Is Sunset Shimmer the 7th element of harmony?

[iluvfluttershy 35]

Sunset Shimmer is probably the element of forgiveness.

[ConcorDisparate 385]

I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

 

I mean, Twilight does magic, RD is loyal, Fluttershy is kind, AJ is honest...

They actually act, and by their acts, they are what their element represent, you know what I mean ?

 

But Sunset is... passive. The only forgiveness about her, is the forgiveness of her friends. She doesn't show forgiveness through her acts.

That's why I don't consider her as an element of anything. She is just being a friend.

[Castle Bleck 19,332]

She's a Sixth Ranger, it would seem to me.

Edited March 7, 2015 by A.V.

[Moonlight 7,286]

A part of me feels like her element would be acceptance, seeing as how she had no choice but to accept what she did. It'd be nice if she was an element, but probably not unless you count Equestrian magic/Rainbow Power(?) as Equestria Girls' version of the elements.

[Ze Ubermage 226]

A part of me feels like her element would be acceptance, seeing as how she had no choice but to accept what she did. It'd be nice if she was an element, but probably not unless you count Equestrian magic/Rainbow Power(?) as Equestria Girls' version of the elements.

Agreed. =) I also follow along with that.

[Dawning Demon 950]

I like to think that she's the element of forgiveness or maybe acceptance or even redemption. 

[Prince Firemane 309]

She seems more of a catalyst than a full-fledged Element-bearer. Her song and standing up for her friends added to her friends' magic enough to allow them to defeat the Dazzlings. But if I had to give her an Element... I say she represents the Element of Bacon Hair. xD

[RivkaBobble 110]

I consider her to be no element. That one on the side, but still a part. Remember when Twilight was a princess but had no part? Something like that. She's still just growing up to be an Element of Harmony, but isn't quite ready.

[VitalSpark 1,830]

But Sunset is... passive. The only forgiveness about her, is the forgiveness of her friends. She doesn't show forgiveness through her acts.

 

Nope, wrong.

 

At the beginning of Rainbow Rocks, the gang had already forgiven her. That's uninteresting. Her whole character development in that film is about her learning to forgive herself. It's only after she's forgiven herself for her past actions that she feels able to confront her friends about their fighting, and able to join the band on an equal footing to help defeat the Dazzlings. Until then, she still feels like they're only hanging around with her as an act of charity, so it's not really her place to interfere with what they're doing.

 

The element of forgiveness completely works.

 

That said, I don't think she is an element of harmony. I don't think that the magic used at the end of Rainbow Rocks is the magic of the elements of harmony, but rather it's the magic of friendship, which is perhaps a stronger underlying force which helped create the elements of harmony. I think the elements of harmony are quantized — there is a countable number of them — but the magic of friendship is not. 

 

Element of Bacon Hair

Where the hell are you people getting your red and yellow bacon?

 

Mine always seems to be pink and white.

 

 

Or is that blue and black?

Edited March 10, 2015 by Vital Spark

[yeet 2,027]

Sunset shimmer isn't an element. Im guessing im the newer movie she is part of the band. That's pretty much to show that she is good now and has learnt her lesson I guess. And that everyone else has forgiven her. There are six elements. Not seven. A seventh would be more comfusing than the rainbow power shit that's gonna happen in season five, because all six (all the elements) have places in twilights castle. And a little chair for spike. It'd be uneven to have another chair there as well.

[Castle Bleck 19,332]

IMO, she's not technically a Bearer, but she now seems worthy enough to borrow one in case the Mane 6 member in question is incapacitated.

[ConcorDisparate 385]

Nope, wrong. At the beginning of Rainbow Rocks, the gang had already forgiven her. That's uninteresting. Her whole character development in that film is about her learning to forgive herself. It's only after she's forgiven herself for her past actions that she feels able to confront her friends about their fighting, and able to join the band on an equal footing to help defeat the Dazzlings. Until then, she still feels like they're only hanging around with her as an act of charity, so it's not really her place to interfere with what they're doing. The element of forgiveness completely works.

 

That's true, but I can developp what I already said.

Maybe she does act, but she doesn't act, uh, I don't know how to say it...

 

I mean, look at the 6 elements. Kindness, Loyalty, Honesty, Generosity, Laughter and Magic.

The six elements, do not represent only what the character do, they represent how the character acts toward somepony. Fluttershy is kind toward people, RD is loyal toward people...

