Critique on The Debate Pit of Tartarus

[Luna the Great of all the Russias 2,984]

18 hours ago, Jeric said:

I think the current application of the rules has been mostly stellar, with the strong disagreement I have over the interpretation of a rule that is covered under “No profanity”.  That was NOT a personal preference. I’m from Philly and when you get me going … I can sound like Gordon Ramsay. But, it fit with the requirements that people be cordial. 

There is a question I have about this.

Was the "no profanity" rule intended as a strict general ban, or was it more to inhibit hostility between users? I think of specifically the case of mentioning a quotation that contains, shall we say, uncivil language or language no longer considered civil that furthers the argument one is making. There was one post I made contains a censored word due to that rule, but it was in the context of a certain people's attitudes towards another people within a certain time period; it was not directed at any users here (nor a roundabout way to do so with quotations). Ultimately, this is more of a minor point as I doubt this will inhibit any posts I will make in the section in the future; I assume a blanket ban is easier to moderate, and people who read said post would still understand what I was trying to convey.

[Octavian 5,421]

mod-ponies, can we be gentle with the debate pit ban hammer please  I know it's often just a temp ban, but unless a poster has gone totally toxic and genuinely needs a time out, can we just assume that most of us in the pit are pachydermatous ponies? Honestly, the debate pit is angelic compared to most places on the web addressing these topics  

[J.J 923]

8 minutes ago, abrony-mouse said:

mod-ponies, can we be gentle with the debate pit ban hammer please  I know it's often just a temp ban, but unless a poster has gone totally toxic and genuinely needs a time out, can we just assume that most of us in the pit are pachydermatous ponies? Honestly, the debate pit is angelic compared to most places on the web addressing these topics  

As true as your statement is, it was irresponsible of me to not keep track of my neurotic typing habits and that's ultimately why I was banned, I'm so censored on MLP forums compared to other sites, but I had the objective outline of what I could and could not do before me, what I was banned for was not malice or direct Ill intent in my words, but just like the real world even if you are just holding that pipe "for a friend" it was you that objectively had possession of it when it was found and unfortunately the law just like the rules are held to literal sentiments... 

I swore in a place I shouldn't swear, I deserve my time out, but at the same time yes, if some of you guys saw the content that was put into some of the other forums I attend you might be scarred by their words alone, let alone some of the imagery, and this is all on the regular web, there is content so brutal and disgusting in this world I just don't know how some people even go on with their day without being utterly furious or demanding a strict change from our internet providers, I am a man of free speech, but what I do more or less is meant to present that freedom of speech is harmless but way more complained about by the mass majority of individuals trying to present themselves as white knights, where are these so called white knights protesting animal cruelty, pedophilia, leniency in rape cases, people want to cry about racist or sexist memes when the reality of sheer cruelty in this world would rock these SJW babies, no you aren't a good person for trying to make someone shut up, you are a coward or just ignorant for not doing everything in your power to get involved WITH REAL INJUSTICE...

[Octavian 5,421]

wait is swearing even banned in the pit *checks*

 oh my, so it is. um... I hope my last post was ok *meep*

I mean, I'm not much for swearing as it goes, but is that necessary? Same with the emoji thing (which I am much more guilty of ). Can't we just say 'using swearing/emojis in excess or in bad faith is bannable' rather than make it a strict rule like this?

On the other hoof I am happy for the use of snide personal phrases like 'have a nice day' in bad faith (which ok I am also guilty of) to be warnable. 

[J.J 923]

7 minutes ago, Props ValRoa said:

I am glad that the Debate Pit has been moderated much more than the old one is. Now that we've had some more time with it, I have to say that it is good to see threads without the incoherent profanity the old debate pit had. I would argue that the current level of moderation is fine.

When reactions were allowed, I found it rather tedious when users would use it in a targeting manner. I do not agree with the idea of having it a free for all. The Debate Pit should be intended to be a serious form of discussion, without any sarcasm, jokes, profanity, or other such behavior. 

