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Going Vegetarian


Circadian

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To me that and battery eggs should be outright banned.

I think that those practices would have been phased out years ago if we had an actual free market in food, since taking a job at a grocery store I have learned just how few corporations own so much. Pepsi for example owns, Frito Lay which is over 90% of the chip aisle in your average grocery store, Quacker Oats, Rice a Roni, and much much more. These companies use regulations to drive their own competition out of business, that is the only reason why organic food is expensive is because it regulated far more strictly than "regular" food. And it is why GMO corn which has been linked to liver failure in rats in legal yet raw milk which is one of the most nutritious things someone could possibly consume is being cracked down on by the government.

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"4) Therefore, eating meat is absolutely unnecessary."

 

 

Well... look on it like this. Humans could survive but they would not be fine if they stopped eating meat. Do you realize what would happen to the earth's ecosystem if 6 billion people stopped eating meat? Things would be blown out of proportion as prey-like animals would go extinct, followed by predators and you would have a mass extinction that could cause a horrible effect on humans as well as everything else. So I'll stick with my meat img-1380512-1-wink.png

Edited by Retro✮Derpy
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Aren't they already working on creating synthetic meat? Using lab-created tissue and the like, no animal harm involved. Then everyone can eat meat without causing animal suffering.

 

Also, if you care for animals, stop eating their food. biggrin.png

That argument is utter BULL. We eat the same food they do, for the same reason they do, TO LIVE. If we did not eat at least plants, we would DIE. 

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Animals eat other animals.  And I feel that humans are animals.  As long as people don't eat endangered species, I feel that eating meat is okay.  If we're eating too many animals, then there are too many people.

 

Actually I think we should support the eating of endangered animals. Woah, what!? Yea hear me out on this.

 

If we eat endangered species, slowly at first, and sell them at really high prices in fancy restaurants, and people like it will drive people to breed that species and sell it for money. After awhile the species will grow in number not only driving the price down, but more importantly saving that endangered species.

 

I'm pretty sure that's what happened with Buffalo

 

here's my supporting evidence: 

 

EDIT: sorry not Buffalo, Bison

Edited by Jble
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I would also like to point out that while you are eating animals, you can still have great respect for it by how you treat it. a animal that dies healthy and with as less pain as possible would probably taste better than any factory farmed cow. Respect for the animal comes hand in hand with hunting I would say.

 

Meat tastes good, I can't deny it. And eating is one of the few luxuries people can experience on a daily basis. So why shouldn't we eat what we want? Animals die regardless if we kill them or not. I don't agree with factory farms at all though, but it is something we sadly need due to demand.

 

Meat eaters are not evil people, they just are on the other side of the fence. People need to focus less on what other people do, and just focus on what they do. It shouldn't matter to you what random people eat unless they are family and eating very unhealthy. however, being a vegetarian gives no one the right to dictate how others should eat. 

Edited by Hayzelestia
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Glad it works for you. Glad you have some arguments to make for your life choice. I however, continue to find nothing wrong with it, and don't plan on stopping :3

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If we eat endangered species, slowly at first, and sell them at really high prices in fancy restaurants, and people like it will drive people to breed that species and sell it for money.

As much as I would personally disagree with it and wouldn't partake in such a thing I don't deny that it would probably work. Cows, chickens and pigs are the most commonly consumed animals yet they are far from being in any danger of extinction in large because they are bred for food.

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That argument is utter BULL. We eat the same food they do, for the same reason they do, TO LIVE. If we did not eat at least plants, we would DIE. 

 

Was it so hard to figure out that my last line was kidding? Holy fuck.

 

I also genuinely think the actual cruelty of the entire meat farming thing is very misconstrued. There are documentaries floating around that show horribly low-grade slaughterhouses, but people then think that all meat production is the same as that. Eating meat is somewhat necessary, additionally; we'd end up with animal overpopulation and a lack of actual food if everyone on Earth became a vegetarian and we excluded all animals as consumable.

