What would Lauren change?

[Hive King 2,001]

Well, she didn't want Cadence to be an Alicorn....I think that would make Canterlot Wedding better actually, because Cadence is the anomaly among royalty. And no I do not consider the children's chapter books as canon because seriously, have you read those? They are as girly and prissy as it gets without much coherence.

Better canon than the comics where the CMC are wise cracking after being kidnapped by a psychotic and murderous insect

[Yellow Diamond 7,578]

When Lauren was around, the jokes were better and characters had little quirks. Twilight Sparkle was better in Season 1 and 2 since she had more faults.

 

Spike was sexist in Season 1. Now he's a bumbling joke.

 

A sexist? I don't recall a single instance in which Spike was ever a sexist. His portrayal -- starting from when Lauren was showrunner and all the way through to the present -- is intended to evoke the character of the youngest sibling, the little brother with a bunch of older sisters (and a crush). Lauren's vision definitely would preclude a sexist character.

 

I do think Spike has been mishandled since Season 2, but that is a discussion for another thread.

[Singe 2,111]

A sexist? I don't recall a single instance in which Spike was ever a sexist. His portrayal -- starting from when Lauren was showrunner and all the way through to the present -- is intended to evoke the character of the youngest sibling, the little brother with a bunch of older sisters (and a crush). Lauren's vision definitely would preclude a sexist character.

 

I do think Spike has been mishandled since Season 2, but that is a discussion for another thread.

 

Season 1 Spike had this idea of staying away from things he viewed as too girly the Mane 6 would do. It wasn't major, but his character was more outspoken than further seasons.

Edited September 18, 2014 by Singe

[mars 4,863]

I'd be devastated if Twilight lost her wings. I love alicorn!Twilight. I always knew, ever since season 1, that she would become an alicorn.

 

I'd also be bummed if Cadance and Shining Armor were out of the picture. Cadance is my favorite of the three princesses.

 

And.. I hate to say it.. But many of her episodes were weak. I actually disliked most of season 1. The ticket master is my least favorite episode. The Nightmare Moon arc was bland in comparison to the villian arcs we have now.

 

 

So back on topic, I hope that Lauren wouldn't come back to show and change things... Even though that hurts me to write.

[Darker 1,352]

Meghan has done in my opinion a better job in the show. The two very first episodes are still my favourites after Twilight's Kingdom, but that's pretty much it. Anything she done or said about the show was that it was only ment for little kids. Meghan has changed that, and the show is becoming more and more mature, which is good for the nowadays kids and entertaining for the bronies.

[Andaasonsan 3,205]

Well, she didn't want Cadence to be an Alicorn....I think that would make Canterlot Wedding better actually, because Cadence is the anomaly among royalty. And no I do not consider the children's chapter books as canon because seriously, have you read those? They are as girly and prissy as it gets without much coherence.

*gasp* you did not just say that.

 

Perdita Finn's Rainbow Rocks book is sort of garbage, but all the rest of the one's by GM Berrow are awesome.

 

And while "girly" isn't necessarily a bad thing

 

in Twilight Sparkle and the Crystal Heart Spell, Twilight turns evil

in Rainbow Dash and the Daring Doo Double Dare, Rainbow fights a zebra supervillain

In Pinkie Pie and the Rockin' Ponypalooza Party we get to see Pinkie's attempts at being a "serious" pony

 

Rarity and the Curious Case of Charity, and Applejack and the Honest to Goodness Switcheroo are much more slice of life, but not more girly than you'd expect from a mid season episode.

[Jeric 46,880]

I would like to point out, as a certain person reminded me on skype yesterday, that Lauren's favorite episode was not even written by her. In a lot of ways, putting her at top all the time is almost like marginalizing the rest of the creative team.

 

If she didn't leave we wouldn't have the knowledge we have now of Twilight's family, no Tirek (she wasn't a fan of the original show preferring the toys), no scootalove (she didn't think RD would make a good big sister figure), and most of my favorite themes and episodes after season 2 would have been removed or altered. I am a fan of hers and think that Fosters was some of the best animation out there, but she is not infallible. Also, I came to eventually appreciate EQG and am looking forward to Rainbow Rocks. That would not have been a Lauren approved project.

[Andaasonsan 3,205]

Plus the books add some great canon stuff like:

 

the story of why Cadance is an Alicorn and a princess

a confirmation that Earth Ponies' special power is great strength

mention of the existence of sea-ponies!

[Jeric 46,880]

And don't forget the line about the Alicorn tribe.

[Andaasonsan 3,205]

And don't forget the line about the Alicorn tribe.

