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Should Flim and Flam get another episode?


EquineJM
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I thought that Flim and Flam were really interesting characters in "The Super Speedy Cider Squeezy 6000" I like how they try to run the apple family out of business and are portrayed as stereotypical "con men." They remind me of a lot of characters from books I've read like The Duke and The King from "The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn."

 

Anyway, I've always thought that they should get at least one more episode. A lot of fans have wanted more episodes focused on Applejack, so maybe they could make an episode where Flim and Flam return to Sweet Apple Acres to get revenge on Applejack and her friends. Or maybe they could make an episode where they stir up trouble in a different town like Canterlot.

 

What does everypony else think?

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I like them too; they're lots of fun. But it'd be hard to do another entire episode with them, I think, because it'd feel like a re-tread. You couldn't have had two "Marge vs. the Monorail" episodes on The Simpsons, for instance. Characters like Lyle Lanley are pretty one-dimensional, and they work that way.

 

I'd like to see them show up once more, though. It'd be funny if either Flim or Flam started singing again, and the other brother stopped him, saying something like, "Oh, forget it. They're onto us."

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Well this could either be good or bad. We do want Applejack to at least have flaws and problems that could lead to learning more about her character, while on the other hand... we could be getting another song from the Flim and Flam brothers. Also, maybe it could lead to more conflict without Apple Bloom or Granny Smith stirring up the pot a bit too much.

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I say yes. I like all the minor characters, and would like to see them around more. Trixie, Photo Finish, Fancy Pants, Gilda... not necessarily as the focus of the episode like their initial appearances, but running across them again for some minor interactions and character development. For example, if Pinkie ever visits her parents' rock farm, it would be amusing if Trixie is working there again, and pops in a couple times to make things awkward tongue.png Especially if she asks anything about Twilight.

 

But Flim and Flam specifically... could have them running a successful business in some other town. Or maybe they should have another whole episode, where they show up in Ponyville again, down in the dumps after having their invention rejected by every town in Equestria? It might get a little heavy, discussing the gray area of technology versus manual labor, and cultural opposition to change. I'm not sure what the moral would even be, much less how to present it.

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They're very eccentric and whimsical characters that play well to the show's tendency towards songs and showmanship. Trixie may be more "talented" at her magic, but she lacks refinement in entertainment and communication, something which Flim and Flam, along with Iron Will do a very good job of.

 

They are portrayed as lowly venture capitalist scum but even if they are not worth redeeming, it would be fun to see the other schemes they cook up even if just in the backgrounds.

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Something I didn't understand about that episode. Why did Applejack agree to a contest where she could lose her farm? She had nothing to gain by agreeing to the challenge. It's a huge plot hole. She even gave them the apples to do it. She should have told Flim and Flam to try to sell their cider and let the town decide which to buy.  Flim and Flam are not bad. They didn't steal. You can argue that it was dishonest of them to allow the bad apples in. But was that a violation of any agreement?

 

In any case, shows like to bring back characters because it saves work. It's easier to use existing characters. They could show up with some new contraption to sell to the town. Maybe a twist could be that their product actually works, and one of the mane six doesn't trust them and tries to "expose them." The lesson is that you can't accuse someone of something without proof.

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I'd like to see Flim and Flam come back, but not as the bad guys again. They don't seem evil, unintelligent, vengeful, or even all that put-out by their previous failure, they're just very aggressively trying to make their own way in the world with their seemingly superb skills at both mechanical engineering and public relations (I like to think that one builds their machines while the other writes their songs, though they didn't differentiate enough in that one episode for me to decide which one is which.

 

As for how they could return, I think it could work that one of them is in some kind of serious trouble (or perhaps not-so-serious for a gag at the end) and the other goes to the Mane 6 to get help, lesson is to help people even if you don't like them, and we get to see how each one acts when separated from the other.

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Something I didn't understand about that episode. Why did Applejack agree to a contest where she could lose her farm? She had nothing to gain by agreeing to the challenge. It's a huge plot hole. She even gave them the apples to do it. She should have told Flim and Flam to try to sell their cider and let the town decide which to buy.  Flim and Flam are not bad. They didn't steal. You can argue that it was dishonest of them to allow the bad apples in. But was that a violation of any agreement?

 

Applejack agreed to the challenge because Flim and Flam threatened to run Sweet Apple Acres out of business with their own apple cider. AJ herself said that cider sales keep their business floating during the winter, but the customers were unhappy that the Apple Family always seemed to run out of cider so quickly. Flim and Flam's SSCS6000 had the potential to give customers quality cider with much speedier service, and Applejack knew this, especially after seeing how amazed everypony was with the machine, so the likelihood of the Apples actually getting run out of business would have been very high.  At least with the competition, they had a fighting chance to save the farm.

 

As for the topic, I quite liked Flim and Flam alright, and I wouldn't mind seeing them again in the future, but at the same time I don't think there's any reason for them to return as major villains. I can't imagine what role they could possibly play in the future other than minor cameo appearances. They are little more than con men, and without any further depth or motive, they have no reason to trifle with Applejack or any of the others as far as I can see.