 

That being said, I'm not saying anyone should stop being a vegetarian, and likewise you shouldn't say that we should stop eating meat. The balance is what we need. Everyone eating meat, and we'd face animal extinction. Everyone not eating meat, and we'd face animal overpopulation. Let's take our halfway point and have done with it.

Edited by Flipturn ツ
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I also genuinely think the actual cruelty of the entire meat farming thing is very misconstrued. There are documentaries floating around that show horribly low-grade slaughterhouses, but people then think that all meat production is the same as that.

Unless you are eating organic chances are that the meat you are consuming really was produced that way unfortunately and that is one of the reasons why I am trying to eat organic as much as I can.

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Footnotes

How Much Feed Will My Cow Eat - Frequently Asked Questions, Alberta Agriculture and Rural Development

Ibid.

Cattle feeding, Wikipedia

Cattle, Wikipedia

Did the Locker Plant Steal Some of My Meat?, South Dakota State University

Water Requirements of Livestock, Ontario Ministry of Agriculture

Ag. Water Quality- Frequently Asked Questions, University of California Cooperative Extension

Livestock's Long Shadow, Food And Agriculture Organization Of The United Nations, 2007

These sources are mostly inapplicable to your arguments. Not only are several of them broken links (as of my making this post), but none of them discuss why humans shouldn't consume meat. I shouldn't have to dig to find your proof, either. 

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I honestly think I could live without meat. In my opinion, it doesn't really taste all that great. There's also the fact that I hate having to pick through a piece of meat when I'm hungry just so I don't get a bone caught in my esophagus. I might go meatless once I'm old enough to get out of the house and live on my own. I swear though, if someone tries to take my pasta, they better expect to lose an eye.

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These sources are mostly inapplicable to your arguments. Not only are several of them broken links (as of my making this post), but none of them discuss why humans shouldn't consume meat. I shouldn't have to dig to find your proof, either. 

 

Two of those links are broken, and I think they do discuss that. You just have to read a little. Reading isn't 'digging', I really dislike people using that adjective when it applies to my favorite hobby. :/

 

Also, it may just be your internet voice, but I think we've agreed to live and let live. :3 Don't see much point in continuing an argument. :D

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6) Therefore, eating meat is immoral and unethical. And abhorrently selfish

There are so many problems with this, but I'll stay calm about it. Three words sum up my feelings on this.

"Consequences of overpopulation". Think about it.

I am an athlete, and most athletes eat a good amount of meat for proteins and other nutrients. That aside though, I think it's very self-centered and ignorant to say what you have said to meat eaters (The majority of the human population). If you want to be a vegetarian or vegan, I applaud you and support your decision! I really do.

But when you spew hate on people that believe or practice something different than you do, you lost my respect.

 

But since I am immoral, unethical, and abhorrently selfish, I guess it doesn't matter what I think. Good day.

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These sources are mostly inapplicable to your arguments. Not only are several of them broken links (as of my making this post), but none of them discuss why humans shouldn't consume meat. I shouldn't have to dig to find your proof, either.

 

My aplogies; okay, here's a link that works for sure and has its sources in the body.

 

http://www.vegetariantimes.com/article/why-go-veg-learn-about-becoming-a-vegetarian/

 

Most of those other links are about why eating meat is an inefficient means of obtaining nutrients, since you don't seem to care for the animals themselves. 

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I honestly think I could live without meat. In my opinion, it doesn't really taste all that great. There's also the fact that I hate having to pick through a piece of meat when I'm hungry just so I don't get a bone caught in my esophagus. I might go meatless once I'm old enough to get out of the house and live on my own. I swear though, if someone tries to take my pasta, they better expect to lose an eye.

 

You could just get boneless meat, I am also not sure what kind of meat doesn't show the bones while eating it. Steaks do, Ribs do, pork can (depending on the cut), and the list goes on.  

