Flaws the show has.

[Thrond 3,263]

4 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

This has been a problem for the show for a while; I blame the constant writer changes. That said, I wouldn't even put Forever Filly in the same category as Honest Apple, Rarity was nowhere near the level of cluelessness that Applejack was, not to mention that while awkwardly put, FF had a clear, relatable lesson. I still have no idea what the mess that was HA was goin for.

1

Honestly, at least Applejack was encouraged to be blunt and merely didn't realize how rude she was. Rarity seemed completely oblivious to Sweetie Belle's feelings until they were spelled out to her. I thought "Honest Apple" was trying to point out that even things you don't understand have a lot of work put into them, but it could have been executed better. 

4 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

Looking past that though, Bow and Windy didn't ignore their daughters concerns. During the private air show, there was no yelling or overblown cheering, just entirely appropriate noises of appreciation. They listened to their daughter and made an immediate change. They didn't even get upset with her at how she treated them. I don't think they really had to learn anything. On top of which, they weren't the focus of the episode, Scoots and Dash were, so they lesson between them got the focus; there are only 22 mins per episode, they can't show everything.

1

I think I was disappointed that, despite half of the jokes in the episode amounting to "these parents are really bothering Rainbow Dash," there's no stated moral about that. It felt to me like it didn't fit the rest of the episode. I forgot about how they reacted to the private air show, however, perhaps because it ended with the three of them loudly cheering Scootaloo. I know Scootaloo likes that sort of thing, but without the parents' lesson actually being stated, it felt like it was encouraging such over-enthusiastic parenting. 

4 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

If everything thing that happened was, in a sense, predestined, I have a hard time blaming Starlight for doing exactly what she was supposed to do.

 

I fundamentally disagree with the show's use of predestination, and am very troubled by Starlight becoming useful for her questionable impulses. I can't help but think that not everybody would be as receptive to being helped in this way. 

4 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

I'd also like to point out that Celestia had nothing critical to say to Twilight after her Lesson Zero fiasco, an event I still consider to be the least excusable misuse of magic in the show.

 

I dunno, she seemed fairly disapproving when she first arrived and only brightened up when Twilight had apologized and her friends had vouched for her. I feel like this case is more like "All Bottled Up," where no punishment was in order because the offending pony cleaned up their mess and understood what they did wrong. 

4 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

Again, 22 mins isn't a lot of time. 

All I ask for is a few lines. Either Starlight getting the princesses to agree to the swap, or one of the princesses requesting at the end that Starlight warn them next time. Either of those would have helped a great deal. With this particular episode, it may very well have had not even a second to spare, but that doesn't make this aspect any more troubling to me. 

To be clear, I quite enjoyed both "Parental Glideance" and "A Royal Problem."

3 hours ago, Prowl said:

28PL is one of the most vindictive episodes in the show with a lot of the blame lying on the ponies, notably AJ and Rarity for goading RD into putting more effort into her pranks, and has by far some of the worst disproportionate retribution in the whole show.

I understand that to an extent, which is why I didn't try to justify my own reaction to it. I don't really have an explanation - it just didn't bother me as much. Although, I only perceived AJ and Rarity's goading as them stating their case improperly, and thought that was corrected by the five rephrasing it at the end. 

3 hours ago, Prowl said:

I don't know what universe some critics are from to believe RD's outburst was acceptable behavior

I specifically said the moral was "unbalanced" - there was definitely something to be taught on both sides. 

3 hours ago, Prowl said:

As for ARP, Starlight was grilled for using magic on the Royal Sisters, and unlike past episodes, she didn't do it out of laziness or maliciousness, she did it under risk and desperation, but with good intentions

In the final scenes, she's told she did the right thing, and that's the final word on it, so that's the only part which I think matters. And good intentions don't necessarily make good actions. 

2 hours ago, ShootingStar159 said:

We saw lots of ponies use magic in their dreams in Do Princesses Dream of Magic Sheep, even Big Mac who's never used magic before. My assumption was that she couldn't use magic because of how helpless she felt.

The dream in "Magic Sheep" seemed a lot more lucid than Starlight's. 

 

Edited August 2, 2017 by AlexanderThrond

[ShootingStar159 2,157]

3 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

The dream in "Magic Sheep" seemed a lot more lucid than Starlight's. 

True, Starlight doesn't seem aware that she's dreaming, but I think that reinforces my idea. If she was aware, then it's her dream to control, not a situation she can't do anything about.

 

13 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

All I ask for is a few lines. Either Starlight getting the princesses to agree to the swap, or one of the princesses requesting at the end that Starlight warn them next time. Either of those would have helped a great deal. With this particular episode, it may very well have had not even a second to spare, but that doesn't make this aspect any more troubling to me.  

In the final scenes, she's told she did the right thing, and that's the final word on it, so that's the only part which I think matters. And good intentions don't necessarily make good actions. 

