Bridle Gossip” we see the ponies learning from their mistake. This one is just like, oh yeah, the mane six have racial prejudices. We don’t see them struggling with that stuff, so they’re now permanently harder to relate to, all for an oversimplified moral. There are a lot of reasons why cultural assimilation is problematic, but those are too complicated for this show so it opts for secondhand embarrassment instead. We know that telling Yona how to speak is a micro-aggression, but why is it a problem for her on-screen? The reason is generic. People need to stop praising this show for being ambitious when the execution is so simplistic.

I think they failed to distinguish between what's bad about of cultural assimilation (I don't even know what that would be like and how to show it in the show) and just playing odd and stupid. (I mean, it's ok to have cultural assimilation the other way around?) None of the ponies would talk that strange, even Rarity paid extra attention to deliberately sound strange. And none of the ponies including Rarity would wear that dress which looked like Mane-iac or what Trixie did to Rarity in Boast Busters. And even the dresses that Rarity forced Applejack and Rainbow Dash to wear before didn't fit the characters, but it still was "pretty" and at least looked like something Rarity would want. As far as I know, none of pony culture is that strange or wrong or forcing at all. Applejack is all about tradition and she doesn't do that. Or Twilight doesn't do that, the pony who would follow all the instructions on a textbook.

They seem like trying to talk about the issue of race and culture, but in the plot, the problem came from the individual level.

I don't even know what the Mane Six was thinking in this episode, and I don't know what's their problem. It seemed like they were dead set on screwing things up. And narrowed their vision and intelligence purposefully. That also makes us hard to relate. I don't know why did they teach Yona all those strange things while none of other ponies were doing it. Things which were ridiculous even in pony standards. I don't get it. Bridle Gossip was like shouting out "Hey kids! Different people might seem strange or scary at first but they are nice people too!", but it had kind of a clear delivery at least. Most of all, even Bridle Gossip was an archetypal 'misunderstood seemingly scary character but actually not' cartoon episode, it wasn't that much predictable and flavorless.

[RaphLuna 305]

6 hours ago, Odyssey said:

I don't know why some people believe that repeating morals is necessarily a bad thing. People have different ways or situations of learning the same moral. And what matters more than anything else is the execution, not if it's already been done.

If your going to recycle morals, at least space them out within a series, not back to back.

Personally season 9 went down hill. It sadly is just being dragged along to the end.

Now don't get me wrong here. If you and many others like the final season so far, that's cool.

This is just my personal feeling about the show.

I'm a big fan of TMNT 2012 It was epic, however once it got to the final season in the series the show went off the rails and now I don't even care to watch the ending.

Its the same for the final season of mlp. King Sombra was rushed to be defeated. However we got quite a bit of him in the first two episodes of season 9 however a lot of time was swallowed up on panic and other men stuff. I did like Discords speech he was awesome, the ponies were meh.

Im not trashing the show. This is just how I feel that's all.

If you like or love it cool, just please understand that not everyone is going to feel the same way about it as you do. And kindly be courteous and respect their honest opinion.

 

[Odyssey 5,712]

8 hours ago, Dark Qiviut said:

To be blunt, calling it a “be yourself” moral shortchanges the actual lesson Yona and the ReMane 5 learned. Today’s lesson is how you shouldn’t have to believe that to grow and mature is to erase your own identity and be trained to another’s under the belief that they’re “more civilized” than yours. It’s an anti-assimilation message above all else.

Yeah, good point. Considering that Yona specifically said she wanted to "fit right in" for a party that was previously a pony tradition.  

2 hours ago, RaphLuna said:

If your going to recycle morals, at least space them out within a series, not back to back.

-

If you like or love it cool, just please understand that not everyone is going to feel the same way about it as you do. And kindly be courteous and respect their honest opinion.

But that's what the show does all the time. With 200+ episodes to watch of course you're going to recycle morals. And when that happens, it sure doesn't do it "back to back."

Also... why would you think I would bash you (or respect, on that matter) for your opinion? Don't be condescending.

 

[Goat-kun 2,490]

Just to be clear: west has the most advanced civilization on this miserable rock and all other civilizations are indeed inferior. New things are discovered and invented, and our cultures need to adapt or die. The progress of humanity is more important than your sentiments. I for one will not tolerate religion-based laws and forced traditions. You shall not consume the brains of your ancestors, you shall not marry your underage cousin, and you shall not kill animals in accordance to your scriptures but in accordance to their rights. No exceptions should be allowed. Of course, the good stuff needs to be assimilated. That was always so.