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I don't think a very large amount of people here are going to have the counter argument you want/need/bargain for or whatever my man. A large manner of people don't really care about the complexities or in depth morality/ chemicals and substances of their diets beyond wither if it is grossly unhealthy or considered healthy or in the middle. For people to actively want to make the transition that you are asking for they would have to actually do some study of this stuff on their own and deeply too from their own sources and most likely multiple ones.

 

 

 

 

Ain't no body got time for that. The only people that really study this much into stuff are most likely are doing it as part of a educational course like nutritionists/doctor/ lord of the flies OR...they study it because they are already on your end of the spectrum and care about the philosophy of the matter or the total opposite and like to debate vegetarianism/ vegans.  I think we are clearly seeing that most people who post are normal on the subject and frankly don't put that much thought or care into what they put into their mouths...and they shouldn't have to. They aren't morbidly obsess or freaky eaters. They eat what their bodies are built to consume and they do so with the rights that are given to them.

 

 

They are not stupid. I'm not posting this so I can point at people and go "durr. Look at these morons can't understand food" they understand food enough. They eat it, it powers them. They enjoy it. Lives continues for them. Besides. I don't know much about food either. I am one of them. 

 

 

No one is willing to make such a big life change without firm facts and sources unless they are very gullible or already on the path to becoming one anyway and need little further convincing. Look, they don't even care enough to look up facts to counter your points even when in defense of what they do.

 

 

also.

 

crack=meat.

 

Lol.

 

No meat heightens aggression in people due to their natural biology telling to hunt and seek food. 

 

Vegetarians = Aggression inhibitors-steroids without any benefits maybe- . 

 

 

 

the people here aren't on the ropes about their choice to eat meat. They just honestly don't care because they don't plan to change at all anyway. 

 

 

 

also. We are not children. Stop using shamming language. Telling me cookies are bad and that it's selfish and bad to eat cookies won't stop me eating cookies. I'm an adult. I can all the cookies I like. Trying to guilt me about something I clearly don't feel guilty for is a rather futile tactic. We are all aware that meat comes from dead animals. I've seen animals die; I still eat meat.

Edited by MiStErUnMeRry
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(edited)
That aside though, I think it's very self-centered and ignorant to say what you have said to meat eaters (The majority of the human population).

 

Not killing things for one's own gain  and actually knowing the consequences of one's actions is the opposite of self centered and ignorant, actually.

 

I think it's very self-centered and ignorant to kill animals just to obtain food and nutrients you can easily get through other, non-violent means.

 

But since I am immoral, unethical, and abhorrently selfish, I guess it doesn't matter what I think. Good day.

 

Okay, if you're just going to give up the debate because it made you feel bad about yourself, so be it. I never said what you think doesn't matter, friend. However, if eating meat truly didn't bother you then what I've said about meat eaters shouldn't matter to you in the slightest. Deep down though, the fact you eat meant bothers you a bit, doesn't it? I know the feeling; I used to eat meat too.

Edited by Circadian
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Okay, if you're just going to give up the debate because it made you feel bad about yourself, so be it. I never said what you think doesn't matter, friend. However, if eating meat truly didn't bother you then what I've said about meat eaters shouldn't matter to you in the slightest. Deep down though, the fact you eat meant bothers you a bit, doesn't it. I know the feeling; I used to eat meat too.

 

No it doesn't, and I don't see why it should.

Honestly, I wouldn't give up meat for the world. I'm not going to believe in vegetarianism just because it's becoming a big fad, or something. I'll keep my meat. 

 

Also, I did a little research on my own, and found these links. Tell me what you think about them.

 

http://www.opposingviews.com/arguments/fact-meat-is-good-for-you

 

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/16/no-surprise-meat-is-bad-for-you/

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Two of those links are broken, and I think they do discuss that. You just have to read a little. Reading isn't 'digging', I really dislike people using that adjective when it applies to my favorite hobby. :/

No, I shouldn't have to do the OP's work for him. If someone makes a claim, he has to demonstrate where he got that information. Quotes and data are preferred, but a specific page works better than an entire article or document that discusses a much broader topic.

