Just how underpowered is Trixie compared to Twilight or even other unicorns?

[Hive King 2,001]

How powerful is Trixie in relation to Twilight? We can assume one of two things from the fact that Trixie bought the Alicorn Amulet

a. Trixie can't train her power any further and needed a cheat

b. Trixie is too lazy to train

Since both of these are opinion based, we'll compare Trixie's shown power to Twilight's. 

 

Trixie's best feat: Barely singing an Ursa Minor

Twilight's best feat: Carrying an Ursa Minor for about a mile with her magic and only being slightly winded afterwards

Trixie with Alicorn Amulet's best feat: Age spell

Twilight during a magical burst: Causing Spike to grow to an adult.

 

Under normal circumstances, Trixie has shown herself to be vastly weaker than Twilight but the Alicorn Amulet was enough to bring Trixie from pathetic, to moderately above Twilight. If we use Twilight as a baseline then in terms of power:

 

Twilight: 100

Trixie: 20

Trixie with Alicorn Amulet: 115(Trixie was beating Twilight, but Twilight could still somewhat hold her own)

Twilight during a burst: 130(Growing a dragon is more impressive than aging Snips and Snails)

Rarity: 15

Sunset Shimmer: 95

 

By my numbers, Trixie is about a 5th as powerful as Twilight, which seems reasonable enough and about 15% stronger when wearing the Alicorn Amulet. 

 

One last thing, assuming the Alicorn Amulet gives the same boost to every pony and is a multiplier then:

 

AA Rarity=86.25=weaker than Sunset Shimmer

AA Sunset Shimmer=546.25=Utterly god-stomping Twilight with a magic fart

AA Twilight=575=Rivals Alicorn Amulet powered Sunset Shimmer

AA Twilight during a burst=747.5=Tanking Sunset Shimmer's magic bolts and toying with her if they fight

[duidamasterXD 9,627]

Not sure about the values of your numbers, or whether they're accurate ways to compare the ponies that we've seen in the show. I'd say that Twilight has the raw power to accomplish things that even five Trixies could not. Twilight is really in an entirely different league from any unicorn we've met so far, with the possible exceptions of Shining Armor and Sunset Shimmer (though it's true that we didn't really get much of a measure of her magical power, considering that we got to see her as a unicorn for a minute or so at most). Trixie seems to be slightly above average.

[Scootalove 10,692]

Trixie was only stronger than Twilight because, of the amulet. Comparing Trixie to Twilight in the mystical art of magic, is like comparing someone who shows off as entertainment and someone who knows a lot about magic while they practice everyday to become stronger. While, Shining Armor and Sunset Shimmer are pretty different compared to Twilight and Trixie has the average amount of magic without the amulet.

[Hive King 2,001]

Not sure about the values of your numbers, or whether they're accurate ways to compare the ponies that we've seen in the show. I'd say that Twilight has the raw power to accomplish things that even five Trixies could not. Twilight is really in an entirely different league from any unicorn we've met so far, with the possible exceptions of Shining Armor and Sunset Shimmer (though it's true that we didn't really get much of a measure of her magical power, considering that we got to see her as a unicorn for a minute or so at most). Trixie seems to be slightly above average.

Well, I'm going off of comic book and anime logic and in that sort of thing, 5x stronger does not neccesarily mean that 6 will overwhelm you. If Trixie and 5 clones all got into a giant beam struggle with Twilight, they might win so as long as Twilight doesn't burst, but if 6 Trixies were attacking in a team, they would lose since each would get one-shotted. 

 

I put Sunset fairly high because if you look at her prequel comic, she made a tree grow to the size of Canterlot Castle with little effort. 

Edited November 1, 2013 by Evil Dragon Master

[Malinter 3,065]

Thats not quite fair on Trixie (I can't believe I said that.)

 

Spike says it himself a unicorns talents usually run along a certain line and its about 5 spells give or take the common ones like teleknesis.

 

Twilight (being element of magic) has no limit to the spells she can cast or master, she can even cast multiple spell in sucession and possibly at the same time. Transmogrifying, Levitation, Gravity, Time Magic, Heck, she'll be firing Celestia's Solar Beam next.

 

Trixies magic is illusions. It has no use in extreme combat. 

Edited November 1, 2013 by Malinter

[Hive King 2,001]

Trixie was only stronger than Twilight because, of the amulet. Comparing Trixie to Twilight in the mystical art of magic, is like comparing someone who shows off as entertainment and someone who knows a lot about magic while they practice everyday to become stronger. While, Shining Armor and Sunset Shimmer are pretty different compared to Twilight and Trixie has the average amount of magic without the amulet.

Shining Armor is a weird case since I remember him saying something about Twilight being stronger but Twilight says only Shining can conjure up a shield. If I had to give a guess

Shining Armor: 75

Shining Armor's Shield and Defense Magic: 120 (Seemed similar to Trixie's shield)

[FNGRpony 658]

Trixie is a conjurer of cheap tricks.  An illusionist.  She's good at what she does.  She's specialized at it.

