My Little Meditation: Destiny and MLP

[BalanceBrony 259]

*WARNING: HEAVY PHILOSOPHICAL CONTENT. IF UNINTERESTED, DON'T WASTE TIME*

 

~Introduction~

 

So, the notion of destiny is one that I have always found interesting, due to the fact that my motto "Everything happens for a reason" pretty much reflects this idea- the idea that all things a part of a predetermined causal chain which is leading to something greater than any one of us. I first realised that this tied to MLP after watching Digibrony's discussion of free will. Digibrony's videos sparked some ideas in my head.

 

 

And I also decided to watch Bionicle on a whim one day, which brought about more ideas.

 

That being said, let us begin.

 

~What is Destiny?~

 

I feel before we truly dive into how destiny is applied to Equestrian life, it is important to note what "destiny" actually is. In any discussion, it is important to establish definitions early on, to prevent misunderstandings and smooth discussion out. As I normally do in discussion, I start with the dictionary definition:

 

des·ti·ny

ˈdestinē/

noun

noun: destiny; plural noun: destinies

1.

the events that will necessarily happen to a particular person or thing in the future.

 

This is what the dictionary has to say about destiny. It is a causal path which one must necessarily go down. Meaning, you have no choice. But there is another concept which you have no choice in, which is completely separate from destiny.

 

~Duty vs. Destiny~

 

This is a distinction which I feel must necessarily be made, because these two things are completely different, yet related, ideas. For anypony who is familiar with the Bionicle fandom, you will know what I am talking about.

 

Duty and Destiny are two of the three virtues. They are interconnected, as opposed to the somewhat isolated virtue of unity. They are concepts which have similarities and differences, but they are so close that nopony who has not dealt with Bionicle would separate them. But to those from within the fandom, the difference is very clear.

 

Duty and Destiny are very similar concepts. Both refer to an aspect of your life path which you have no control over. You have no choice with regards to your Duty and Destiny. This similarity is, I feel, the one that prevents people from seeing the subtle, but very important difference between the two.

 

The difference lies in what the terms mean. Duty refers to the specific niche which you are suited to. This is your role in the big picture. This is where you fit in the machine of society. Destiny refers to some grander arc in the story of your life. Duty is very much in the now. It is where you are at as you progress down the path of life. Duties can change, depending on how things around you change.

 

But Destiny refers to the whole plot. It covers a much broader scope than simply doing your duty to society. Your duty is certainly a part of your destiny, and it can even lead directly to the final destination of your life, which is the other common usage of destiny. But your duty is not always synonymous with your destiny. To best illustrate this point, let us actually turn to MLP.

 

~Duty vs. Destiny in MLP~

To better point out how this distinction applies, let's cover the notion of cutie marks. Cutie marks are a very shaky thing, in terms of this discussion. They mark what a pony is best suited to do in their life. As such, cutie marks seem to outline a pony's duty- their role in society. Yet, we see in Magical Mystery Cure that the ponies relate their cutie marks to their destiny. Is this truly the proper use of the term? I would argue that no, it is not.

 

Here's my reasoning. In most cases in pony society, we see the case where duty and destiny are pretty much synonymous. For most ponies, their sole purpose and path in life is simply to do their duty to Equestrian society. But we do see exceptions to this rule, in terms of the Mane Six, and the Celestial Sisters. In all of these cases, the duty of the character (defined by their cutie mark) has not been their whole path. The Mane Six are united in one destiny. They represent the Elements of Harmony, and their destiny is to be the protection of Equestria from the forces of disharmony.

 

From the moment when they simultaneously received their cutie marks, it was clear that their life path was shared. Their duties all lead them to a common destiny. This is further shown in Friendship is Magic Part 1 & 2. All of the ponies were acting in their duty to make the Summer Sun Celebration happen, but they discovered a greater path which transcends their cutie marks the moment they united in the quest to save the Princess. This is a shining example of the fact that their destiny, while connected to their duty, was not synonymous with it.

