Why Make Your Mark is terrible.

[Casey Pones 48]

Spoiler

The following contains spoilers for A New Generation and Make your Mark

I am a big fan of MLP FIM and A New Generation gave me such hope for the future of the franchise. Numerous references to G4, showing this new team had done their homework. Great songs, voice acting and animation. They even improved the pony's design by including hooves and making them able to use them as grasping hands. Yes I know it looked weird, like they were suction cups or electromagnets but it was also kind of funny. And it was foreshadowed that Earth Ponys were going to get magic.

My problem with A New Generation was that it left so many open questions.

• How and why did Equestria fall?
• How did society built on friendship and unity split into isolationist xenophobic city-states?
• Why are there no historical records of the real history?
• Where did those crystals come from? Why is pony magic connected to them now? Why were they separated?
• Why did pony magic disappear?  
• Why was there a socket for them in the lighthouse? Did Arglye know about this?
• What happened to Twilight Sparkle and the other Princesses?
• What's become of Equestria's other towns and cities?
• What's become of the Yacks, Griffins, Hippogriffs, Changelings, Kirin, Dragons and other groups Equestria was in touch with?
• What happened to the Tree of Harmony?

Despite this I looked forward to Make Your Mark with hope and optimism but that was eroded chapter by chapter but when I saw the dragons had been redesigned, that was the last straw! I was so outraged I went looking for a site to see how outraged my fellow fans and that's what lead me here, the first MLP fan site I've ever joined. And I was amazed by how little raging against MYM there was, how many people say they like it even that it's better then FIM! Well I've finally gotten around to posting my thoughts on MYM, so get ready for some backlash and remember... it's only because I care.

 

When the first episode of Make Your Mark starts, the first thing I noticed was the come-down in animation, which I can understand but it still subtracts from the enjoyment. And the replaced voice actors were a little off putting, I get that they probably couldn't hire the actor but was it really worth hiring those names for the film? Couldn't you have just used the same ones you planned for the show and spared everyone an awkward transition?

Although, to be honest I value the perk animation has over live action. It's less noticeable and easier to replace a voice actor then a regular actor.

Overall I felt most of the storytelling was rushed all the dialog and events seemed to come and go really fast without the proper pacing or time to focus on what was important.

 

And this show is supposed to be about multi-culturalism and inclusion? I'm barley picking up on that at all in this show. There's a few episodes involving different pony traditions and holidays but aside from the premier I didn't see any friction that often comes when cultures clash for the first time. And even the first episode didn't do enough with it in my opinion. In episodes like the Traditional Unicorn Sleepover, Portrait of a Princess or the Manescrade Ball, we see the new mane six introduced to aspects and holidays of foreign cultures for the first time. Yet there are no problems adapting to, tolerating or functioning withing these new settings and traditions. Which is a good thing but this show said it was about teaching inclusion and multiculturism. How is it supposed to teach dealing with other people's culture if the all characters just breeze right through it effortlessly? If you want to make it that easy for them you could at least tell us how it's so easy for them.

And yet I've heard people say this show is doing a great job, that G4 was about mixing with people within your own world while G5 is about mixing with people beyond your world. Well that would be a good direction for the new series to go in but, as I've said, they just aren't doing a good job. In fact I think G4 did a better job on this subject with episodes like The Hearth's Warming Club and Hearthbreakers.

 

And speaking of all this new culture in the franchise, where did it come from? G4 had a slumber party episode, thrown by Twilight (then a unicorn) and yet had none of the "traditional" elements we see in Izzy's traditional unicorn slumber party. I know some of you MYM supporters will say these traditions developed in the period between shows but for me it's just not a good enough excuse to remake Unicorn, Pegasus and Earth Pony cultures any way you want.

Also it would have been better if we were given the rhyme and reasons and history behind these traditions. Like Maretime Bay Day, what are they actually celebrating? And why are ribbon wreaths (something else we've never seen Earth Ponies with) the traditional decoration? And the same things can be said for the other new holidays and traditions they have, what is their history and meaning? In G4 we were not only introduced to holidays like Nightmare Night and Hearth's Warming Eve but the meanings and symbolism of the festivities and decorations. Not only does that make them feel more fleshed-out but they add to the worldbuilding and history of the show's world. In G5, not only are they just flinging out holidays and traditions but by not explaining them to us, they are raising our curiosity and then leaving it unstratified. And by having the show centred on a group of ponies, some of who are as new to these things as we are, all the writers have to do is have them explain to the other ponies and that informs the audience without making it feel forced.

 

But all this pales in comparison to the show's constant continuity errors with G4 and even itself, along with the nonsensical and disappointing answers to the questions left behind by A New Generation.

In Izzy Does it, we see the origin of Izzy's wagon which came after Make Your Mark episode one. But it's also clearly shown in Tell Your Tale existing BEREFORE then when Izzy repairs Sunny's lantern. As I will show, it's bad enough they have all these continuity errors with G4 but to have errors with itself?!

In Make Your Mark episode one, we get a message from Twilight Sparkle herself, pointing to a few answers but the message itself is a continuity error. This is set after the events of the final episode and from her message and what we later learned, just after Opaline tried to take over and Equestria was sealed off from the rest of their world. So why does Twilight look the way she did throughout the series and not in her fully grown alicorn form? I'll tell you why, because the makers of the show wanted to gain viewers by using her much more well known form. But really you people, would it have been that bad to use her canonical form for a cameo that only lasted minute? Also I assumed the ponies would either repair that message or find another copy so we could hear it in it's entirety. But we never did. Also how did she know Earth Pony magic could be coming?