 

 

Now that we got that out of the way, there is something to be said about the use of pony traditions and philosophies. Ponies in general are shallow pieces of shit that act the same way as unfriendly non-pones but are somehow protected from all the consequences that pester the rest of the world due to "friendship problems". There is nothing good or grand on anything pertaining to Equestrian civilization. Yak traditions are, as far as we know, a benign assortment of foods, clothes, and dances. There's nothing wrong with those things. Even ponies have their differences when it comes to tradition, so I fail to see a problem. Is there anything that one could interpret as a difference in core values? Not really. Neither Equestria nor Yakyakistan have core values that go beyond a vague notion of personal happiness that is linked to an amorphous religion of Friendship and Harmony ... sometimes, when the plot demands it.

 

 

What we saw was not an exchange between two civilizations. We saw a couple of snobs doing snob stuff while failing to comprehend why anyone wouldn't want to do snob stuff. You could have easily switched Yona for a redneck pony.

Edited May 12, 2019 by Goat-kun
Expanding Equestrian lebensraum

[Yfus 28]

Not a big fan of this episode, but ok. Not so many emotions like in previous ones.

 

I have known since the very beginning, that Rarity isn't a good teacher  She should be rather an actress in a drama than a professional teacher, but it was fun.

[Lambdadelta 1,462]

At first I thought this is a Pinkie episode with Yaks (I didn't read anything about this ep), it turned out an episode about Yona (best student) try to "fit right in".

Pretty dull episode with a lot of montages. Rarity's face in this ep is the highlight of the episode and I have to announce new Yona & Sand Bar ship. The song is just meh, not even mlp standard, songs are getting worse these days. Hard to find anything funny to say about this ep, because it's just not very fun to watch, 5/10

I hope to see a stronger student 6 episode because this ep might be the first worst episode in the first 10 episodes of this season, any lower than that is fatal.

[YoshiAngemon 223]

7 minutes ago, Yfus said:

Not a big fan of this episode, but ok. Not so many emotions like in previous ones.

 

I have known since the very beginning, that Rarity isn't a good teacher  She should be rather an actress in a drama than a professional teacher, but it was fun.

With that kind of drama, Rarity could NEVER be Best Teacher, or Teacher of the Month like Fluttershy! Maybe she needs to be put in a Pony Version of the Three Stooges' Hoi Polloi, which has the boys trying to be like gentlemen, only to cost the Environment guy to lose the wager, thereby proving once again that Heredity is the backbone of social distinction.

Edited May 12, 2019 by YoshiAngemon

[Yfus 28]

Well i love Rarirty, but i do not understand what she can teach apart from fashion and sewing dresses. Emm, no idea what is Three Stooges, i meant a pony theatre. You know Romeo and Juliet? Rarity should be the mother either of Juliet or Romeo. She would be so great! Firstly raging, secondly crying.

Back to the episode. I have no idea how it's possible that Yona could learn "May I offer you a cup of ponch?" without learning what "I" is. How is it possible, that she still knows nothing about grammar? Maybe she's me and she speaks English like i do. 

And the party. Was it a normal disco party or a ball? 3 types of partying (traditional rural party, ball and modern disco) mixed together. It happens only in Equestria XDD

[Thrond 3,257]

7 hours ago, Sepul-Coloratura said:

I think they failed to distinguish between what's bad about of cultural assimilation (I don't even know what that would be like and how to show it in the show) and just playing odd and stupid. (I mean, it's ok to have cultural assimilation the other way around?) None of the ponies would talk that strange, even Rarity paid extra attention to deliberately sound strange. And none of the ponies including Rarity would wear that dress which looked like Mane-iac or what Trixie did to Rarity in Boast Busters. And even the dresses that Rarity forced Applejack and Rainbow Dash to wear before didn't fit the characters, but it still was "pretty" and at least looked like something Rarity would want. As far as I know, none of pony culture is that strange or wrong or forcing at all. Applejack is all about tradition and she doesn't do that. Or Twilight doesn't do that, the pony who would follow all the instructions on a textbook.