I really need to get The Journal of the Two Sisters 

[RainbowMau 292]

As for Cadence/Shining Armour, there's absolutely nothing wrong with having a relationship in a show, if anything it makes these two standout a bit because they have that, plus they're older than Twilight and her friends so it's only natural that they should be pursuing a relationship. That's part of the natural evolution of things. Won't I don't like is when relationships are put in a show for the sake of it. Example, recently I've watched through 5 seasons of Parks & Rec and the show has got to the point that most American Sitcoms do in that everyone needs to be paired with someone...no they don't! Relationships should happen if they come naturally to the characters and story, developing it further in a meaningful way, not for the sake of "all characters must have happy ending = get them in a relationship".

 

I don't think it would be a bad thing for one of the mane 6 to have a relationship, but certainly not all of them. I've said before but I think Fluttershy might benefit from a relationship. She's been really underwritten and underdeveloped, but I think it would be interesting to see her in a relationship, giving her someone to put all that love towards, seeing them appreciate her back, having to deal with when they have an argument and think it would be funny that they'd perhaps be such a sickly sweet couple that it would annoy the rest of the mane 6. Then if she got dumped it would teach her that not everything will always work out perfect and she needs to be more independent and outgoing at times.

 

Apparently that's something that Lauren tried to avoid, I don't know why, I guess if Shining and Cadance appeared during her development she would probably have avoided the wedding topic, but the love and relatioship topic reached levels that Lauren's development would have never reached, they would probably stay as a couple but not with that love manifestation that Lauren tried to avoid. Now that they're passionately married there's no turning back and if Lauren was back her only optio would be letting them living in peace in Crystal Empire and forget them or at least just show an eventual son of them.

 

Of course let's not forget that Rarity had a love interest to meet in the Great Galloping Gala which was still under Lauren's command, however it ended on a joke, would that happen if Lauren wasn't in charge by then? At least a big no to Twilight x Flash Sentry would have been obvious.

Edited September 18, 2014 by RainbowMau

[deadprofile 1,123]

*gasp* you did not just say that.

 

Perdita Finn's Rainbow Rocks book is sort of garbage, but all the rest of the one's by GM Berrow are awesome.

 

And while "girly" isn't necessarily a bad thing

 

in Twilight Sparkle and the Crystal Heart Spell, Twilight turns evil

in Rainbow Dash and the Daring Doo Double Dare, Rainbow fights a zebra supervillain

In Pinkie Pie and the Rockin' Ponypalooza Party we get to see Pinkie's attempts at being a "serious" pony

 

Rarity and the Curious Case of Charity, and Applejack and the Honest to Goodness Switcheroo are much more slice of life, but not more girly than you'd expect from a mid season episode.

 

I own and read all the ones released so far. I cannot call Twilight Evil, just overtly selfish...And the type of girly at least in the Crystal Heart book is a bad kind of girly because that book is not boy friendly, whereas the others are (even with the pastel colors). Even as an adult woman, I felt it was needlessly "cutsie" in ways that the show does not present, but is actually more in line with G3....

As far as the other books go, they are actually good. I like all the others thus far (Pinkie's is my favorite so far), but the Crystal Heart one was the worst. Cadences story does not add up, either. Mind you, I really like Shining Armor and Cadence (I relate it to my own relationship with my husband), and really don't see them as boring characters like many seem to, but the backstory involving her becoming an alicorn I'm calling out as BS....and Lauren did say she only intended Luna and Celestia to be the only Alicorns....

[Singe 2,111]

Rainbow Dash has came off as someone who loves to be free. However, friendship seems to be at times more of a leash on her.

[Andaasonsan 3,205]

I own and read all the ones released so far. I cannot call Twilight Evil, just overtly selfish...And the type of girly at least in the Crystal Heart book is a bad kind of girly because that book is not boy friendly, whereas the others are (even with the pastel colors). Even as an adult woman, I felt it was needlessly "cutsie" in ways that the show does not present, but is actually more in line with G3....

As far as the other books go, they are actually good. I like all the others thus far (Pinkie's is my favorite so far), but the Crystal Heart one was the worst. Cadences story does not add up, either. Mind you, I really like Shining Armor and Cadence (I relate it to my own relationship with my husband), and really don't see them as boring characters like many seem to, but the backstory involving her becoming an alicorn I'm calling out as BS....and Lauren did say she only intended Luna and Celestia to be the only Alicorns....

Yeah Crystal Heart Spell was definitely the weakest of the series.

 

I guess I'm just happy to have some sort of explanation for where this other alicorn came from, rather than no explanation. Because otherwise she's just kind of confusing.

 

Plus I like the idea of alicorn status being something earned.