 

Season/Chapter 2 Episode 6, The Traditional Unicorn Sleep-Over was much, MUCH worse. We got an explanation from Sunny as to what happened in Equestria, which is something I was burning for but it was a HUGE disappointment!

"An earth pony got hurt by a unicorn. Everypony started fighting with each other." 

Are you serious? One argument between 2 ponies sent the ENITRE kingdom into chaos?! That's hard enough to swallow by itself but this is Equstria, a kingdom founded on fraternal love and harmony between ponykind!

"The princess, wanting to protect her kingdom and all of the ponies in it, decided to put all magic into 3 crystals before it got out of hoof."

Exactly how did creating the unity crystals fix this problem? This was a riot, not some kind of magical event. It wouldn't stop them from fighting.

"After that, earth ponies only felt safe with other earth ponies. Unicorns with unicorns and pegasi of a feather flocked together."

Why would the unity crystals do that?

"The ponies galloped, trotted and flew as far as they could with their crystals. Settling in what would become Zephyr Heights, Bridlewood and Maretime Bay."

No no no no no! These two lines are an outrage!

Firstly We clearly saw the forgotten station in Zephyr Heights, it had an arrival-departure board with names of multiple towns and cities from FIM. And posters from this same time period showing all 3 ponykinds visiting each other. Indicating that these 3 settlements existed BEFORE Equestria fell! And even if they were built after that, what about Sunny's lighthouse? It had a socket for all 3 crystals, indicating they were all kept there and NOT separated before it's founding! And if this is how pony kind lost their magic, how come there's no record of it or their real history? How is it a big mystery to them how they lost magic? And wouldn't they have known that's what would happen if they separated the crystals? And again there is no way a nation like Equestria would just break up into isolationist, mono species, xenophobic city states just like that.

"We pieced together the crystal part ourselves."

You pieced the story together? From what?! And why would you do that writers? Don't you know you can use that mystery to build a compelling story? Have you ever heard of a video game called Horizon? It plunges you into a world with tons of questions that demands explanation. And that explanation is trickled in as you follow the story yet raises more questions that compels you to learn more. You could have done the same thing.

And some might say this explanation isn't cannon anyway. Well what's it doing here then?! Being presented as truth?!  Especially when it's in the scenario used to bring lied-to characters around to realising the truth.

 

Season 4 Episode 05: The Manesquerade Ball. There's a book on the alicorns of Equestria, a written record of pre-fall Equestria and the Pegasi had it in their library THIS WHOLE TIME?! How is it they all lost their history, that's a big part of A New Generation! 

 

Season 5 Episode 2 & 3 Family Trees. It was good that they brought the Breezies back, finally one of the G4 races brought back and they did a good job with them. But do they live inside the tree? Is the tree a portal to their world? How come they've never appeared before? How did Misty bring the Breezies into Bridalwood? But the biggest problem is that we never got an explanation as to how Misty got separated from her dad. She found that door and it sent her somewhere else? We just saw it doesn't work without a key and it's not on the Wishing Tree (and we never got to know why it's called that either) This event is a huge part of Misty's backstory, it's a big part of this two part episode and we don't get an explanation?

Also, Sunny has seen something like the key before? What? Never answered.

And I think misty looks better with that new mane colour but couldn't they have just designed it that way from the start? Now she's got to dye her mane in every episode?

 

Season 5 Episode 4 Father of the Bridlewood. apparently the character Elderflower is the great great great great nice of Moondancer. A separation of that number of generations is not enough to be considered ancient.

 

Season 6 Episode 01: The Isle of Scaly. I had been trying to like this new show and hold onto hope it would get better. But this one pushed me right over the edge! Dragons are QUADRUPEDAL NOW?!!! It goes without saying that in G4 dragons are clearly BIPEDAL! HOW did they overlook this obvious detail!? Or think we wouldn't notice or care?! It's bad enough when people who take over a franchise redesign characters, history, magic systems and places. But the actual anatomy of the creatures?! As bad a job as Disney did with Star Wars at least they knew not to make the wookies walk on all fours! And to add to the stupidity, the show also has a BIPEDAL baby dragon! What the in hay writers?! How can you change the dragons to quadrupedal AND have one bipedal?! How does that even work?! Oh and they have cutie marks and magic now? Although it would explain that thing spike can do with scrolls. Oh and the Dragon Lands, a harsh land full of volcanos, are an now a tropical island?

And speaking of Spike, he's back, not that surprising but he's dragon lord now? What happened to Ember?! You can't just put him in Ember's seat writers. Why couldn't you have him among the dragons but still have Ember there as dragon lord? Would that have been so hard? And not only is he quadrupedal they got his eyes wrong too. they are not supposed to be round but vertical slits! Seriously Entertainment One,
Atomic Cartoons, did you even WATCH G4?!

