TheGr3ml1n

Hmm... perhaps maybe they were born with abilities much more incredible than ponies of their type, and when they were realized they reached their full potential? I do believe that Twilight may end up being in the category of power such as Celestia and Luna, because of Lauren Faust's original intention to have Twilight be Celestia's heir. However, I do not believe that Cadence is in that category (I believe there's a distinguishable difference between simply normal Alicorns and "super" Alicorns, assuming of course that Cadence wasn't just thrown in for toys, and doesn't cause a major fault in continuity) Ah well, hopefully the long awaited and promised Celestia and Luna backstory episode will finally air this upcoming season, and we can have answers to all these questions.

Alright, so this is my first major post. I don't think this has been brought up as a topic before (I searched for it and found no results), so I figured this was as good as any a reason to create my first forum discussion. Plus, it's pretty long, so I thought it probably deserved it's own topic (as opposed to a wall-of-text reply). ________________________________________________________________ A while back, one of my brony friends and I came up with this theory (which I realized later some other people had thought of as well). We were contemplating Celestia's backstory, trying to figure out if the writers had snuck anything into the show relating to her, or coming up with our own ideas about where she came from. After we started discussing Hearth's Warming Eve (the only episode that seems to provide real backstory on the founding of Equestria), we started questioning why Celestia wasn't even mentioned in the episode. You'd think that an episode about the founding of Equestria would have a reference to Celestia, since she is the ruler of the land? Not only that, but we know she's been alive for hundreds if not thousands of years, so shouldn't she have been alive even in those times? Then my friend came up with a theory. What if Celestia is, in fact, Clover the Clever? Now, before you dismiss the idea, think of the awesome mythological similarities this would have, more specifically related to the legends of Camelot. We already know that there are some similarities between MLP and the Arthurian legends, specifically the inclusion of the city of Canterlot (a pun off of "Camelot"), and that Star Swirl the Bearded is in fact Equestria's Merlin (confirmed at the writers panel). Now, I am by no means an expert in the stories of King Arthur and Merlin, but what little I do know is that Merlin was King Arthur's personal advisor and mentor. And since the Canterlot Castle is ruled by Celestia, and also since we already know she's presumably a thousand years old, it seems very possible that Clover the Clever is in fact Celestia before her ascension to Alicornhood. On top of that, there seems to be a certain significance to having Twilight play Clover in the story. I, like i'm sure many others have, once watched the Disney interpretation of King Arthur, called The Sword in the Stone. In this movie, Arthur is portrayed as a servant (similar to how Clover is portrayed to the ruler of the time, Princess Platinum), and Merlin as his mentor. Merlin trains and teaches him for a while before he proves himself by removing the legendary Excalibur from the stone, and is crowned king. How is this similar to Clover the Clever? Well, Clover was a servant to the Princess before Equestria's founding. When she, along with the three other members of the pony races met up with eachother, she was successful in banishing the Windigoes using the magic of friendship. Not only that, but she also displayed a powerful ability in magic, very similar to Twilight's. The significance of having Twilight play Clover's part, is because we know that Twilight ascended to become an Alicorn. We also know that Clover was a very powerful wielder of magic, similar to Twilight, and that she was monumental to the founding of Equestria. Who would be better to be crowned the ruler of the new-found Equestria, than Clover the Clever? And if for some strange reason Clover the Clever was not in fact Celestia, then how come this is the first we've ever heard of her, and she's never mentioned in the show again? One last thing to note, based on the way Celestia and Luna have spoken about Star Swirl, it almost seems like they knew him personally. But we know that he was in fact mentioned in Hearth's Warming Eve and they weren't. So the question is this, is there some giant lapse of continuity, or is it in fact true that Clover the Clever is actually Celestia? (and one more quick thing, it is worth noting that the sun and moon are specifically mentioned to be controlled by a group of unicorns, and NOT Celestia and Luna in this time. So that would mean that they hadn't always controlled the rotation of the sun and moon) What are your thoughts? Does it seem likely they would go this far in the mythology of the show? Will Season 4 delve into this at all? Are my friend and I simply conspiracy nuts? Please, discuss.

