Does this make me a "douche"?

[AegisReflector 886]

Okay, so I'm a radical leftist. I believe in a Socialist concept of government, albeit to the extreme as in pure communism but enough so that the government can reap off the benefits. Anyways, with these comes over beliefs such as pacifism, equal rights, stopping corruption, making the wealthy pay, etc.

 

All said and good, but just recently I dealt with an internet experience that virtually almost turned my life completely backwards.

 

I believe in the philosophy of "Soldiers are not heroes. They are tools of war." I honestly believe that military, and not just ours in general, are a waste of space and provides countries with an image of imperialism and evil intentions to weaker powers who try to disagree on some of their foreign policies. Soldiers are not heroes in the fact that there has been many coverted operations within our country that don't make headline news because it tells about our atrocities over in the Middle East. Yes, there are drone strike reports but so much else is happening right now.

 

Okay, whatever. Those are my beliefs. If you guys want me to get into it more I will most certaintly do so.

 

Anyways, I posted a status from the "Soldiers are not heroes..." FB page and commented about the kind of imperialism and oppression happening in the Middle East right now and called the soldiers nothing more than pawns. Left it at that.

 

Shitstorm happens. 17 close friends and a massive amount of strangers from my alma mater (high school) seemed compelled to make statuses behind my back criticizing me for my opinions. Hoping that I would enlist in the military and getting my head blown off by terrorists. Soldiers messaging me saying that they will beat the shit out of me. Idiots from out of left field who don't know anything about the military messaged me and with their "yolo swag" attitude thought would pop me a cap or two for my "un-American" behavior.

 

What exactly is the problem here? Just because I don't believe in war and think that soldier culture is a dangerous and savage lifestyle automatically makes me less of an American and that I should get the hell out of it? Being half Native American and a quarter Russian-Ukraine, having been called that plus a socialist, commie, savage, and "redfag" really offended me.

 

The most common complaint was that I was taking soldiers for granted because they protect our freedom of speech? How? According to the Declaration of Independence, we are born with inalienable rights, one of them being freedom of speech, press, assembly, liberty, property, etc. Plus, the same people who were complaining were trying to scare me with death threats. And even from some people I thought I truly known. The fuck is that about?

 

My close friend, who didn't get into the whole thing, said that my "antics" have spread like wildfire throughout the school, and that there's actually verbal fighting between liberals and conservatives all because of my one status. Gee, I just made one lousy status and it wasn't even that bad. Gimme a break already.

 

So, anyways, was I in the wrong to state my opinions? Are any of you military and if so are you offended? Love to hear from you!

[Dusty Soul 2,611]

You weren't wrong, though you weren't right.  I have to say that I agree with all but the radical Socialist thing.  Though people get offended from the simplest things.  You are fine to have your own opinions, but some people don't see it that way.  Freedom of speech is a friend.  It might have been better to not have made the post though.  Military is one of those things people are VERY passionate about.  So I'm in between, good luck in dealing with this whole thing.  

[Naught Important 433]

Honestly, I think Soldiers are tools of war who want to be tools of war. I'm certain that the majority of soldiers are told what to do, and not told to do what they want to do.

 

And no, there is absolutely nothing wrong with stating your opinion. Unfortunately for the people who have conflicting thoughts, then they have to suffer from the 70+% of mankind who don't accept others' opinions.

I know, because I hardly believe in God. Imagine how life is in America, where on the coin it says "In God we trust?"

[Titan Rising 2,156]

No. And am I offended?  No.  But I do think you are a bit naive.  While soldiers can be military dogs used as nothing more than obedient, unthinking, tools of war respect should be had for their intentions.  Many want to preserve freedom and gain the skill to keep their family and friends safe.

 

The idea that you consider this a savage idea boggles my mind.  Unless you are willing to give your life up so that you don't hurt someone else, you are probably going to have to defend yourself at some point in your life.  Even if you do live in a first world country.

[Алексей 110]

In my opinion, a Socialist society is one that could only function without humans. Capitalism works best for us shitty humans. I like the idea of Socialism, and, consider myself to be a Socialist, but, again, it just isn't a good system when you put humans into the equation.

