darknessrising24

As I said before at the beginning:

While I can't speak for Timber, the argument that Flash is invalid into the plot.... the same could be said for any other characters in the other movies: Trixie's scenes could've been removed completely since the Dazzlings could've simply trapped the Rainbooms themselves. The Shadowbolts barely had any interaction with their "counterparts" despite all the hype and could've been switched out with other humanized rival/enemeis from the show. Filthy Rich's villany made no sense, he could've been replaced with Glademane, Svengallop,or even his wife Spoiled Rich and it would've made more sense.

I greatly dislike this episode. Now I’m not so much of an RD fanboy that I believe she can absolutely never be in the wrong or need to be taught a lesson herself. I’ve come to terms with my stance on the episode: (Who was in the wrong?) Looking back on it, I acknowledge that RD was in the wrong,there were points in the episode where lives were at risk and her showboating could’ve been saved for later. And while I understand that she kind of needed to be taken down a peg when lives were in danger, but the mane five were also in the wrong, and the way they conveyed their message was very poor and came off as VERY mean-spirited and hypocritical! Not mention that Fluttershy didn’t even DO anything in the grand scheme of things aside from said flyby when RD expressed the joy that flying was the one thing she was the best at. So what? RD wasn’t allowed to be proud that she could fly?? That is NOT humbling someone, that’s just pouring salt in the wound. (The Hypocrisy) Let's see, aside from the fact that RD has bragged before, the Mane Five bragging about their own accomplishments behind her back and then laughing at her is just downright cruel. You don't just do the exact same thing you're trying to teach your friend NOT to do, if you're gonna teach her to be humble then that involves being humble yourselves and actually complimenting the others work instead. Also, how can they call her out on bragging and saying she should be humble if they showed up at the parade? That comes off as more hypocritical since the episode practically begins with her enjoying the fact that she has a fan club and the Mane five get on her case about her huge ego while she’s at a gathering of said fans at Sugarcube Corner, which was technically after her heroics. And yet it was ok for Mare Do Well to attend her own parade under the same circumstances? They both technically EARNED that praise. Not to mention that with episodes like Applebuck Season, The Last Roundup, Bats, Sonic Rainboom, and Sweet and Elite(which takes place AFTER this one!) under their belts, AJ and Rarity are the LAST characters I want teaching someone about humbleness! (If they did try talking to her, would she have listened?) No, she probably wouldn’t listen, but it would’ve been a nice gesture of faith if we saw that her friends trusted her enough to at least TRY that first! Just jumping into the Caped Crusader scheme shows a lack of respect towards their friend; they were basically saying "Why bother?" instead of "We have to try!", and that just isn't the way they roll. Even the BRIEFEST attempt to talk Dash down (even if it failed utterly) would have PROFOUNDLY changed the feel of this episode. What would the others have said if Dash had asked "Why did you do all this? Why didn't you just TELL me I was being a jerk?" What COULD they have said that wouldn't have gravely damaged their friendship? "Well, gee, Dash... we assumed you wouldn't listen, because you're a cocky jerk. So we didn't bother!” Another one of the biggest problems I have with the episode was the aspect of "SHOW DON’T TELL" being ignored. "28 Pranks Later" worked better with that reason because of that solitary aspect. We actually SEE them SIT HER DOWN AND TALK WITH HER. And when that fails they have Pinkie confront her one on one. It’s one of the reasons why I was able to genuinely enjoy "28 Pranks Later" despite having a similar premise. For me, if we had seen the two scenes where they talk it out with her and she didn’t listen in place of the flyby and Sugarcube Corner scenes then it would’ve worked a lot better in my opinion. That way it doesn’t feel like they all just jumped in on the plan without thinking of other options, but instead the gang DIDN'T talk to her, then messed with her behind her back, then praised THEMSELVES (instead of Twilight praising the runaway vehicle save, AJ praising the Dam rescue, etc) in front of her. Even if she was too stubborn to listen, why can't they at least make the ATTEMPT? Then, if Dash rebuffs them, they are JUSTIFIED in their actions! But no, her friends made it clear to her that believe she's too thickheaded and stupid to even TRY to reason with, and they duped the entire town into worshiping a made-up Pony who promptly vanished forever. Twilight and the others contradict themselves by saying bragging is bad when they've clearly done it more than a few times in the past. Even Twilight tried to talk to Applejack when she was doing the harvest by herself in Applebuck Season. But Twilight and the others never did that when it came to Rainbow's bragging. If they'd acted this way in Applebuck Season, they would have snuck around taping apples back up on branches and letting AJ keep working and working and working until she woke up in the hospital... and THEN given her the aesop. But instead Twilight spoke with her immediately. Why doesn't Dash deserve the same respect? AJ is stubborn. Everypony KNOWS she is stubborn. Later on, she nearly abandons here entire LIFE in The Last Roundup because she's stubborn. But TS still TRIES to talk to her in Applebuck Season. Even if it doesn't work for several attempts, she actually TRIES. So Twilight can repeatedly try to talk with AJ during Applebuck Season even though her antics were causing trouble throughout the entire town and yet RD’s completely unreasonable