Let's talk about genders

[Feather Scribbles 194]

I have a couple of questions.

(Note: If this post is to be deleted, I apologize for having had posted it. I was merely curious of other people's opinions.)

First of all... What is your opinion on gender neutralism? It's a movement supporting the idea that all gender-, non-gender-, and gender-neutral pronouns should be eliminated, and only they/them will remain.

Second of all... What is your opinion on the male gender?

For as long as there have been two genders (note: there have always been dozens of genders), men have suppressed women. For a long time, women were their property. No longer. Women are rising up and are striving to achieve equality. But do men really deserve to be treated as equals to them? Do you think that once equality is achieved, women should go the extra mile and begin to suppress men? Do you think that men are biologically and should be politically and socially inferior to women, and thus should be driven to extinction. (As for reproduction: science will find a way.)

[StrawCherry 1,673]

Personally, to me there are four genders. You're either male, female, both or none. The other genders don't make too much sense to me and I apologize for that, but it is my opinion. As for gender neutralism as you stated it, I've never heard of it before, but I think I'm against it. Everybody can be themselves. Just call everyone whatever they want to be called, and don't change it to just "they/them". I, for one, wouldn't want it. I don't feel completely female, but I also don't feel male. I'm not in between and I prefer the female pronouns nevertheless. Gender neutralism seems a bit... hypocritical to me. They want people to be themselves yet want those who are male or female to change? Yeah, no thank you.

My opinion on the male gender, well... nothing against them?  Everybody is equal and should treat each other like it. I know that will probably not happen anytime soon, but one can hope.

[Feather Scribbles 194]

1 minute ago, StrawCherry said:

Personally, to me there are four genders. You're either male, female, both or none. The other genders don't make too much sense to me and I apologize for that, but it is my opinion. As for gender neutralism as you stated it, I've never heard of it before, but I think I'm against it. Everybody can be themselves. Just call everyone whatever they want to be called, and don't change it to just "they/them". I, for one, wouldn't want it. I don't feel completely female, but I also don't feel male. I'm not in between and I prefer the female pronouns nevertheless. Gender neutralism seems a bit... hypocritical to me. They want people to be themselves yet want those who are male or female to change? Yeah, no thank you.

My opinion on the male gender, well... nothing against them?  Everybody is equal and should treat each other like it. I know that will probably not happen anytime soon, but one can hope.

Then I will ask... Do you think that females should one day be politically and socially superior to men?

[StrawCherry 1,673]

No one should be superior to the other. That's what equality is all about, isn't it?

[Feather Scribbles 194]

1 minute ago, StrawCherry said:

No one should be superior to the other. That's what equality is all about, isn't it?

Alright, alright, I meant no offense. I was just merely asking/thinking critically here. And whilst men are not biologically and intellectually equal to women (they are less), I do believe in equality. However, considering that there are dozens of genders out there (call that an opinion, I call it fact), I don't think the war between equality between men and women is very... inclusive?

[StrawCherry 1,673]

Hey, no offense taken.  I'm just a firm believer in equality. Male, female, non binary, genderfluid - you name it, all are equal. After all, underneath the skin and all the parts that do make up the gender, there are identical skeletons. Heck, I believe that even animals should be treated the same as humans. There shouldn't be a "war", that's ridiculous. Treat the other like you want to be treated. If you want to be treated like you're superior, treat others like they are as well. What goes around comes around.

[Feather Scribbles 194]

Just now, StrawCherry said:

Hey, no offense taken.  I'm just a firm believer in equality. Male, female, non binary, genderfluid - you name it, all are equal. After all, underneath the skin and all the parts that do make up the gender, there are identical skeletons. Heck, I believe that even animals should be treated the same as humans. There shouldn't be a "war", that's ridiculous. Treat the other like you want to be treated. If you want to be treated like you're superior, treat others like they are as well. What goes around comes around.

You do make an excellent point. (As do I. But that is all in the eye of the beholder, or beholders.)

[ShadOBabe 18,997]

1 hour ago, Feather Scribbles said:

Do you think that men are biologically and should be politically and socially inferior to women, and thus should be driven to extinction.

Um, no? Seriously, what the hell? That’s some Hitler crap right there.

39 minutes ago, StrawCherry said:

there are identical skeletons.

Actually, fun fact, human skeletons different depending on biological sex. It’s how archeologists can identify the sex of a human if the body has decayed too far.

[StrawCherry 1,673]

Just now, ShadOBabe said:

Actually, fun fact, human skeletons different depending on biological sex. It’s how archeologists can identify the sex of a human if the body has decayed too far.

Let me feel smart, please. I didn't do research.  Joking aside, yes, but there's no... flopple bone down there for the men. Which is what defines the gender.