So we get the full explanation now, from Spike who was actually there. Opaline was banished from Skyros, the alicorn land. Alicorns are a full ponykind now and are born? Even though it is CLEARLY stated in Friendship Is Magic Season 6 Episode 1 – The Crystalling (Part 1) that alicorns need to earn their wings and horns and the birth of one is unheard of. I've learned since then that "The Journal of the Two Sisters" says Alicorns are born but to me, in show trumps other media. Although I expect there are journal purists who will be quite happy about this. So Opaline used dark magic to become a fire alicorn, an event which clashes with Opaline's own backstory about being born a fire alicorn (whatever that means.) And Twilight created the crystals and the dragon stone to hide the magic from Opaline. How does doing that "hide" the magic from her? Wouldn't concentrating it all into defined objects in fact make it easier to steal it as opposed to it being all over Equestria? Twilight sent the dragons to the island to hide them, how does being in hibernation hide them? Wouldn't that make them more vulnerable to Opaline? Why hibernate? How long were they supposed to stay like that, forever? If she did put a spell around Equestria, wouldn't it make sense to do the same thing for the Isle of Scaley? And Opaline did this to Equestria? The Mane 6 defeated super powerful magical threats time and time again, how was Opaline more then they could handle? And what happened to the other nations and races outside Eqestria? Have they just been crowded around it's boarders this whole time?

 

Season 6 Episode 3 & 4 Roots of All Evil. And now we come to the epic climax, that which needs to go better then anything before it. We get a complex and hastily explained magic system regarding the Together Trees, Opaline is wearing a chest piece with places for 6 cutie marks when she didn't know Misty had betrayed her and so was only after 5. Where did that G1 pendant come from and why is it here other then pandering? You can't jut throw a new element into the story at the last minute and not make it understood the audience. Opaline tried to pull a "we're not so different" moment without anything to really back it up. Spike can now teleport anyone from anywhere? Isn't that a little over powered? Sparky gets to live with his adopted father but who are his real parents? As Dragon Lord, wouldn't Spike feel a responsibility to return him to them?

And then right at the end, without a moment to take a breath, we get a last minute teaser for a whole new adventure. Shouldn't this be the moment when all is well and wrapped up?

 

And as for Secrets of Starlight, we were disappointed that it had nothing to do with Starlight Glimmer. We get a new pony kind, the aurora-corn, which would normally be nice but we learn nothing about what they are and what kind of magic they have and there are so many G4 races still to reintroduce, do we really need to clog up that process by adding new ones now? What's the origin of the aurora-corns? How come they've never heard of Equestria?

The stars in the Equestrian sky are really gemstones just above the atmosphere? Ever since season 1 of FIM I've known their world has a kind of child-like, mythic quality. With the sun and moon orbiting the world and having to be manually moved. This star thing keeps in with that but what does that mean for the wider universe? Why are the stars keys out of it. Why can Allurea just leave? Is Starlight Ridge in another reality like Canterlot High? How dumb is Alurea if she was fooled at all by that arts and crafts project? The snow all over Starlight Ridge is a cure for Alurea's mind-control?! How has she been able to do that with the cure literally all around?

 

All together I would say that while Entertainment One
Boulder Media did an acceptable, even admirable job of adopting MLP from Allspark Animation and DHX Studios... Entertainment One and Atomic Cartoons did a worse job adopting it then Disney adopting Star Wars from Lucasfilm. I'm not a big Star Wars fan but even I cringed watching those films. Like one of those Star Wars fans who just want to pretend Disney never made those films, I almost want to refuse to acknowledge them. Like Quibblepants refused to acknowledge the later Daring Do books. In fact I have so much against MYM and am thinking of saying more in the individual episode sections, I'm thinking of changing my user name to some variation on Quibblepants.

This show started out with such promise, such potential and had so much established lore, history and world building to work with. And I've just seen it get misused and mangled by people who don't seem to know what they are doing or don't care.

In fact I've come to feel that these days the media industry no longer cares about it's audience. The big studios seem to think they can do whatever they want with whatever franchise, no matter how precious it is to fans and still make a ton of money out of it. And what's worse is that it seems to work out just like that over and over.

All the questions left behind by A New Generation, that could have been a great way to build the new show and fill it's story with captivating content, have either been left unanswered with no apparent intention to answer them or just had an unfulfilling answer conveniently dumped out.

The continuity with G4 and G5's own storytelling is so broken, I think best if not only way to fix it is for Hasbro to declare everything after A New Generation non-cannon and bring in someone like Boulder Media to remake the whole series from scratch. In fact, since I've heard there will be no more G5 episodes this year, I think we should use this window to circulate a petition to have Hasbro do just that.

Some of you might say that MYM has a big act to follow in FIM and that's why it didn't work out but I say these new people didn't put in an effort or care what we fans would think, either in it's connection to FIM or in it's own quality. I believe art is a serious matter and people have no excuse for not trying.

And that concludes my essay on Make your Mark, it is the reason I joined this community and it took me 4 days to fully put together. 

[Tacodidra 59,801]

I don't think it should be remade. I doubt that will ever happen to any MLP content (there were also some petitions to remake parts of G4, which obviously failed). The best we can do is hope for the next series to be better and ignore the aspects of the previous series we didn't like (if there were any).

This seems to be an unpopular opinion, but while MYM wasn't always perfect, I'll take it over ANG any day. The series rekindled my interest in G5 after finding the movie underwhelming. Maybe Sunny's portrayal was better in the movie, but otherwise MYM is a lot more to my liking.

Edited March 3 by Tacodidra

[Props Valroa 26,048]

@Casey Pones

I have seen all of Make Your Mark. I don't think it is terrible, but in my opinion it is a significant downgrade from G4. As someone who has watched almost all G5 content, the glaring issues that I see are how they tried to connect it to G4. The quality of the writing leaves something to be desired in a lot of avenues. There are a lot of things about it that I do like though, however in my opinon it should be remade as a separate universe from G4 and that would solve the bulk of the problems I have with it - and if it was it's own universe, it would solve this here.

