Rainbow Dash changed for better?

[pinkieshyrose 58]

well she to me felt more like she did  rude uncalled for and mean spirted things and nice things she did were to burst her ego..... but  yeah these season she doesnt feel more nice and true to her elment of loytaly than before but as i think about maybe she just hasnt had egnough thime yet to do somthing like shes done before the werid thing though is the lessons she learned still wasnt what seemd to change her the writers must have entinally wrote her that way because they saw it to ...... but the reason why i wasnt so keyed to her persnality before was only because

 

1. the luna episode where shes using the lightning cloud

2.telling derpy off in her  first speaking role

3. being un loyal in cider season

4. forgetting pinkie and rarity for apple jack

5. i can go on.....

 

season 3 is the only glimpse im having of a ok character and shes getting higher than apple jac on my liking scale  who tell you the truth i just find boring and just not like me very much...  my gav is pinkipie followed by fluttershy  and twilight and rarity running a close race but the end its rarity

 

shes getting better

 

1. cystral empire she decies to go easy on fluttershy

2.two many pinkiepies you see a glance of rd pinkie pie friendship just a bit

3. scotalloo episode she was herself but still nicer to scootaloo even before camping

4.her own episode shes tells spitfire ecscatlly what she thinks and stands up for her freinds who could have gotten hurt but  thought the jealusly of her not being wing pony was mixed signals........

Edited December 29, 2012 by pinkieshyrose

[duidamasterXD 9,626]

2.telling derpy off in her  first speaking role

3. being un loyal in cider season

You're entitled to your opinion of course but I dispute these two because

1: She didn't do anything to Derpy except be visibly annoyed with her, and I think you have the right to display annoyance with someone who is destroying public property and almost cooking you with lightning bolts.

 

2: Who was she being disloyal to? The moment she was allowed to she worked her flank off to try to save the farm, and after the brothers cheated she tried to beat the tar out of them, and would have if not for Applejack, the tail-pulling master.

[pinkieshyrose 58]

You're entitled to your opinion of course but I dispute these two because

1: She didn't do anything to Derpy except be visibly annoyed with her, and I think you have the right to display annoyance with someone who is destroying public property and almost cooking you with lightning bolts.

 

2: Who was she being disloyal to? The moment she was allowed to she worked her flank off to try to save the farm, and after the brothers cheated she tried to beat the tar out of them, and would have if not for Applejack, the tail-pulling master.

1. no she didnt "do anything" to derpy but in the un altered episode the i dont want you to do anymore damege than youve already done has not just annoyed tone to me but a insuteing not aceppting tone then the sarcasm that was just plain mean to me... and the no nothing was sorta mean to  not just annoyed unaceppting but oh well might be because im a bit of a klutz to not so much as derpy but egnough  

 

2.  maybe i didnt describe that your  right but cheering on flim and flam for most of the episode then helping apple jack o...

[duidamasterXD 9,626]

1. no she didnt "do anything" to derpy but in the un altered episode the i dont want you to do anymore damege than youve already done has not just annoyed tone to me but a insuteing not aceppting tone then the sarcasm that was just plain mean to me... and the no nothing was sorta mean to not just annoyed unaceppting but oh well might be because im a bit of a klutz to not so much as derpy but egnough

 

2. maybe i didnt describe that your right but cheering on flim and flam for most of the episode then helping apple jack o...

Well she didn't specifically insult Derpy since she knew Derpy had good intentions, her tone struck me as more irritated than critical. I guess you had a different interpretation.

 

As for the other episode, she cheered for Flim and Flam when they were offering her cider, since the Apples couldn't make enough for everyone. There's nothing wrong with that, but the moment that they stepped into villain territory and threatened Applejack's livelihood she was there for her, just like always.

[Chrysalisa 60]

Ever since the ending in Mare do Well, I think RD's attitude has improved. She was just trying to be understanding towards Scootaloo, to show her that she did in fact care for her. I never did dislike Rainbow, I mean yeah she's cocky (exceptionally so in Mare do Well) but in reality she's prideful. She's not a bad person or anything, it's been shown many times that she cares for her friends. If anything, she just gets carried away with herself.