If Starlight had asked first, she wouldn't have felt guilty about what she did, that she had "driven them apart". No guilt, no nightmare; no nightmare, and Celestia wouldn't have had to face the idea of the worst case scenario, as well as had to deal with a nightmare as powerful as Daybreaker. Without that, I doubt Celestia would have truly experienced how hard Luna's job is, and she wouldn't have gained the empathy to repair their relationship. Everything worked out perfectly in the end, and Starlight acknowledged what she did was reckless. Luna identifies with Starlight on a personal level, and Celestia isn't the type to hit someone when they're already down, so I find their actions at the end completely within character.

23 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

I fundamentally disagree with the show's use of predestination, and am very troubled by Starlight becoming useful for her questionable impulses. I can't help but think that not everybody would be as receptive to being helped in this way. 

Yep, not that big a fan of it myself, but predestination is a pretty common theme in fantasy, and it really hasn't been used much in this series. As such, I don't have much of a problem with it now; if it starts to become more common, I'll have to rethink my position on that.

And yeah, most people would react the same way the princesses did in this situation, angrily. It's also worth noting that if this was all predestined, having Starlight forcibly switch there Cutie marks like that is still pretty extreme. So, this is just a theory I've been kicking around in my head.

When Daybreaker first appeared, I, and I know a few others first reaction was 'Wow, Starlight, way to think up the absolute worst case scenario.' But after spending way too much time rewatching and thinking about the episode, I started to wonder if Starlight was right. Luna first turned into NMM for very similar reasons, that she wasn't being appreciated enough. What if the same thing happened again? There is a line that Daybreaker says in the dream, that she should have destroyed NMM instead of banishing her. What if seeing Luna turn again breaks something in Celestia, and her own bitterness towards her sister turns her in into Daybreaker, to punish Luna and ensure she never threatens anyone again.

Its really just a theory I had, but if it were true, it would explain why something as drastic as sending Starlight needed to be done.

39 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

To be clear, I quite enjoyed both "Parental Glideance" and "A Royal Problem."

Me too, it's why I bothered to type out the long-winded 'rant' I just want to give some different views on the episodes, maybe get people like them a bit more as well.

[Thrond 3,263]

12 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:

If Starlight had asked first, she wouldn't have felt guilty about what she did, that she had "driven them apart". No guilt, no nightmare; no nightmare, and Celestia wouldn't have had to face the idea of the worst case scenario, as well as had to deal with a nightmare as powerful as Daybreaker. Without that, I doubt Celestia would have truly experienced how hard Luna's job is, and she wouldn't have gained the empathy to repair their relationship. Everything worked out perfectly in the end, and Starlight acknowledged what she did was reckless. Luna identifies with Starlight on a personal level, and Celestia isn't the type to hit someone when they're already down, so I find their actions at the end completely within character.

That's fair, and I wouldn't want to get rid of any of that.

15 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:

When Daybreaker first appeared, I, and I know a few others first reaction was 'Wow, Starlight, way to think up the absolute worst case scenario.' But after spending way too much time rewatching and thinking about the episode, I started to wonder if Starlight was right. Luna first turned into NMM for very similar reasons, that she wasn't being appreciated enough. What if the same thing happened again? There is a line that Daybreaker says in the dream, that she should have destroyed NMM instead of banishing her. What if seeing Luna turn again breaks something in Celestia, and her own bitterness towards her sister turns her in into Daybreaker, to punish Luna and ensure she never threatens anyone again.

Without knowing exactly how Luna turned in the first place, it still seems implausible that a spat like this would drive her to become Nightmare Moon again, as I assume this kind of thing happens all the time among ponies without them turning evil, and we know Luna enough to not think she'd *want* to turn evil. Plus, unlike before, she knows Equestria loves her, so I think this is a different scenario anyway. 

[Meeps 298]

Not even sure if this is a valid complaint, but the way things are always fully wrapped up in an episode kind of bothers me at times. Almost every argument or issue a character has - no matter how major - seems to get fully resolved with no hard feelings and no catches. One exeption to this that I can think of atm is how Twilight felt about Trixie for the longest. I actually like that it took her longer than an episode to accept Trixie and to give her a chance, and that we got to see her struggle with even opening herself to the possibility of it. It just seemed more realistic to me than everyone shaking hands at the end of the day and calling it good all the time. 

[cmarston1 5,959]

I have to agree that the biggest flaw the show has is it's lack of consistency due to the constant shifting of writers.

[Tao 7,808]

I feel in how they tend to cast Rainbow Dash in the same frame of mind and old flaws,  even after learning and seeming to grow in a few eps.

[Sly 236]

Tsk tsk tsk tsk. You really want to know what is the REAL flaw of this show, that already signed its fate before the very beginning? Its nature of Merchandize driven series. This series doesn't exists to tell a story from the beginning to the end, but to advertize toys, and when the toys will stop sell, it will be cancelled.