 

The use of profanity doesn't take away from the integrity in the sentiment of someone's statements, especially if you use it contextually like did, I didn't call anyone an ***** name of refer to anything in a manner with the profanity that took away from the maturity of my general presence in the debate pit, it just makes people look more needlessly aggressive, that I can agree with, but you aren't any more mature or have more rational political perspective simply because you "don't use profanity", not from what I've seen, some people really need to get out there on the web and try to broaden their horizons if they think they are material for the "debate team" some people bring very structured manipulative arguments to the table and get shut down and made a fool of by fowl mouth bigoted assholes, sometimes in funny little quips and one liners even, the contextual use of the words really don't take away from the political/social awareness of an individual or the education they truthfully retain in reality ...

One just looks more appealing and friendly, but I know people that are very gutter mouthed that are way more friendly, understanding and open minded than some of the posh arrogance I've seen from people who falsely believe themselves to be worldly because of how they structure themselves in an online debate with people that don't even know them, yeah these are serious topics people should be talking about them anywhere in my opinion, but sometimes swearing shows just how serious someone actually is about these topics, not that they aren't taking it seriously, it is the arrogance of other debaters that refuse to take the perspective of another potential debater seriously because they swear, not the person swearing...

[J.J 923]

57 minutes ago, Props ValRoa said:

It is a matter of decency and respect between both parties to not use profanity in serious conversation, such as the topics in the debate pit. Profanity erodes the value an argument has, though that depends on the context. No matter what political alignment someone may have, it is important to avoid insulting language towards anyone involved in the discussion.

There are better ways to express one's argument. We are all on an equal level here, and everyone is deserving of respect and decency. Profanity stands in the way of that respect. At least that is just the way I see it.

Let the arguments speak for themselves. 

The arguments can't speak for themselves if you censor the person trying to participate in them, but like I said "pish posh, to those swearing heathens" right? Lol 

"Erodes the value of an argument" that is the sentiment I am disagreeing with right there because that is just one person's arrogant opinion who would rather choose to hone in on the way someone verbalizes themselves and not what they are verbalizing themselves about... 

And "insulting language" sounds like you should have been debating on the old Twitter if "shit" offends you, because that's what got me banned ultimately, but yeah if you are offended by people using ass, or hell, or damn or the F word publicly you are very easily insulted 

And since I'm someone that ACTUALLY believes everyone is on an equal level and deserves that respect and decency, that includes the people that may use profanity by force of habit like myself, I will not condone directly insulting someone with derogatory terms or offensive slang in a place like this, but I can handle people having emotions, it's up to you if you want to hold yourself to a higher standard, obviously I have expressed I can communicate with or without swear words, but the internet is such a cesspool of profanity I'm not always conscientious about when I'm doing it, it's a force of habit with the way I communicate in some places, it's the internet it's not like I'm fowl mouthed at a church or around children, these are all  extended self manufactured perversions of who we want the world to see us as, not who we potentially are in reality... Like I said it can seem needlessly aggressive if someone interjects with profanity in an argument that didn't previously appear to be that emotionally driven, but from my perspective all arguments are emotionally driven, and you can sound equally as insulting without the use of profanity, kind of like when you tried talking to me like I was a child for having a right to an opinion... But we're past that part now, I'm not gonna battle to get profanity approved, I recognized I broke the rule and I accept it as a rule, but I won't recognize someone on a higher level of understanding or maturity for not using profanity, maturity is a sentiment that can only be proven by actions and the sentiments those actions serve, all words are empty at the end of the day, I can pitch you objective points from both left and right leaning perspectives on the same issues... How I or anyone else chooses to conduct their verbalization of said perspectives online is only meant to manipulate others into adopting rationale for our biased political perspectives or agenda, your lifestyle is a literal reflection of your political alignment and affiliation, your words are just a way to sway people toward that alignment, typically a man on welfare is an obvious democrat, watch how quick he becomes a conservative after coming into some money, rationale is determined by our inherent standing in the world, it's impossible to be wrong or right on many issues from a personal standpoint because that is merely circumstantial...

 

 

Edited November 10, 2022 by Uncle Bumper

[Octavian 5,421]

On 2022-11-09 at 11:46 PM, Props ValRoa said:

When reactions were allowed, I found it rather tedious when users would use it in a targeting manner.

now reactions aren't allowed either?  I thought the sassing in reactions was kinda fun! Gave them an evil new meaning >:3 and a bit of welcome relief given you can't have emojis in the posts. Was the last DPoT so bad that this one has to be so soberly?

