Disable Download Feature?

[Marcato 2,143]

One feature I think could be a good idea, for pony.fm is to give artists the option to enable or disable downloads of their tracks at will. Basically, it's free to listen but you can't download the audio. Soundcloud has a system just like this.

 

Reasons people might want to do this includes say, the user released a preview that wasn't meant for download, and would rather people wait for the finished product before downloading (I have done this myself,) or the song is meant to cost money but the payment feature isn't implemented yet. 

 

I know this can easily spiral into tons of branching things to work on in the programming and whatnot, but it could be a useful little feature to consider implementing.

Edited December 2, 2012 by Silver Arrow

[Vinly Note 3]

I agree with your statement. The artists should be given the option to chose if people can or can't download their songs. 

[Geohot 28]

I can record any song with hypercam so i dont think it gonna help as well i dont want to earn money for my music because i make my music easy -.-

[Apple-Jack 312]

Well i'm for ... it might work but you realize most of the good tracks won't be downloadable? 

Well if were sharing the good tracks then will have problems because there is no chance to prove the fact that we made them and there might appear remixes or stuff like that stuff that i would like to avoid ...

[Geohot 28]

I wont work because hypercamming is legal and i can record every soundtrack with it

I also make videos but thats not for this topic

[Apple-Jack 312]

I wont work because hypercamming is legal and i can record every soundtrack with it

I also make videos but thats not for this topic

uhm i wasn't talking about something which is not legal it's just they might just post our work on theyre own accounts on youtube on theyre names...Maybe im a bit stupid but that's just my opinion ...And about videos a animation is always welcomed if you ask me 

[Marcato 2,143]

@, 
The problem with Hypercamming is the lack of sound quality. It's actually quite easy for your sound quality to decrease upon hypercamming. Not to mention it's an extra bit of effort for whoever may want to download, and so it's an option only some people would use in the end. I do see your point though. It's a similar issue with youtube downloads, quality isn't always guaranteed.

 

Well if were sharing the good tracks then will have problems because there is no chance to prove the fact that we made them and there might appear remixes or stuff like that stuff that i would like to avoid ...

That's where moderation comes in aye? Although a completely separate topic in itself, moderation of some content would likely be necessary to avoid people stealing others content. Trust me, that was an issue on another community I used to use called "Flipnote" and it was horrid. 

Actually, this might be something to bring up in an entirely different thread considering the circumstances. I can see it as being a very in depth discussion that would need a lot of consideration and thought. 

[Geohot 28]

My quality is great or just use an other screen capture program that can capture video+sound

[Apple-Jack 312]

Silver arrow i really think you are right well hypercam leaks in sound quality and also leaks a bit in image quality if you ask me

Edited December 4, 2012 by Apple-Jack

[Geohot 28]

-1 for reply above it isnt true you must configurate it

And YTP's are i think must placed in OCty's hall

+1 for topic because music is pro

 

[Marcato 2,143]

@, @@Apple-Jack,

Ultimately the quality isn't so much the question, it's moreso the effort one has to go through just to hypercam the audio. Someone may not be willing to go out of their way just to get a song by downloading hypercam, recording the song, then finally turning the video file into an audio file. In the end it's up to the user.

 

Honestly though, let's not get into a debate over this. Bottom line and question; Is the extra work worth the option to toggle whether or not people can download songs?  

[Geohot 28]

+1 for you lets talk about some other things

+1 for the topic because we can get so many reply's

Of the same subject

[Twilight Sparkle ✨ 8,529]

Bottom line and question; Is the extra work worth the option to toggle whether or not people can download songs?  

 

If someone wants to "download" a song, they can and will do it. If there is audio playing through your computer's sound card, it can be recorded and all possible protection is rendered moot.

 

At its most basic level, I don't see a disabling of downloads as being a feature realistically worth adding as long as Pony.fm remains a non-commercial site. If you're not putting a price on your music, but you're putting it up online, clearly you want to share it, right? If that's the case, why limit listeners' options to take your work with them, even if it is incomplete?

[CloudFyre 848]

A feature that I'd love to see (and I was surprised that I didn't think of before) would be a small box to check/uncheck whether viewers can download copies of the song they're listening to.

For example, the two songs I currently have on my profile, That I Could Dream and Moonrise Anthem, are test versions - songs that are very close to being finished, but still need some final mastering before I think they can be called "finished". They exist so that others can provide feedback while I'm still in the mood to edit them.

That being said, I would rather not allow people to download unfinished tracks. SoundCloud has such a feature, and that also prevents derivative copies from showing up, and it also allows people to "preview" tracks but still force them to buy a copy, should it be a commercial work.