As for the military thing, yeah, I think you are in the wrong, but you are entitled to your opinion. If you disagree with the soldiers being in Iraq, don't blame the soldiers, blame the ones that sent them there. The soldiers didn't go there with imperialist and evil intention(most, at least), they went there because they thought it was a righteous cause worth putting their lives on the line for. You have to have respect for soldiers, almost no matter who they are and what they are fighting for.

I don't think that is something that should've ignited heated debates all over your school, death threats, and other hate, though.

 

EDIT: I don't think I elaborated on the title of this thread as much as I should have. No, having an opinion doesn't make you a douche. Especially not solely because I disagree with your opinion.

Edited March 5, 2013 by Андрей

[Betez 1,734]

Not at all. In fact, it seems like your friends and all the people who threatened to beat you up are the real douches. You stood up for what you think is right, and they tried to inflict their opinions on you. You defended your opinion, and they attacked you.

[SørenWolf 227]

Look. I (respectfully) disagree with your views. but that dosent mean I can criticize you.  especially in the way you described here;

 

Shitstorm happens. 17 close friends and a massive amount of strangers from my alma mater (high school) seemed compelled to make statuses behind my back criticizing me for my opinions. Hoping that I would enlist in the military and getting my head blown off by terrorists. Soldiers messaging me saying that they will beat the shit out of me. Idiots from out of left field who don't know anything about the military messaged me and with their "yolo swag" attitude thought would pop me a cap or two for my "un-American" behavior.

 

 

These people are idiots, lets face it; the world if full of them. in short; no it dosent make you a "douche" it just revealed that so many other people are

[HunterTSN 1,444]

As much as they can be tools, the military is not a waste of space. America may act retarded and start unnecessary fights at times, but without the military we would be just like Canada (JK Canadians, I love you). Soldiers go out there and risk everything so that we can sit around at home with internet access discussing multicolored ponies. Without the military America wouldn't exist. I'm not blaming you, for I too am very left-wing liberal and I believe we as Americans put to much emphasis on our army and patriotism, but a country without a military won't be a country for long. The reason so many people rose up against you is because you insulted them on more then a personal scale. Lots of people lose friends, and family to war, and the last thing they want to here is that their loved ones died as tools. So at least be a little less rude when stating your opinions, nobody likes a hater.

Edited March 5, 2013 by TheSteampunkNinja (TSN)

[Krimson Dawn 17]

I am a radical rightest,  but I am not saying that what you did is wrong. I fully believe in military, small government, and if you are rich, 4/5 times you earned it. But you aren't wrong for posting your opinion an more power to you. A true friend wouldn't make comments like that without being civil first.

[Scootalove 10,684]

I really do believe that a lot of people want to live in a different government. But, I think that's why we have freedom in the United States. We try not to put our soldiers at risk but, that kind of government, I can't live in.

 

So I'll just sit on my chair, and wait for another government idea.

 

[hawkflame 3,310]

It was wrong of your friends to react the way they did, but you have to understand where their POV is coming from.  Like it or not, a lot of people enter into the army believing that it's the right thing to do and will save innocent American lives.  And they sacrifice a lot to do so.  Like it or not, to them you come across as an ingrate who doesn't appreciate that. 

 

People don't like being told that they or their friends wasted their lives for nothing. 

[Rainbow Dash 1,471]

Geez this is my sociology class all over again. I am a patriot and my views are different than yours. While i respect your views and opinions i would have to say you are and you aren't. Calling the Soldiers anything negative in today's society is the absolute worse thing you could possibly do. when it comes to Soldiers in the U.S. military the social Norm is you always support them and never talk to them about what they are. calling them tools of war or something close is like spitting in their face.

 So yes you kinda are. Some things you shouldnt post on Facebook. Although after my classes at an all liberal college i can see it your way. sometimes i wonder if we are really fighting for America or Big Oil companies. When it comes down to it, Soldiers made their decision; whether or not other people (especially politicians) agree with what they do. I also ask this question: would you consider enlisting much less actually enlist? 

[Dark Fox 151]

Support the soldiers, not the war, atrocities you've heard of do not represent the entirety of the US armed forces, generalizing an entire group of people based on the actions of a few are why the other side of your argument demonizes muslims and middle eastern people.

