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Posts posted by Thrond
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3 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:
It wasn’t, that’s kinda my point. Starlight wanting to talk it out is never treated like the only “morally superior” option, only a different one. You’re claiming that the rest of the characters are only there to make Starlight look like a saint, when I don’t agree that banishment was an evil decision to begin with, only one that ultimately turned out to be unnecessary.
And it’s only unnecessary because... well, honestly, this has been gone over often enough, you know it’s because Starlight sympathized, etc, etc.
I think that’s a large part of why I don’t like this episode. Its main conflict is resolved from the moment it begins, and the rest of the episode is waiting for everyone else to catch up.
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2 minutes ago, CypherHoof said:
The idea that the hosts to dark forces could be more a victim than a culprit is explored fairly well in the EqG movies - both Sunset and SciTwi were tempted by an easy path to power, then overwhelmed - and were as much rescued as defeated. Stygian may well have walked a similar path.
I do feel that “Friendship Games” does most of what “Shadow Play” does better.
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2 hours ago, Lambdadelta said:
What is it? Why is one certain difference comics and the show speak about what's wrong with this show? Are comics better? I dont read them often. You know the show has more restraints than the comics, right!? Under some toy promotion agenda by a billion-dollar company, the writers still try to make some good things out of it, i think it is admirable.
Starswirl in the comics is goofy and eccentric. Starswirl in the show is humourless and domineering. The latter, to me, reads like a character written to suit the plot.
1 hour ago, ShootingStar159 said:I can’t really agree with this, mostly because I don’t think Starlight was in any sort of moral right.
Stygian might have been wrongly treated by people that were his friends, but becoming host to a darkness god and trying to steal all light and hope from the world, (whatever that actually means) is not an appropriate response, just like going back in time to destroy someone’s friendships isn’t. Starlight isn’t trying to give Stygian a chance because he deserves one, she wants to give him a chance because she knows that sometimes a chance (or two, or three) is all you need to be a better person.
If Twilight had decided to banish Starlight, or put her in prison, Tartarus, etc. I don’t think that anyone would say she didn’t deserve it. And by the same hand, banishing Stygian wouldn’t have been a wrong thing to do, he was trying to do something evil. Banishing him wouldn’t have been any more wrong than banishing Luna to the moon, or turning Discord to stone, or sealing Tirek in Tartarus.
Starlight was right in the end, and giving Stygian a chance did lead to a better outcome for everyone involved, but that doesn’t mean everyone else was really wrong to consider banishing the Pony of Shadows.
I don’t remember this being discussed much in the episode. We see Starlight suggesting they try to understand the Pony of Shadows, then Starswirl says no, then she briefly doubts herself before quickly going back to learning more and trying to convince others. We barely see Twilight discuss, and Starswirl’s justifications don’t amount to anything more than “but he’s bad.” And because part 2 is focused on Starlight’s point of view. Starswirl just becomes another obstacle to overcome. So much time is wasted on exposition and object collecting which might have been used to further explore the human side of this.
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1 hour ago, Lambdadelta said:
Starlight role in this finale is moral compass, of course she is more right than other, friendship and forgiveness are superiority in ponies world, but her reasoning still be proved by the map, if not for the map, Starlight's optimism will be drowned in disappointment because violence still the most easy answer to most of conflicts. Like i said, you can pick any side of this episode based from your own moral definition, the map just make the answer less ambiguous.
I tend to side with Starlight here, but it’s hard for me to take the opposing side seriously when Starswirl isn’t terribly empathetic and Starlight gets so much more screen time. It feels one sided enough that I find it kinda boring, perhaps because I don’t care about Starlight anymore.
1 hour ago, Lambdadelta said:About the group of characters are just accessories to some main characters.... sound familiar, dont you? Why do i have some deja vu about this? Or these things are projections of some things that has repeatedly happen in the past? Season 2? Season 3? Season 4? Season 5? Season 6?
Well, I do find this episode highly formulaic, so I’ll concede that point.
1 hour ago, Lambdadelta said:In the grander scheme, everyone are accessories to the map...
Terrifying.
1 hour ago, Lambdadelta said:I see many people sided with Starwirl and criticized Stygian and Starlight in moral conflicts. Being the mightiest wizard of Equestria make him a bit 'dickish' but still his reasoning is very reasonable, perfectly normal, like mane 6 treat Discord in S4, perfectly normal for people in his timeline. Stygian in Starwirl eyes is a thief, a monster that he even sacrificed himself just to contain him and now some silly unicorns release that monster? How should he treat them anyway?