For me personally, letting people download unfinished works feels a bit weird. I'd rather keep them coming back for more until I can release a final, mastered, and fully functional copy of the song for them to download and listen to on their own Ipods/computers/etc.

Thoughts?

[Twilight Sparkle ✨ 8,529]

A feature that I'd love to see (and I was surprised that I didn't think of before) would be a small box to check/uncheck whether viewers can download copies of the song they're listening to.

 

For example, the two songs I currently have on my profile, That I Could Dream and Moonrise Anthem, are test versions - songs that are very close to being finished, but still need some final mastering before I think they can be called "finished". They exist so that others can provide feedback while I'm still in the mood to edit them.

 

That being said, I would rather not allow people to download unfinished tracks. SoundCloud has such a feature, and that also prevents derivative copies from showing up, and it also allows people to "preview" tracks but still force them to buy a copy, should it be a commercial work.

 

For me personally, letting people download unfinished works feels a bit weird. I'd rather keep them coming back for more until I can release a final, mastered, and fully functional copy of the song for them to download and listen to on their own Ipods/computers/etc.

 

Thoughts?

 

I merged your topic with the existing feature request Silver Arrow made a couple of weeks ago, CloudFyre. Some discussion has already taken place around it and I have voiced my thoughts on the last post just before yours.

[CloudFyre 848]

I merged your topic with the existing feature request Silver Arrow made a couple of weeks ago, CloudFyre. Some discussion has already taken place around it and I have voiced my thoughts on the last post just before yours.

 

I see that...but I'd still hold to my point.

 

I'm sharing it. Do I want people to hear it? Yes. Do I want them to have download access every single time? Nope. And yes, a determined soul could get around such things, but it would deter the less tech-savvy people at the very least.

 

[Anorax 29]

What about an option for pony.fm that allows you to mark a song as WiP?

 

This WiP option would block downloads only because it's an unfinished product, while also tagging the song as such. People are less likely to attempt to download if, one, downloads are, of course, disabled, and two, they can clearly see that it is not, in fact, a finished product.

 

Another possible mark or tag allowed would be to "disable" downloads and to, instead, replace it with an external purchase link? (mark as "external purchase" or something like that)

Let's say, for example, Silva Hound had a pony.fm account, and he uploaded his new song "CKDS". How, he doesn't want people downloading it for free (because it's part of a commercial album), so he can put in the Bandcamp URL of his song (or the album URL that it's a part of), and this link will replace the download links.

 

And yes, you can also rip audio from Bandcamp and Soundcloud when they have [free] downloads disabled. Will people do it? Yes. However, it's a low-level deterrant that some, if not most, people won't bother working around.

[CloudFyre 848]

What about an option for pony.fm that allows you to mark a song as WiP?

 

This WiP option would block downloads only because it's an unfinished product, while also tagging the song as such. People are less likely to attempt to download if, one, downloads are, of course, disabled, and two, they can clearly see that it is not, in fact, a finished product.

 

Another possible mark or tag allowed would be to "disable" downloads and to, instead, replace it with an external purchase link? (mark as "external purchase" or something like that)

Let's say, for example, Silva Hound had a pony.fm account, and he uploaded his new song "CKDS". How, he doesn't want people downloading it for free (because it's part of a commercial album), so he can put in the Bandcamp URL of his song (or the album URL that it's a part of), and this link will replace the download links.

 

And yes, you can also rip audio from Bandcamp and Soundcloud when they have [free] downloads disabled. Will people do it? Yes. However, it's a low-level deterrant that some, if not most, people won't bother working around.

 

I agree with all of these.

 

The only thing I'd mention is the commercial tracks - while there is a *possibility* of commercial tracks, most people legally can't pursue that course of action due to Hasbro owning the copyright powers over MLP (which is what this entire website is based upon).

 

Original works that 1) are not remixes of MLP songs and 2) have no soundbytes from the show would be fine, but even then, one would still have to make extra sure that they're not crossing any unseen boundaries.

 

But yes: a the possibility of an external purchase link might be useful to some people.

[DusK 1,264]

If that's the case, why limit listeners' options to take your work with them, even if it is incomplete?

I gotta agree with CloudFyre and Anorax on this one. If I were to upload a WIP, I definitely wouldn't want people downloading it. Really, that's basically like treating it as a final form of the track. Most people won't be bothered with attempting to work around a download link not being available.