Edited by Sugar Cube
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They remind me of a lot of characters from books I've read like The Duke and The King from "The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn."

 

Never heard of them described as those characters before.

 

As for me I would like them to come back, but not as villains. For one, they aren't really con-men at all. Their machine did work and seem to do the job well. Also I don't think that they hold a grudge towards AJ and her family. They just know that no pony in Ponyville well not buy their cider.

 

If anything they should come back and help out the Apple family and maybe having AJ accepting that new age machines can help make things better or something along that line. 

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I say no, both because I don't like them and because I honestly don't see a reason for them to comeback. They're one of the few antagonists where I don't feel their characters have anywere to go

Edited by Phoenix Trite
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Applejack agreed to the challenge because Flim and Flam threatened to run Sweet Apple Acres out of business with their own apple cider

But Flim and Flam did not have apples. That is the flaw. Applejack gave them the apples for the contest. If she hadn't done that, then they would not have been able to even make the cider. They can't sell cider if they can't make it. Besides, if they made good cider then they deserve to sell it.

 

Applejack couldn't make cider fast enough, but Flim and Flam could, but they didn't have the apples to do it. Applejack could have sold raw apples to Flim and Flam. They would sell the cider at a mark up. Applejack might have made more money, per barrel of cider, by making the cider herself rather than selling apples to Flim and Flam But she makes up for it in volume. It would have been a win for everypony: Applejack sells all the apples, and Flim and Flam make enough cider for everypony. That's how things work in the real world.

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But Flim and Flam did not have apples. That is the flaw. Applejack gave them the apples for the contest. If she hadn't done that, then they would not have been able to even make the cider. They can't sell cider if they can't make it. Besides, if they made good cider then they deserve to sell it.

 

Flim and Flam didn't have apples with them at that very moment, but they even said that there were plenty of other apples in Equestria and that they would make enough cider for every pony, so providing the brothers weren't bluffing, it wouldn't have done a lot of good for AJ to refuse to let them use any apples. It might have slowed them down a bit, but then Flim and Flam would have just come back with apples and plenty of cider. :/

 

The brothers wanted to stir up the Apple Family into agreeing to the competition so they'd have access to the top-notch apples of Sweet Apple Acres. Applejack was never completely comfortable or confident about holding any kind of competition, nor did she ever agree to it. It was Granny Smith who accepted the challenge and provided apples to the brothers.

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I think a re-appearance could work with the story, as long as they are put in different roles than last time. Instead of villains, they can just be portrayed as business ponies or innovators. I don't think they need to have an episode totally focused on them or anything, but maybe playing a minor role would be nice.

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Something I didn't understand about that episode. Why did Applejack agree to a contest where she could lose her farm?

 

Actually, if I remember correctly, she didn't agree to the contest. It was Granny Smith who actually made the decision, as the family matriarch.

 

Even if I'm misremembering though, Applejack does have a huge competitive streak. One that seems to override her common sense on a regular basis as seen in that exact episode, as well as Applebuck Season, Fall Weather Friends, and the Last Roundup. With the way Granny reacted, I'd expect that to be something Applejack inherited from her.

 

EDIT: Oh, wait, I forgot to put my opinion on Flim and Flam. I wouldn't mind seeing them again, but it would have to be from another perspective. If they are really supposed to be con-men, which I'm not 100% convinced given the episode we've seen, then I would like to see them trying to pull a completely new approach.

Edited by Fhaolan
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Now that you mention it, they were a lot like the Duke and the King. Funny and charismatic tricksters who scam the town into doing what they want. I would love to see them again, because they were funny characters, and their episode was one of my favorites. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

It might be cool for them to make an appearance, but in truth, a complete episode would be too much. They were fun characters, but I can't see a situation that wouldn't just be a repetition of Super Speedy Cider Squeezy. What I personally think would be cool is if they had a brief background appearance. For example, have the focus on a major event involving whomever the episode is centred on, and discreetly a corner of th background selling something to a small crowd. This way we can have another appearance and the writers aren't scrambling to think of a way to have them show up without the episode being a repeat of the last time.

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Least there up to there old tricks in the comics :P

 

I personally want to see Lightning Dust again, tho i probably wouldn't have if they'd gone with the ending where she told RD she was right for calling her out on being reckless and that they were still friends.

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When I first saw Flim and Flam my first thought was "Monorail! Monorail! Monorail!". They're standard con-men and I think one episode was just fine for them. If they come back they shouldn't be doing something apple-related, that'd just get old quickly. Anyways, I never really liked their characters too much to be honest so I really don't care if they come back.

 

Also, anybody who gets my Monorail reference gets a free cookie

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I don't think I would be sold on another episode with those characters. The episode itself that they were in was fine enough but those two antagonists were not that interesting. The episode song dragged on too long in order to justify their personalities. It's perhaps best that they remain as only one episode characters.

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May Hasbro bring them back to the next season?

I have been interested and so entertained by them. 

They are quite smart and good villains; i don't want them ending up like King Sombra

 

Have to admit the image of them exploding into little pieces popped into my head as I read that. I would love to see that even tho it is rather mean for such hopeless villians. :P

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