to the point where instead of trusting and talking with her, her friends talked behind her back and formulated a conspiracy whose sole purpose was taking her down a peg?! FUCKING BULL. (Not much would've changed) Many people like to point out that she put many lives at the list due to her bragging. With the hot air balloon I can understand, if RD stopped signing autographs she could have saved the mare before MDW popped up. But with the rest? Even if she had been super-modest and humble, nothing would've been different at all! For example: Runaway carriage - Nothing more RD could have done with this one than she did. RD did not have the strength to even slow it down at all. She even hurt herself trying to stop it. AJ would've had to step in anyway. The construction site- Nothing more RD could have done with this one than she did. She barely saved one of workers and only got out unhurt due to his help. Again, Pinkie would've had to step in. The dam- If the theme is so fragile that simply leaning against it too hard caused it to give away, it was definitely gonna collapse anyway. Being modest before then wouldn't have altered a thing. We never see Rainbow's over-confidence directly leading her to making a mistake. The times she wasn't able to save ponies in the second half of the episode (the construction workers, the runaway carriage, the dam) wasn't because she was overconfident. The way they set those up, she couldn't have handled those on her own regardless of whether she went in humble or bragging. So that doesn't support the lesson they were (allegedly) trying to teach.. (Mare Do Well’s creation was well-meaning, but selfish and pointless) More crucial are the issues that the Mane Five conceived of this plan -before- the balloon incident or anything like it occurred and most importantly, that was NOT their motivation for it. Their motivation was that "heroes don't brag." If you want to argue that Rainbow's intention outweighs the fact that she was saving ponies, what does that say about her friends then? They didn't do a single thing to help until after they became annoyed with Rainbow's attitude. If their priority was saving lives, they wouldn't have bothered with the costumes and the charade. They would've just went out and helped, period. Instead, they put teaching Rainbow Dash a lesson over saving lives. How is that any better than what Rainbow did? If anything, it's worse. The episode never established why arrogance or over-confidence was bad beyond the fact that the attitude that came along with it was abrasive and unpleasant, and even then, it was only her friends who took issue with said attitude, no one else did. The reason why we generally consider arrogance and ego as flaws isn't because of the attitude in and of itself: it's because over-confidence leads to making mistakes that could've been prevented. The connection between bragging and getting over-confident was never made in the episode, so the only conclusion a viewer can take away was: her friends didn't like her attitude. That was it. The argument since Rainbow Dash's ego could've risked lives, therefore what her friends did was correct, fails because her friends NEVER said a word about trying to prevent Rainbow from making mistakes or pointing to how over-confidence can lead to messing up. The ONLY justification they gave in-show was 'heroes don't brag.' As far as rationales go, this is far from convincing. Why did her friends bother with costumes at all? That was done SOLELY so Rainbow Dash wouldn't know who they were. It served no other purpose and I'm sure took time and energy that could've gone to helping ponies sooner. But they prioritized teaching a "lesson" over saving lives. This isn't like super-heroes safeguarding their identities in DC or Marvel. They had no secrets or love ones to protect. They only bothered with them for the purposes of messing with Rainbow Dash. So she was not out of bounds in trying to unmask them. If you're saying that “Rainbow should've just been content with ponies being saved”, then her friends should've been just as content and have NO objections to Rainbow Dash's attitude so long as she was saving lives. Which. She. Was. The rest of the Mane characters showed absolutely zero interest in helping Rainbow Dash out, or saving lives on their own--they ONLY got involved because they objected to Rainbow's attitude. If Rainbow's attitude hadn't rubbed them the wrong way, they would've sat on their plots the entire time. An endless parade of implausibly close-together disasters still doesn't validate shattering a friend's self-esteem and driving them into depression without even TRYING to talk to her. I'm not saying they shouldn't have leaped to the rescue. I'm saying they should have sat Dash down before any of that, as a group -- maybe even with some of the pestered townsfolk tagging along -- and given her a firm but gentle talking-to. The exact one they gave AFTER emotionally torturing her. Tell her that it's okay to be proud, but not to rub others' faces in it. Tell her somepony is going to get hurt while she brags, and then NOPONY will cheer. All that stuff. Maybe even mention how bad Shimmer-Wing-Rarity made HER feel back in Cloudsdale. (Final Thoughts) So yeah, bottom line, with everything that's been pointed out, I can safely and confidently say that MMDW is a bad episode. It may have had a well-meaning moral, but that moral falls flat when the one on the receiving end is turned into a victim and the ones giving it come off as hypocrites. That being said, I don’t hate it like the majority of the fandom, I just think it could’ve been done differently to help the message flow better. I may dislike the episode, but I am not opposed to MDW coming back in the future… but only as long as she's not just an unbeatable rival for RD.Maybe have RD don the mantle herself for some superhero antics or something? I don't hate mare Do-Well as a concept, but her debut episode was just BAD.

