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Equestria Girls is no longer canon!


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1 minute ago, LonelyYugi said:

I'm not the one in denial.

No one here is ‘in denial.’ We’ve given you all the reasons why it isn’t canon but you’re blatantly ignoring them. The very first post in this thread also has a very good reason why it couldn’t possibly be canon. Please give it a careful read. 

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Guy who works on show: X is canon

fans: You're in denial! You don't know what you're talking about! That doesn't prove anything!

Jackie Chan What GIFs | Tenor

takes me back to they Cyclonus is Skywarp/Bombshell arguments in the Transformers fandom, mainly because I'm seeing similar reactions here lol

Anyway I'm with @CloudMistDragonon this

Edited by Megas
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4 minutes ago, Megas said:

fans: You're in denial! You don't know what you're talking about! That doesn't prove anything!

I literally just said that no one was in denial. We were just speaking the truth. I don’t appreciate you putting things we never said into our mouths. 

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2 minutes ago, TomDaBombMLP said:

I literally just said that no one was in denial. We were just speaking the truth. I don’t appreciate you putting things we never said into our mouths. 

I must of misread one of the posts here then, I know someone here said that. Apologies.

But still hard disagree with "speaking the truth", I think someone who worked on the show would probably hold more weight than someone in the fandom

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Moments ago, Megas said:

I must of misread one of the posts here then, I know someone here said that. Apologies.

But still hard disagree with "speaking the truth", I think someone who worked on the show would probably hold more weight than someone in the fandom

That’s fair enough. One of the people who think it’s canon was the one who said that we were in denial.

As for what you’re saying about the people involved saying it is canon, I get that but most of us still stand by the fact that unless the actual show itself had a character’s name specifically mentioned or a human world referenced, it’s not canon. It would be the same for any show with a spin-off, not just MLP. 

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Honestly whether it's Cannon or not is not important. What's important that there are some fans who enjoy the spin-off show and anyone who hates the person for loving the show is not respecting their opinion. That would be like someone hating on people who like chocolate ice cream just because the complainer hates chocolate ice cream themselves.

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11 hours ago, CloudMistDragon said:

Even if we theoretically were the deciders of what was canon or not, IT WOULDN'T BE FUN. WE WOULD BE FIGHTING FOR AGES.

Wow, my point here was proven in this thread pretty quick. Guys, it's just Horse School Musical. I'm not even the biggest EG fan and even I'm just like...what does it matter? :huh:

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The speculation was redundant eight years ago, and it’s even more redundant now. Equestria Girls is canon to the show and will always be canon. After the Mane Six stepped into the Crystal Empire, the events of the coronation and Twilight’s newfound princesshood were explicit. The events from Rainbow Rocks and the after-credit scene of Friendship Games only accentuate that.

The big separation is that we don’t have to follow the events of EQG to follow FIM. Easter eggs were included here and there, but nothing more than that.

7 hours ago, Landi said:

Just because Josh Haber said so doesn't mean anything unless the show itself proves Equestria Girls is canon.

Haber co-edited Season 7’s second half with Lewis and Songco and co-wrote Shadow Play with Dubuc. The Sirens from the flashback are the same ones from Rainbow Rocks.

Edited by Dark Qiviut
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3 hours ago, Dark Qiviut said:

The speculation was redundant eight years ago, and it’s even more redundant now. Equestria Girls is canon to the show and will always be canon. After the Mane Six stepped into the Crystal Empire, the events of the coronation and Twilight’s newfound princesshood were explicit. The events from Rainbow Rocks and the after-credit scene of Friendship Games only accentuate that.

The big separation is that we don’t have to follow the events of EQG to follow FIM. Easter eggs were included here and there, but nothing more than that.

I don't have any problem with people who do actually like EQG, my issue is just when they try to force it on people who don't like it and say it is "100% canon" and we aren't able to say otherwise. That's all. People are completely able to say it's canon if they want, and the same thing goes for those of us who say it isn't canon. We just prefer to disassociate the two vastly different franchises entirely, and I don't see what is wrong with that.

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2 hours ago, Landi said:

I don't have any problem with people who do actually like EQG, my issue is just when they try to force it on people who don't like it and say it is "100% canon" and we aren't able to say otherwise.

 We just prefer to disassociate the two vastly different franchises entirely, and I don't see what is wrong with that. 

I think when people talk about disassociating the two as their own series, that's fine and all, but in the universe, it doesn't mean the other doesn't exist

Obviously, you're not beholden to pay attention to the side series, and can totally ignore it, but I know that both shows have shown the other does exist. (Wouldn't that be what canon means?) This doesn't automatically mean you have to pay attention to the other, it's obviously like two different worlds and stories but I know the show has shown the two are congruent.