Starwirl is a bit dickish but not total ass. He behaved just like what i expected from his status. I think he's an OK old dude.
As far as I can tell he’s always been kinda prideful and lacking in empathy, and if he was friends with Stygian for so long, why didn’t he actually try to understand the latter’s decisions? The way Starswirl acts in this, I’m not convinced he’s ever made a meaningful relationship in his life, and if that’s the point... surely that should have taken focus instead of Starlight being morally correct? It’d be less boring.
1 hour ago, Lambdadelta said:random: some few people dislike Starwirl because he's not like his pre-legend of magic version.... hahahahahahahaha....... hahaha... comics are B-canon until Hasbro say otherwise, it not writers faults to write something not fit to your non-canon interpretation....
I think the difference between comics Starswirl and show Starswirl speaks volumes about what’s wrong with the show right now.
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I doubt they were involved, but there's a good chance that other students and school events gave them a good sense of the importance of this rivalry.
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19 hours ago, Lambdadelta said:
Twilight just too fond of her idol that bringing him back is worth the risk
Doesn't make it less stupid.
19 hours ago, Lambdadelta said:Why no one realized reform Pony of Shadow is a thing? Mane 6 is so good as villain ass-kicking that they usually not even think about that option (that exclusive belongs to Humane 7) and reformed a gosh dang Eldritch abomination that could end the light of Equestria? A rational human (or pony) should think Starlight must be a fool, if not for the map, no one will take Starlight opinions seriously.
How about when Starlight suggested it, and Twilight seemed to genuinely consider it, but deferred to Starlight despite outclassing him? Maybe she has a reasonable thought process, but then, I'd argue that's a much more interesting story than "Turns out Starlight was right all along. All glory to Starlight." The problem, in my eyes, is that the second half doesn't make room for its other characters. It doesn't matter how reasonable the mane six's perspective is, because the episode doesn't give it any credit, and the second half doesn't give us much insight into their thought processes. They're accessories to Starlight proving her moral superiority.
19 hours ago, Lambdadelta said:Starwirl is an asshole, he just thinking like a normal human would think, that how humans dehumanizing his enemy for decades and he is a gosh dang Starwirl, he's always right.
I might not have considered him an asshole if he was shown doing anything other than being commandeering and insensitive. Maybe he could have shown some other side in that flashback, but nah, just more jumping to conclusions, with a hint of egotism thrown in.
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Fun idea, but that would also raise the question of the numerous other characters repeated in early season backgrounds, which, alas, cannot all have such workable explanations. I would probably read a fanfiction about this, though.
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I wasn't huge on it. I guess I'm just not very interested in the show's lore anymore, and I didn't find it very exciting here either. I found Twilight to make some uncharacteristically poor decisions, I find Starlight boring in general, and I didn't like that the first half was the mane six just collecting items to do something we already knew would end badly. Also, maybe I'm biased from having read the comics, but I also found Starswirl to be quite dull. I felt he existed for the sake of the moral more than anything else. With that said, there were a handful of funny moments, so I didn't have an entirely awful time watching it.
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Either Trixie or Starlight would be perfectly suited to such an episode, as both have demonstrated themselves to be unpredictable with magic. I bet that one of Celestia's first thoughts after the cutie-mark-swap incident was about how Starlight might liven up this year's Gala.
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On 2017-12-28 at 3:53 PM, Momento Mori said:
Disappointing. Straight up, disappointed. The Shadow Pony could have been amazing. And with as much emphasis they put into these old legendary characters and how powerful this enemy was that even Starswirl and the others couldn't defeat him they just had to seal him, made me think that we were in for a great ride!
No.Pacing, pacing PACING ISSUE. This could have easily been a gorgeous story arc that stretched four episodes minimum, or an entire season maximum. So much could have been done with this. Instead it was all so fast, it made my head spin. And the pay-off? I felt like they wasted my time. For as powerful as Starswirl and his group were supposed to be, I expected this enemy to be super powerful, like TIREK LEVEL THREAT OR BIGGER. And what was it? A sad, little wobbly, "I didn't get credit so I'm sad" pony. Wah. We get it, that situation sucks, but come on, you're regressing your storytelling back to baby level! Give us something dangerous, one up yourself on Tirek, give us a villain that is threatening. One that doesn't just need a one on one talk session with the mane 6 for 10 minutes to get over a 'misunderstanding'.