[DrAltaica 13]

 She has always cared for her friends, such as helping Pinkie snap out of her depression, returning Applejack to her family and trying to help Fluttershy overcome her performance anxiety.

You forgetting how RD treated her best friend from her days at Junior Speedster flight camp.

 

"Girls will be your friends - they'll act like it anyway. But just remember, some come, somg go. The ones that stay with you through everything - they're your true best friends. Don't let go of them." -- Marilyn Monroe

 

Griffon the Brush Off was the first episode I watched and the twist ending of Rainbow Dash kicking her supposed best friend when she is down really turned me off. It's like a Care Bears episode, if the Care Bears where evil.

 

 

 

When Gilda learns the what is probably the worst party in her life is Rainbow Dash's fault Gilda is still RD's friend.

 

RD realizes Gilda is her only revival for the position of biggest jerk in Ponyville. Not that you remember that the 3 minutes of the episode before Gilda shows up focuses of RD trying to give PinkiePie the brush off. 

 

And how does RD react when Derpy pulls the same lightning cloud prank of her that RD and Painkie pull of Spike?

 

Twilight's "Sailor Says" letter for that ep.

 

 

Dearest Princess Celestia,

 

Today I learned that it's hard to accept when somepony you like wants to spend time with somepony who's not so nice. Though it's impossible to control who your friends hang out with, it is possible to control your own behavior. Just continue to be a good friend. In the end, the difference between a false friend and the one who is true will surely come to light.

 

Your faithful student,

Twilight Sparkle

 

 

Hell even FlutterFly acts like a better friend to Gilda than RD.

 

"Friends will always be there for you. Don’t worry about the fakes. Worry about the people who had your back from the start and never treated you wrong. Always remember they are your real friends. Don’t ever take them for granted because one day you’re going to lose a good friend by the way your actions are. When you see a good friend, stick to that person." -- Marilyn Monroe

 

 

RD is a fare-weather friend and even then she is still a jerk to her "friends".

In the season 2 opening RD says, "That's right! I'll always be loyal to the Princess!" Not to her friends.

 

 

[MadDoggyca 710]

I hope not not.. I love it when RD is Cocky and Sarcastic. That alone is why she's the best pony of the mane 6.  I be disappointed if she gets to be more "soft"

[weegeez 150]

She is still fairly cocky. "Best Flyer in all of Equestria!" or when she states she would deny any of her childhood fears if Scootaloo lets one slip ring a bell? However despite her arrogance, she is much more loyal and less of a prick to others. Basically someone who thinks highly of herself without allowing to overshadow her judgement of others and have more moral values, which is respectable

[duidamasterXD 9,626]

You forgetting how RD treated her best friend from her days at Junior Speedster flight camp.

 

"Girls will be your friends - they'll act like it anyway. But just remember, some come, somg go. The ones that stay with you through everything - they're your true best friends. Don't let go of them." -- Marilyn Monroe

 

Griffon the Brush Off was the first episode I watched and the twist ending of Rainbow Dash kicking her supposed best friend when she is down really turned me off. It's like a Care Bears episode, if the Care Bears where evil.

 

 

 

When Gilda learns the what is probably the worst party in her life is Rainbow Dash's fault Gilda is still RD's friend.

 

RD realizes Gilda is her only revival for the position of biggest jerk in Ponyville. Not that you remember that the 3 minutes of the episode before Gilda shows up focuses of RD trying to give PinkiePie the brush off. 

 

And how does RD react when Derpy pulls the same lightning cloud prank of her that RD and Painkie pull of Spike?

 

Twilight's "Sailor Says" letter for that ep.

 

 

Dearest Princess Celestia,

 

Today I learned that it's hard to accept when somepony you like wants to spend time with somepony who's not so nice. Though it's impossible to control who your friends hang out with, it is possible to control your own behavior. Just continue to be a good friend. In the end, the difference between a false friend and the one who is true will surely come to light.

 

Your faithful student,

Twilight Sparkle

 

 

Hell even FlutterFly acts like a better friend to Gilda than RD.