 

Quote

• How and why did Equestria fall?
• How did society built on friendship and unity split into isolationist xenophobic city-states?
• Why are there no historical records of the real history?
• Where did those crystals come from? Why is pony magic connected to them now? Why were they separated?
• Why did pony magic disappear?  
• Why was there a socket for them in the lighthouse? Did Arglye know about this?
• What happened to Twilight Sparkle and the other Princesses?
• What's become of Equestria's other towns and cities?
• What's become of the Yacks, Griffins, Hippogriffs, Changelings, Kirin, Dragons and other groups Equestria was in touch with?
• What happened to the Tree of Harmony?

All these open ended questions and how G4 was treated by G5 just makes me have a negative opinion over all on the setup. I like the characters, I like some of the plots, but the part of contention for me is that it is connected to G4. It does not feel like a sequel at all to me. It feels like the writers tarnished and walked over G4 with these haphazard concepts that make no conceptual sense for G4 to end up being. G4 has a lot of issues especially towards the end, but tacking G5 onto it just seems to compound the problem and make it over all worse.

Just remake it as a separate universe and come up with it's own world building. Problem solved. 

 

[Evil Pink One 12,992]

@Casey Pones

There is little outrage about it because we dont want to hurt the feewings of the others who like it.

I did and got me points haha

[Rafa Stary 683]

 

16 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

In Make Your Mark episode one, we get a message from Twilight Sparkle herself, pointing to a few answers but the message itself is a continuity error. This is set after the events of the final episode and from her message and what we later learned, just after Opaline tried to take over and Equestria was sealed off from the rest of their world. So why does Twilight look the way she did throughout the series and not in her fully grown alicorn form? I'll tell you why, because the makers of the show wanted to gain viewers by using her much more well known form. But really you people, would it have been that bad to use her canonical form for a cameo that only lasted minute? 

No, Twilight is easily recognizable by her End of FiM apperance, that's not a good excuse to use her younger appearance, they more likely used it because her design from The Last Problem is stuck to the contract with Discovery Family supposedly along with several other stuff from G4. I guess it wouldn't be very interesting if they used only her voice so they had no choice but use her original Alicorn appearance, some say it wasn't actually her but the spirit of the tree of harmony, but that's theory territory.

Quote

In fact I've come to feel that these days the media industry no longer cares about it's audience. The big studios seem to think they can do whatever they want with whatever franchise, no matter how precious it is to fans and still make a ton of money out of it. And what's worse is that it seems to work out just like that over and over.

Only "these days"? You sure? 

• And well, now actually talking about the subject (you can stop reading here if you want) No, I mean, maybe it would be interesting to see a remake where they had the purpose of improving the series, but I know that won't happen just as Toei won't remake DBS with better art and animation, more SSJ God and less errors, I already accepted it, the production was already made, they already got their money with it, they aren't interested in telling the same story again but stuff changed.

You said that you saw little against MyM coming from your G4 friends, but maybe that is simply because the major part of the fans didn't even watch MyM, just a guess.

I personally have little to almost no nitpicks with MyM, I'm mostly fine with it and with G5 in general (maybe it's because I haven't been a fan of MLP long enough and if I had remained a brony for 11 years straight I would have created a greater feeling for the series and thus I would have been angry about something in G5 :v)

as I can see here most of your criticism is towards the fact that the series is a sequel to G4, and well, I'll be honest. 

When I finished FiM and went straight to ANG and MyM & TyT, everything I wished for was just a fun silly kids show with horses for me to watch, that's all, yes I was expecting something on the same level as G4 but not necessarily, and well, all three entertained me despite their problems, I personally really don't care about the "sequel to G4" part, it doesn't make me like it more and it doesn't make me dislike it neither, i'm sure that if G5 was a full reboot my personal feelings about it would've been the same, another interesting entry in this franchise, but it's definitely not as good or thrilling as G4 and that's it.

But to make this at least minimally interesting to read, I do have some opinions about this show's connections with G4, it's actually about G5 in overall, and well, while I do appreciate their attempt on making this as a sequel to the previous gen (specially that all the past generations were reboots) I personally really don't think the connection to G4 was necessary, for me it was clearly Hasbro's attempt on making this gen a hit like G4, they couldn't use things from G4 until 2025 or do a reboot of G4 because of the contract with Discovery Family, they weren't confident with these new characters and world, so they made this gen be connected with the previous one to guarantee an easy success, and FOR ME, everything that came out after Opaline's defeat, is a clear demonstration that they gave up and now they believe it's not worth to keep making connections between the two generations (yeah there was Misty's Room in TyT recently but for me it's still too soon to talk about it)

I did feel some effort coming from the people who tried to connect the gens though, but something went wrong there and I have no idea what it was, I wouldn't go out saying that "these people know or don't care about what they are doing", executives and artists are different, of course, there are countless examples of artists who hated their works, but I'm not sure if this is one of them, and even though I don't about the connections with G4, it kind of saddens me how they gave up on something they had plans for, I do believe they still planned to develop more stuff as the supposed Tree of Harmony and the new Cutie Mark Crusaders, but well, it happens.