 

Paramedics work for the community and put their lives on the line to save others but often make mistakes, accidental or from negligence. Are all paramedics bad? No...Do most paramedics try their hardest to save lives? Probably

 

Police work for the state and put their lives on the line to protect people from criminals but often make mistakes, accidental or from negligence. Are all police bad? No...Can a decent amount of mistakes be attributed to fear and miscommunication? Probably

 

Soldiers work for the federal government and put their lives on the line to defend the nation from foreign offenders, soldiers also make mistakes, due to negligence or merely for following orders. Are all Soldiers bad? No...Can a decent amount of mistakes be attributed to lack of military intelligence, corruption from superior officers, PTSD and combat stress? Probably

 

You're not wrong for saying soldiers are tools for war, but you can't hold a soldier to the same ethical responsibility as the government giving the orders, sure they are told to question orders but how far can that go? A civilian can die because someone up the chain of command made a mistake. You know how many times a story about a soldier or police officer performing an act of kindness without bloodshed makes the headlines? Rarely

 

Dont be so cynical yo, if anyone is to blame it is the government giving the orders.

[FoxyCryptid 4,328]

All of you were wrong. While you have the right to voice your opinions, there's such a thing as having tact and watching what you post where. Also, while they have the right to disagree,  they shouldn't threaten you over it and cause a scene.  

 

But on the third hoof, you need to understand where they stand. These are people that have spent their lives fighting for what they believe in, fighting to protect their families back home, so you calling them useless weapons is a low blow.

 

It's not a black and white thing. are there soldiers just there to get paid and take orders? Yes, but there's also thousands that go because they believe in something and want to fight for it. 

Edited March 6, 2013 by Shoboni

[Midnight Seeker 302]

I was put off the idea of military life by a lot of elder family members as I was growing up. They all have served times in the armed forces (my father is ex-navy, many of my uncles are army and Royal air force and my grandfather fought in Italy during the second World War).

Reading history has also hardened my attitude towards war (and driven me towards socialism). Looking into the history of both world wars made me sick to my stomach, and reading up on Western interference with everyone else also horrified me.

My grandfather spent his life ashamed of his actions and despised the politicians that allowed the war to happen. My father pointed out to me that he (and two of my uncles) grew up in a slum and had to join the armed forces to escape that life. What he hated about the navy was that anyone from a wealthy background always ended up rising faster through the ranks than anyone else (Heaven help you if you had a better car than the officers, it would get scratched to hell and you would get all the shit duties).

All my family praise the fellowship of their forces, but they also all hate politicians and profiteers. My uncles went to Afghanistan and Iraq. Both have since left the army and are struggling to cope because it was the only life they knew and they have been given no assistance. Both of them grumble darkly about the friends that lost their lives in such a pointless conflict, and both have horror stories of the actions they have seen committed by our allies!

They demand that soldiers be respected, but they hate the war, and the politicians that caused it (anyone else notice a trend here?).

My advice to you AegisReflector is that you learn to pick your battles. You have the right ideas, but understand that you have to be careful that you don't antagonize people. It's never what you say, but how you say it and where.

[Pinguino~ 85]

You are one of the few that see though the veil. So no you are absolutly in the right. and the few that can see through are ridiculed  by the ones that cannot.

[AegisReflector 886]

I probably should have elaborated further. I wasn't asking you guys if you think my beliefs are right (I'm not THAT pretentious, heavens no ) but rather asking if expressing my beliefs via a mere FB page was a "douche" thing to do, or that I worded my statements in the wrong way. I deleted the original FB post so I can't exactly remember what I said but it's not like I called them anything extreme or wishing harm to them. It was just a simple calm and collected post like this one. Never thought I would get ragged on this much though when it first posted, lol. XP

 

So here's my whole thing on the matter. I'm completely fine if someone wants to go off and fight for their country. I can't change their direction, like someone who chooses to believe in religion, smoke weed, or get an abortion. It's their life, I can't change that. But the problem I have is how the government uses the military for their own dastardly political agenda. I can understand if we had the military so that if we feel like we are about to go under attack that we can act fast on the homefront and keep enemies at bay. But look at all the past post-WWII conflicts our military has been involved with.