The problem is that Mare-Do-Well didn't need to EXIST in the grand scheme of things. Think about it, Rarity contributed nothing aside from making the costume, Fluttershy didn't need to be in on it since all she did was fly by when RD gloated that it was the one thing she couldn't do. Which was completly pointless. Now imagine that Twilight, AJ, and Pinkie pulled off their rescues WITHOUT the costume. Wouldn't THAT have had more of an impact considering the fact that it's her friends helping out with crisis that she couldn't handle alone? But instead they simply pulled the costumed hero gig, stalked her around town in-costume (how else would they have known when the crisis was happening and managed to get in costume so quickly, not all of them are Pinkie Pie) and simply did the hero act to teach her a lesson. Also how can they call her out on bragging and saying she should be humble if they showed up at the parade? Not to mention the little stunt AJ pulled after not winning a blue ribbon the Last Roundup, or her huge ass trophy and "I can do it myself " attitude in Applebuck Season, or considering how Rarity ditched Twi's birthday party to hang with some nobels in "Sweet and Elite", or how she went out of her way to show up RD in Sonic Rainboom! Heck, the costume would've worked if they left out Fluttershy's little stunt and gave her some words of wisdom to her after saving ponies. And before you say "RD wouldn't have listened anyway", the Zombie-Pony episode worked better with that reason because of one solitary aspect: SHOW DON'T TELL We actually SEE them SIT HER DOWN AND TALK WITH HER. And when that fails they have Pinkie confront her one on one. That way it doesn't feel like they all just jumped in on the plan without thinking of other options. Was RD in wrong? YES, there were points in the episode where lives were at risk and her showboating could've been saved for later. But the mane five were ALSO in the wrong, and the way they conveyed their message was very poor and came off as VERY mean-spirited and hypocritical! So bottom line, Mare Do-Well is worse that 28 Pranks Later.