There's a lot of ways EQG references MLP/Equestria, but even in terms of MLP addressing or nodding to EQG, well I know these were said already but,

  • The Sirens appearing in the flashback in Shadow Play where Starswirl and the Pillars banished them.
  • Pony Flash Sentry's existence in the show.
  • Sunset appearing in the finale montage.

This doesn't mean a bunch of people can't push EQG aside and ignore it, (and I believe the showrunners never put Sunset in the main show just to keep the two worlds seperate) but I think that's what I think the hangup is. Ignoring the other world/other show is an option, but the show is trying to show with little references and such that this world at least exists somewhere else 

(I personally have only seen the first three movies and a few different clips from other sources, especially the Equestria scenes.)

 

Edited by Toastypk
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When I saw the promotional material for EG, I wasn't too excited about the Mane 6  reimagined as teens in high school primarily due to my experience with Disney high school flicks of yesteryear.

At the time, I felt that as long as it didn't affect the series in any meaningful way, it was fine. But it didn't mean that the other narrative (EG) didn't exist. When I look at the Sirens' flashback from S7, it looks to me more like a nod to EG rather than confirmation that EG is canon, but of course that's moot. 

Edit:

It's worth noting that G4 is known for its nods to real-life celebs and other franchises. Discord riding Blythe's scooter, Link, D&D, etc. Naturally, this includes EG. 

Edited by Sasoriman
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Strictly speaking something is only canon of Hasbro declares it so. It is a matter of the position/judgement/ruling of the authority on the matter.  

 

Comtinuity errors are a separate issue. Many of them can be handwaved by asserting that fictional characters, like their all too human writers, do not have absolutely perfect recollections of past events.

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5 hours ago, StormyVenture said:

Strictly speaking something is only canon of Hasbro declares it so. It is a matter of the position/judgement/ruling of the authority on the matter.  

 

Comtinuity errors are a separate issue. Many of them can be handwaved by asserting that fictional characters, like their all too human writers, do not have absolutely perfect recollections of past events.

There are a number of comic issues which have put people off, and are easily ignored.

But even like with the Starswirl and the Sirens thing, a comic came out before which showed what supposedly happened with Starswirl and banishing the Sirens, but it had a weird reception. Then came Shadow Play (and later the Legends of Magic comics) and expanded on that to include the rest of the Pillars. Then the original comic was easier for people to discount.

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22 hours ago, Sasoriman said:

franchises. Discord riding Blythe's scooter, 

Don’t forget the inverse happened as well :fluttershy:

Spoiler

counts as a VA joke too :mlp_icwudt:

 

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18 hours ago, Toastypk said:

There are a number of comic issues which have put people off, and are easily ignored.

I don't think there was ever any question about the comics being canon, they were always just their own thing.  A good example is the 'Nightmare Rarity' arc which, in my opinion, undermined Luna's character development by attributing her transformation into Nightmare Moon to possession by an external entity instead of being a result of her own jealousy.  We know that this story arc in the comics cannot be canon to the cartoon because if it was, it would be utterly inconceivable that the 'Nightmare Rarity' incident would not have been brought up at all during 'Do Princesses Dream of Magic Sheep'.

Just to caveat the above, I absolutely love the comics, probably even more than the cartoon itself, and that absolutely includes the 'Nightmare Rarity' arc, even if I do think that it weakens the character development of my favourite pony.

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I will never consider EQG part of FiM's canon. Not that I hate EQG nor that I am denying that anything from EQG appears in FiM. The reason I do not and will never consider the two shows to be two parts of a whole is because the two shows are notably different from each other.

As for those arguing or attempting to define what is canon, take a look at the Transformers universe - is Transformers Prime part of the Bayformers canon because Optimus Prime appears in both, or because a writer simply says so? The answer will vary. Some will say yes, some will say no, and some will say it depends. None of those answers are incorrect. That is because the answer is subjective because ultimately the term "canon" is subjective and therefore to attempt to make it objective is to claim that you have authority over everyone else and what they define as "canon".

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33 minutes ago, EpicEnergy said:

I will never consider EQG part of FiM's canon. Not that I hate EQG nor that I am denying that anything from EQG appears in FiM. The reason I do not and will never consider the two shows to be two parts of a whole is because the two shows are notably different from each other.

As for those arguing or attempting to define what is canon, take a look at the Transformers universe - is Transformers Prime part of the Bayformers canon because Optimus Prime appears in both, or because a writer simply says so? The answer will vary. Some will say yes, some will say no, and some will say it depends. None of those answers are incorrect. That is because the answer is subjective because ultimately the term "canon" is subjective and therefore to attempt to make it objective is to claim that you have authority over everyone else and what they define as "canon".