 

Korea and Vietnam were all about containment, or stopping Communism, a belief that we didn't support. We were raised on a Capitalist foundation, so anything remotely different from our norm, even outside from us, must be weird and atrocious. Did we really have to go over to these places? What did we have to gain from this? To establish Capitalist governments that most of the people in that country didn't like in the first place? We lost both of these wars (no, it wasn't a stalemate, the Communists there had stronger batteries) and lost so many countless lives out of a theory that if we didn't stop the "red wave", they would try to come over here and infiltrate the US government. Well, Vietnam doesn't have any modern intention of starting beef with us. And yeah, while North Korea is testing nuclear weapons and has severe human rights issues, I'm pretty sure the UN wouldn't allow for an actual nuclear holocaust to go in effect. Plus, what happens in other countries shouldn't be our concern. We need to focus on our domestic problems, like the economy/unemployment issue. Bottom line, we were in those wars to imperalise and spread our Capitalist word to the masses and it failed miserably because we got too cocky.

 

Some type of deal over in Iraq and Afghanistan. At the end of WWII, we started to inflitrate the Middle East for two reasons: 1) To stop Communist Russia from spreading their ideals to the region; and 2) the black gold, oil. To make it so that these tactics go more smoothly, the US, along with Great Britain, France, and other allies, ascended many pro-US Shahs to the throne in exchange for loads of oil. The Shahs started to spread US ideals like Capitalism and Christianity. Do you think traditionalist Muslims were going to take that sitting down? That's when terrorist groups like al-Qaeda emerged, to release the rage bottled up inside many young Muslim students at the time when pro-Muslim movements was at its core. They didn't want a Western government. They wanted to go back to the way things were. Hence the 1979 Iranian Hostage Crisis and the tragic days of 9/11. Now, with the current wars going on over there, nothing is/was being obtained over there. Bush failed with his WOMD theory. The infamous Abu Gharib prison abuse detailed Muslims getting the harshest treatment by US soldiers under orders from their Generals (and they were innocent political leaders too who outspoke against the US regime). Drone strikes target and kill innocent civilians to this very day.

 

Bottom line, we are in these conflicts for very selfish reasons. It's not "salvation" or trying to rid the world of evil. Its culture clashes. Same deal happened with the Crusades.

 

And to those of you who say that the soldiers protect our rights, I highly disagree. Take it from my standpoint, as a half Native American. Just like the Declaration of Independence, we believe in inalienable rights, and that we are born to the freedom of speech and choice and whatnot. How did soldiers protect that when they in the past slaughtered Native Americans? How are they doing that today killing innocent lives over in the Middle East? Because they don't like our lifestyles? That just doesn't sit right with me. Anyways, I believe that we carry free will on our own accord, and that it's the only "card" war supporters lay out because other defenses just don't seem to work.

[Clover Heart 978]

I don't think what you posted is wrong. While I agree with your views, whether I agree with you or not is irrelevant. You have the right to post your opinions on your own page without people giving you a hard time about it.

 

However, I think you do need to realize that our society, currently, is extremely pro-military, and even people who are neutral or even slightly left "support our troops." I don't think you deserved that kind of backlash, but at the same time, I couldn't really have expected any other outcome. Before I read about what happened as a result, I thought "Wow, he's gonna get 50 thousand people at his throat, isn't he?"

 

For the people simply saying that they disagree with you, that's fully within their right, and they deserve to express and defend their opinions. However, nobody should be calling you names just because you don't agree with their point of view, and nobody should be threatening you for any reason whatsoever, regardless of what you said. Name-calling, while childish and wrong, I don't think you can do much about, no matter how offensive. However, for the people threatening you, I think if you really feel threatened and it's worth your time, you might be able to take action against these people.

 

Anyway, no, you weren't wrong to post your opinion. And is it total bullcrap for people to gang up on you? Yes. Is it total bullcrap that you can't even express a dissenting opinion without people being outraged? Yes. Is it total bullcrap that people don't even allow for any discussion about this topic? Yes. However, unless you're willing to crusade against these people and keep up constant conversations about why you think they're wrong, maybe it's just best to move on. And now you know for next time... people can be dicks about this kind of thing.

 

And just reading about the whole "freedom of speech" thing made me laugh. What do they think, that they're fighting in the Revolutionary War or something? Though, that, I could actually get behind.

Edited March 5, 2013 by Clover Heart

[AegisReflector 886]

I understand that people disagree with my views. I used to live in a very Conservative neighborhood so I basically got heat everyday from someone who just wanted to always get that "commie" remark in. It's quite impressive how much they can keep it up.