They seem like trying to talk about the issue of race and culture, but in the plot, the problem came from the individual level.

I don't even know what the Mane Six was thinking in this episode, and I don't know what's their problem. It seemed like they were dead set on screwing things up. And narrowed their vision and intelligence purposefully. That also makes us hard to relate. I don't know why did they teach Yona all those strange things while none of other ponies were doing it. Things which were ridiculous even in pony standards. I don't get it. Bridle Gossip was like shouting out "Hey kids! Different people might seem strange or scary at first but they are nice people too!", but it had kind of a clear delivery at least. Most of all, even Bridle Gossip was an archetypal 'misunderstood seemingly scary character but actually not' cartoon episode, it wasn't that much predictable and flavorless.

Yeah, the question of immigrants adopting the dominant culture’s mannerisms is a complex one, and this episode just reduces it to a handful of signifiers which do nothing but make the show more depressing. It has no way to show the problems caused beyond contrived accidents, so there’s not much to the moral beyond “be yourself.” Anything else depends on how you react to, say, Rarity telling Yona that the way she’s speaking is wrong; personally, I want to think that Rarity would be much more sensitive about such things, which is why I found the writing of the mane six here depressing. 

[Yfus 28]

Never thought before, that pony show could be about modern problems XD

If they wanna go for that, let them go, let them make a show about immigrants' problems. But i think they are doing it wrong. They showed Yona as a dumb one and then they were like "it's ok, you can be a yak, no problem, you don't have to be ponish". That's bad. "We're tolerant, we accept you have your own culture, but your culture is inferior". In my opinion they should show a creature, that is way wiser and smarter than Yona. Yona shouldn't be an example of foreign cultures.

[RDDash 18,836]

When you throw a real life issue in a fictional world you will get a complicated responses from both sides of the camp. Especially if the country's history is based on immigrants abusing native population for centuries. 

[Yfus 28]

2 hours ago, R.D.Dash said:

When you throw a real life issue in a fictional world you will get a complicated responses from both sides of the camp. Especially if the country's history is based on immigrants abusing native population for centuries. 

Thanks, i understood why the 9th season is the last one.
One or two more and Equestria would be overtaken by creatures XD I can imagine Fluttershy as a slave but the rest no. Rainbow Dash would be mad, Twilight stressed and Rarity depressed.

[Dark Qiviut 22,160]

13 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

You’re completely missing the point of my problem, which isn’t that Starlight hasn’t had an episode completely outlining her new role.

We did last year. Twilight used the basis of what Starlight learned since becoming her student, counselor, and temporary role as headmare to promote her for that same position. In her scroll, she called her one of the smartest and most caring ponies she ever met, and Twilight knows Starlight better than anyone else in the cast outside of Spike. With how Starlight faked a meltdown of her own to calm Twilight, chances are she has it under control.

13 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

She wasn’t there in Uprooted,

She has no reason to be in the episode at all. With Sombra destroyed, the school’s back under Twilight’s control, and it remains inactive for another few weeks. Sparkle’s Seven was the first to show it running.

And with the Tree’s spirit closely resembling Twilight, including Starlight (who has no connections to it whatsoever) would be mere pandering to the cause.

13 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

If the writers were serious about Starlights future role, they would have had her plan the ball instead of Twilight.

That’s shortchanging Twilight’s role. She’s the de facto headmare here and the one who planned the whole curriculum, this included. Twilight fits the role just fine.

13 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

Running a school by her own merits and abilities (Running activities like the spellvenger hunt, choosing permanent teacher, managing a curriculum)  is not something Starlight has any experience doing.

Neither did the RM6. When they left her in charge while on that fake quest, no substitutes were waiting in line. Starlight had to hire her own after Discord’s choices screwed everyone over. At least a year has passed since School Daze; SG can implement what she learned into the School while retaining Twilight’s vision. With how close she and Twi are, she’d know the curriculum by now.

13 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

Sure, there was a meta reason that Starlight should have been included more in Season Six. But there was never a narrative slot that they should have fit her into but didn’t.

There doesn’t need to be some major change in S6’s present plots to include her, and at no point do I advocate it. Just as much as a background cameo would work just as well, like being with the RM7 in Newbie Dash or Dungeons & Discord, or helping build that dumb track for Cart Before the Ponies. Just that little bit of something would make her feel belonged. Her cameo from Fluttershy Leans In’s resolution was small, but fulfilled that same point.