 

Combine this with elements being discussed in other threads regarding feedback and updating music. I strongly support the idea of tracks having downloads disabled mainly for that purpose. I do agree with this point though at least regarding finished tracks:

 

If you're not putting a price on your music, but you're putting it up online, clearly you want to share it, right?

Really, any track that'd be considered a finished piece should have downloads enabled. Applying to the discussion regarding Featured Artists, any track that's made that list should have downloads enabled permanently.

Edited January 4, 2013 by DusK

[CloudFyre 848]

Yet another comment I would like to add to the discussion (although this hasn't been talked about for almost three weeks now): now that I'm part of the music team for a separate MLP fan episode (Feld0 knows what I'm talking about), I find that Pony.fm is a very good place to upload test runs of music for other dev team members to listen to.

It's easier to link than a Dropbox file, it doesn't force the user to actually "download" an actual copy of the information, and it can be referenced quite easily if someone wants to show it to someone else.

Case in point: I have a WIP piece that I'm debating on uploading (I'll probably just do it anyways), but it's a collection of 4 various orchestral pieces that I've constructed for the show specifically, and I do NOT want anyone else to have access to the sound effects. Granted, I doubt anyone would use them, but after working on them for quite a while and refining a rather fun, bass intensive intro (similar to the infamous THX violin intro), I'd really like to have some measure to help keep people from using it without permission.
 

[Carbon Maestro 1,003]

Hi,

 

Is there a Disable Download Link Feature available?

[CloudFyre 848]

At the present: no.

It's a feature that I've wanted to have implemented as well. Any artists who want to sell their music aren't going to want to upload it if there's no way to turn downloads off.

I'll take it up with Feld0 whenever he gets back online.

[Neikos 968]

It's a feature that I've wanted to have implemented as well. Any artists who want to sell their music aren't going to want to upload it if there's no way to turn downloads off.

 

 

This has never worked, since the sole fact you can stream it means you can download it. So it can be intercepted and thus any protection in place is void. ( And you have now way of telling that it got saved, unlike trough the downloads. )

 

If you are afraid of piracy then look at your service. You should make it easy for the user to purchase and get his tracks in some way or else he will get it another way. It's not rocket science and you can't stop it so there is no need to put up an illusion of safeness anyway. ( Also, as a heavy music consumer, not making me able to listen to the music on my phone until I feel like paying for it means that I won't ever pay for it. )

[CloudFyre 848]

This has never worked, since the sole fact you can stream it means you can download it. So it can be intercepted and thus any protection in place is void. ( And you have now way of telling that it got saved, unlike trough the downloads. )

 

If you are afraid of piracy then look at your service. You should make it easy for the user to purchase and get his tracks in some way or else he will get it another way. It's not rocket science and you can't stop it so there is no need to put up an illusion of safeness anyway. ( Also, as a heavy music consumer, not making me able to listen to the music on my phone until I feel like paying for it means that I won't ever pay for it. )

This is not true. While I agree that anyone with any sort of technical skill could rip the audio straight from the source, having a disabled downloads feature does show that it's illegal, and in some cases, that's enough to prevent someone from illegally downloading it.

 

Some people only download songs if they're free, others pirate, and others still will pay for songs, even if there isn't a set price (like on BandCamp). Disabling downloads is more or less an indicator to honest people that they should buy the song. I'm an audiophile, and I have a true appreciation for music. If the author thinks it was enough work that they should sell it, I will buy it. And there are hundreds upon thousands of others who have the same mindset.

 

Yes, the moment you introduce any kind of music preview, security holes open up. There's no way around it. If I'm going to sell music, I'll drop a link on the Pony.fm page to my BandCamp page, and viola - he's one click away from a purchased copy of the track.

Edited April 23, 2013 by CloudFyre

[Neikos 968]

Disabling downloads is more or less an indicator to honest people that they should buy the song. I'm an audiophile, and I have a true appreciation for music. If the author thinks it was enough work that they should sell it, I will buy it. And there are hundreds upon thousands of others who have the same mindset.

The only honest way to tell people that they can buy your song is by asking/telling them that they can buy it. 

Then, being an audiophile means you care about High Fidelity and not the music, so I have a hard time to understand how this has anything to do with Music Downloads. ( Other than being a Red Herring. ) And I am not so convinced that there "hundreds upon thousands of others"(sic) that believe the same thing. ( Well that might explain why the lobbies exist. Actually it doesn't, only the money behind it does. )

 

By disabling downloads and forcing users to pay for their music you alienate a rather big possible fanbase. ( Which is all those who cannot pay or are unable to pay due to their age. )