SEASON 9 SPOILER Did Discord know cozy terek and crisalis where going to betray him?

[Winter heart 2]

So if discord knew sombra was going to fail did he know he was going to be betrayed he acts very suspicious the whole time (and don't say no i want a reason why u sayed no)  in the end of the end part 1 & 2 he big useless tell me why u think he new of his betrayal

[Megas 27,062]

No, but it wouldn't have mattered in the grand scheme of things. He was hoping to set them up for Twilight to defeat them.

If his endgame was to actually reform them(like the season was alluding to), their betrayal might have been more impactful

[fare67t 242]

Considering me and some friends came up with a theory that the writers didn't originally plan to have Grogar turn out to be discord, I dunno really.

[Megas 27,062]

4 minutes ago, fare67t said:

Considering me and some friends came up with a theory that the writers didn't originally plan to have Grogar turn out to be discord, I dunno really.

Spoiler

I believe they planned Grogar to be Discord from the start. I still have to read emails, but the early scripts show that was the case

 

[fare67t 242]

9 minutes ago, Kiryu-Chan said:

  Hide contents

I believe they planned Grogar to be Discord from the start. I still have to read emails, but the early scripts show that was the case

 

Ah. Still fun to imagine that they were approaching the moment of "eh, we need to think of SOME kind of twist here...fuck it" near the end x3

[Hierok 11,829]

I think he knew, and trusted completely on Twilights skills at the end.

[Latecomer 438]

He may have expected them to try - I don't think he expected them to succeed. But then, planning beyond the immediate future has never been his strength.

[Cash In 21,503]

Knowing Discord, I think he expected his plan to go without failure. He may have imagined there being a few bumps along the way, but I don't think he saw the betrayal coming at all.

[EpicEnergy 22,072]

The season 9 finale didn't indicate that, and it seemed like Discord did not intend for them to betray him (especially since his magic was stolen and he had no backup plan for that), so I think he didn't have any idea all of them would team up and betray him.

Edited November 28, 2019 by EpicEnergy

[BornAgainBrony 2,395]

On 11/17/2019 at 11:15 PM, fare67t said:

Considering me and some friends came up with a theory that the writers didn't originally plan to have Grogar turn out to be discord, I dunno really.

Jim Miller said it was always the plan. They didn't want to give the glory of a finale battle to a character never seen before S9.

[nightshroud96 116]

2 hours ago, BornAgainBrony said:

Jim Miller said it was always the plan. They didn't want to give the glory of a finale battle to a character never seen before S9.

That's.. honestly iffy.
Couldn't they have it so its both the trio AND the real Grogar for the final battle thing?
Or something?

[BornAgainBrony 2,395]

1 minute ago, nightshroud96 said:

That's.. honestly iffy.
Couldn't they have it so its both the trio AND the real Grogar for the final battle thing?
Or something?

That's what I would've liked to see. Something turning into a 3-way battle. Nowhere near enough time for it. The episodes were rushed as it is. It really deserved to be a second MLP movie. They had more than enough material to fill 2 hours worth.

[nightshroud96 116]

1 minute ago, BornAgainBrony said:

That's what I would've liked to see. Something turning into a 3-way battle. Nowhere near enough time for it. The episodes were rushed as it is. It really deserved to be a second MLP movie. They had more than enough material to fill 2 hours worth.

Wonder what stuff would the writers be able to do if it was a movie?

[CypherHoof 26,479]

17 minutes ago, nightshroud96 said:

That's.. honestly iffy.
Couldn't they have it so its both the trio AND the real Grogar for the final battle thing?
Or something?

Nor was in necessary. "team evil" managed to use the bell to defeat discord, they could have used it to defeat a "real" Grogar, cast him into a portal, and still had the final battle be just the three of them.

[Latecomer 438]

30 minutes ago, CypherHoof said:

Nor was in necessary. "team evil" managed to use the bell to defeat discord, they could have used it to defeat a "real" Grogar, cast him into a portal, and still had the final battle be just the three of them.