Edited September 18, 2014 by Andaasonsan

[Nom de Plume 29]

Season 1 Spike had this idea of staying away from things he viewed as too girly the Mane 6 would do. It wasn't major, but his character was more outspoken than further seasons.

I wouldn't call that 'sexist,' I'd call that 'being a little boy.'  It's more to do with his self-image than any disrespect or belittlement towards the girls.  Spike has nothing but respect for Twilight and her friends, and, presumably, mares as a whole.  He grew out of that 'Eww, it's pink' phase as he got older.  Are you saying Faust would have it so that Spike wouldn't be maturing and growing up over the course of the show?

 

Plus the books add some great canon stuff like:

 

the story of why Cadance is an Alicorn and a princess

a confirmation that Earth Ponies' special power is great strength

mention of the existence of sea-ponies!

I've never read the books, but I always kinda figured they were only meant to be semi-canon, like the comics.  I mean, they're kinda hard to get hold of, and shelling out tons of money for a potentially infinite source of 'canon' is kinda unreasonable.  Plus, there's a lot in them that restricts or contradicts fanon that's been in place almost since the beginning, and I doubt most bronies have read them.  Asking us to put away our histories that we spent months writing, or slap an AU tag on them, for the sake of a single book is... Painful.  Those books have forced me to use an AU tag on my entire writing universe, just because my Earthies have more to them than strength, and that I can't really work this 'Alicorn Tribe' that everyone's making a fuss over in without a shoehorn and a sledgehammer.

 

... I'm veering off-topic.  Sorry, it's just a bit of a sore point with me.  There's a lot about them that has the the potential to be good, too, but that's for another thread.

 

Anyway, I think we'd see more episodes focused on specific characters as individuals.  Character development was really important to Faust, and we'd see things balance out more, maybe with secondary characters like Spike and the CMCs getting more screentime as individuals.  A Granny Smith episode would be cool, I think, if handled correctly.

[Andaasonsan 3,205]

I've never read the books, but I always kinda figured they were only meant to be semi-canon, like the comics.  I mean, they're kinda hard to get hold of, and shelling out tons of money for a potentially infinite source of 'canon' is kinda unreasonable.  Plus, there's a lot in them that restricts or contradicts fanon that's been in place almost since the beginning, and I doubt most bronies have read them.  Asking us to put away our histories that we spent months writing, or slap an AU tag on them, for the sake of a single book is... Painful.  Those books have forced me to use an AU tag on my entire writing universe, just because my Earthies have more to them than strength, and that I can't really work this 'Alicorn Tribe' that everyone's making a fuss over in without a shoehorn and a sledgehammer.

 

Frankly, the fanon stuff was AU to begin with. I don't get why people get so attached to their headcanon like this. By it's very nature it's totally unofficial stuff that the writers are under no obligation to read, care about, or follow.

 

FiM is still an ongoing series, so even if it wasn't the books, the TV Show was going to inevitably knock your sand castle over.

[Singe 2,111]

I wouldn't call that 'sexist,' I'd call that 'being a little boy.'  It's more to do with his self-image than any disrespect or belittlement towards the girls.  Spike has nothing but respect for Twilight and her friends, and, presumably, mares as a whole.  He grew out of that 'Eww, it's pink' phase as he got older.  Are you saying Faust would have it so that Spike wouldn't be maturing and growing up over the course of the show?

 

Spike's self image is trying to be a dragon. The show was equating being a dragon to manliness on Spike in Season 2. I was just saying, Season One is the only time Spike had something original over his constant pony pleasing self or trying to be a dragon. Spike can respect Twilight and his friends, but most importantly he can still have a personal opinion and limits to how far he'll go.

 

The Mane 6 were all rougher around the edges during the first season. I just feel that the friendship aspect has smoothed out too fast.

 

As for Spike, it should have been a transition episode rather than instantly change over night. This is just my personal opinion.

Edited September 18, 2014 by Singe

[Nom de Plume 29]

 

Frankly, the fanon stuff was AU to begin with. I don't get why people get so attached to their headcanon like this. By it's very nature it's totally unofficial stuff that the writers are under no obligation to read, care about, or follow.

 

FiM is still an ongoing series, so even if it wasn't the books, the TV Show was going to inevitably knock your sand castle over.

Yeah, but... If the show was going to go into how Celestia and Luna got their thrones, and what had happened before Discord's reign (as I've heard that Journal does) it was going to do it long after I was done writing it.  Mostly I'm just kinda vexed about the timing; I know it's childish and silly, but...  I've actually spent many zoned-out hours building things and working to keep them straight in my head.  And when the tide knocks down a sandcastle that you've spent that long, that much effort in creating, doesn't one have the right to be sad, whether it was inevitable or not?