[Feather Scribbles 194]

2 minutes ago, StrawCherry said:

Let me feel smart, please. I didn't do research.  Joking aside, yes, but there's no... flopple bone down there for the men. Which is what defines the gender.

I thought that the brain separated the male gender from the female gender.

[StrawCherry 1,673]

1 minute ago, Feather Scribbles said:

I thought that the brain separated the male gender from the female gender.

But brain isn't part of the skeleton.  

[Feather Scribbles 194]

1 minute ago, StrawCherry said:

But brain isn't part of the skeleton.  

I know that. XD I just meant that, what is down there isn't the only separater. Lol

[Black Sabbath 2,486]

55 minutes ago, Feather Scribbles said:

And whilst men are not biologically and intellectually equal to women (they are less)

Can you elaborate on this a bit? Why aren't men biologically and intellectually equal to women?  

[Feather Scribbles 194]

1 minute ago, Yamet said:

Can you elaborate on this a bit? Why aren't men biologically and intellectually equal to women?  

It's just a political and social joke. I'm sure you've heard it a lot.

[Cherry-Pie 176]

Gender, race, religion, tradition, culture, nationality and ethnicity are fraudulent concepts. Anytime someone hands you one of these flimsy cardboard identities it's meant to distract you while they walk away with your individuality in their Pocket. 

[Jeric 46,854]

40 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

Um, no? Seriously, what the hell? That’s some Hitler crap right there.

Actually, fun fact, human skeletons different depending on biological sex. It’s how archeologists can identify the sex of a human if the body has decayed too far.

Those hips don't lie.

 

[SparklingSquirrels 21,345]

I think there are only two genders. However, I fail to see what the big deal is about gender. No matter what your gender is, that shouldn't prevent you from being who you want to be and doing what you want to do . So by that logic, I support total equality between the genders.

Drive men to extinction? I sure wouldn't want that  

[Jeric 46,854]

39 minutes ago, Cherry-Pie said:

Gender, race, religion, tradition, culture, nationality and ethnicity are fraudulent concepts. Anytime someone hands you one of these flimsy cardboard identities it's meant to distract you while they walk away with your individuality in their Pocket. 

I'm not sure if you meant to say they are abstract concepts when you said fraudulent concept. Just about everything on that list is genetically and biologically derived. They are symptomatic of our species evolution so it would have a greater chance to survive. Some are an artifice of comfort, which is still part of our biological makeup. If you want to blame anything, blame agriculture. I mean I wouldn't go that far myself, but that's the beginning of many of these concepts. 

I am a strong advocate of individuality, but pop-transcendentalism like the idea that one can't have several identities is absurd. I am a father, a scholar, a football fan, an American, a male, a book lover, a Brony, a musical theater fan, a Star Wars fan, I'm white, Irish and German ancestry, and many many more. I am also Jeric. 

Some of those are social constructs, but that doesn't mean they are fictitious, or unnatural. Also I'm amused at the word fraudulent being used. There is something adorable about using a social and legal concept to decry social concepts. I understand you were going for a strength of effect when you decided not to be precise, which is fine and good, but I had to giggle.

 

[Catpone Cerberus 23,607]

2 hours ago, Feather Scribbles said:

First of all... What is your opinion on gender neutralism? It's a movement supporting the idea that all gender-, non-gender-, and gender-neutral pronouns should be eliminated, and only they/them will remain.

It's stupid. But that's all I gonna say because in my language there is only one word "Hän" and it means both She and he, thus, this doesn't concern me. But if we are talking about words like Fireman being replaced with Fireperson (they are wanting to do that in Finland) I say it's nonsense and will keep saying Fireman until I die. If your identity suffers from word having a gender in it, the problem isn't the word. 

2 hours ago, Feather Scribbles said:

Second of all... What is your opinion on the male gender?

I have no opinion because we males are not one group, but instead of bunch of individuals who aren't defined by what sex we have born as. 

2 hours ago, Feather Scribbles said:

But do men really deserve to be treated as equals to them? Do you think that once equality is achieved, women should go the extra mile and begin to suppress men? Do you think that men are biologically and should be politically and socially inferior to women, and thus should be driven to extinction. (As for reproduction: science will find a way.)

 

If one really believes that we men should be removed from the earth and the other things you ask about....someone else can tell why that's just a stupid thing to think, I really don't want to bother.

But let me ask you this, if there was no men, who would....
Fight in the wars that will be a thing, no matter if there is men or not?
Clean the sewers (male dominated job)?
Do any of the dangerous jobs that are dominated by men?
Do the shitty jobs that are dominated by men?
More importantly, would you as a woman do those things?

And should women go the extra mile and begin to suppress men?
How long you think men would take that? Don't forget that we are half the population, and men are generally stronger than women, and we could just as well make children without women with science.