 

This is also seen in the Celestial Sisters. Their duty of raising the sun and moon are not their destiny. Their destiny was to find the pony who would learn the power of friendship, to change Equestria forever. To go into headcanon territory for a moment here, I think that the EoH did not work properly for the Princesses because they did not fully grasp how the EoH worked. I think more so that it was just the Princesses' raw power being channeled through the EoH which made things happen. This would also explain why the EoH did not work the same way for the Mane Six as they did for the Princesses.

 

This is opposed to the use of the EoH being used by ponies who actually emulate the true power of the artifacts. The Princesses were acting outside of their niche when they used the EoH, so they did not function properly, like how a Bionicle wearing the wrong mask cannot use its full power. The Princesses had to find a pony who emulated pure magic, because only such a pony could be the 6th element, and truly understand the EoH.

 

But their first attempts at this failed. Starswirl the bearded and Sunset Shimmer, while good at magic, were simply not destined to understand the EoH. If there weren't something beyond cutie marks, why couldn't these other star pupils figure out the EoH?

 

The answer is destiny. Despite Starswirl and Sunset having the duty to serve as ponies who are good at magic, they could not utilise the most powerful magic of all. No amount of knowledge and study was enough. So cutie marks alone do not define a whole pony's path. There is something more, and that something is destiny. So clearly, there is a distinction in Equestria between destiny and duty, despite the fact that it is unacknowledged. But where does that leave us?

 

~The Big Picture~

So, we have established that there is a difference between duty and destiny in Equestria. So what? So, it adds a whole new layer to Equestrian society. When you make the distinction between a grander destiny versus a mundane duty, the story has a whole new element of "where will their cutie mark lead them?" or "what great things can we expect from this simple pony?"

 

This distinction also adds to the idea that everypony has a purpose. Even if a pony doesn't have some grand arc, or big involvement, they still have a purpose. If you simply stick with cutie marks, and that's it, it kind of removes some depth from the characters. But if you accept that their is something beyond simply pulling a plough, or bucking apples, the whole thing acquires a new level of awe and detail.

 

In summary, the distinction between duty vs. destiny takes us even deeper. It becomes even more clear that in Equestria, everypony has a reason for existing. One point Digibrony makes is that being bound to a cutie mark would, in a realistic situation, result in some ponies just being screwed. But if you accept that there is something beyond the cutie mark, that problem vanishes.

 

It is a very liberating notion when we accept that everypony has a purpose. I don't get the whole opposition to determinism in our society. Isn't it good to believe that everypony has a reason for existing? That nothing is without purpose? That is why I love the notions of duty and destiny. It means that there is something more... something beyond us. And when you find that meaning, life just seems so much more awesome. You get a whole new eye for existence. If we accept that all things have purpose, it can breed notions of tolerance and understanding. If we accept something greater, we become a step closer to knowing that existence really is a stunning work of art... With everypony playing their part in the symphony of life, and accepting that everypony has a major role, we come that much closer to a transcendent Harmony, and greater Peace.

 

What are your thoughts everypony? I know this was an enormous waffle, but I had a lot to say. I look forward to reading your ideas and reactions!

[Winona the Dog 1,984]

That's a pretty well thought out passage. I admire your ability to think all of this out as it does take alot of philosophical thinking. I'm a bit irked to really understand all of this destiny stuff as the show points out even though it's pre-determined, it CAN change based on their decisions.

[BalanceBrony 259]

That's a pretty well thought out passage. I admire your ability to think all of this out as it does take alot of philosophical thinking. I'm a bit irked to really understand all of this destiny stuff as the show points out even though it's pre-determined, it CAN change based on their decisions.

But are there really decisions involved? One example I always like to point out is the idea that I have every capacity to murder somepony. It would be easy to do, and I could probably get away with it. But my nature means that I will never do it. You can argue many different points, yet looking back, could you imagine life happening any other way than the way it happened?