This whole thing, makes me so disappointed, because the whole set-up was amazing! They had me on my toes with it! I wanted to know where this went, I was excited! And then-----
crushing, eye-rolling, Disappointment.
I’m not clear on how a big dangerous monster is more mature storytelling than attempting to depict an antagonist with some complexity.
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5 hours ago, heavens-champion said:
Personally, I think it would be important to know how the Mane 6 were captured. Chrysalis could at least give a hint.
I’m split between finding it distracting and thinking these details are unnecessary.
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On 12/28/2017 at 10:49 AM, KH7672 said:
She tells Hard Hat, build a sanctuary...that's it! How is he supposed to know what to build if he's never done it before. She tells Dandy Grandeur decorate it but how and why, he's an intertior designer what interior is there in this sanctuary. She tells Wranger give the animals a place stay and she does...in cages because that's her job that's why you hire her for! Fluttershy is telling these ponies not to do their jobs with little more instruction than don't do this but then how do they do it with no further plan?
The impression I got was that these "experts" simply believed they knew better than her, which simply made me wonder how they even kept their jobs if they weren't willing to listen. I don't recall if Fluttershy communicated her desires all that well to begin with, but surely the right thing to do would be to ask for more instructions.
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1 hour ago, Momento Mori said:
No, I agree with you. While I was impressed with some of the animation upgrades, my biggest disappointment was the lack of character development or set up. We get no exposition on The Storm King, who he is, why is he a threat really, why should we care? Why is he evil? Where on earth did he come from? We don't know And the Prequel comic book doesn't tell us either, in fact it quite insultingly tells you it won't tell you anything about him. And I'm sorry, Tempest's reason for 'going bad' is a major overreaction. Her backstory was not sufficient for her actions. I was very disappointed. They had the opportunity to take risks, especially knowing they have a devoted older fanbase. It was overall, a cashgrab for more marketing. Not to mention the pace was all over the place, and did anyone else really feel that the Hippogriffs and the whole Seaponies thing was 'thrown together'? The whole scenery just felt like it should be in a different movie or an episode or two in the show. I mean, this movie, it felt like they tried to throw so many ideas and creatures, and storylines at you all at once to be like "LOOK HOW EXPANDED AND EPIC THIS IS! NEVER MIND IT MAKES NO SENSE! LOOK! SHINY!" and, it just...wasn't cohesive.
It just hopped rapidly from scene to scene of shrill jabber, ugly action setpieces, and generic songs. I found it very tedious, and I have no idea how this thing was supposed to bring in new audiences.
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6 hours ago, Kreamer said:
or the bee stinging her is what made her faint
I find this unlikely. Lack of rest weakens one's immune system, and because she only contracted the disease later despite being right there with Zecora, it makes sense to me that this exhaustion was the main cause. Which, then, means it makes sense that her exhaustion would be why she eventually succumbs to her exhaustion.
6 hours ago, Kreamer said:I'm supposed to feel like Fluttershy should have done things better but, instead, I understand why she did all those things and since she solved the issue in the end, I don't feel like a change in action was necessary.
I think understanding Fluttershy's motivations helps us sympathize with her more, so when we see her wearing herself down later on to no end, it makes the moral more surprising and thus more effective. And I'm not sure whether resting at night would have made up for those three days, but she was clearly not in the right state of mind even before falling off the tree, and simply might have been more productive were she not severely exhausted and sleep deprived.
Although Twilight could have been a bit more worried.
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3 minutes ago, Duzzki said:
Not much of a reason for it to be hated, is that?
I don’t know, I just disliked watching it. I was looking forward to it based on the synopsis, but the narrative arc is completely flat. Fluttershy is never wrong, the experts are never right, there’s no reason for anyone to doubt anything, and it’s not terribly humorous. Feels to me like a waste of time.
6 minutes ago, Duzzki said:I don't see what you're seeing at all.
I love both episodes, but “Twilight’s Kingdom” is slower, cuts to its villain more often, and climaxes with an action scene. “To Where and Back Again” is more vague (mane six captured), more humorous, never cuts to its villain, and doesn’t have much action.
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11 hours ago, blackstarraven said:
Maybe.
But she also did get knocked out for three days.
She might not have made that mistake. (Or maybe have recovered quicker) If she had taken better care of herself.
I would agree that there are / could be better ways to explain that lesson however.
I also think it’s significant that Fluttershy herself contracted the disease, which she might not have had she taken care of herself. She tried to hard to save her friend that she wound up putting others at risk.