I have a theory, like many others have said, that Star Swirl could play a role in Season 4, possibly as an antagonist. The writers have mentioned that the S4 premiere will have something very "surprising" if it isn't leaked first, and considering the amount of times the show has alluded to Star Swirl, I think it's quite possible that it could be his return, somehow as a direct result of Twilight finishing his unfinished spell. It would also add nicely to the apparent "3-parter" Meghan mentioned earlier, since Star Swirl had a lot to do with the central plot of the finale. Add to that the apparent "leak" that there were a few lines specifically from Star Swirl, and I think he might have a significant role in the next season of Pony. (the guy who leaked it thought that John De Lancie was reading these lines, but it seems unlikely there was much context to prove that Discord and Star Swirl are one and the same. Assuming of course, that the leak is at all legit.) Imagine the story possibilities if, Twilight now an Alicorn, had to go up against her most powerful opponent yet, the one pony she used to look up to all her life, Star Swirl himself? Something small to add, relating to idea that Star Swirl is dead due to how long ago he was around, there were a few things established this (and last) season that makes me suspect he might still be alive. For one, we know from "It's About Time" that Star Swirl was likely a master of spells that have to do with time. (since, you know, in the very center of the Star Swirl the Bearded wing there's a giant hourglass). Another thing that was established this season, is the existence of age spells. (which was established at the same time as the Alicorn Amulet was revealed, something that could connect directly to Star Swirl if he was, in fact, trying to become an Alicorn). All of this seems to be a good set-up for the return of Star Swirl, something I think would be an awesome story-arc to once again give the show direction after Twilight's ascension to Alicornhood, as well as give her status and development purpose in the show. Not to mention, we may get some side goodies such as more info on Celestia and Luna's past (which has been hinted at multiple times), and could clear a lot of people's head-cannons. As for the idea of Star Swirl being a regeneration of the Doctor, (something that would be doubly epic, considering that in an episode of Doctor Who, it is mentioned that the Doctor once was in Camelot and the legends of Merlin are actually based off of him), it would be a pretty risky move on DHX and Hasbro's part (copyright), but it could also nicely explain why there are so many repetitions of the Hourglass mark on different ponies (either regenerations of the Doctor, or actually Time Lords (gallopfrey?)).

There was a question asked that made me consider this theory in the first place. The question was this: Luna was banished to the moon for a thousand years. She's had that much time to plan her revenge. But when she gets back, she's defeated in twenty minutes? This can be explained two ways: One, it wasn't really considered in writing and just brushed off, or two, it's part of the overall story-arc. Now don't get me wrong, i'm still not entirely convinced about this. I'm actually less convinced Luna is a changeling, and more convinced she just had a part in what happened. There seems to be an awful lot of coincidences between the MLP storyline and a famous Tolkien novel, which is part of the reason this theory seems to have any merit. I also like to think that the main storyline of the entire show isn't already over. It gives me hope for how they'll handle Twilicorn.

That may be so, but if Alicorn Twilight hadn't been revealed ahead of time it would've been a pretty big twist, don't you think? As for the idea that it being a kids show being the reason it can't be pulled off, if Lauren Faust, who's entire purpose was to challenge what people saw as a "little girls" show, planned it from the beginning, who's to say it couldn't happen? Of course, I know it's probably not true, but if I was a writer, i'd think it would be the perfect way to end the show with a bang