Five mediocre-to-terrible self-contained episodes (AJ’s “Day” Off, Cart, 28PL, PPOV, and Where the Apple Lies) could be replaced with episodes around Starlight, Thorax, Trixie, and Discord. Starlight could take over ADO’s, Cart’s and WtAL’s. Thorax PPOV’s and WtAL’s, sharing the ladder with SG. Trixie could take two, and Discord one. Intertwine them all somehow to clue the audience who will be involved in the finale and make their tandem feel more organic once they all meet up.

2 hours ago, Yfus said:

They showed Yona as a dumb one and then they were like "it's ok, you can be a yak, no problem, you don't have to be ponish". That's bad.

Yona was never stupid at all. Because of the pony lexicon used in the episode, usage of Ponyville’s dancing tradition for the school, and all the pony paraphernalia on the trophies and in posters, she assumed she’d have to change who she was in order to qualify for the Amity Ball. At no point did she make that decision out of thin air; the unfortunate implications surrounding the ball influenced her.

She wasn’t the only one to feel left out. The rest of the Young Six didn’t participate, either. Even though it was supposed to be a more inclusive dance compared to the Fetlock Fete, they felt uninvolved, either. The rest of the non-ponies played cards into the background.

At no point did her teachers intend to change who she was. Yona’s their client, and she requested them to help her fit in. What they were saying and doing sounded innocuous on the surface, but all it did was add up to even more despair and further confusion for Yona if she messed up. And she messed up horribly. In trying to help her, they were accidentally erasing her.

The moral also works contextually.

1. Sandbar, the one who asked her out, was the one to help her. Thanks to their close friendship, he knew where to find her. The Tree grew the Palace of Solace for predicaments like this. It gave someone like her a safe space to express herself without feeling ostracized, and the same goes for Sandbar had something like that happened to him.
2. This was Yona’s lowest moment of her entire life. We have never seen her feel this depressed before, and who can blame her. No matter how hard she tried, she screwed up. But Sandbar stayed with her and gave her much-needed comfort. He symbolizes what a great friend is: When someone needs help, he helps her the best he can. By reassuring her how she doesn’t need to erase her yakness, he cheers her up.
3. Despite being an accident, their actions hurt her. In trying to help her, they made a grave mistake and apologized to her to make amends themselves. Because of this accident, the RM7 also got good opportunity to rethink the Amity Ball’s purpose.  There’s a reason why one of the statues is dressed like a yak when they awarded them the trophy: to sum up how friendship crosses boundaries. Thanks to their own mistakes, they can plan it better with everyone else included. Rather than accidentally leaving non-ponies out, everyone was involved, thanks to the Yakyakistan stomp. Lemons became lemonade.

[Yfus 28]

Ok well, you do not find Yona stupid you showed arguments but still i do not like the way it she was shown :/

 

Edit: what is Amity Ball?

Edited May 12, 2019 by Yfus

[AwesomeRainbow 473]

I thought the episode was very funny her freaking out and all

[Yfus 28]

2 minutes ago, Baby RainbowDash said:

I thought the episode was very funny her freaking out and all

It's ok that you find it funny  Tbh i prefer the first and the last ones of seasons. More emotions and action and magic. Those ones in the middle hardly ever satisfy me.

[Dark Qiviut 22,160]

13 hours ago, qwerE said:

However, the last episode 'common ground' already covered the same issue and having the same lesson twice in a row seems excessive.

The morals from both yesterday and last week aren’t the same. This moral is about not having to erase your own identity to feel like you belong. Last week’s has two:

1. “Creating interior barriers divides people from becoming part of a family and only increases bitterness within someone.” Believing Quibble’s presence was only going to replace her dad’s memories, Wind rejected him.
2. “Don’t feign a passion to feel like you have to get someone to appreciate you.” In trying to pretend to like buckball or know other sports, Wind treated him as a fake, and he had to make amends with her to begin a true father/daughter relationship.

22 minutes ago, Yfus said:

Ok well, you do not find Yona stupid you showed arguments but still i do not like the way it she was shown :/

That’s fine. You don’t have to like it. As someone who loves it and thinks it’s really well done, I explain my own side.