Heck the first thing I thought at that time I was on the forums and read canon. Was the thing that goes boom!:crackle:

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This thread is so old, lol. To bad Equestria Girls got canon with the ending of Season 7 of FIM, with that great revival of the pillars >_>

And my favorite season was 7... Up to that point :dry:

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11 hours ago, EpicEnergy said:

That is because the answer is subjective because ultimately the term "canon" is subjective and therefore to attempt to make it objective is to claim that you have authority over everyone else and what they define as "canon".

As I pointed out a couple posts ago, canon is not subjective, especially as it applies to this sort of thing, but rather is something that Hasbro (or the owner of the IP) defines. Anything else is a headcanon, fanon, community consensus, etc. In the same way, Kkat gets to define what is canon in relation to the original Fallout Equestria fanfic and nobody else's opinion matters. And by extension her thoughts on other related fan-works bear rather more weight if another fanfic insists that it's part of the world /she/ created, as opposed to simply a vaguely similar crossover.

 

If anyone in the fandom is being honest, they are really just providing their own view plus an objective criteria for why they think something should or shouldn't be accepted as canon in relation to the show.

 

P.S.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/canon

Edited by StormyVenture
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5 hours ago, StormyVenture said:

If anyone in the fandom is being honest, they are really just providing their own view plus an objective criteria for why they think something should or shouldn't be accepted as canon in relation to the show.

 

P.S.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/canon

I've felt a similar sort of semantic gymnastics with the manga. Reading about the issue where a pony comes from the future to visit what she says is the "past", really sat uncomfortably with me for various OCD reasons. (Though this is before G5 really cemented G4 as "the past", so I'm less bothered now) People obviously like the manga, but I was trying to figure out if it was "official" or not.

Edited by Toastypk
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On 2021-08-04 at 10:14 AM, StormyVenture said:

As I pointed out a couple posts ago, canon is not subjective, especially as it applies to this sort of thing, but rather is something that Hasbro (or the owner of the IP) defines. Anything else is a headcanon, fanon, community consensus, etc. In the same way, Kkat gets to define what is canon in relation to the original Fallout Equestria fanfic and nobody else's opinion matters. And by extension her thoughts on other related fan-works bear rather more weight if another fanfic insists that it's part of the world /she/ created, as opposed to simply a vaguely similar crossover.

 

If anyone in the fandom is being honest, they are really just providing their own view plus an objective criteria for why they think something should or shouldn't be accepted as canon in relation to the show.

 

P.S.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/canon

That is the legal definition of "canon", but "canon" has several other different meanings. When you say "canon is not subjective", you need to state what definition of "canon" you are using (which you did, but that's not my point). Isn't that subjective though? Each individual has their own idea of what measurements determine what is or isn't canon, so to objectively state that a certain measurement determines what is or isn't canon is to undermine everyone else's ideas on the matter. Therefore, to say that the measurement that determines what is canon is the owner's definition is to say that every other measurement is wrong.

Also, there is a major flaw in saying that Hasbro, or the owner of the IP, defines what is canon. Hasbro isn't a sentient being, nor is it one individual; rather, it is a company that consists of numerous human beings with varying opinions. The flaw lies in that which one of those people gets to define what is canon? Do all of them? If they all get to decide what is canon, what happens when their decisions conflict with each other? What happens when one leaves the company, does what that person said was canon suddenly become irrelevant? Hypothetically speaking, what if Ashleigh Ball said that EQG wasn't part of FiM's canon, does that make her statement a fact? You see, Hasbro isn't an individual nor is it a group of people who all come together to decide what is canon.

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It would be best to avoid picking nits.

Everybody understands that Hasbro is a company and that companies have employees, but at the same time we all understand, I think, that when we say "Hasbro" we are talking about a single entity/mouthpiece. In general the employees are not the company and the CEO may not be either. Ultimately someone holds the real authority though. It might be their board of directors, I don't know.

Nevertheless what is important here is that the owner of the intellectual property gets to decide what's canon for MLP:FiM and their answer is definitive and final. Whatever any of the rest of us have to say is "head-canon" or "fanon".

Ashleigh Ball can say what she likes, but she's just a voice actress. She may have more insight into the thought processes of the writer, but even the writers don't get the final say.

If you assert that there is no official source of canon then all of this is just a bunch of bickering, because nothing is canon.

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Everything is canon unless I don't like it and that's an objective fact.

Seriously though, I think that Sirens appearing in the show and a writer explicitly confirming EQG as canon is a concrete enough evidence but ultimately, does it matter either way? If you like EQG there's plenty of crossover in EQG films and shorts, and if you don't, you can literally ignore all of it, it's purposefully designed that way.

Can't wait for an 80 page thread on whether G5 is canon

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If you want to consider it canon, great. If you don't want to consider it canon, great. I like Equestria Girls and to me it's canon. The end.

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