 

"Friends will always be there for you. Don’t worry about the fakes. Worry about the people who had your back from the start and never treated you wrong. Always remember they are your real friends. Don’t ever take them for granted because one day you’re going to lose a good friend by the way your actions are. When you see a good friend, stick to that person." -- Marilyn Monroe

 

 

RD is a fare-weather friend and even then she is still a jerk to her "friends".

In the season 2 opening RD says, "That's right! I'll always be loyal to the Princess!" Not to her friends.

 

 

 

If you recall the episode, Gilda chose to leave rather than apologize for her incorrect assumptions.  To use your Marilyn Monroe quote

"Friends will always be there for you. Don’t worry about the fakes. Worry about the people who had your back from the start and never treated you wrong. Always remember they are your real friends. Don’t ever take them for granted because one day you’re going to lose a good friend by the way your actions are. When you see a good friend, stick to that person." -- Marilyn Monroe

 

Gilda proved that she was not a good friend, that she was a fake, and that she did not respect anyone but Dash. If one of your friends was determined to treat the rest of your friends like garbage, the immoral thing to do would be to enable the behavior, not demand that it stop. Rainbow Dash is loyal to her friends, loyal to her GOOD friends, ones that don't demean and bully the rest of her friends. She is loyal, however part of loyalty is choosing who and what to be loyal to, and the moment that Gilda decided that she was too good for the rest of the rest of the mane six and refused to compromise, Rainbow correctly decided that Gilda would not always be there for her, would not always have her back and would take her for granted. And so she allowed Gilda to leave.

Edited December 29, 2012 by DashForever

[Commander Bubbles 1,343]

With all due respect, and I am saying WITH ALL DUE RESPECT (which means I can say whatever I want and get away with it; it's covered in the Geneva Convention) (free cookie if you get that reference), Rainbow Dash is the most unlikable of the Mane 6. Certainly, RD and I both share a passion of going fast and flying, but the thing is, other than that, she has no desirable traits whatsoever. Well, aside from the Scootaloo episode, she's nothing but a cocky, arrogant, self-centered asshat. Sure, she had some moments where she showed her moral side. But other than that, she's lazy as hell, self-centered most of the time, and I just find nothing to like in her character. She's the most overrated of the Mane 6, mostly due to the fact that she has basically no likable traits, and I'm not sure why she gets all the attention she has. Bitch, moan, and whine all you want about my rant, RD fanboys, but that's my absolute honest opinion about Rainbow Dash.

[letterone 1,204]

While I personally think her cockiness made her interesting as a character, I kinda like this newer form of her. Self-absorbed sometimes, but really kind at others.

 

I'm a Sonic fan. She seems more Sonicy now.

[Doctor-Whooves 288]

When I think about it, her personality is similar to Sonic's. Cocky, but not arrogant. I still hold that the best episode for character development for her was Sleepless in Ponyville.

[Megas 27,539]

With all due respect, and I am saying WITH ALL DUE RESPECT (which means I can say whatever I want and get away with it; it's covered in the Geneva Convention) (free cookie if you get that reference), Rainbow Dash is the most unlikable of the Mane 6. Certainly, RD and I both share a passion of going fast and flying, but the thing is, other than that, she has no desirable traits whatsoever. Well, aside from the Scootaloo episode, she's nothing but a cocky, arrogant, self-centered asshat. Sure, she had some moments where she showed her moral side. But other than that, she's lazy as hell, self-centered most of the time, and I just find nothing to like in her character. She's the most overrated of the Mane 6, mostly due to the fact that she has basically no likable traits, and I'm not sure why she gets all the attention she has. Bitch, moan, and whine all you want about my rant, RD fanboys, but that's my absolute honest opinion about Rainbow Dash.

Normally I'd respect your opinion, but really? Most unlikeable? No Positive traits? It's like you're trying to hate Rainbow Dash

Edited January 5, 2013 by Megas75

[Commander Bubbles 1,343]

Normally I'd respect your opinion, but really? Most unlikeable? No Positive traits? You make it sound like your stating these as facts.