 

Twilight is an Arch mage.  Ahem, she's thee arch mage.

 

Ones a carney and ones a scholar.  (I like trixie more lol. she is the gruncle stann of the show after all).

[Hive King 2,001]

Thats not quite fair on Trixie (I can't believe I said that.)

 

Spike says it himself a unicorns talents usually run along a certain line and its about 5 spells give or take the common ones like teleknesis.

 

Twilight (being element of magic) has no limit to the spells she can cast or master, she can even cast multiple spell in sucession and possibly at the same time. Transmogrifying, Levitation, Gravity, Time Magic, Heck, she'll be firing Celestia's Solar Beam next.

 

Trixies magic is illusions. It has no use in extreme combat. 

Twilight already used the solar beams in the caves to blast down the walls. I get your point but if this is the case, how did Trixie know how to cast all those spells with the Alicorn Amulet? Either the Amulet also gives her knowledge or Trixie's talent is(much as I hate to say it) the same as Twilight's. As for raw power, I just mean who can lift the heaviest object

Edited November 1, 2013 by Evil Dragon Master

[Orablanco Account 3,708]

Every unicorn's magic is its unique thing. Rarity is adept at telekinesis and finding gems because that feeds into her life's work, Shining Armor is the captain of the guard, so it stands to reason that he's probably casts more powerful force fields than everyone else, and Trixie, of course, is an entertainer, so she's good at all those do-dads.

 

Twilight and Sunset's talents revolve around magic itself, so it's really unfair to compare Trixie with that.

[FNGRpony 658]

Here in theory,

 

Could twilight put on a better magic show with pump an ceremony that trixie could?  I have no doubt she could do the tricks, but would it have the show man ship?

[Scootalove 10,692]

Shining Armor is a weird case since I remember him saying something about Twilight being stronger but Twilight says only Shining can conjure up a shield. If I had to give a guess

Shining Armor: 75

Shining Armor's Shield and Defense Magic: 120 (Seemed similar to Trixie's shield)

If you put it that way, yes. Shining Armor's shield was able to cover all of Canterlot in a Canterlot Wedding, while Trixie's shield covered Ponyville but not exactly all of Ponyville.

[Hive King 2,001]

Every unicorn's magic is its unique thing. Rarity is adept at telekinesis and finding gems because that feeds into her life's work, Shining Armor is the captain of the guard, so it stands to reason that he's probably casts more powerful force fields than everyone else, and Trixie, of course, is an entertainer, so she's good at all those do-dads.

 

Twilight and Sunset's talents revolve around magic itself, so it's really unfair to compare Trixie with that.

We know all unicorns can use telekinesis though and this power scale would probably be measured by how much a pony can lift with magic. This isn't fair to certain ponies like Shining Armor who are ridiculously powerful in some sections, but overall, I'd say it works all right to gauge the rough power of a unicorn. Maybe Trixie's attitude came from being born naturally strong?

[FNGRpony 658]

Every unicorn's magic is its unique thing. Rarity is adept at telekinesis and finding gems because that feeds into her life's work, Shining Armor is the captain of the guard, so it stands to reason that he's probably casts more powerful force fields than everyone else, and Trixie, of course, is an entertainer, so she's good at all those do-dads.

 

Twilight and Sunset's talents revolve around magic itself, so it's really unfair to compare Trixie with that.

 

 

See this is a little bit of the shows problem, with twilight already being Over powered.  In diamond dogs she uses raritys spell.  And she does it just as good as rarity hell maybe better.

 

It's suppose to be raritys bread and butter,

 

personally i would have liked it if twilight's only kinda worked, i mean she couldn't have been as practiced at it.

[Hive King 2,001]

Here in theory,

 

Could twilight put on a better magic show with pump an ceremony that trixie could?  I have no doubt she could do the tricks, but would it have the show man ship?

That has nothing to do with magic though and is a character trait

 

If you put it that way, yes. Shining Armor's shield was able to cover all of Canterlot in a Canterlot Wedding, while Trixie's shield covered Ponyville but not exactly all of Ponyville.

Trixie was keeping up her shield with vastly less effort than Shining though

[Malinter 3,065]

Twilight already used the solar beams in the caves to blast down the walls. I get your point but if this is the case, how did Trixie know how to cast all those spells with the Alicorn Amulet? Either the Amulet also gives her knowledge or Trixie's talent is(much as I hate to say it) the same as Twilight's. As for raw power, I just mean who can lift the heaviest object

 

If trixie could perform time spells and summon a gold chariot out of thin air, i don't she'd be making a living as a 2bit performer.

 

The amulet probably puts that knowledge in her head (and knocking out there morals in the process). Also twilight tried copying the time spell on the flower but it didn't work. looking back now that was the first sign of Twilight being able to copy a spell she'd seen like she did when celestia demonstrated the power of fear and hate.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Malinter

[Scootalove 10,692]

 

 

Trixie was keeping up her shield with vastly less effort than Shining though

Yeah, I get that. Since, Shining Armor had to put up his shield to protect Canterlot from an unknown invasion while Trixie puts up her shield to keep Twilight out.