 

But then again, is that really true ? I remember one of the first episode where AJ don't want anybody to help her. Doesn't this episode shows that she learnt not only to be honest toward people, but also toward herself ?

 

You can't say Sunset Shimmer represents the element of forgiveness because she learnt how to forgive herself. Representing an element means acting like the element, both toward itself and toward others. The element of magic being an exception, we could think about that another time, by the way.

 

 

But that's not all, look at anypony in the mane 6. Their element wasn't given to Fluttershy because she once learnt how to be kind with anypony. No, the element belongs to her because her kindness is much more than something she learnt, this is something she did, does, and will do.

It's much more than an experience, like Sunset Shimmer learning how to forgive herself before confronting her friends, it's something she IS. Something that isn't limited in time.

 

How do I know it ? Simple. Consider Sunset Shimmer immortal. Does her forgiveness end at anytime ?

 

 

It's only after she's forgiven herself for her past actions that she feels able to confront her friends about their fighting

Answer, like you showed it : Yes.

 

Now, consider Fluttershy immortal. Does her kindness ends at anytime ?

Well, unless the worlds end or she becomes crazy, never. Basically, if fluttershy does not completely change, it will last forever, while Sunset's forgiveness toward herself is only temporary. Because she does not embraces the forgiveness like every one of the mane 6 embraces what its element represent.

Basically, while you could say that Rarity is the Generosity itself, you can't say that Sunset is the Forgiveness itself, only because she learnt how to forgive herself.

 

 

Sorry if that was too long, I tried to developp others arguments why I think she does not represent the element of forgiveness. We could keep thinking much longer if necessary

Edited March 10, 2015 by ConcorDisparate

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,161]

While it's an interesting prospect, that assumes that she will return to Equestria on a permanent basis. Keep in mind that the Mane 5 of Canterlot High are not the bearers of the Elements of Harmony; they have not experienced the events and revelations that their pony counterparts in Equestria have. As such, unless there is a counterpart to the Elements in the world of EqG, Sunset will not be a bearer anytime soon, IMO.

 

And that is not anything against her. She's my fifth favorite pony overall, and her redemption in RR was one of the best scenes in anything FiM-related period, IMO.

[TwilightDreamer 69]

If she were to be an Element of Harmony, she would have to answer to her sins she committed back in Equestria in her conquest for power and to gain more power and her position as Alicorn Princess for herself and then work her hardest to repent for them as well as discover what's so amazing about herself that makes her unique, so different from the rest and that could contradict to her friends in the EG universe.

 

Keep in mind that she hasn't been given full forgiveness during her time on screen, her friends at Canterlot High gave her forgiveness for her actions since she didn't know about friendship and the greater forgiveness (herself, Celestia (partially), all of Canterlot High) is something she'll still have to earn if she's going to become a second Element.

[lesbiandash 10]

Holy cupcakes, why have I never thought of this before?? I mean I suppose it would make sense....

[CottonCandyTheFurry 1]

I know this is an older post but I'm new and I just feel like I need to say something because this has really been on my mind a lot. This may be just my opinion but what if Sunset Shimmer is a new addition to the elements of harmony. Now to prove my point, we need to take into account the new Legend of Everfree movie which plays a big roll in this but let's start off with the Tree of Harmony in equestria. We know that the elements of harmony originally came from the tree and that the tree is basically the source of all magic and harmony in equestria. We also know that twilight and the others had to return the elements to the tree in order to save it. Knowing this lets go back to Canterlot High in EG. At the end of the movie we see magic leaking out of the portal after Midnight Sparkle destroyed the statue on top during the Friendship games hinting to how the Geodes got there. After the defeat of evil Gloriosa we also here Sunset mention she thinks they were meant to have the geodes. What if, the magic leaking into EG is the elements magic from the tree of harmony and it created the bases of the elements in that world. This is proven by how the geodes match the mane 7s colors at first and then later on, when they turn into necklaces they all have the certain character's cutie mark just like in Equestria. To further prove this point look at what happened when Sunset Shimmer tried to use the element of magic within Princess Twilights crown Then look at what happened when Twilight tried to use the 5s equestrian magic after draining it from them Now look at Gloriosa after she tried to use the geodes magic which aren't connected to her Seeing this we can conclude that everytime somebody tries to use the magic of the element's when it doesn't belong to them it makes them evil but when the magic is with who it's supposed to be with it's good. So knowing all of this we can conclude that the Geodes do prepresent the Elements of Harmony for that world. So knowing that Sunset Shimmer had her own Geode/Necklace we can safely assume that she to is one of the Element's of Harmony. As to what she represents I would say she represents the element of possibly friendship. Princess Twilight Sparkle is in charge of spreading friendship in equestria being the princess of friendship so it can be safe to say Sunset Shimmer could be in charge of spreading friendship in EG by representing the element of friendship. She has proven herself as a trusting and loyal friend and even helped their twilight overcome obstacles standing in her way of making new friends and trusting herself and them.