 

 

Spike's self image is trying to be a dragon, not a man. I was just saying, Season One is the only time Spike had something original over his constant pony pleasing self. Spike can respect Twilight and his friends, but most importantly he can still have a personal opinion and limits to how far he'll go.

 

The Mane 6 were all rougher around the edges during the first season. I just feel that the friendship aspect has smoothed out too fast.

A male adult dragon is still a male adult, and thus a man.  Species isn't an issue when humans don't exist and there are multiple dominant species on the planet.

 

However, I agree with you that they've all lost a little asymmetry and uniqueness as the show went on.  There's been a lot that's been sacrificed for the sake of character development.  And while I believe character development is extremely important in things like this, you can't remove what makes them them.  AJ's lost a lot of her stubbornness, and Dash is more prone to panic attacks more befitting Twilight than she used to be.  Fluttershy and Rarity are almost the same as they began, four seasons later, and Pinkie's the only one to move along a different track.  A track that leads sideways into madness, but a track nonetheless.

[deadprofile 1,123]

 

I've never read the books, but I always kinda figured they were only meant to be semi-canon, like the comics.  I mean, they're kinda hard to get hold of, and shelling out tons of money for a potentially infinite source of 'canon' is kinda unreasonable.  Plus, there's a lot in them that restricts or contradicts fanon that's been in place almost since the beginning, and I doubt most bronies have read them.  Asking us to put away our histories that we spent months writing, or slap an AU tag on them, for the sake of a single book is... Painful.  Those books have forced me to use an AU tag on my entire writing universe, just because my Earthies have more to them than strength, and that I can't really work this 'Alicorn Tribe' that everyone's making a fuss over in without a shoehorn and a sledgehammer.

 

Sadly fanon's don't matter too much to the main creators (in the grand scheme of the entertainment industry, although luckily DHX has mostly accepted Bronies and their ideas with open arms). Books are one of the areas where it could slap fan writers in face...really hard. As far as these specific books go, they are not in same category as the comics. They have not been called out as canon by the creators in the same ways the comics have been (the comics are canon unless otherwise specified in the show, which is B-canon). I am not sure if there is a C-canon, but that's where I put these books...They are canon as far as overall connection to the world and characters of the show, but otherwise have nothing much in common....basically in the same place as the toys...

The two biggest things the fandom has cried fowl/fair over, is Cadences ascension and Pinkie's siblings....neither of which have been confirmed in the show, or comics, or really anywhere else. Yes Cadence is an alicorn in the show...but that's it. Maud was mentioned but not named, and neither sisters were ever named in show yet. If they confirm/deny any element of these books in the show, then that specific instance is confirmed/denied, but not the series as a whole, or until the creators confirm the books to be as canon in any way as the comics.

[RainbowMau 292]

However, I agree with you that they've all lost a little asymmetry and uniqueness as the show went on.  There's been a lot that's been sacrificed for the sake of character development.  And while I believe character development is extremely important in things like this, you can't remove what makes them them.  AJ's lost a lot of her stubbornness, and Dash is more prone to panic attacks more befitting Twilight than she used to be.  Fluttershy and Rarity are almost the same as they began, four seasons later, and Pinkie's the only one to move along a different track.  A track that leads sideways into madness, but a track nonetheless.

 

 

I'd also add that Twilight has lost a lot of her naivety, which actually made the show more interesting.

Edited September 19, 2014 by RainbowMau

[hip-indeed 304]

If you're talking what she WOULD HAVE done differently had she stayed and been able to keep major control of the show, well, we know Cadence, Shining and Chrysalis likely wouldn't have existed, neither potentially would Sombra or the Crystal Empire have, and who knows how many characters that have been introduced since S1.  Some 'good' stuff and some 'bad' depending on your tastes.  I think the show'd have been excellent regardless, though I'd have felt strange pangs of not ever having gotten to meet Chryssy or probably Maud Pie among others.

 

If she actually got reinstated as exec. producer now though (funny enough to bring up such an idea when the show's possibly going to have to move to another channel with this whole Hub breaking up business... who KNOWS what'll happen!) I am very positive she'd not remove shining or cadence, nor would she 'un-princess-ify' Twi, she'd simply roll with it.  But EqG stuff would definitely be completely ignored from here on out.  The show would become slightly less over-the-top as it has been the last couple seasons, and there'd be more of a focus on adventure and sliiiightly more mature tones (like what she was originally gonna do with Luna et. al., though the current team has more or less instated those tones themselves with newer Luna eps, the Tirek eps and many other things... Lauren would just do it in a more... subdued way I think?)