Also, it may just be your internet voice, but I think we've agreed to live and let live. :3 Don't see much point in continuing an argument. biggrin.png

Wait, what. I honestly have no idea what you're talking about, here.

 

All I'm saying is that the OP has not made a convincing argument for not eating meat, beyond "You don't have to eat meat. Eating meat is cruel!"

 

I'll stop badgering him, though (even though the link he just provided a few minutes ago simply provides new reasons, rather than covering his original ones). Don't want to risk derailing the thread.

 

EDIT: typo 

Edited by Тwilight Sparkle
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And I think it's very self centered to kill animals just obtain for food and nutrients you can get through other, non-violent means.

 

How is it self centered when you are buying food for other people's pleasures? As someone who has to buy food I want to make sure we enjoy our meals. Killing things for food is the rule of nature. things MUST DIE for life to go on. Without that there can't be life. Plants die for the herbivores, they die for carnivores, and omnivores are in the middle.

 

How is it self centered to decide the path of life we want? It is self centered of you to expect everyone to follow your life-style because you don't agree with the opposite.

Edited by Hayzelestia
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Okay, if you're just going to give up the debate because it made you feel bad about yourself, so be it. I never said what you think doesn't matter, friend. However, if eating meat truly didn't bother you then what I've said about meat eaters shouldn't matter to you in the slightest. Deep down though, the fact you eat meant bothers you a bit, doesn't it. I know the feeling; I used to eat meat too.

 

Can you please stop speaking to people as if you know them better than they do? No debate is enjoyable when someone self-imposes superiority, honestly. Everyone is going to be set in their beliefs about eating meat, and many of us have given you decent arguments explaining why they do it. 

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Living things eat living things. That's the cycle of life, right?

 

If humans have been eating meat for thousands of years, and animals have been eating meat for thousands of years, what's so wrong with that? I see nothing. It's a form of sustenance, and a damn tasty one at that. To be honest, you know that cute little cow over there? It's one purpose on this planet is to provide meat for a predatory animal. Humans are predatory animals by nature, are we not?

 

Let us feast!

Edited by Twiliscael
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Just a small question for you, who started this thread. I have Crohn's disease and the foods that cause my symptoms to flare (this can vary from people to another) when the disease is in an active phase are: foods high in fiber, gas-producing foods (lentils, beans, legumes, cabbage, broccoli, onions), nuts and seeds (peanut butter, other nut butters), most of fruits and vegetables (especially citrus, apples, berries, tomatoes, greens, peas, potatoes, avocados), whole grains and bran. So... If I decided to adopt a vegetarian diet, what the hay am I supposed to eat when the disease is active???

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(edited)
Can you please stop speaking to people as if you know them better than they do? No debate is enjoyable when someone self-imposes superiority, honestly.

 

I suppose it may seem that way. Apologies. This film was the primary reason I changed to vegetarian. Its way of going about things is less... inflamatory. img-1380640-1-smile.png

 

http://www.hulu.com/watch/289122

Edited by Circadian
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I would also like to point out that while you are eating animals, you can still have great respect for it by how you treat it. a animal that dies healthy and with as less pain as possible would probably taste better than any factory farmed cow. Respect for the animal comes hand in hand with hunting I would say.

 

Meat tastes good, I can't deny it. And eating is one of the few luxuries people can experience on a daily basis. So why shouldn't we eat what we want? Animals die regardless if we kill them or not. I don't agree with factory farms at all though, but it is something we sadly need due to demand.

 

Meat eaters are not evil people, they just are on the other side of the fence. People need to focus less on what other people do, and just focus on what they do. It shouldn't matter to you what random people eat unless they are family and eating very unhealthy. however, being a vegetarian gives no one the right to dictate how others should eat. 

It does. It tastes 1000000x better. We used to get really good beef from our neighbors, now I can't hardly stand anything else. 

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