(facehoof)

Did you not read my last sentence? I stated clearly that it was all my opinion. Everything preceding that last sentence was all my opinion. Maybe it didn't sound that way, but that's all it is. An opinion.

[duidamasterXD 9,626]

Sigh... I've had to come to terms with the fact that no matter what she does, some people will always hate Rainbow Dash. The depths that people have gone to in order to continue hating her astound me quite honestly. I've seen people jump on her for her actions in Sleepless in Ponyville and Hurricane Fluttershy. Perhaps we are operating on different moral codes or something, but really now. I get the feeling that if their favorite character said all of Rainbow's lines and committed all her actions in those episodes they'd want to hang a medal around their neck (after wondering why they seemed OOC). Even if I have accepted this, it doesn't make it any less depressing.

 

End rant.

[pinkieshyrose 58]

Well she didn't specifically insult Derpy since she knew Derpy had good intentions, her tone struck me as more irritated than critical. I guess you had a different interpretation.

 

As for the other episode, she cheered for Flim and Flam when they were offering her cider, since the Apples couldn't make enough for everyone. There's nothing wrong with that, but the moment that they stepped into villain territory and threatened Applejack's livelihood she was there for her, just like always.

not just that apple jack was explaning how they try there best but rd just kept on complaning way before flim and  flam got there making the apple familys customers argumentive  with her rants

[duidamasterXD 9,626]

not just that apple jack was explaning how they try there best but rd just kept on complaning way before flim and flam got there making the apple familys customers argumentive with her rants

Well to be fair, they weren't making enough cider for everyone and she was fed up with never getting any year after year. Apparently others felt the same way. Even if the Apple family were trying their best and I can't fault them for that I completely understand Rainbow Dash's frustration in that situation.

Edited December 29, 2012 by DashForever

[Twinhead B 482]

The show writers seem to love to have Rainbow Dash develop and become less one-dimensional and then regress her back to her old "turbo-cunt" ways whenever the need arises. It's a shame really, because RD could be a much more interesting character if her development and growth weren't retconned every six episodes.

 

Still, it could be worse, at last RD has actually goals to achieve; Season 1 Applejack served no other purpose than to sell apples and apple accesories.

Edited December 30, 2012 by Twinhead B

[DrAltaica 13]

If you recall the episode, Gilda chose to leave rather than apologize for her incorrect assumptions. 

 

First Gilda starts to leave before she is told she is wrong.

Second While Gilda is still shock from finding out Pinkie Pie was actually trying to be nice to her. Dash Tell her to leave.

 

If you recall the episode, Dash chose to kick Gilda out of Gilda own birthday party(Birthday candles suggests that it was a birthday cake which suggests it was Gilda's birthday party) rather than apologize for her incorrect assumptions(That Dash's pranks would help turn Gilda's frown upside down.). 

 

Gilda: [roar] This is your idea of a good time? I've never met a lamer bunch of dweebs in all my life. And Pinkie Pie, you! You are queen lame-o with your weak little party pranks. Did you really think you could make me lose my cool? Well, Dash and I have ten times as much cool as the rest of you put together. Come on Dash, we're bailing on this pathetic scene. Come on Rainbow Dash. I said, we're leaving.

Rainbow Dash: You know Gilda, I was the one who set up all those weak pranks at this party.

Gilda: [gasp] What?

Pinkie Pie: Ooh.

Rainbow Dash: So I guess I'm queen lame-o.

Gilda: Come on, Dash, you're joshing me.

Rainbow Dash: They weren't all meant for you specifically, it was just dumb luck that you set them all off.

Pinkie Pie: I shoulda known, that dribble cup had Rainbow Dash written all over it.

Gilda: No way. It was Pinkie Pie, she set up this party to trip me up, to make a fool of me.

Pinkie Pie: Me? I threw this party to improve your attitude. I thought a good party might turn that frown upside down.

Rainbow Dash: And you sure didn't need any help making a fool of yourself. You know, this is not how I thought my old friends would treat my new friends. If being cool is all you care about, maybe you should go find some new cool friends someplace else.