Yeah - him being disposable and him being Discord aren't the same. Of course, then you need to get Discord out of the picture seperatealy...

[BornAgainBrony 2,395]

1 hour ago, Latecomer said:

Yeah - him being disposable and him being Discord aren't the same. Of course, then you need to get Discord out of the picture seperatealy...

Yeah that's still a problem. When Discord is involved, you need to Deus Ex Machina something for the villains because if you don't, Discord can smite everything like he's Thanos.

[nightshroud96 116]

40 minutes ago, BornAgainBrony said:

Yeah that's still a problem. When Discord is involved, you need to Deus Ex Machina something for the villains because if you don't, Discord can smite everything like he's Thanos.

Pretty much a problem I have with Discord.
Due to how "op" his Chaos magic is, it can render the threats of any villain artificial(one issue I had with the season 9 premiere is how he made a fool out of Sombra there).
They need to introduce ways of how his magic can be BEATEN without outright getting cancelled out by stuff like Chrysalis's throne(or at least execute the nullifying part right) or getting stolen via some magic stealing thing(if you catch him off guard).
And as in without the Elements of Harmony/magic of friendship to beat his powers..
Its getting pretty tiring seeing people saying Discord can easily fix everything and screw the villain over by literally snapping his fingers and how "OP" he is.


 

Edited November 29, 2019 by nightshroud96

[CypherHoof 26,479]

42 minutes ago, BornAgainBrony said:

Yeah that's still a problem. When Discord is involved, you need to Deus Ex Machina something for the villains because if you don't, Discord can smite everything like he's Thanos.

Discord has just mysteriously not been around in most of the other finales - so why would this be different? It's like guard ponies in the movie, or a competent princess, ever....

[BornAgainBrony 2,395]

17 minutes ago, nightshroud96 said:

Pretty much a problem I have with Discord.
Due to how "op" his Chaos magic is, it can render the threats of any villain artificial(one issue I had with the season 9 premiere is how he made a fool out of Sombra there).
They need to introduce ways of how his magic can be BEATEN without outright getting cancelled out by stuff like Chrysalis's throne(or at least execute the nullifying part right) or getting stolen via some magic stealing thing(if you catch him off guard).
And as in without the Elements of Harmony/magic of friendship to beat his powers..
Its getting pretty tiring seeing people saying Discord can easily fix everything and screw the villain over by literally snapping his fingers and how "OP" he is.

Turning him good probably wasn't part of the original plan, so nobody gave any thought to him being too powerful. Especially in how he used his powers early on. Was he ever really evil, or just imprisoned by his chaotic nature? Seeing him try to juggle that with Fluttershy was a fun idea and it felt for a long time like he may have been constantly trying to circumvent the rules that governed him to keep from betraying his friends. Again, unfortunately they blew the shock moment of Discord being "defeated" in the premiere. A real Grogar would probably have met Discord way back in the day, and someone with his knowledge probably could've figured out a way to defeat him (and would make for a pretty good reason to start stockpiling ancient artifacts). I felt like we were robbed of a proper "Discord unleashed" moment. That's something that has never happened. I just imagine a kaiju-sized Grogar, drunk on power from recovering his bell. Twilight is begging Discord for help and he's doing his usual, "I'm just here to watch the free live entertainment" and then out of nowhere Fluttershy gets knocked out by a blast from Grogar. "Princess Twilight, tag out." Just imagine the insane chaos that would erupt from that.

11 minutes ago, CypherHoof said:

Discord has just mysteriously not been around in most of the other finales - so why would this be different? It's like guard ponies in the movie, or a competent princess, ever....

Because it was the very last finale, and there's no way that he didn't deserve to be a part of it.

[nightshroud96 116]

1 minute ago, BornAgainBrony said:

I felt like we were robbed of a proper super-Discord moment. That's something that has never happened. I just imagine a kaiju-sized Grogar, drunk on power from recovering his bell, and some energy blast knocking out Fluttershy. Just imagine the insane chaos that would erupt from that.