For now, I think it doesn't make a difference, this generation will continue, I'll try to keep following it, but I know it's not G4, it's G5, it is its own thing, also, I said that "I have little to almost no nitpicks" with this gen, which means that it must have at least something that annoys me, right? Actually, I don't know, I thought about TyT's art style but I already got very used to it, I don't like how uninteresting the world in this gen is, but it's not something that annoys me, it's just there, it exists. Not even the Dragons annoyed me, I actually kind of liked their designs (more than Sparky, for me the little guy is too generic), I did expect them to explain why Dragons aren't bypedal (except Sparky) anymore, but I wasn't sad or angry that they didn't, my reaction was just "well, okay", I actually think that in-universe this change doesn't matter because FOR ME, the Dragons only became quadrupeds because this way it would be easier to make their char models and, well, by making the Dragons more pony-like, they would look more attractive to little girls so they could sell toys of these characters, the Dragons from G4 were all just too ugly to sell toys (I'm not saying thay their char designs are bad, I think you understood it)

I believe that my actual feelings about this generation revolve around the characters, the world, the visuals and the worldbuilding, and not the connections to G4, I think even if the connections to G4 weren't inconsistent and with a lot of problems it wouldn't change much for me because what really matters in G5 for me is it's original/new content, and for me that just isn't at the same level of G4, also, I actually think that things would've worked the same if it was a sequel to a Alternate Reality G4, or even!! If it was actually a sequel to a unseen generation, instead of Twilight and Spike, we would have Past Alicron Princess and her Dragon friend, hehe, just to show you that I really don't care, messing with the past is not going to make this gen any better imo, for me what matters is the present

But well, I believe most of or all of my thoughts are because of the according

When I finished watching all of FiM, I felt that all those characters and world became too big and too strong for the general franchise, in every way, or better, by that I mean that I think G4 became much more important than it was supposed to be, and kind of ended up becoming the face of the franchise, you remember MLP and think about the Mane Six and Lauren Faust' art style, that became too much even for me, when I finished Season 9 I was scared and sad because I wouldn't be seeing more of those characters and world anymore, so next would be new territory with new cast. I understand when they need to change the cast in a live action series or movie, because in these productions, the characters are brought to life by actors, real people, so character and actor become one being, that's when the actor becomes too old or when he doesn't want to play a character again, his character dies or retires. But we're talking about a cartoon, and for me at least cartoon characters are eternal

I really like the G5 characters and I do enjoy their stories, but what I really would like to see is more of Twilight and her friends and that huge Equestria, things just doesn't feel the same for me without them no matter how good the connections G5 did could've been, without G4 I probably would never have been interested in MLP in the first place, I care about the other generations because of it, 

I really don't know what Hasbro would've made if the contract with Discovery Family expired before G5 was made, maybe they would reboot G4, or maybe do a new series on the same continuity that would take place during the time skip in between FiM's Final battle (The Ending of the End) and Final episode (The Last Problem), that would make me laugh my pants off haha but it would be more than enough to satisfy me, I think it would be perfect if they made G4 and G5 coexist at the same time, make stories or entire arcs with the G5 characters but not get rid of the G4 characters and that world, something like the Young Six episodes did, I would've loved it.

In summary I don't expect anything from G5, I don't care about the connections with G4, they don't annoy me nor make the story better for me, what truly matters for me in this gen are its new characters and world and for me they (mostly the world) aren't as good as stuff from G4, but at least the movie and the two cartoons manage to entertain me, but what I really wanted to see was more of characters and the world that made me love the series.

Well, I wrote too much, I said a lot of things but also nothing :v not surprised.

Edited March 4 by Rafa Stary
Correct text

[Casey Pones 48]

5 hours ago, Rafa Stary said:

 

Only "these days"? You sure? 

 

By "these days" I mean the last 20 years. The 90s was the decade of my childhood. For all I know you're too young to remember you wippersnapper but back in my day it was a great time for movies. The 90s saw the Jurassic Park films, the first CGI film Toy Story, some of Disney's best work ever, even pop-corn movies like Independence Day felt better then the pop-corn movies we have now.

The last 20 years have been direct to video sequels, live action remakes, resurrections of beloved franchises that just trample on our childhood, studios pandering to fans while giving them nothing they want. And backpedalling in sequels when the backlash came in which just made things worse.

Recently I watched "The General" one of my most beloved childhood movies and I thought how different it was to the films we have today. It was a time when film makers actually cared about quality and making a film stand up on it's own merits. Buster Keaton literally risked his life to make it! Incidentally that film is part of why I chose my user picture.

Quote

When I finished watching all of FiM, I felt that all those characters and world became too big and too strong for the general franchise, in every way, or better, by that I mean that I think G4 became much more important than it was supposed to be, and kind of ended up becoming the face of the franchise, you remember MLP and think about the Mane Six and Lauren Faust' art style, that became too much even for me, when I finished Season 9 I was scared and sad because I wouldn't be seeing more of those characters and world anymore, so next would be new territory with new cast. I understand when they need to change the cast in a live action series or movie, because in these productions, the characters are brought to life by actors, real people, so character and actor become one being, that's when the actor becomes too old or when he doesn't want to play a character again, his character dies or retires. But we're talking about a cartoon, and for me at least cartoon characters are eternal.

I don't have a problem with a world being big and strong and I never saw it as a problem in FIM. If anything I would have liked to understand the whole planet they were on. Like, if Celestia's work is considered done when the sun is lowered, does that mean their planet is flat? 

I'm not sure where you stand on actors in cartoons. Personally I don't have a problem replacing a dead or retired voice actor as long as they do a good job. I consider it an advantage of cartoons, it's less noticeable then replacing a live-action actor.