On 2022-11-09 at 11:46 PM, Props ValRoa said:

The Debate Pit should be intended to be a serious form of discussion, without any sarcasm, jokes, profanity, or other such behavior. 

on behalf of all pinkie-lovers who want to have a bit of friskiness in the Pit, can't it just be a lil more fun than that? Afterall, these topics are debated seriously all over the place, but this time they are debated by people with cute pony avs and sigs so the debate section is already kinda unintentionally a bit hilarious anyway. Ofc maybe I shouldn't have said that or there will be special sober debate pit sigs and avs. At least I've already got a head start on the black and white colour scheme...

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On 2022-11-10 at 12:06 AM, Uncle Bumper said:

I know people that are very gutter mouthed that are way more friendly, understanding and open minded

so much this! Mean and immature people can still be mean and immature in nicey-nice or sobery-sober atmospheres.  

 

[J.J 923]

9 hours ago, abrony-mouse said:

now reactions aren't allowed either?  I thought the sassing in reactions was kinda fun! Gave them an evil new meaning >:3 and a bit of welcome relief given you can't have emojis in the posts. Was the last DPoT so bad that this one has to be so soberly?

on behalf of all pinkie-lovers who want to have a bit of friskiness in the Pit, can't it just be a lil more fun than that? Afterall, these topics are debated seriously all over the place, but this time they are debated by people with cute pony avs and sigs so the debate section is already kinda unintentionally a bit hilarious anyway. Ofc maybe I shouldn't have said that or there will be special sober debate pit sigs and avs. At least I've already got a head start on the black and white colour scheme...

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so much this! Mean and immature people can still be mean and immature in nicey-nice or sobery-sober atmospheres.  

 

I disagree with the sentiment that someone is even necessarily mean or immature for using profanity or being playfully provocative, it takes a certain level of maturity to understand that not everyone has the same lifestyle, grew up around the same individuals, or has been taught in the same way... Someone isn't uneducated or immature for using profanity just unthoughtful... and to virgin eyes "insensitive". That is all I will say. 

[Octavian 5,421]

5 hours ago, Props ValRoa said:

not for any kind of “cutesy pony stuff” like the rest of the forum,

blasphemy! cute ponies must be everywhere :3

ah well, you have a different idea to me on this  I enjoy the sassiness and you don't. but the Pit will continue kamarad Props, and it is doing so in a generally gentle, friendly way regardless of the fact I might have reacted to your last post using a derpy in a costume. What does that reaction mean? I couldn't say. But it is a pony. And it is cute :3

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

Sarcasm and jokes banned me hahaha... Too bad they don't see the deeper meaning of it.... Oh well. Not everyone can understand how deep comedy can be?

Plus I kinda agree and disagree in profanity....

I had a friend. Who was a call center who always interacted with people who swears a lot.

His reply: " sir let's be professional on the way we talk."

Comedy I can considered very professional. Since you can play and hide it's meanings and is very hard to do.

But profanity.... Mmmmm yeah it has emotions but is not very professional to me.... Like F this F that... F became a lot of stuff F can be anything now... It can be good it can be bad... It lost its true meaning.... Over used and pretty much... Mehhh. 

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

On 2022-11-12 at 2:23 AM, Props ValRoa said:

@abrony-mouse

I think the way I do because I wish common decency and respect between all involved. Sassiness and emojis isn't the way to do that. The old debate pit allowed profanity and emojis, and it was a constant mess.

Well... You see text doesn't have emotions.... You can't see what the writers emotions are. So I think emoji's help a bit I guess on that matter? 🤔 Like if the person is truly pondering with a ? Or is trapping you with a question mark 😎

[Jeric 46,851]

23 minutes ago, Kujamih said:

Well... You see text doesn't have emotions.... You can't see what the writers emotions are. So I think emoji's help a bit I guess on that matter? 🤔 Like if the person is truly pondering with a ? Or is trapping you with a question mark 😎

That’s more a question of skill. Thousands of years of textual art demonstrates that emotion can be deftly used in any situation. If a reader can’t tell the emotion or nature of a text, it’s the author’s failing. We are living in a world where textual communication is far more ubiquitous, so having an opportunity to hone a writing skill should be seen as challenge. 