22 minutes ago, Yfus said:

Edit: what is Amity Ball?

The School’s version of Ponyville’s Fetlock Fete. Because they teach non-ponies, she planned it to make it inclusive to everycreature.

[StitchandMLPlover 930]

13 hours ago, qwerE said:

This was an ok episode. Yona talking like Rarity was the funny part for me. Her dacing was cute, too.

I agree. Although I mostly liked the episode, people who say that the lessons are too repetitive certainly have a point. I know the lesson 'be yourself' is important, especially to kids who are prone to suffer from peer pressure. However, the last episode 'common ground' already covered the same issue and having the same lesson twice in a row seems excessive.

This lesson also undermines the importance of trying to learn new things outside your comfort zone. Being yourself is obviously important and all, but Yona being punished (as in, punished by the storywriters) for trying to learn a pony dance seems absurd. I thought it was really sweet of her to practice hard to learn a new pony culture, and really felt happy for her when she finally mastered the moves. But after all that work, she messes up and embarrasses herself because of her dress. I couldn't help but feel that was a bit unfair.

Being yourself is important. But how do you know what you are if you don't try out things that you don't know? It is entirely possible that Yona turns out to be a Yak who likes pony dance, and foods like cupcakes. I know this isn't the intended effect, but this story may subconsciously reinforce the idea that Yona should do things that Yaks do, because she belongs to that group. When I saw Yona in her dress with everyone saying she looked weird, it kind of reminded of me as a brony. Other creatures may think Yona looks weird, but I don't think that should stop her from trying pony things.

I have to wonder if this episode was originally going to air later in the season but Discovery Family just happened to air 2 episodes with a similar moral back to back. The production crew does not control release dates. Only Discovery Family does. You make a good point. Yona is interested in the culture she is an exchange student in, and wants to show it respect by learning pony habits. Just like I try to show my friends who are of different religions or who were born in other cultures respect by asking them what their traditions mean and using their greetings and timings for things. That's part of friendship too. Pinkie followed Yak culture the same way in the past. 

11 hours ago, Sepul-Coloratura said:

I think they failed to distinguish between what's bad about of cultural assimilation (I don't even know what that would be like and how to show it in the show) and just playing odd and stupid. (I mean, it's ok to have cultural assimilation the other way around?) None of the ponies would talk that strange, even Rarity paid extra attention to deliberately sound strange. And none of the ponies including Rarity would wear that dress which looked like Mane-iac or what Trixie did to Rarity in Boast Busters. And even the dresses that Rarity forced Applejack and Rainbow Dash to wear before didn't fit the characters, but it still was "pretty" and at least looked like something Rarity would want. As far as I know, none of pony culture is that strange or wrong or forcing at all. Applejack is all about tradition and she doesn't do that. Or Twilight doesn't do that, the pony who would follow all the instructions on a textbook.

They seem like trying to talk about the issue of race and culture, but in the plot, the problem came from the individual level.

I don't even know what the Mane Six was thinking in this episode, and I don't know what's their problem. It seemed like they were dead set on screwing things up. And narrowed their vision and intelligence purposefully. That also makes us hard to relate. I don't know why did they teach Yona all those strange things while none of other ponies were doing it. Things which were ridiculous even in pony standards. I don't get it. Bridle Gossip was like shouting out "Hey kids! Different people might seem strange or scary at first but they are nice people too!", but it had kind of a clear delivery at least. Most of all, even Bridle Gossip was an archetypal 'misunderstood seemingly scary character but actually not' cartoon episode, it wasn't that much predictable and flavorless.

I don't think Fluttershy, Rainbow Dash, Applejack or Pinkie Pie showed any less intelligence. The way Fluttershy took such care and detail in teaching the dance actually showed more of her intelligence. Rarity's flaw was that she tried to turn Yona into a Canterlot style pony almost as if it were the Grand Galloping Gala instead. It might be better to teach a lesson on an individual level if kids are the main audience, I don't know. Yona is an exchange student. Not an immigrant. As an immigrant myself, I feel there's a difference between the 2 because Yona specifically came to Equestria to learn, not to live permanently, at least so far.  So cultural assimilation is a slightly different conversation with Yona. 