 

I can't. So many things have happened to me in life, and shaped me based on the way I naturally reacted to them. Looking back, every choice I made doesn't seem like much of a choice, as looking back I would not have chosen any different. So the point is, do we really choose? Or is the innate nature of our soul the real driving force behind out actions? Is there any going against the way that you are? Could you really choose to do something so contradictory to you that your very being fights against it?

 

The thing that made me believe in destiny was this train of thought. I noticed that, after reflecting on things, I would not even consider altering any of my choices. Looking back, the only right choices seemed to be the ones I made. So it seems like there really was no choice. In the moment, you may think you are making a choice, and indeed you are. But when you look at the grand scheme of things, you can only imagine it happening one way- the way that it happened.

 

I think this is because of the time dilution effect. As you move forward in your life, past choices seem less and less significant as time goes by. At the moment you make a decision, your brain is projecting many different possibilities. But once you go further down the path of a choice, those possibilities seem to vanish, as you begin to realise that the reality you "chose" is already so much different than the one you thought you chose. Decisions are fleeting, and in the end, when we are nearing our end, it seems like none of them really counted. Everything led up to that moment. You could not imagine your life having gone any other way.

 

And this is why I'm of the opinion that, though we may make fleeting choices, in the end they will become illusory. The unique eye of life's experience changes so many things. And sometimes it can be hard to imagine seeing with that eye. But I know that one day, I will see with that eye, if I don't already. But until that becomes out eye, we will remain affirmed in our views. The eye of experience has taught me that my life happened the way it did for a reason, though I do not know it yet. But as I see all of the things which led up to who I am now, and all of the interactions I've had with the web of existence, other possibilities are so infinitely far away that they do not exist for me.

 

Somewhere, there will be a me that made a different choice. But for the purposes of my limited paradigm, some other me universes away is irrelevant to my existence here. The me that matters is the one that is here and now, and I would not want to be any other me than the one I am, nor do I wish I made any choices that I haven't already. No regrets, no guilts. It all happened for a reason, though it yet escapes me. But I'm sure it will become clearer down the line, when my eyes of experience have become stronger. But for now, I live here, and simply press on. The past is past, and will not change, so I would not imagine any change befalling it. In the present, I will make my choices that shape the future. But once the future is nigh, even these decisions will vanish into a spiraling mist.

 

So, that was quite the lengthy response, I am sure, and perhaps but a little incomprehensible. I am quite tired right now. But I hope it is clear enough to get my point across. My life has taught me that destiny is real. It may turn out different for you, as everypony has different vision. But this is what works for me. And I would not change that which is not flawed in application, so far as my life is concerned. So yeah, I look forward to hearing more of your thoughts.

[aoEAF2FBvC0MIo2Q 3,676]

Just going to say this first and foremost; I only watched the video. I'm up early because I couldn't sleep because of a loud thunderstorm.

 

Alright then. What I found really interesting is what grows out of each belief system. Destiny vs the American dream/free will. Let's start with the latter; it was mentioned that people can change, that they have control in their lives. Pretty easy to see how this judgmental "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" mentality emerged from it. It also means that you don't really have flaws but instead they are seen as you making flawed choices or choosing to be flawed if you prove to have an inability to change for the better at practically a whim. Unless you attain absolute perfection, there's always something to be ashamed of because it is your choice to do what it takes to eliminate your flaws, no matter how tiny.

 

Now for what emerges from the belief of Destiny. What really got me intrigued was how from this belief emerge a greater disposition to accept people as they are which also makes it easier for individuals to accept themselves for who they are -- to be satisfied with the contributions you make be they big or small. What I see this doing is also give ponies better protection against self-loathing and therefor protects them from all the detrimental health effects that comes with chronic self-loathing. It may also protect ponies from feeling jealousy since the concept of destiny makes it much easier to accept that some people are better at certain things than you are. Another thing I see emerging from this is that it also gets ponies to pursue their own interests and passions much more readily and go after their own potential without having to care as much about how they will compare to others. I think what gives many people nightmares is doing your best without it ending up being good enough which will give the message that they are not good enough. Another thing this belief system can give more protection against is going too far in trying to be someone or something you are in fact not (which is also bad for your health it turns out).