I want to apologize for the wall of text ahead of time. When I was looking around the MLP forums and I saw this topic, I immediately dismissed it as a crazy fan theory. But then, I came across that video a while back, and I thought to myself, "maybe there's something to this, though I doubt it." Then something hit me. In almost every scene I've seen Luna in, there's always something odd/off about it. Now, I don't necessarily agree that Luna is the same pony as Chrysalis, because there are a few things about that that don't make sense. It's a stretch for them to be the same, but at the same time I wouldn't say it's impossible. Even though the comics have an entire arc dedicated to Chrysalis, keep in mind that the comics were never alerted to Twilicorn, which took them by surprise. So we already know that DHX isn't willing to give out major plot details to anyone before it happens in the show. My suspicions of Luna actually go way back to the Discord two parter. In these episodes, Luna is never actually seen in the episode, but she is mentioned. When Celestia is telling the Mane Six about Discord and what he did all those years ago, she mentions that both her and her sister defeated him with the Elements. After that though, she's never mentioned again until the Nightmare Night episode. I actually think that Luna might've been the one to free Discord. The episode leads you to believe that it was the CMC that freed Discord by accident, but that doesn't seem to make much sense. If that were true, then why wasn't Discord freed, I don't know, 500 years ago? In all that time, not a single occurrence of Disharmony happened close enough to him to free him? Sure, I guess you could chalk it up to not the best writing, but what's the fun in that? The next time we see Luna is in Nightmare Night. There's not much evidence in this episode to suggest that Luna is anything but good, However, it is proven that Luna can still shapeshift in this ep, which sort of lends credence to the "Luna is Chrysalis" theory. She also seems to form a friendship with Twilight, one that shows itself later in the show. Skipping ahead to A Canterlot Wedding, when Luna is at the guard tower and spots Twilight running by, she says "Stay indoors, Twilight Sparkle". The way she said it sounded odd to me, almost like she knew something would happen soon. On top of that, if she was so worried something would happen, why didn't she do something about it when it actually happened? IMO, I believe that Luna was saying this specifically to Twilight, because Twilight treated her like a friend in Nightmare Night. Almost like Luna wanted to make sure that Twilight was safe during the takeover of Canterlot. When the cast were asked why Luna wasn't a more prominent character in the episode, the cast said that Luna was simply thrown in at the last minute "for the fans". Here's the thing though. If Luna was a major part of the overall FiM arc, they wouldn't want to raise any suspicions to that arc. Just like when Meghan Mccarthy was asked whether or not Sunset Shimmer would be a part of FiM, and she replied no, but it was later shown that she's a major part of Equestria Girls. Or when Tara Strong specifically denied that Twilight would become an Alicorn. The next "hint" that Luna could still be evil happened in the first episode of Season 3. After Celestia talks to Twilight, and they leave the castle, Luna is waiting outside, and she gives Twilight a certain look. To me, the look was less of a "stern" look, and more of a jealous one. Still that's based on perception. I've heard many people say, that maybe Luna just didn't think Twilight could complete the mission, and that's why she gave her the look she did. But at the same time, Luna knows Twilight. Why would she act like that towards her, when Twilight was so kind to her during Nightmare Night? To top it off, it's never explained, and most people just brush it off as nothing. That's pretty much the last time we see Luna except for Sleepless in Ponyville, and a cameo in the Coronation event. The thing that makes me think the theory that Luna may still be evil has any merit, is because of the whole Twilight Alicorn arc. Ever since the first episode, the Elements of Harmony hinted at the fact that Twilight might become an Alicorn, since her element was always the crown, and her friends were always the necklaces. Even in the case that Lauren Faust didn't intend for her to become an Alicorn, she did intend for her to eventually become Celestia's successor. The thing is, not very many people saw the Alicorn thing coming (excluding the leaks), because the staff put a super tight lid on the whole thing. At the same time though, there were hints throughout the show, whether it being Twilight facing up against the Alicorn Amulet and winning, or Celestia's constant pushing to have Twilight and her friends solve problems without her interference. They did a fairly good job of being subtle about the whole thing, but they did build up to it. Probably not as much as people wanted, but they did. Now, from what I can tell, Luna being the one planning things behind Celestia's back seems to be hinted at in the show, but with much much ?more subtlety. One of the major things that bothered me about the whole Alicornification was, where do they go from here? If it's true that they've been setting the Alicorn thing up from the very start, wouldn't that mean that the main major story arc of the show is now over? Wouldn't that make the show hard to write for now, since there's no actual "goal" they're heading towards anymore? Yet, the cast have mentioned several times, that they had absolutely no trouble writing for Season 4. Not only that, but that it would be the "most epic season of Pony yet." Not to mention that, if this whole arc thing is true, it could be the perfect finale for FiM. Think about it, Twilight's final test, is to fight against the conflict that started the entire series in the first place. Since she has a connection to Luna, she could appeal to her good side, and she could be the only one to stop Equestria from being destroyed. It's like the whole show comes full circle. Of course, I still have my doubts, and it might be true that all of these things were just due to faulty writing and nothing more. But the thing is, there's nothing to directly disprove it. The fact that it's a kids show doesn't really matter, because Lauren Faust had already created a story bible that had tons of world building, character arcs, and even story arcs up until the very end of the show. I see this as being a big opportunity to give the show an epic conclusion. And although I'd prefer not to think that season 4 is the last season of FiM, if it goes out like this, I think it would be the perfect way to go. TL;DR: The theory that Luna may still have some "alterior motives" has not been disproven by anything in the past three seasons of the show, and in fact there's some evidence to show it might be the major arc of the entire series. Also, if Twilight being an Alicorn was planned from the beginning, who's to say this wasn't planned as the finale of the whole show?

From what I heard, Discord is most likely going to be the one who will sing in S4. I believe the question was asked at Unicon with John De Lancie present. His response was "Just remember that you asked"