[ohno 0]

Might as well throw my two cents into the ring.  I hadn't actually considered the 'Element of Forgiveness' theory, but I do really like that one!

I assume she started out as a contender for the element of magic, given that she was Twilight's predecessor, and their similar name conventions.

I had two guesses, based on traits she's had both before and after her redemption. 
The first wasn't far off from 'Acceptance.'  I was thinking Sunset might represent "Empathy," not in the sense of always being caring and understanding, but in the way that she understands how other people (and ponies think), what motivates them, what they want, etc.  Even when she had no concept of how friendship works, she still used her knowledge of the other students to manipulate them and get what she wanted.  She knew how to figure people out, and what might hurt them the most.  After she started using her insight for good, she became a supportive and observant friend.  And when they all gained new powers that seemed tailored to their personalities, if not elements, her power was the ability to literally sense what others feel and basically re-live their memories at a touch.  (It could also fall in with the way she was instantly repentant after being defeated - she got Twilight's message right away, even if she didn't know how to act on it.  But also her fast turnaround was probably just a matter of efficient storytelling, haha.)

My other guess was the element of "Confidence," but that she's still on the path to properly embodying it.  As both Celestia's student and the school bully, she was arrogant.  (I think the comics even mention Celestia lecturing Sunset on humility, in the same way she later urged Twilight to consider the importance of friends.)  After repenting, she lost her confidence in herself and her place among her friends, even when she noticed them having problems and had good suggestions that would have helped.  She still seems to struggle with faltering self-esteem from time to time, but maybe she's on the path of turning her previous pride into a force for good.  She doesn't shy away from confrontation, even when she overdoes it.
She certainly seems to have a broad range of talents, from painting, music, photography, and academics.  She has a lot to be confident about, if she can trust herself and temper it with humility.
(Also, when she "ponied up" in Legend of Everfree, it was after she encouraged Twilight to use her magic and believe in her own ability to control it.  I know her words were "our friends are in there," but since "Loyalty" is already spoken for, "Confidence" seems like a decent contender.)

Anyway, it's fun to think about.  I know it's all speculation at this point, but the argument for the geodes representing the alternate elements, and her ability to connect with the others during their big final showdowns both make it seem like she's Element potential.

EDIT:

11 minutes ago, ohno said:

 I was thinking Sunset might represent "Empathy," not in the sense of always being caring and understanding, but in the way that she understands how other people (and ponies think), what motivates them, what they want, etc.  Even when she had no concept of how friendship works, she still used her knowledge of the other students to manipulate them and get what she wanted.  She knew how to figure people out, and what might hurt them the most.  After she started using her insight for good, she became a supportive and observant friend.  And when they all gained new powers that seemed tailored to their personalities, if not elements, her power was the ability to literally sense what others feel and basically re-live their memories at a touch.  (It could also fall in with the way she was instantly repentant after being defeated - she got Twilight's message right away, even if she didn't know how to act on it.  But also her fast turnaround was probably just a matter of efficient storytelling, haha.)

Oh.  Well then.  There's also this quote from the wiki.

"According to Twitter conversations with Jim Miller, Sunset Shimmer's popularity is not why Starlight Glimmer was added to the show.^[9] When asked on Twitter in mid-December 2016 if Sunset is one of the Elements of Harmony, Ishi Rudell replied, "In our world she is the 7th element! ☀️"^[10] later specifying said element to be "empathy".^[11]"

http://mlp.wikia.com/wiki/Sunset_Shimmer#Development_and_design

Wish I'd read that before writing out this whole thing, LMAO.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edited May 6, 2018 by ohno
Forgot to check the wiki first lol