 

41 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

We did last year. Twilight used the basis of what Starlight learned since becoming her student, counselor, and temporary role as headmare to promote her for that same position. In her scroll, she called her one of the smartest and most caring ponies she ever met, and Twilight knows Starlight better than anyone else in the cast outside of Spike. With how Starlight faked a meltdown of her own to calm Twilight, chances are she has it under control.

She has no reason to be in the episode at all. With Sombra destroyed, the school’s back under Twilight’s control, and it remains inactive for another few weeks. Sparkle’s Seven was the first to show it running.

And with the Tree’s spirit closely resembling Twilight, including Starlight (who has no connections to it whatsoever) would be mere pandering to the cause.

That’s shortchanging Twilight’s role. She’s the de facto headmare here and the one who planned the whole curriculum, this included. Twilight fits the role just fine.

Neither did the RM6. When they left her in charge while on that fake quest, no substitutes were waiting in line. Starlight had to hire her own after Discord’s choices screwed everyone over. At least a year has passed since School Daze; SG can implement what she learned into the School while retaining Twilight’s vision. With how close she and Twi are, she’d know the curriculum by now.

There doesn’t need to be some major change in S6’s present plots to include her, and at no point do I advocate it. Just as much as a background cameo would work just as well, like being with the RM7 in Newbie Dash or Dungeons & Discord, or helping build that dumb track for Cart Before the Ponies. Just that little bit of something would make her feel belonged. Her cameo from Fluttershy Leans In’s resolution was small, but fulfilled that same point.

Five mediocre-to-terrible self-contained episodes (AJ’s “Day” Off, Cart, 28PL, PPOV, and Where the Apple Lies) could be replaced with episodes around Starlight, Thorax, Trixie, and Discord. Starlight could take over ADO’s, Cart’s and WtAL’s. Thorax PPOV’s and WtAL’s, sharing the ladder with SG. Trixie could take two, and Discord one. Intertwine them all somehow to clue the audience who will be involved in the finale and make their tandem feel more organic once they all meet up.

Yona was never stupid at all. Because of the pony lexicon used in the episode, usage of Ponyville’s dancing tradition for the school, and all the pony paraphernalia on the trophies and in posters, she assumed she’d have to change who she was in order to qualify for the Amity Ball. At no point did she make that decision out of thin air; the unfortunate implications surrounding the ball influenced her.

She wasn’t the only one to feel left out. The rest of the Young Six didn’t participate, either. Even though it was supposed to be a more inclusive dance compared to the Fetlock Fete, they felt uninvolved, either. The rest of the non-ponies played cards into the background.

At no point did her teachers intend to change who she was. Yona’s their client, and she requested them to help her fit in. What they were saying and doing sounded innocuous on the surface, but all it did was add up to even more despair and further confusion for Yona if she messed up. And she messed up horribly. In trying to help her, they were accidentally erasing her.

The moral also works contextually.

1. Sandbar, the one who asked her out, was the one to help her. Thanks to their close friendship, he knew where to find her. The Tree grew the Palace of Solace for predicaments like this. It gave someone like her a safe space to express herself without feeling ostracized, and the same goes for Sandbar had something like that happened to him.
2. This was Yona’s lowest moment of her entire life. We have never seen her feel this depressed before, and who can blame her. No matter how hard she tried, she screwed up. But Sandbar stayed with her and gave her much-needed comfort. He symbolizes what a great friend is: When someone needs help, he helps her the best he can. By reassuring her how she doesn’t need to erase her yakness, he cheers her up.
3. Despite being an accident, their actions hurt her. In trying to help her, they made a grave mistake and apologized to her to make amends themselves. Because of this accident, the RM7 also got good opportunity to rethink the Amity Ball’s purpose.  There’s a reason why one of the statues is dressed like a yak when they awarded them the trophy: to sum up how friendship crosses boundaries. Thanks to their own mistakes, they can plan it better with everyone else included. Rather than accidentally leaving non-ponies out, everyone was involved, thanks to the Yakyakistan stomp. Lemons became lemonade.

I completely agree! Yona has always been shown to be smart, especially emotionally intelligent, making her compassionate and insightful. The Mane 5 did exactly what Yona asked them to do. They never forced her or purposefully put her or her culture down but did some stuff that inadvertently sent wrong messages and owned up to it. Just like how often in real life "Inclusion" does not translate well because it becomes a "thing" rather than a natural flowing cultural exchange. 