Special note before we start: I don't HATE Timber Spruce, nor am opposed to him and Sci-Twi being together, I'm just sick and tired of people over glorifying him and claiming he somehow "better" than him. First off, let's consider the following: FlashLight was basically bumping into each other and being awkwardly adorable. TimberTwi was basically him saying something corny (usually with an air of smug) and then her giggling. How is this better? And more time was spent with these two together and yet nothing changed. It was exactly the same throughout. At least with FlashLight it slowly built a little (not by much I admit). I mean sure there was a bit of an attraction without knowing much about the other for them, but Flash wasn’t making moves until later when she had that big song trying to unite everyone and then him finding out Sunset framed her and he clears her name. The problem is that here was less buildup, Flash at least flirted gently with Twilight, Timber was giving her the "I want you" look the second he saw her. And even THEN Flash and Twi didn't (almost) kiss until the second movie, with Timber they were ready to suck face right off the bat. Now go into his "usefulness" factor: Timber gets a buttload of screentime together with Twilight yet he never actually "connects" with anything going on with her. Instead of being of some use to help her sort out her problems, he’s just there to give Twilight a break from her moping. And since in the end it’s her friends who make her feel better and let go of her issues, Timber is pretty much just the character equivalent of a safety blanket. Now let's get to the issue that everyone seems to completely ignore: During the entire movie, Timber KNEW that his sister was the one behind all the magical happenings at camp, and instead of actually doing something to stop her (it’s clear that talking to her wasn’t getting anywhere), he pretty much does nothing about it, except come up with the Gaia Everfree story to cover up for her. I have NO idea what the point of that is. It’s not like it was gonna make things any better. Intentionally or not, that’s pretty much him enabling Gloriosa to keep using magic. It’s also kinda tone deaf how the CHS students could be in serious danger yet he passes off that danger as a literal campfire story. So yeah, he pretty much knew Gloriosa was doing something crazy dangerous, using power she obviously didn’t understand, and pretty much did nothing to help. Worst of all, for some reason, he thinks hooking up with a girl he barely knows is a better use of his time in what should be a very urgent situation. Even putting age aside, somehow the movie doesn’t think it’s creepy that a counselor has the hots for one of his guests/clients.

Gonna have to slightly disagree with you on that part. If Flash is a representation of too little development, then Timber is the representation of too much, especially when he barley had any big impact on the two driving conflicts of the entire movie or the movie as a whole. Now before anyone has a heart attack or starts crying "hypocrisy", I don't HATE Timber Spruce, nor am opposed to him and Sci-Twi being together, I'm just sick and tired of people over-glorifying him and claiming he's somehow "better" than Flash. First off, let's consider the following: FlashLight was basically bumping into each other and being awkwardly adorable. TimberTwi was basically him saying something corny (usually with an air of smug) and then her giggling. How is this better? And second of all, Timber gets a buttload of screentime together with Twilight yet he never actually "connects" with anything going on with her. He's mostly there to be Human Twilight's love interest and a red herring for Sunset, he doesn't play any part in in Twilight's issues with Midnight Sparkle and accomplishes little to nothing against Gaea Everfree. At the very least Flash manged to contribute SOMETHING, even if it was minuscule at best. In short. Timber isn’t much better than Flash. If Flash-haters are gonna while about how useless a character he is and then glorify another who’s basically the same, then they have no right to be judgmental in the first place.