[PfcRich 19]

Yeah, but were all douches haha. I don't care what your beliefs are but people giving you grief about them are are always in the wrong.You have the right to think anyway you want to, thats one of the things that make this country awesome that and Kansas City style barbecue. Also military members are not "obedient, unthinking, tools of war." The old excuse of just following orders is as bullshit now as it ever was. One does not have to follow an order they think is unlawful, and I would hope most the men and women I work with would do so even if it would put themselfs in peril.

[Master Blade the Bearded 112]

First off, stating your opinion does not make you a douche. If anything, the others who attacked you for your opinion are.

 

That being said, I do at least partially agree with you. America has gotten herself into many a thing she had no business in, but what's past is past. Like what you said about the killing of Native Americans. That's just wrong. A military should be used for defense and retaliation for acts of war brought upon by foreign nations.

Though I disagree with you about soldiers not protecting our rights. They do. We need a military to protect our country, and by extension, the rights that come with that country.

 

Now, I probably have a biased opinion, as I am going to join the Marines, but I join not for love of war, but instead for the ideals that America says she stands for. The protection people, not the mindless killing of them. The equality of all people.

 

Besides, article 92 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice states that you have to obey any lawful order, emphasis on lawful. I think ethical should be added to that. I know at least one country has that, but I can't remember which one right off of the top of my head. Russia, maybe. I plan on using this to its fullest extent.

 

God and country, that is who I choose to fight for.

[Just some guy 1,070]

Goddamn pinko!GIT OFF OUR LAND OF 'MURICA!!

I kid,I kid.Anyways...

 

What you posted?Totally fine.The fact that the very soldiers who are "protecting" your freedom of speech are condemning you for speaking out against them is ironic and wrong,but there's not much you can do about that in the US.Like others said,we idolize our soldiers because we,as Americans,believe that might makes right,hence the heavy pro-militarism most US citizens seem to have.We're lead to believe that we should want to be soldiers because of all the propaganda and media that display them as super badass squadrons of death when,in reality,they'd most likely end up as a statistic to the masses.

[Beta 42]

If the actual question here is if you were being a dbag or not, then I'm going to have to say yes. I'm going to leave my own opinions out of this post for the most part because I have no intention in getting into a debate about the war or the ways that soldiers serve.

 

I definitely think you have the right to your opinion, as does everyone. I also believe in freedom of speech. A lot of people interpret free speech as being able to say whatever you want, whenever you want. Of course, you have proved that to be mostly true, but I think that responsibility should play in. If you truly posted that status not expecting attention or an argument from someone, then you are naive.

 

The same goes for any debatable subject really...religion, for example. I'm not personally very religious and I have my own opinions about it. However, I know better than to post a status update or go into a public place and state how I think others are wrong or how I disagree with Christianity. I mean, I very well could if I wanted to start a ruckus, but is that really polite or mature of me? You have got to know your audience and the right time and place. Choose your battles, I say.

[hawkflame 3,310]

Korea and Vietnam were all about containment, or stopping Communism, a belief that we didn't support. We were raised on a Capitalist foundation, so anything remotely different from our norm, even outside from us, must be weird and atrocious. Did we really have to go over to these places? What did we have to gain from this? To establish Capitalist governments that most of the people in that country didn't like in the first place? We lost both of these wars (no, it wasn't a stalemate, the Communists there had stronger batteries) and lost so many countless lives out of a theory that if we didn't stop the "red wave", they would try to come over here and infiltrate the US government. Well, Vietnam doesn't have any modern intention of starting beef with us. And yeah, while North Korea is testing nuclear weapons and has severe human rights issues, I'm pretty sure the UN wouldn't allow for an actual nuclear holocaust to go in effect. Plus, what happens in other countries shouldn't be our concern. We need to focus on our domestic problems, like the economy/unemployment issue. Bottom line, we were in those wars to imperalise and spread our Capitalist word to the masses and it failed miserably because we got too cocky.

 

 

With all due respect, at least regarding Korea, if it wasn't for MacArthur landing at Inchon, I'd be living under the roof of the most dangerous government in the world right now.  (I know hindsight is 20/20 and Syngman Rhee was as brutal a dictator as Kim Il Sung, but you can't say that the US presence/support didn't help turn the tide in that war).   If not for US involvement, South Korea wouldn't be the successful country that it is today.   