Edited March 4 by Casey Pones

[RDDash 18,866]

G5 movie was still the best thing they ever made, the tv show could have been better 

[Iforgotmybrain 3,514]

I do agree with most of what Rafa said. I don’t really hold the same opinions or feelings as you so I can’t really say I relate to a lot of the complaints. But I do want to respond, because it’s fun.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

And the replaced voice actors were a little off putting, I get that they probably couldn't hire the actor but was it really worth hiring those names for the film? Couldn't you have just used the same ones you planned for the show and spared everyone an awkward transition?

I actually kind of prefer the current VAs in some aspects. Pipp’s current VA for example is a genuinely amazing singer which fits her character a lot better vs Sofia Carson. Who wasn’t bad… but just isn’t as good as AJ Bridel. That said I do think they should’ve just went with smaller name VAs to begin with because absolutely no animated kids show was ever going to be able to afford even a single one of those big name actors in a consistent role. It was just Hasbro trying to catch people’s attention with flashy, fancy names.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

Overall I felt most of the storytelling was rushed all the dialog and events seemed to come and go really fast without the proper pacing or time to focus on what was important.

I feel a similar way with the first few episodes tbh. I also feel it’s somewhat forgivable since it was the first chapter and the show was still getting its footing. And I do think the later chapters do a better job of avoiding those issues.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

I know some of you MYM supporters will say these traditions developed in the period between shows but for me it's just not a good enough excuse to remake Unicorn, Pegasus and Earth Pony cultures any way you want

I really do think that’s the answer, though. Holidays and traditions can change in only decades irl. There’s multiple generations between G4 and G5, and with everything that happened, the separation of the tribes, it definitely makes sense that holidays and traditions would develop or change. It’s a pretty logical change to me that has a basis in the real world. I do agree more background details on those traditions or holidays would be nice.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

As I will show, it's bad enough they have all these continuity errors with G4 but to have errors with itself?!

I chalk those up to issues with trying to have two shows run concurrently. And also just Hasbro’s incompetency with releasing things in general.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

So why does Twilight look the way she did throughout the series and not in her fully grown alicorn form?

I think Rafa’s explanation is the most likely here. It could also be that they just decided they didn’t like Twilight’s final alicorn form (I know I didn’t…) and wanted to use her regular form.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

Are you serious? One argument between 2 ponies sent the ENITRE kingdom into chaos?! That's hard enough to swallow by itself but this is Equstria, a kingdom founded on fraternal love and harmony between ponykind!

Didn’t something similar almost happen in one of the late season G4 episodes? I haven’t watched them in a while but I could swear something similar happened, caused by Cozy Glow, but everyone ended up coming together in the end.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

Although it would explain that thing spike can do with scrolls. Oh and the Dragon Lands, a harsh land full of volcanos, are a now a tropical island?

 I think the Dragon Lands and the Isle of Scaly are two separate locations, but I could be wrong. And as far as the dragons being quadrupeds now: in G4 we see that the older, elder dragons are also quadrupeds and not bipeds, like Torch. My theory is that’s just how dragons age.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

What happened to Ember?! You can't just put him in Ember's seat writers. Why couldn't you have him among the dragons but still have Ember there as dragon lord?

Like I said I think it’s a different location. I can’t recall if all the dragons were in hibernation or if it was just Spike and his gang. But if they weren’t all in hibernation like Spike I guess that’d explain why Ember doesn’t appear, she’s still in the Dragon Lands, not the Isle of Scaly.

17 hours ago, Casey Pones said:

So Opaline used dark magic to become a fire alicorn, an event which clashes with Opaline's own backstory about being born a fire alicorn (whatever that means.)

I… don’t remember it playing out like that?With how I understood it, Opaline was born an alicorn with fire powers. The dark magic ritual with the dragon fire was her regaining those fire powers she was born with before they were taken by Twilight.

On 3/3/2024 at 12:14 PM, Casey Pones said:

Sparky gets to live with his adopted father but who are his real parents? As Dragon Lord, wouldn't Spike feel a responsibility to return him to them?

Ehh. Sparky willingly choose to stay with Hitch so I don’t think there was much need to explore that. Even G4 never really explored Spike’s parents until that one infamous episode.

On 3/3/2024 at 12:14 PM, Casey Pones said:

Is Starlight Ridge in another reality like Canterlot High? How dumb is Alurea if she was fooled at all by that arts and crafts project? The snow all over Starlight Ridge is a cure for Alurea's mind-control?! How has she been able to do that with the cure literally all around?

I kind of figured it was either extremely far away from Equestria or another sort of dimension. Which is why they had to travel there via portal. And yeah Allura being fooled by the jank arts and craft show is a bit silly. I just play it off as cartoon logic honestly. I’m guessing the Auroracorns were too scared of Allura to stand up to her even with the snow countering her mind control.

On 3/3/2024 at 12:14 PM, Casey Pones said:

And I've just seen it get misused and mangled by people who don't seem to know what they are doing or don't care.

I don’t think it’s fair to say that they didn’t care. The show genuinely has too much effort and love put into it to say that none of the creators or actors cared. Maybe they wish they could’ve done things differently in hindsight but I really don’t think they were careless or just making this as a quick cash grab.

On 3/3/2024 at 12:14 PM, Casey Pones said:

In fact I've come to feel that these days the media industry no longer cares about it's audience. The big studios seem to think they can do whatever they want with whatever franchise, no matter how precious it is to fans and still make a ton of money out of it. And what's worse is that it seems to work out just like that over and over.

Ehhh to a degree. But this isn’t anything new. Remember the Star Wars holiday special? Or the mountains of direct to DVD Disney movies?