I'm not just trying to "build him up in the eyes of others" I'm just pointing out that with everything we've done as a fandom giving him a personality shouldn't be impossible and simply dismissing him as worthless is hypocritical. Tell me, Who was it that made the "Celestia is a troll" meme a thing? And did the "Derpy is a clutz who loves muffins" characterization come before or after the 100th episode? And did the producers make that a thing? It was us Bronies! I’ll say it once and I’ll say it again, we’ve been taking small personality traits and basing entire characters are around them, so how is the scenario any different? Flash is still a supporting character that can be made interesting, for example; he’s a royal guard in the ponyverse, so why can’t that be paralleled by him aspiring to be a police officer? And I repeat, most of facts and speculations that were brought up are from actual parts of the movies and shorts. While the speculative aspects were from parallels to his pony-self as well as a certain character with a similar design. I don’t recall that being a problem for when Derpy was given a daughter based on the fact that their mane and coat matched. I have no problem with people who are indifferent to him, I know that I can't make everyone spontaneously you like him, but I can at the very least put up a better defense as to why he's not a horrible character. Bottom line: Flash DOES have personality that can be used, and he DOES have a few character traits and flaws, and those CAN be used to give hr more depth as a character, even if it’s only a little, the little can go a long way.

I care because I like Flash, I care because he has just as much potential as any "fanon-fueled BG ponies" to be made interesting. I can point out SEVERAL BG/side-ponies who had a few lines and/or screentime (before the 100th episode): Thunderlane, Cloud Chaser, Bulk Biceps, Bonbon, Carrot Top, Colgate, Caramel… just to name a few. And they were simply given more appearances throughout the series, WE gave them that development, hence why the 100th episode was made. The problem is that Flash-haters can’t be bothered to acknowledge it because it’s easier just to hate him and use the same old "he's bland" excuse. They treat his character like he’s a main character who is taking up tons of screen time despite it’s the opposite of that, they act like it’s okay for BG ponies to get special treatment but not Flash even though he is not presented as a main character, why should he be hated so much and not be allowed to be given any characteristics or traits but the BG ponies get a free pass with the same restraints? He’s a supporting character at best and a BG character at worst. And for the record, I wouldn't do with me calling them stupid, I was calling their reasonsfor hating him stupid and hypocritical.

Sorry for the outburst, it's just when it comes to Flash I seriously just seriously can't get over how unjustifiably hated he is. It grinds my gears. If DT was fixed even though she basically insulted a handicapped pony, then Flash isn’t a lost cause. Even the blankest of canvases can be made into something magnificent if we take the time to do so. Heck many people outright hated the idea of bringing back MLP because of G3… ...and now look at what MLP has become.

....then why did you bother replying in the first place? I don't mind if you're indifferent to him, but going out of your way to say you don't feel like reading walks of text is kinda pointless if you've already read it. Dude, either provide a LEGIT argument or don't comment at all. Exactly how does THAT stop us from just GIVING him a personality? We’ve given other BG/side/supporting characters their own character and personalities with even less than that, and yet somehow Flash is an impossible character to do the same for? BULL. A small characteristic could be pointed out over the course of each and every one of these movies with just a bit of looking, so the complaint that he’s "bland" is both irrelevant and hypocritical. Also, have common decency/intelligence to use his actual name, that whole "Brad" joke is old as dirt.

But like I said, we've done a lot with very little in the past, so why stop now? Those minor flaws I mentioned can be played for laughs if done right. While I’m not expecting everyone to love him, but acting like he’s Satan himself and hating him for the "crime" of not having much development or so much as looking at Twilight is completely pointless. That kind of hate is better directed towards Blueblood, Spoiled Rich, pre-reformation Diamond Tiara, Gladmane and Svengallop, characters that have actually DONE SOMETHING to wartent such hatred. Flash? He exists. You see where I'm going with this. Heck, characters like Trixie and Diamond Tiara developed into better characters even when some people outright despised them, Flash is no exception. The steal a quote from Overwatch: "Don’t see something for what it is, see it for what it could be."