 

Back to the crux of the issue, though; you aren't a douche for expressing your opinion in the way that you did.  I, however, would tread more carefully around that issue, though, because you could very easily be perceived as being anti-troops, as opposed to anti-military. Remember, people don't join the military just because they want to kill innocents.  They do so because they really feel the need to serve their country

[Cupcake Ice Cream 436]

Okay, so I'm a radical leftist. I believe in a Socialist concept of government, albeit to the extreme as in pure communism but enough so that the government can reap off the benefits. Anyways, with these comes over beliefs such as pacifism, equal rights, stopping corruption, making the wealthy pay, etc.

 

All said and good, but just recently I dealt with an internet experience that virtually almost turned my life completely backwards.

 

I believe in the philosophy of "Soldiers are not heroes. They are tools of war." I honestly believe that military, and not just ours in general, are a waste of space and provides countries with an image of imperialism and evil intentions to weaker powers who try to disagree on some of their foreign policies. Soldiers are not heroes in the fact that there has been many coverted operations within our country that don't make headline news because it tells about our atrocities over in the Middle East. Yes, there are drone strike reports but so much else is happening right now.

 

Okay, whatever. Those are my beliefs. If you guys want me to get into it more I will most certaintly do so.

 

Anyways, I posted a status from the "Soldiers are not heroes..." FB page and commented about the kind of imperialism and oppression happening in the Middle East right now and called the soldiers nothing more than pawns. Left it at that.

 

Shitstorm happens. 17 close friends and a massive amount of strangers from my alma mater (high school) seemed compelled to make statuses behind my back criticizing me for my opinions. Hoping that I would enlist in the military and getting my head blown off by terrorists. Soldiers messaging me saying that they will beat the shit out of me. Idiots from out of left field who don't know anything about the military messaged me and with their "yolo swag" attitude thought would pop me a cap or two for my "un-American" behavior.

 

What exactly is the problem here? Just because I don't believe in war and think that soldier culture is a dangerous and savage lifestyle automatically makes me less of an American and that I should get the hell out of it? Being half Native American and a quarter Russian-Ukraine, having been called that plus a socialist, commie, savage, and "redfag" really offended me.

 

The most common complaint was that I was taking soldiers for granted because they protect our freedom of speech? How? According to the Declaration of Independence, we are born with inalienable rights, one of them being freedom of speech, press, assembly, liberty, property, etc. Plus, the same people who were complaining were trying to scare me with death threats. And even from some people I thought I truly known. The fuck is that about?

 

My close friend, who didn't get into the whole thing, said that my "antics" have spread like wildfire throughout the school, and that there's actually verbal fighting between liberals and conservatives all because of my one status. Gee, I just made one lousy status and it wasn't even that bad. Gimme a break already.

 

So, anyways, was I in the wrong to state my opinions? Are any of you military and if so are you offended? Love to hear from you!

Good evening...I don't know you and you don't know me but I will say the following

 

I AM a veteran...a live, in-person veteran  from the active duty military

 

I too am a Socialist (doesn't mix well believe me) in the old days being a Socialist openly could cause you to lose security clearances and positions. 

 

Anyway...as a former solder I will say this

 

You have every right to call me an industrial tool of the man...why? because you have that right

 

I am so sick of these fanatical patriots who believe in the constitution but don't want to offer the free speech to those who don't agree. When I became a sergeant in the AF I was given some conflicting messages...and I followed the second

 

1. "SSgt G****, you are an NCO now.by virtue a leader. You need to perform and defend and blah blah." - Now I do believe this. NCO's are they linchpins...I believe NCO's are the leaders of the enlisted class and that's all fine...

 

but then I heard something that made me feel like a REAL soldier

 

2. "SSgt G****, I'm going to tell you a secret. A real soldier is a person who will fight for the flag one day, and be proud that he gave a flag burner the right, the next day."

 

THAT is a soldier. Fight for actual freedom...because guess what...some people won't agree with your ideas.

 

OP, you're not a douche...if you did it to flame then yes you are...but if you believe it...then be who you are

 

This soldier salutes your use of freedom of speech