Edited May 12, 2019 by StitchandMLPlover

[ExplosionMare 18,007]

While it wasn’t the best episode dealing with this topic for me, I thought it was good. It was pleasant enough in some parts. Plus, it’s good to point out that the whole “When in Rome, do what the Rome do” thing can put lots of pressure on people. Like they said at the end, it’s better to just be yourself than to try to force yourself into another culture. (Besides, the world would be pretty boring if cultures didn’t mix sometimes).

[Music Chart Fan 818]

Overall, I didn't really care for this episode. Part of the reason for that may be that I don't particularly care for the subject matter. Out of the Student Six, Yona is probably the one that I least like, and Sandbar's eagerness to invite her to the dance seems to come out of nowhere. Also, I generally don't enjoy going to dances, in part because of the types of preparations for these dances that are shown in this episode. When I've had to attend dances (as a required activity at band camp, for wedding receptions, etc.), I've done what Smolder, Gallus, Ocellus and Silverstream did: eat food and hang out away from the dance floor to talk, play cards, etc. Besides that, though, I feel like the seemingly intended message of the episode - that Yona should have just been herself and not tried to be something that she wasn't - doesn't follow from what actually happened.

To start off, I don't see any particular problem with the event itself. When Twilight puts up the poster for the school dance, she says "We're bringing one of Ponyville's oldest traditions to our school – the Fetlock Fete". But after Sandbar says it's a pony dance party, and Ocellus transforms into a pony, Twilight says to the Student Six (who are, as far as we've seen, the only non-pony students) that Ocellus doesn't need to transform into a pony, and that the event is "open to everycreature" (and will be called the Amity Ball). I think the situation here might be analogized to, say, being invited to a formal ball or other such event where specific dances will be done, a dress code may be enforced, certain rules of etiquette may be expected to be followed, etc. So if one wants to participate, then one may have to learn (and practice) the dances, rules of etiquette, etc. ahead of time. But if someone (like me) doesn't really want to do those things, then he or she can choose not to participate. So, in this episode, Yona agreed to attend the Amity Ball with Sandbar, and so she tried to get dressed up and learn the dances and traditions so she could participate in them with him. On the other hand, Smolder, Gallus, Ocellus and Silverstream evidently didn't want to do those things, so they didn't participate.

However, there are a couple of oddities about the run-up to the Ball itself. Rarity runs into Yona with a rack full of dresses that Rarity says she's sewing for the dance, and that leads Yona to ask Rarity for help with getting a dress, which leads to helping Yona with other preparations for the Ball. However, at the Ball itself, we see almost nobody else dressed up at all, and I don't recall seeing anyone wearing any of the dresses that Rarity was sewing. So why is that? What happened to the dresses Rarity was making for the dance? Is it just that the animators didn't create clothing for all the background characters? Was Rarity's preparation of Yona more in accordance with the Fetlock Fete tradition, and Rarity wasn't informed that the tradition wasn't being followed that strictly for the Amity Ball? Did Rarity make dresses in anticipation of students wanting them for the Amity Ball, but it turned out that none of the other students wanted to wear them?

Also, the other four of the Student Six knew that Yona was preparing by learning the traditions of the Amity Ball, but apparently they and the Mane Six kept that a secret from Sandbar, who's totally surprised by Yona's preparation for the Ball. So I guess we're meant to assume that Yona asked all of them to keep it a secret? Or maybe Rarity (and perhaps the Mane Six) suggested to keep it a secret? However, as we see Sandbar repeatedly being surprised that Yona dressed up, brought a lucky pot, knows the dances, etc., I couldn't help wondering what he was doing in the run-up to the Ball. Since Sandbar asked Yona to be his "pony pal" and to enter the contest with him, shouldn't Sandbar have told Yona about what the traditions are, and talked to her about what she wants to do or plans to do for the dance? Did Yona deliberately avoid talking to Sandbar about the Ball in order to keep her preparations a secret and surprise him? However, despite Sandbar's initial surprise, he seemed to like doing the dances with Yona, and the two of them seemed to be having a good time.