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Almost forgot 28 Pranks Later, which I think is very funny and has a neat atmosphere in the zombie part.
25 minutes ago, Duzzki said:"Fluttershy Leans In" I literally have no idea why people say it's one of the worst episodes in Season 7. The only arguments I've seen to that end have made no sense to me. In fact, I think it was actually the best episode in the season before "A Royal Problem."
"To Where and Back Again" Same sort of thing here. I honestly can't see why somebody would dislike this episode unless they hated Season 4's finale, unless it was for some stupid reason like "but Trixie" or something like that. Aside from who saved the day, there's very little different between the two to be quite honest.
I just don’t find “Fluttershy Leans In” funny, and that leaves me with Fluttershy never doubting herself and new characters I don’t care about. Boring.
I don’t see how the S4 and S6 finales are similar. They have wildly different paces, and I see major differences in tone and focus.
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+1 for "Family Appreciation Day" and "Castle Mane-ia."
"Leap of Faith" is one of the most nuanced conflicts the show has ever offered, and yet people only seem to bring it up to complain about the Flim-Flam Brothers.
"Equestria Games," while not as good, deserves a lot more credit for its genuinely sympathetic portrayal of Spike. Similarly, "Inspiration Manifestation" is fairly creative, and features a major step in Spike's maturation.
I maintain that "Bloom and Gloom" is one of the most intelligent and creative episodes of the whole show.
"Party Pooped" is delightful, and features the mane six struggling for the first time with the task of diplomacy. And there's plenty of hilarious, memorable scenes.
I could just say "all of season 6," but more specifically, the intelligent and grounded "The Crystalling," the incredibly funny "The Gift of Maud Pie," the overwhelmingly powerful "A Hearth's Warming Tail," the funny and exciting "Stranger Than Fan Fiction," the energetic "Dungeons & Discords," and of course "Top Bolt," which I consider the best Cutie Map episode by a country mile. "To Where and Back Again" also deserves more credit, but people pay attention to that one.
"A Flurry of Emotions" was my favourite episode of season 7 for its relentless charm and for giving Twilight something to do other than be a mentor and princess.
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I'm just gonna use this to talk about episodes which I feel I enjoy more than most.
Feeling Pinkie Keen - I think there might be a more positive consensus about this one nowadays, but I still consider it one of the best examples of slapstick in the whole show. Really well-paced jokes.
Owl's Well That Ends Well - Haven't seen this one in a while. For all of Spike's immaturity and bad behaviour, I thought it ultimately came from a somewhat sympathetic (if juvenile) place, and I really liked seeing how much he actually cares about Twilight.
Putting Your Hoof Down - "New Fluttershy" is super charismatic and super entertaining, and Iron Will is a really funny antagonist as well. Not entirely sure about the moral, but I like that Fluttershy attempts to be more assertive, and then needs to learn what that means to her.
Dragon Quest - Huge fan of this one. The dragons are super funny, Spike's internal conflict is very sympathetic, and we see great character development from Rarity and Rainbow Dash in particular. In the end, this episode's about how family transcends genetics, how the people who love you matter more than the people you're genetically related to.
One Bad Apple - This one took a bit of a hit for me recently, but I still think there's some hidden depth to Babs which makes the episode a lot more interesting than its reputation suggests. I'm still hoping she gets a second appearance in the show.
Spike at your Service - Despite the weird characterization in spots, I think this one actually has some of the show's best dialogue. It's so snappy and casual, and other parts like Rainbow's fanfiction novel are absolutely hilarious.
Daring Don't - I guess the thing here is that I like Daring being real, and don't quite understand why so many people take issue with it. This is a pretty entertaining adventure all around.
Rainbow Falls - Wouldn't say I'm a fan, per se, but I think this has some good intentions that it doesn't always get credit for. I think the core idea of forcing Rainbow to chose between her dreams and her friends is worthwhile.
Leap of Faith - Most meaningful of the "key" episodes, and while not the most fun, it still has its fair share of entertaining moments. Mostly I just think this story has a lot of depth, and provides a more significant conflict than most My Little Pony episodes.
Equestria Games - Spike's inadequacy has always felt emotionally resonant to me, and the long, uncomfortable scenes of him messing up only really enhance how sympathetic his feelings are. We can see why he might feel insignificant, and it's not hard to feel for the poor guy.