Gilda: Rrgh. Yeah? Well you, you, you are such a, a flip-flop: cool one minute and lame the next. When you decide not to be lame anymore, gimme a call. [bird of prey shriek]

 

To use your Marilyn Monroe quote

"Friends will always be there for you. Don’t worry about the fakes. Worry about the people who had your back from the start and never treated you wrong. Always remember they are your real friends. Don’t ever take them for granted because one day you’re going to lose a good friend by the way your actions are. When you see a good friend, stick to that person." -- Marilyn Monroe

 

Gilda proved that she was not a good friend, that she was a fake, and that she did not respect anyone but Dash.

That doesn't prove Gilda is not a good friend, only that Gilda is not a good example. It was "never treated you wrong." not "never treated your other friends wrong." 

Dash is the only one that actual has a friendship with Gilda, admittedly  Pinkie Pie tries to become friends with Gilda.

 

If one of your friends was determined to treat the rest of your friends like garbage, the immoral thing to do would be to enable the behavior, not demand that it stop.

So we agree that Dash is immoral because she doesn't demand,or even suggest, Gilda treat Dash's friends differently.

Rainbow Dash is loyal to her friends, loyal to her GOOD friends, ones that don't demean and bully the rest of her friends.

A friend who supports others only when it is easy and convenient to do so. That is not a true friend, That's a fare weather friend.  

 

And a bit hypocritical when Dash is known to demean and bully her friends.

She is loyal, however part of loyalty is choosing who and what to be loyal to, and the moment that Gilda decided that she was too good for the rest of the rest of the mane six

It wasn't just the main 6 at the party. is was practical all of ponyville. 

 

and refused to compromise,

Um, Gilda does fellow Rainbow Dash's suggestion that, "you should go find some new cool friends someplace else."

 

When does Gilda refuse to compromise?

 

Dash refuses Gilda's compromise, Gilda will hang with Dash when Dash isn't with her new friends. a bit immature but hardly evil.

Rainbow correctly decided that Gilda would not always be there for her, would not always have her back and would take her for granted.

If that where true Gilda would have abandoned Dash after she learned Dash was self described "queen lame-o."

And so she allowed Gilda to leave.

 

Dash don't allow Gilda to leave she tells Gilda to leave.

 

 

The last thing Dash tells Gilda is "maybe you should go find some new cool friends someplace else." which implies Dash doesn't want to be Gilda's friend anymore.

 

The last thing Gilda tells Dash is "gimme a call" which implies she still willing to be Dash's friend.

[duidamasterXD 9,626]

First Gilda starts to leave before she is told she is wrong.

Second While Gilda is still shock from finding out Pinkie Pie was actually trying to be nice to her. Dash Tell her to leave.

 

 

 

If you recall the episode, Dash chose to kick Gilda out of Gilda own birthday party(Birthday candles suggests that it was a birthday cake which suggests it was Gilda's birthday party) rather than apologize for her incorrect assumptions(That Dash's pranks would help turn Gilda's frown upside down.).

 

Gilda: [roar] This is your idea of a good time? I've never met a lamer bunch of dweebs in all my life. And Pinkie Pie, you! You are queen lame-o with your weak little party pranks. Did you really think you could make me lose my cool? Well, Dash and I have ten times as much cool as the rest of you put together. Come on Dash, we're bailing on this pathetic scene. Come on Rainbow Dash. I said, we're leaving.

Rainbow Dash: You know Gilda, I was the one who set up all those weak pranks at this party.

Gilda: [gasp] What?

Pinkie Pie: Ooh.

Rainbow Dash: So I guess I'm queen lame-o.

Gilda: Come on, Dash, you're joshing me.

Rainbow Dash: They weren't all meant for you specifically, it was just dumb luck that you set them all off.

Pinkie Pie: I shoulda known, that dribble cup had Rainbow Dash written all over it.

Gilda: No way. It was Pinkie Pie, she set up this party to trip me up, to make a fool of me.