 

TL;DN
Yes, no and no

[Cherry-Pie 176]

They are fraudulent because they come from the outside, true identity comes from the self, from realization, exploration and growth. When someone says "now you're a christian and you believe these things and do these things and you re not allowed to question it." That is a fraudulent identity. It is not a reflection of you at all, its like the difference between picking out an outfit that you like and being told to wear an orange prison jump suite. The more you give away to these vampire systems the less actual pieces of you still exist. 

[Envy 6,170]

Personally, I'd like a move toward gender-neutrality. I don't know about eliminating gendered pronouns altogether, but I think it's better to - especially online - not assume someone's pronouns until they have told you. There are some people who just can't seem to understand the concept of not using gendered pronouns when they don't know someone's gender and that's just silly. I regularly use "they/them" when I don't know the gender of an individual I'm referring to. I always have. It's not rocket science.

That's kind of a tangent, though. Sorry.

As for the number of genders. I do not know. I am not an expert on the subject. To be honest, I do not really understand those who say that they are gender-fluid or any of those things, but I'm not saying I won't believe that their feelings have a solid basis. I respect them, I just personally don't understand. I mean, certainly biological sex is not anywhere near as binary as people like to think it is, so I can understand that could translate to identity, even though I personally can't wrap my mind around how someone like that would feel. lol

I find no end to the humor at how the more we understand about biology and the sexes, the more we understand that if there is such as a thing as a default sex, it is actually female, not male. It makes such a big mockery of the creation story of the Bible and any other misogynistic nonsense posited by men throughout history.

...But I only bring that up in jest, because I don't care which sex is the "default" (I just think... it's like science has some angle of justice to it, even though I know that makes no sense because it can not and does not operate like that). Men are not superior, nor are they inferior. We're all people. We should all have the same opportunities.

I don't know where in the world your last paragraph even comes from. That's just silly. In a culture where we still need to fix so much of the misogyny that has pervaded our culture for so long, I don't appreciate that. It's just fear-mongering to misogynistic men who already mistakenly think that women gaining equality is somehow infringing on men's rights.

[ShadOBabe 18,997]

40 minutes ago, Cherry-Pie said:

When someone says "now you're a christian and you believe these things and do these things and you re not allowed to question it."

Yeah, because that’s how all people get into their chosen religions. #sarcasmmode

[Cherry-Pie 176]

2 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

Yeah, because that’s how all people get into their chosen religions. #sarcasmmode

Its how most people do. Take a four year old, tell them what their allowed to believe, threaten thim with idiotic ideas like hell and god, while they are still too young to think critically. Thats why they don't wait untill people are 18. Teaching religion to children is like psychological and philosophical foot binding.

[honk friend 1,978]

1 hour ago, Cherry-Pie said:

They are fraudulent because they come from the outside, true identity comes from the self, from realization, exploration and growth. When someone says "now you're a christian and you believe these things and do these things and you re not allowed to question it." That is a fraudulent identity. It is not a reflection of you at all, its like the difference between picking out an outfit that you like and being told to wear an orange prison jump suite. The more you give away to these vampire systems the less actual pieces of you still exist. 

Your identity is everything that defines you. Everything. People treat you differently based on every one of those so called 'fraudulent' details so people assign meaning to those things for a reason. People WILL me differently from a man since I'm a woman, just like people will treat a muslim differently from a christian and a black person differently from a white person. Everyone does it, even on a subconscious level, so no, they're not just meaningless details meant to strip you of your actual character the second you start identifying with them.

Edited December 3, 2017 by Annie

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Feather Scribbles said:

For as long as there have been two genders (note: there have always been dozens of genders), men have suppressed women. For a long time, women were their property. No longer. Women are rising up and are striving to achieve equality. But do men really deserve to be treated as equals to them? Do you think that once equality is achieved, women should go the extra mile and begin to suppress men? Do you think that men are biologically and should be politically and socially inferior to women, and thus should be driven to extinction. (As for reproduction: science will find a way.)

Ridiculous. This is a modern feminist dogma for some fantasy genocide that can result in nothing more than the willful destruction of the human race for no benefit. Seriously, what is the outcome supposed to even resolve? Why do you and people like you seem to think that men are destruction incarnate? Men and women have clear distinctions for a reason, and those distinctions aren't that one is better than another. I for one don't want my men to become useless, castrated tomcats resting on top of the TVs that represent these twisted moral 'virtues' just waiting for their screeching overlords to will them to die. I want them to be men. Aggressive, loud and full of wonderful, purposeful presence.

Equality between sexes is as achieved as it can be in the western world. One sex's perspective always seems to find the idleness to go wanting for a benefit or single out a flaw in the other, so now there's ideologies like the OP floating around in an unassuming way. I keep seeing this trend of men who feel inadequacy towards other men feeling like their only recourse is to jump the ship and burn it down. You people are the ones creating this facade of inequality.