Party Pooped - Hilarious. Rapid-fire jokes, one after the other, and there's an anxious atmosphere here which keeps the episode emotionally grounded. Mostly, I like that this episode actually considers how these ponies might struggle with actual diplomacy, given that they've never dealt with it before this point.
The Hooffields and McColts - I just find the interplay between Twilight and Fluttershy really funny.
The Cutie Re-Mark - Starlight's reformation, wherein a misguided pony is faced with the consequences of her actions and is given a second chance, still strikes me as deeply poignant.
The Crystalling - This low-key two-parter is pretty funny and is filled with relatable human experiences, and it all culminates in a pretty spectacular setpiece, and shows how even someone who has failed and failed again can still do something important.
The Gift of the Maud Pie and On Your Marks - Both of these are just really funny. The former has some nice worldbuilding, and the latter has a fairly sympathetic conflict from Apple Bloom.
Newbie Dash - Impressions aside, I think this does a good job of putting Dash's boasting in a context which still makes her sympathetic and even lets her learn a lesson other than "don't be egotistical." In this one, Dash actually stops boasting when her self-esteem is increased, which is quite clever. And I do think the interpretations that this promotes bullying/hazing are a little exaggerated.
Flutter Brutter - I just find this jerk funny, and I can relate to his fear of failure if nothing else. (obviously nothing else.) He's so smarmy, and I just find that funny for whatever reason. The episode is just nicely paced to emphasize the absurdity of his behaviour.
Every Little Thing She Does - I mean, Starlight does face consequences for her actions in this one.
To Where and Back Again - Probably the best that most of these characters have ever been. An episode grounded by the sheer anxiety of its protagonists, and filled with one creative turn after another. Very little action, but lots of satisfying adventure.
Triple Threat - Has a lot of funny moments, and the ending is genuinely sweet. I find Spike's confusion about these characters fairly sympathetic - he spent time with both of them exactly once, and besides, he's already stressed out of his mind.
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I mean, there might be some comedic potential there, but does anyone really care?
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46 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:
Because mares from young adults to late middle aged generally use the same body model in Flash.
It’s mostly this. Despite the various leaps in quality the show’s look has taken, it still doesn’t use significantly different models between varying ages of adults. The moms who do look older achieve that effect largely through how they’re dressed.
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This one has a little more going on than the previous two. Gilda could have perfectly understandable reasons to dislike Pinkie's behaviour, but she deals with them immaturely, and does all sorts of other mean, selfish things to boot. It's not a terribly insightful depiction, and it makes me wonder what the show might have done with her had it not doubled down on the reformation thing, but it works for the story being told, which is a little less simplistic than in prior episodes.
And yeah, otherwise this is probably the funniest episode up to this point, and the characters have started to solidify a little beyond the simpler archetypes seen in the previous two episodes. It's still season 1, so it's hardly the show's peak of complexity, but you see them being a little more mature here as they try to consider the effects of their actions on others. The Fluttershy scene is a good example of that.
Score:
Entertainment: 9/10
Characters: 8/10
Theme: 7/10
Story: 7/10
Overall: 78/100 -
This one's funny too! It kinda slows down a bit when Twilight's lecturing Applejack, but it's also packed with jokes and energy. There's a few too many lame puns, and the animation ain't quite there yet, but this one's a lot of fun. I still really like how this show humorously exaggerates the characters' flaws while still throwing in a few lines which make it easy to understand the character's mindset. More importantly, there's a bunch of really creative slapstick scenes. Gotta love the catapult, for instance, not to mention Pinkie's general absurdity. Fun episode.
Score:
Entertainment: 8/10
Characters: 8/10
Themes: 7/10
Story: 7/10
Overall: 75/100 -
This one's relatively simple and silly, but it's got a lot of the energy and charm which made me love the show and which I've been missing from some of the recent seasons. As far as I know Twilight literally just met these ponies, so the conflict doesn't have as much weight as it should, and the moral is kinda simple, but that doesn't really matter with some of the nice little moments here.
Favourite moment: "Twilight! It's raining."
Mostly charm, not so much substance, but hey, it makes me smile. And I really miss the electric guitars in the soundtrack.
Score:
Entertainment: 8/10
Themes: 6/10
Characters: 7/10
Story: 6/10
Overall: 70/100
Season 7 finale
in MLP:FiM Canon Discussion
The main conflict isn't solved by MacGuffins, but the entire first part is dedicated to collecting one set, and then the second half briefly features a second set. That first half doesn’t even contribute to anything more than setup.