[Lumen 106]

I believe Trixie bought the Alicorn amulet because it was the easiest way to guarantee a victory in the duel against Twilight. Trixie's special talent could be being a showpony and that's not really useful for magic duels so she needed the amulet to get revenge. I also think that Trixie could have done the same thing to the Ursa Minor as Twilight did, if she only would have known how to deal with it. The only reason Twilight was able to get rid of the bear so easily was because she had read about it earlier, because of Trixie, and knew exactly what to do to calm it down.

I'd say Trixie is significantly above average when it comes to magic as unicorns are only supposed to have a little magic related to their special talent, but Trixie's talent IS magic and she has actually studied it, making her magic more diverse and powerful.

[FNGRpony 658]

That has nothing to do with magic though and is a character trait

 

Trixie was keeping up her shield with vastly less effort than Shining though

 

I totally dis agree.

 

She does stage magic.

Stage magic is about specifically about the flair.  it's about the presentation.

 

Like for example could twilight do all the spells rarity does to make dresses?  Sure.  but would they be the same quality?  the same aesthetic.

[Malinter 3,065]

I totally dis agree.

 

She does stage magic.

Stage magic is about specifically about the flair.  it's about the presentation.

 

Like for example could twilight do all the spells rarity does to make dresses?  Sure.  but would they be the same quality?  the same aesthetic.

 

I'd say Rarity's magic strength is precision, she can manipulate a lot of very small things all at once without even needing to focus at all.

[FNGRpony 658]

to further elaborate on why i feel the presentation is part of the magic, suppose you were in a magic class to make a dress, or perform an act.

Would you not be graded on the final product?  As so far as to say "I got the spells right but what i did looks terrible."

you'd still get an F right?

Edited November 1, 2013 by FNGRpony

[Malinter 3,065]

You know, its just dawned on me. I think I know what Trixie's ultimate spell is and even Twilight can't copy it.

 

I think trixies magic is so bad because 99% us needed to use "Hammerspace Magic". lets her pull stuff out of nowhere.

 

she'll be like Rincewind, knows one godlike spell that all the other spells are scared of. xD

Edited November 1, 2013 by Malinter

[Hive King 2,001]

If trixie could perform time spells and summon a gold chariot out of thin air, i don't she'd be making a living as a 2bit performer.

 

The amulet probably puts that knowledge in her head (and knocking out there morals in the process). Also twilight tried copying the time spell on the flower but it didn't work. looking back now that was the first sign of Twilight being able to copy a spell she'd seen like she did when celestia demonstrated the power of fear and hate.

Twilight was able to make the flower somewhat age, she just lacked the power to do so. I'm pretty sure Twilight's talent is magic copying judging by her actions

 

I believe Trixie bought the Alicorn amulet because it was the easiest way to guarantee a victory in the duel against Twilight. Trixie's special talent could be being a showpony and that's not really useful for magic duels so she needed the amulet to get revenge. I also think that Trixie could have done the same thing to the Ursa Minor as Twilight did, if she only would have known how to deal with it. The only reason Twilight was able to get rid of the bear so easily was because she had read about it earlier, because of Trixie, and knew exactly what to do to calm it down.

I'd say Trixie is significantly above average when it comes to magic as unicorns are only supposed to have a little magic related to their special talent, but Trixie's talent IS magic and she has actually studied it, making her magic more diverse and powerful.

Trixie might(MIGHT!) have been able to put the Ursa to sleep, but the idea that she could lift up and take the Ursa back is laughable

[Wardaddy 470]

I've spent a lot of time on this forum discussing many notable topics, such as the S2 finale, the infamous S3 finale, and other things, but perhaps the one notable topic I've not hit on yet is why Trixie, compared to most other unicorns in MLP, seems so underpowered and basic in her magic. Sure, she is just a magician (as if nopony else in Equestria but her can conjure up magic spells), but surely she must have a decent, if not great, level of magic power in her horn? It's almost as if she had no tutelage in moderate to near-advanced levels of magic. What could be the reasons for this?

[Hive King 2,001]

She is weak. I put her just barely above Rarity, and that's pushing it since Rarity wasn't expecting a fight and ran off before retaliating. We know that, genetically, some unicorns are just better and it could be possible that Trixie makes up for her power with her ego. I'd say Trixie is a 5th as powerful as Twilight at best. 

[Malinter 3,065]

What would give is a good idea of trixie's ability is something rather simple. I could bet you 100bits that Trixie did not go to the School for Gifted Unicorns, but a regular school. Trixie is probably like Twilight in that she is self taught in all the basics, the difference is Trixie went straight into work as a stage performer while Twilight took the higher education route.

 

Twilight is simply better trained.

 

Trixie may have better magical potential than even she believes she has but simply doesn't know how to tap into it.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Malinter