On 3/3/2024 at 12:14 PM, Casey Pones said:

The continuity with G4 and G5's own storytelling is so broken, I think best if not only way to fix it is for Hasbro to declare everything after A New Generation non-cannon and bring in someone like Boulder Media to remake the whole series from scratch. In fact, since I've heard there will be no more G5 episodes this year, I think we should use this window to circulate a petition to have Hasbro do just that.

I feel like they’re already trying to distance the series from G4 in TYT. Which I genuinely think will make the show better because they aren’t trying to follow in G4’s footsteps or attempt to stay within the confines of G4’s lore. I don’t think there’s any need to make it non-canon though… If someone really dislikes G5 that much they can just ignore it as if it never happened. G6, whenever that comes out, will probably be a whole new universe anyway. 

On 3/3/2024 at 12:14 PM, Casey Pones said:

Some of you might say that MYM has a big act to follow in FIM and that's why it didn't work out but I say these new people didn't put in an effort or care what we fans would think, either in it's connection to FIM or in it's own quality. I believe art is a serious matter and people have no excuse for not trying.

Like I said I really do think they’ve put in effort and care. And FiM was a big act to follow. People already had their expectations set sky high by G4. No matter what MYM and G5 ended up being I think someone was always going to end up disappointed.

I grew up with G4, I adore it. I love the characters, I love the show. And I’m genuinely pretty happy with G5. I look forward to the new TYT episode every week just like I used to with new G4 episodes on The Hub or Discovery Family. The lore inconsistencies or issues don’t really bug me because honestly? I never watched G4 or G5 for the lore. I watch it because of the characters and the stores involving them. And I really do like G5’s mane 6. Some I even like more than their G4 counterparts.

i don’t know. I get the issues and complaints fans like you have, I really do. But I just don’t share them. They just don’t bug me that much. Trust me I’ve been witness to sequels to shows or media that underwhelmed compared to the original. The Evangelion Rebuilds are a good example of this. I’m not a huge fan of them. I don’t like the characters they added or how they wrote some of the existing characters. It just completely invalidated what made them great in the original series. The Rebuilds in general kind of miss what made the original show so good. Even though Anno was involved with both.

I don’t think G5 really has those same issues though? At least they don’t bug me like they did in the Evangelion rebuilds, or they’re easier for me to just ignore or overlook. Like I said I get where you and other fans are coming from, but I just don’t share the same vitriol or feelings about G5. Those things, to me, don’t really take away from the show. Which at the end of the day I expect to be a cute, goofy cartoon. And G5 definitely satisfies that for me. 
 

Thank you for taking the time to write out that essay. I did enjoy reading and responding to it.

[North Star 4,540]

woah, that was some essay - some interesting stuff there! And I agree with most of it, despite liking MYM 

Totally agree that MYM doesn't nail its inclusion message - the film nailed that through Sunny and then MYM fluffed it. It was too easy to get the pony tribes to be friends again, so there wasn't much room for the sorts of conflicts that would call for mutual pony understanding.

I have always thought G5 would never live up to the idea of a living pony world. Lore and continuity hasn't been a thing for most of MLP's history after all. 

MYM's animation was variable, ranging from passable (chaps 4/5) to horrible (first chapter). They improved the feeling of living environments in chap 4, I thought. 

My fave things about MYM and TYT are the characters - I like their dynamic and I just... kinda like them  Sunny, Hitch, Pipp, Izzy and Zipp all pop for me, as do Misty and Opaline, and even a few background ones like Jazz, Posey, Alpha bittle and Queen Haven. I quite enjoyed a few of the character driven stories too, especially the Pipp/Zipp family eps :3

 

[Casey Pones 48]

On 2024-03-03 at 7:56 PM, Props Valroa said:

@Casey Pones

G4 has a lot of issues especially towards the end, but tacking G5 onto it just seems to compound the problem and make it over all worse.

Just remake it as a separate universe and come up with it's own world building. Problem solved. 

 

What G4 issues are you talking about?

And at times, it's almost like G5 is a separate universe.

[Props Valroa 26,048]

5 minutes ago, Casey Pones said:

What G4 issues are you talking about?

And at times, it's almost like G5 is a separate universe.

My main gripes with G4 were the final two seasons and the finale, but, G5 being its own universe without any references to G4 would have been preferable.

[Casey Pones 48]

On 2024-03-04 at 9:01 AM, Rafa Stary said:

No, Twilight is easily recognizable by her End of FiM apperance, that's not a good excuse to use her younger appearance, they more likely used it because her design from The Last Problem is stuck to the contract with Discovery Family supposedly along with several other stuff from G4. I guess it wouldn't be very interesting if they used only her voice so they had no choice but use her original Alicorn appearance, some say it wasn't actually her but the spirit of the tree of harmony, but that's theory territory.

Some of G4 is still held by Discovery Family? Why? And what things specifically?

3 minutes ago, Props Valroa said:

My main gripes with G4 were the final two seasons and the finale, but, G5 being its own universe without any references to G4 would have been preferable.

I thought opening a school of friendship was a good way of keeping the show fresh and opening up new possibilities.

[Casey Pones 48]

On 2024-03-04 at 8:32 PM, Iforgotmybrain said:

Didn’t something similar almost happen in one of the late season G4 episodes? I haven’t watched them in a while but I could swear something similar happened, caused by Cozy Glow, but everyone ended up coming together in the end.