But then we get to what happened at the Ball itself. And there, the real problem doesn't seem to be that Yona "wasn't a good pony" or that she tried to be something she wasn't; rather, it was that, when Yona's wig blocked her vision, she spent close to 30 seconds running around and smashing into things like a proverbial bull in a china shop, even when her friends explicitly tried to get her to stop. So why did that happen? Was that response something that Yona (or anyone else) was aware that she would do? Is that something that Yona could/should be learning not to do? Is that supposed to be some kind of subconscious automatic instinct that she's incapable of stopping? It could be argued that Yona, Rarity, Fluttershy, and/or Rainbow should have realized that Yona needed to practice dancing in her dress, or that she should have worn a dress that wasn't a tripping hazard. And if it was known that Yona would react the way she did when her vision was blocked, then it could be argued that Yona shouldn't have been, or should have been more careful about, wearing a wig or something that could block her vision and trigger that reaction. But regardless, Yona's response in that situation really ought to be addressed - not just because Yona might embarrass herself and make a mess, but because she could really hurt people or do a lot of property damage. Also, we see in the episode that Twilight was right there when Yona first hit Sandbar and started running around, causing guests to scatter in fear of getting hurt, and Twilight reacted quickly enough to make a magic barrier to stop the flying food from hitting some of the room. So couldn't Twilight have levitated Yona off the ground or used her magic to force Yona to stop?

Now here are the rest of my miscellaneous observations:

Is Yona's exclaiming that she loves Brussels sprouts supposed to suggest to any kids watching that vegetables are good?

Rainbow's being one of the dance instructors reminded me of the mid-air "twirl" that she did during the song back in "Castle Sweet Castle", and how people joked that Rainbow was secretly learning ballet or something, although in this episode, Rainbow doesn't end up teaching anything like that.

Also, as a demonstration of how much of a music chart nerd I am, the first thing that came to my mind when Rarity mentioned the "pony cotillion" was the R&B record label Cotillion Records, which was in business from the late '60s through the early '80s.

There's one scene during a montage where Rainbow is wearing hockey-style protective equipment and flying around interposing herself between Yona - who's hopping around - and other stuff in the room. Was that supposed to be teaching Yona not to run into and break things? If so, what was the outcome of that lesson?

The opening "pony cotillion" dance at the Ball didn't even last a full minute. We might presume, though, that Spike cut it short because he saw that everyone stopped dancing to look at Yona, and Spike was trying to get the Ball back on track.

When Twilight goes to erect the magic barrier against the flying food, she also drops Spike on his head; I'm not sure if his costume exacerbated or alleviated how much that would have hurt.

It's a little strange to me that other dance goers appear to be helping to clean up, but Ocellus, Gallus, Smolder, and Silverstream are just hanging around a table, doing nothing in particular. Do they feel like they don't have to help because they weren't participating in the dancing and/or the pot luck? Are they considered to be particularly traumatized by what Yona did, and so everyone is okay if the four of them don't feel like helping with the cleaning?

Also, in the clean-up scene, there shouldn't be any food or buckets near the DJ booth; Twilight put up her magic barrier to stop the flying food well in front of the DJ booth, and we saw that area remain clean in the immediate aftermath of Yona's rampage.

Finally, I hope that a room full of people doing the "Yakyakistan stomp" doesn't result in anybody getting hurt or any property damage. When I was an undergrad, there was a story about some students who had a dance party at their house and had the floor collapse. Considering the tunnels and such under the school, hopefully the floor is structurally sound.

[Senko 459]

Honestly now I've gotten to see it I'm not a fan. There's a lot in this episode that just doesn't work for me. Here's some of the most obvious . . .

 

1) The dance itself laying aside the fact we have another holiday introduced why did it need to be a "Here's our traditional ponyville dance renamed for our school." when they could just attend the town one? After all Ponyville's been through the past few years I doubt having the students attend their traditional dance would have even raised an eyebrow.

2) The fact Rarity pushed a dress on Yona to help her "fit in" when Rarity is the only one wearing a dress aside from her.

3) The fact Pinkie suddenly became bad at teaching somone to bake when we've seen her take on that role multiple times.

4) The fact there's two traditional dances performed yet no one points out that Twilight is probably awful at them too. "Yona imitate princess" smash. Plus every single student there not only know's them but is skilled at performing the dance.

There are things I liked as well Dash is cute in sports gear but still overall it just didn't work especially set in the timeline where it was as opposed to earlier when the student 6 didn't know each other that well.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Senko