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

1 hour ago, Jeric said:

That’s more a question of skill. Thousands of years of textual art demonstrates that emotion can be deftly used in any situation. If a reader can’t tell the emotion or nature of a text, it’s the author’s failing. We are living in a world where textual communication is far more ubiquitous, so having an opportunity to hone a writing skill should be seen as challenge. 

Not  everyone has that skill and that skill can still be misread.... Hence different opinions on a book one reads.... 

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

Although.... that can still be said even  when communicating with words hahaha

[BornAgainBrony 2,397]

On 2022-11-12 at 1:59 PM, Kujamih said:

Well... You see text doesn't have emotions.... You can't see what the writers emotions are. So I think emoji's help a bit I guess on that matter? 🤔 Like if the person is truly pondering with a ? Or is trapping you with a question mark 😎

Well, kind of. Emotes/emoticons/smileys were originally created to allow people to communicate emotions across the pre-internet multi-user networks. But as time went on and trolls became a thing, and people used sensationalism on social media to grab more likes, emoticons are now seldom used to reflect a person's real emotions. LOL was actually among the first emoticons, but how often is a person actually "laughing out loud" when they use it? Almost never.

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

4 hours ago, BornAgainBrony said:

Well, kind of. Emotes/emoticons/smileys were originally created to allow people to communicate emotions across the pre-internet multi-user networks. But as time went on and trolls became a thing, and people used sensationalism on social media to grab more likes, emoticons are now seldom used to reflect a person's real emotions. LOL was actually among the first emoticons, but how often is a person actually "laughing out loud" when they use it? Almost never.

... Bro even emotions in real life is seldom used to reflect a person's real emotions... Hard to pull off but plausible...

Like a fake smile.... Parents usually don't show their real emotions to their children. They give a smile to hide their pain etc. 

[Octavian 5,421]

well no more debate pit for me - tough for me to keep my sass levels down  Sorry if anypony was upset, you know I <3 you all really :3

if anypony fancies continuing debating then PM me, or alternatively I am on a lil forum BronyBase (tapatalk.com) which is manely RP but that might work too

[Octavian 5,421]

9 minutes ago, Props ValRoa said:

@abrony-mouse

I tried to join that BronyBase thing but it's not sending me an email verification link. 

hmm strange D: I'll ask the admin about it. tapatalk is not the best forum software  

[Octavian 5,421]

I've pm'd you  anypony else who wants to continue debating is ofc welcome too. 

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

On 2022-11-25 at 9:01 PM, abrony-mouse said:

well no more debate pit for me - tough for me to keep my sass levels down  Sorry if anypony was upset, you know I <3 you all really :3

if anypony fancies continuing debating then PM me, or alternatively I am on a lil forum BronyBase (tapatalk.com) which is manely RP but that might work too

Its not a place for us....they cant handle our sassyness... We are to .... SASSEEHHH...

UUU TAPATALK... Please do tell about this place?

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

On 2022-11-26 at 1:40 AM, abrony-mouse said:

I've pm'd you  anypony else who wants to continue debating is ofc welcome too. 

Yes lets debate!  About pineapples!

[Octavian 5,421]

5 minutes ago, Kujamih said:

Yes lets debate!  About pineapples!

pineapples should be blue and have Styrofoam on their spikes because they're too dangerous! 

7 minutes ago, Kujamih said:

Its not a place for us....they cant handle our sassyness... We are to .... SASSEEHHH...

UUU TAPATALK... Please do tell about this place?

 and tapatalk is a forum which made me a mod D: and is also an old RP forum. it's sadly only got a few members now.  

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

28 minutes ago, abrony-mouse said:

Styrofoam on their spikes because they're too dangerous! 

Make it marshmallows and we have a deal!

[Octavian 5,421]

THAT'S NOT HOW THE DEBATE PIT WORKS!

no compromise >:3 even though I love the idea of marshmallow spike hedgehogs

[Evil Pink One 13,506]

Oh! I have an idea! Can we have a troll pit? This way the trolls can stay there and leave the debate pit and avoid making people cry there.