Yes but it wasn't just 2 ponies. It was a mass smear campaign all over Equestria. And my point is represented here as it was what the Mane Six had taught their pupils about friendship that saved Equestria.

Edited March 10 by Casey Pones

[Casey Pones 48]

On 2024-03-04 at 8:32 PM, Iforgotmybrain said:

Like I said I think it’s a different location. I can’t recall if all the dragons were in hibernation or if it was just Spike and his gang. But if they weren’t all in hibernation like Spike I guess that’d explain why Ember doesn’t appear, she’s still in the Dragon Lands, not the Isle of Scaly.

Of course it was all the dragons, why would just a few hibernate?

On 2024-03-04 at 8:32 PM, Iforgotmybrain said:

I… don’t remember it playing out like that?With how I understood it, Opaline was born an alicorn with fire powers. The dark magic ritual with the dragon fire was her regaining those fire powers she was born with before they were taken by Twilight.

My own point about the backstory inconsistencies. 

On 2024-03-04 at 8:32 PM, Iforgotmybrain said:

Ehh. Sparky willingly choose to stay with Hitch so I don’t think there was much need to explore that. Even G4 never really explored Spike’s parents until that one infamous episode.

I know but didn't Spike or anyone think they should at least look into where Sparky came from? 

On 2024-03-04 at 8:32 PM, Iforgotmybrain said:

Ehh. Sparky willingly choose to stay with Hitch so I don’t think there was much need to explore that. Even G4 never really explored Spike’s parents until that one infamous episode.

Ehhh to a degree. But this isn’t anything new. Remember the Star Wars holiday special? Or the mountains of direct to DVD Disney movies?

On 2024-03-04 at 8:32 PM, Iforgotmybrain said:

Ehhh to a degree. But this isn’t anything new. Remember the Star Wars holiday special? Or the mountains of direct to DVD Disney movies?

By "these days" I meant the last 20 years. Should have been more specific.

I was indeed thinking of the direct to DVD Disney movies. You think they were bad for you to watch, how do you think I, a child of the 90s felt? 

in the last 20 years we also seen 90s and 80s movies and tv shows like Jurassic Park, Indiana Jones, Jumanji, Animaniacs, Tiny Toons, Ghostbusters the Wonder Years and all the hits of the Disney Renaissance get dragged out, dusted off and given lousy sequels or remakes. The only thinking they had behind them was to capitalize on nostalgia and existing fan bases. They just pander to fans these days yet give them nothing of what they want. And no effort is made for actual quality of story telling and they have no passion for the art behind them.

I know this is nothing new but it just feels it more common place now. And I'm not the only one who thinks so. people have agreed with my saying "we live in an age of creative decline." Which is all the more worse since humanity has a greater ability to create and share works now then any other point in history. Even recent history.

On 2024-03-04 at 8:32 PM, Iforgotmybrain said:

Like I said I really do think they’ve put in effort and care. And FiM was a big act to follow. People already had their expectations set sky high by G4. No matter what MYM and G5 ended up being I think someone was always going to end up disappointed.

.Well I think the reason it's a big act to follow is because those people put in the effort. more then most people these days and more then expected for this show.

MY expectations for MYM were high because of A New Generation. Since people put effort into that I assumed they would continue to do so.

And to me MYM isn't a show that's only bad when compared to something like FIM. It's bad on it own merits.

On 2024-03-04 at 10:01 PM, North Star said:

woah, that was some essay - some interesting stuff there! And I agree with most of it, despite liking MYM 

Totally agree that MYM doesn't nail its inclusion message - the film nailed that through Sunny and then MYM fluffed it. It was too easy to get the pony tribes to be friends again, so there wasn't much room for the sorts of conflicts that would call for mutual pony understanding.

I have always thought G5 would never live up to the idea of a living pony world. Lore and continuity hasn't been a thing for most of MLP's history after all. 

MYM's animation was variable, ranging from passable (chaps 4/5) to horrible (first chapter). They improved the feeling of living environments in chap 4, I thought. 

My fave things about MYM and TYT are the characters - I like their dynamic and I just... kinda like them  Sunny, Hitch, Pipp, Izzy and Zipp all pop for me, as do Misty and Opaline, and even a few background ones like Jazz, Posey, Alpha bittle and Queen Haven. I quite enjoyed a few of the character driven stories too, especially the Pipp/Zipp family eps :3

 

Actually I've always been impressed by G4's respect for it's lore and continuity.

[The Nth Doctor 652]

G5 becomes a lot better when you realize that it is its own separate thing like how My Little Pony, My Little Pony Tales, and the G3 movies were all their own things

Its depiction of Twilight Sparkle, Celestia, Luna, and Spike point to events of a completely different Friendship is Magic than the one we saw

But to each their own, since everyone wants something different from a show aimed at kids literally 1/4th the usual age of members of the Brony community who don't care about the deep lore or continuity with previous series

(Where were the Bronies upset with G4 for not following up on anything from G1/3? :P) Feels a little silly to do the same for G5

[CastletonSnob 3,025]

I wouldn't call it terrible, but it's definitely not as good as G4.

[Props Valroa 26,048]

@The Nth Doctor

I think the mistake G5 made was having any references to G4 at all, it should have just been its own universe completely.

[Rafa Stary 683]

On 2024-03-10 at 1:23 PM, Casey Pones said:

Some of G4 is still held by Discovery Family? Why? And what things specifically?

Sorry for the late reply, well, I think there is no info on what specifically is owned by them, but here is Equestria Daily talking about it.