 

My conclusion to this is that this concept of destiny is a belief that is much more healthy to hold than free will. The finer details to this idea needs to be worked out though.

[BalanceBrony 259]

Just going to say this first and foremost; I only watched the video. I'm up early because I couldn't sleep because of a loud thunderstorm.

 

Alright then. What I found really interesting is what grows out of each belief system. Destiny vs the American dream/free will. Let's start with the latter; it was mentioned that people can change, that they have control in their lives. Pretty easy to see how this judgmental "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" mentality emerged from it. It also means that you don't really have flaws but instead they are seen as you making flawed choices or choosing to be flawed if you prove to have an inability to change for the better at practically a whim. Unless you attain absolute perfection, there's always something to be ashamed of because it is your choice to do what it takes to eliminate your flaws, no matter how tiny.

 

Now for what emerges from the belief of Destiny. What really got me intrigued was how from this belief emerge a greater disposition to accept people as they are which also makes it easier for individuals to accept themselves for who they are -- to be satisfied with the contributions you make be they big or small. What I see this doing is also give ponies better protection against self-loathing and therefor protects them from all the detrimental health effects that comes with chronic self-loathing. It may also protect ponies from feeling jealousy since the concept of destiny makes it much easier to accept that some people are better at certain things than you are. Another thing I see emerging from this is that it also gets ponies to pursue their own interests and passions much more readily and go after their own potential without having to care as much about how they will compare to others. I think what gives many people nightmares is doing your best without it ending up being good enough which will give the message that they are not good enough. Another thing this belief system can give more protection against is going too far in trying to be someone or something you are in fact not (which is also bad for your health it turns out).

 

My conclusion to this is that this concept of destiny is a belief that is much more healthy to hold than free will. The finer details to this idea needs to be worked out though.

Ahh. Free will vs. destiny. I never looked at it in terms of pros and cons. But your views in that regard do make a lot of sense. But as for the notion of one existing and not the other, well check out my response to Goodra. It sums up very nicely what my beliefs are. It's long, but I would say that, among the many posts I have made, ones as clear and thorough as that one are not very common. I won't post it again because its so long. I just wanted to make sure your valid arguments were recognised.

[aoEAF2FBvC0MIo2Q 3,676]

Ahh. Free will vs. destiny. I never looked at it in terms of pros and cons. But your views in that regard do make a lot of sense. But as for the notion of one existing and not the other, well check out my response to Goodra. It sums up very nicely what my beliefs are. It's long, but I would say that, among the many posts I have made, ones as clear and thorough as that one are not very common. I won't post it again because its so long. I just wanted to make sure your valid arguments were recognised.

Thank you. Well, increasingly I've been getting less concerned with how "real" belief systems are and instead more concerned with what emerges from them. Your belief systems affect your behavior in an input-output kind of way (be sure to also consider your own physiological responses as output). So far it looks like destiny is the more beneficial belief system though right now I'm wondering if my argument on it may be truncated.

[BalanceBrony 259]

Thank you. Well, increasingly I've been getting less concerned with how "real" belief systems are and instead more concerned with what emerges from them. Your belief systems affect your behavior in an input-output kind of way (be sure to also consider your own physiological responses as output). So far it looks like destiny is the more beneficial belief system though right now I'm wondering if my argument on it may be truncated.

While shortening your argument can be good at times, make sure you preserve the long form somewhere. If you become too familiar with it, some aspects might just become accepted in your paradigm. But to other people, things you have accepted might require elaboration. Whenever I first make a solid argument, I copy and paste it into word, then save it. That way, if I ever get into a more intense debate, I will have the more thorough argument to reference.