 

I feel the same about the royal sisters in the finale too. Especially Luna..
Was disappointed how she(and Celestia) didn't properly battle at all but just lose their magic and only just distract the trio(and that moment got overshadowed by Starlight vs Chrysalis thing).  It really stung with Luna's case there for me..

Back to Discord, they could have introduced some weaknesses to his magic without outright nullifying/stealing it so he can still do something but can't freaking break the story in two with a literal snap of his fingers.(My main issue with reality-warping characters pretty much..)

[Castle Bleck 19,166]

@nightshroud96

Sombra had a nullifier of his own: his anti-magic crystals. But the writers made him conveniently forget it and just spam basic beams instead.

Edited March 23, 2021 by Orcus on His Throne

[CypherHoof 26,479]

18 minutes ago, BornAgainBrony said:

Again, unfortunately they blew the shock moment of Discord being "defeated" in the premiere

Fair enough. We know from the S6 finale though that Discord IS vulnerable to artifact magic preventing him using his powers, Not to mention Tirek has drained Discord's powers before now too.

 

21 minutes ago, BornAgainBrony said:

out of nowhere Fluttershy gets knocked out by a blast from Grogar. "Princess Twilight, tag out." Just imagine the insane chaos that would erupt from that.

Yup, S6 finale again, I am constantly surprised Discord hadn't tracked down cheesebutt before now and "explained" to her just how upset he was about the whole Fluttershy thing....

[nightshroud96 116]

2 minutes ago, Anti-Villain said:

@nightshroud96

Ironically, Sombra had a nullifier of his own - those trap crystals - but the writers made him conveniently forget it and just spam generic, easily deflected blasts instead.

I headcanon Discord erased Sombra's memory of that when he brought him back or have it so he "conveniently" forgets about that if he ends up fighting Discord.

[BornAgainBrony 2,395]

47 minutes ago, nightshroud96 said:

I headcanon Discord erased Sombra's memory of that when he brought him back or have it so he "conveniently" forgets about that if he ends up fighting Discord.

Also I just realized, ironically those crystals made Twilight forget that she could teleport. She obviously could still do magic, she just couldn't destroy them (same thing happened when Tempest had her caged). Seems like those crystals aren't practically useful for much besides shielding, unless we just assume some invisible dampening field is also at work. Would've been nice to actually see that though.

48 minutes ago, CypherHoof said:

Fair enough. We know from the S6 finale though that Discord IS vulnerable to artifact magic preventing him using his powers, Not to mention Tirek has drained Discord's powers before now too.

Yup, S6 finale again, I am constantly surprised Discord hadn't tracked down cheesebutt before now and "explained" to her just how upset he was about the whole Fluttershy thing....

Well clearly he's not as smart as he thinks he is. You'd think he would've kept a closer eye on the Legion while he was sending them off on missions and would have known all along they had the bell. To say nothing about sending them out to get something that could actually be used against him.

51 minutes ago, nightshroud96 said:

I feel the same about the royal sisters in the finale too. Especially Luna..
Was disappointed how she(and Celestia) didn't properly battle at all but just lose their magic and only just distract the trio(and that moment got overshadowed by Starlight vs Chrysalis thing).  It really stung with Luna's case there for me..

Aye, that bothered me as well. Cadence too really. Another thing I felt robbed of, especially in the premiere. Thought for sure we were finally going to see "angry momma bear" Cadence.

 

 

[nightshroud96 116]

14 minutes ago, BornAgainBrony said:

Also I just realized, ironically those crystals made Twilight forget that she could teleport. She obviously could still do magic, she just couldn't destroy them (same thing happened when Tempest had her caged). Seems like those crystals aren't practically useful for much besides shielding, unless we just assume some invisible dampening field is also at work.

 

 

 

Iirc, in the season 3 premiere when she tried to teleport out of that black crystal trap, the trap's dark magic teleported her back in instantly.