So when Flash was first introduced into the fandom he was met with complete hatred and scorn, why? Because he ended up being Twi’s love interest, so everyone started treating him like the cancer of the fandom that needed to die a horrible death because he’s “bland”, “cliche”, a "waifu stealer" and “has no character”. Well if one re-watches the movie, it can be argued that Flash DOES have several character traits that make for an interesting personality, and this topic is for bringing them to light! Let’s begin shall we? Flash… …presumably taught Sunset how to play guitar considering no one else getting close to her during her bully phase. Flash has a sense of justice as he went to clear Twilight’s name when Sunset framed her. And considering that he used to be Sunset’s boyfriend, that means he memorized and knows exactly how she operates. He also dumped Sunset despite everyone in the school being afraid of her so he clearly wasn’t afraid of a bully or at the very least knows how to spot a bad influence. However he also tried to at least start over with her later as friends, showing that he doesn’t hold grudges. Didn’t seem to care about peer pressure considering the way he danced with Twilight. Was mature enough to moves on from his relationship with Twilight due to the complications of it. He’s a gentleman, a bit of a music nerd and a clutz. He has a few character flaws like him not being able to cook (if Friendship Games is any indication), and having a bit of an ego when it comes to his music (Banner Day is a good example of that) to the point of naming the band after himself (Flash Drive)… not unlike Rainbow Dash. He’s apparently good friends with Sandlewood, Micro Chips, Lyra, and Bonbon, or at least on good enough terms to be partnered up with them. Was considered smart/talented/athletic enough to be picked for the Friendship Games. If he’s a Royal Guard in the pony world, that could be carried over to his human counterpart in the form of him wanting to be a police officer. Does he just put on a serious front when on duty, or play music as a hobby while off-duty? There also has been a colt named Popfly (or First Base, depending on who you ask)with a similar mane and coat color who’s been seen in a few episodes https://derpibooru.org/559238 Could he be Flash’s younger brother? We’ve given Derpy a daughter on the same bases so why not? Keep in mind, a good chunk of those facts are taken from the movies themselves, the only ones that are in head-canon territory are the Police Officer & little brother ideas. It may not be much, but we’ve done a lot more with much less. Granted, those last part are speculation at best but you get what I’m saying, these are several facts about his character that can be used to make him interesting, all simply because I explored ALL possibilities for his character, not just the ones I WANTED to. Let me ask you Flash-haters this: Why is it we can make a Derpy’s animation error and her saying "muffins" and make her a clutz who’s obsessed over the food… …make Lyra a human-obsessed conspiracy theorist based on how she sits… …take a DJ with a two-second cameo and make her a party animal who’s dating that one mare from the Gala episode… …make Berry Punch an alcoholic based on her drinking directly from a punch bowl… …make Scootaloo an orphan simply because we don’t see her parents and Rainbow Dash a lesbian with a cider addiction… …and yet giving one character some interesting personality traits based on his scenes in the movies is somehow impossible? Even if the writers didn’t do much for him, that doesn’t make him a lost cause that no good can come out of. As Bronies we’ve been nitpicking small aspects of several characters and giving them their own personalities since the show started, so to whine about Flash being bland is not only lazy, but also hypocritical. Heck we add aspects and traits to main characters like Rainbow Dash, Luna, Scootaloo, and Sweetie Belle. Everyone assumes that Scoots is an orphan, Sweetie Belle is Button Mash’s special somepony, Luna is a binge gamer, and Rainbow Dash is a lesbian with a cider addiction. If we can nitpick and speculate about various characters in the franchise and give them their own personality or add onto their character then Flash is no exception. Him being "bland" is just a petty excuse used by lazy hypocrites who are too stubborn to be imaginative when it comes to this character. "Oh but he's a walking "nice guy" cliche that's not even interesting!" Cliche does not define one's entire personality, heck the mane six are all walking cliches when you think about it. Discounting a personality trait or event just because it’s cliche is just another sign of laziness. Oh, and one last thing that proves that Flash-haters are all just a bunch of hypocrites: If Flash had been introduced as a female, no one would've CARED, if anything they'd be singing a different tune and shipping them like everyone else because "OMG GIRL-ON-GIRL IS SO HAWT!!" Bottom-Line: Flash-hate is pointless, hypocritical, and just plain STUPID. So, what are your thoughts? Any ideas, facts, or aspects that can be used to make him interesting?