Because that, this series it has NEVER been conceived to have a proper ending, and when it will end it will end with something that will HARDLY feel like and ENDING. Just look at LPS2012 and how it ended. That's why I've decided to quit this show after the Movie.

 

There is something I never understood thought: there are A LOT of people who have shitposted on this show since after Return of Harmony, the very last episode in which the original creator Lauren Faust had direct input in it(and when I say A LOT I mean A LOT), but they still stayed on the show only to do their shitposting.... if they don't like the show anymore since so many years, why would they have kept watching it? Personal vendetta or something like that? If you use a show as an instrument to use other people then you are completely in the wrong.... I remember some years ago an innocent boy that already had his problem was overwelmed by some Lauren faust supremacists on his FimFiction page and driven by pain, fear and frustration gave up his life committing suicide.... is that really what those DEMONS want?

Edited August 2, 2017 by Sly

[ShootingStar159 2,157]

On 8/1/2017 at 10:38 PM, AlexanderThrond said:

That's fair, and I wouldn't want to get rid of any of that.

Without knowing exactly how Luna turned in the first place, it still seems implausible that a spat like this would drive her to become Nightmare Moon again, as I assume this kind of thing happens all the time among ponies without them turning evil, and we know Luna enough to not think she'd *want* to turn evil. Plus, unlike before, she knows Equestria loves her, so I think this is a different scenario anyway. 

So, after a rather... nasty back and forth on EQD, I thought I'd come back and share a realization I had. Celestia and Luna punishing or reprimanding Starlight at the end of the episode would still go against the characters, the tone of the show, and wouldn't be in Starlight's best interests. That said, I think Starlight should have apologized for what she did. It would have shown character growth and a better understanding that she knew what she did was wrong. A lot of people who don't like Starlight just seem to want her to be brought down, not become a better person. I guess the extreme negativity is getting to me.

[Thrond 3,263]

21 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:

That said, I think Starlight should have apologized for what she did. It would have shown character growth and a better understanding that she knew what she did was wrong.

That wouldn't really solve the problem that she's being praised for altering others' bodies without consent. I don't think punishing Starlight would fit either, but Celestia simply requesting that Starlight ask them permission next time would have helped a lot. I think this episode would be better were it longer. 

[ShootingStar159 2,157]

11 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

That wouldn't really solve the problem that she's being praised for altering others' bodies without consent. I don't think punishing Starlight would fit either, but Celestia simply requesting that Starlight ask them permission next time would have helped a lot. I think this episode would be better were it longer. 

I meant replacing the whole 'going with your gut scene', or putting the apology/forgiveness first so it doesn't come across as praise.

Edited August 3, 2017 by ShootingStar159

[CypherHoof 26,483]

28 minutes ago, ShootingStar159 said:

I meant replacing the whole 'going with your gut scene', or putting the apology/forgiveness first so it doesn't come across as praise.

I am 50/50 on it.

I am in the "Stop using Magic to solve your problems" camp where Starlight is concerned, but am willing to give her a pass on this one.

First, she had been told rather firmly by Twi that a fight between the sisters Must Not Happen - and her attempts to defuse the situation without magic led to her being first hoof-pushed out of the way then telekinetically lifted out of the combat zone. She was literally having a panic attack as the two most powerful equines in the land faced off against each other.

Second, while it is clearly problematic in many respects (disrespect for the royal person(s) at the very least) it isn't THAT bad of a spell. It stopped the fight, without really hurting either sister. It was also time-limited (so that if no further action was taken, it would run its course after a day anyhow) and (depending on how you read it) was either the inevitable mcguffin for the "changing places" plotline or at least played well into the argument the sisters were having.

Finally, when it seemed like it was destined to fail, Starlight had nightmares about being the cause of that failure. (And as an aside, I am REALLY glad I don't have these writers orchestrating MY dreams; Starlight's was relatively tame  - even if harassment from talking pancakes is pretty creepy, and having a huge Twi shouting down at you isn't the best way to start your day - but Luna's was such nightmare fuel I had contact trauma just watching it....) Without Starlight's NM/DayBreaker faceoff though, Celestia would never have broken down in front of her sister that way, and that was a major factor in healing the rift between them. so yeah ,plot device, but Starlight clearly came to regret her actions, and acknowledged that in the final scene when stating she had come dangerously close to ruining everything.  Not that THAT is going to help Starlight get any confidence in her own leadership skills, but on the other hoof, I am not sure I want her to until she makes better choices consistently.

[Babyyoshi309 1,829]

The only flaw FIM has is when it gets bad writers. Specifically when a writer writes the episode for little girls rather than all ages (cough cough "Hard to Say Anything" cough cough). 

[Jeric 46,852]

The occasional bad episode. The reasons for each of them falling flat for me are so varied any list would give the impression I dislike the show, which is very far from accurate. 

I will also say that there is the occasional missed opportunity that would take a average episode and turn it into gold. 

You take the good you take the bad. You take them both and there you have ...