Pinkie Pie: Me? I threw this party to improve your attitude. I thought a good party might turn that frown upside down.

Rainbow Dash: And you sure didn't need any help making a fool of yourself. You know, this is not how I thought my old friends would treat my new friends. If being cool is all you care about, maybe you should go find some new cool friends someplace else.

Gilda: Rrgh. Yeah? Well you, you, you are such a, a flip-flop: cool one minute and lame the next. When you decide not to be lame anymore, gimme a call. [bird of prey shriek]

That doesn't prove Gilda is not a good friend, only that Gilda is not a good example. It was "never treated you wrong." not "never treated your other friends wrong."

Dash is the only one that actual has a friendship with Gilda, admittedly Pinkie Pie tries to become friends with Gilda.

 

So we agree that Dash is immoral because she doesn't demand,or even suggest, Gilda treat Dash's friends differently.

A friend who supports others only when it is easy and convenient to do so. That is not a true friend, That's a fare weather friend.

 

And a bit hypocritical when Dash is known to demean and bully her friends.

It wasn't just the main 6 at the party. is was practical all of ponyville.

 

Um, Gilda does fellow Rainbow Dash's suggestion that, "you should go find some new cool friends someplace else."

 

When does Gilda refuse to compromise?

 

Dash refuses Gilda's compromise, Gilda will hang with Dash when Dash isn't with her new friends. a bit immature but hardly evil.

If that where true Gilda would have abandoned Dash after she learned Dash was self described "queen lame-o."

 

Dash don't allow Gilda to leave she tells Gilda to leave.

 

 

The last thing Dash tells Gilda is "maybe you should go find some new cool friends someplace else." which implies Dash doesn't want to be Gilda's friend anymore.

 

The last thing Gilda tells Dash is "gimme a call" which implies she still willing to be Dash's friend.

Just because Gilda never mistreated Dash specifically does not make her a good friend. Being a good friend also involves understanding that your friends may have other friends, and knowing better than to mistreat or insult them. Dash's response was to Gilda completely disrespecting everyone invited to the party. If Dash hadn't cared about that then she would have been an EXTREMELY poor friend, and letting that slide would have been flat out wrong.

 

Dash's telling Gilda to leave was an "if then" statement, not an order. She did not unconditionally reject Gilda, she only wanted Gilda to leave if Gilda was unwilling to accept her other friends and apologize for insulting them. This is an implicit demand for Gilda to stop criticizing the rest of her friends. The "if then" statement implies that Rainbow is willing to keep being friends with Gilda, but only if Gilda changes her attitude towards Dash's friends in general. Gilda was unwilling to do this and left. That is the refusal to compromise, Gilda will not accept that in order to be Dash's friend she has to treat everyone else that Dash cares about at least halfway decently.

 

You keep using the phrase "fair weather friend". The definition from Urban Dictionary is:

A friend who is only a friend when circumstances are pleasant or profitable. At the first sign of trouble, these capricious, disloyal friends will drop their relationship with you.

 

If anything Rainbow Dash is the opposite of this. When times are good, she will tease Twilight, be insensitive to Rarity etc, However at the first sign of trouble, such as Applejack losing her farm, Pinkie sinking into depression, Rarity losing her reputation, the return of a psychotic Alicorn, Twilight getting punished by the supreme ruler of the country, Spike turning into Godzilla, Parasprites eating the town, need I go on, she will not leave her friends and rather will do anything in her power to help them out. A friend who is willing to do that is much more than a fair weather friend. Perhaps you disagree with the definition, but I don't think that the term applies the way you are using it.

Edited December 30, 2012 by DashForever

[Jessper 735]

Hmm, it's interesting how many people only became interested in Rainbow Dash as a character by Season 3. I'm not gonna lie, the episode that made me start thinking of Rainbow Dash as a multifaceted, likable character was none other than...

 

THE MYSTERIOUS MARE DO WELL! 

 

(No, I will never stop promoting this episode, by the way)

 

I think I'm broken. I only started liking Applejack with Hearth's Warming Eve, the first time I enjoyed Fluttershy was The Stare Master, and I thought that Owl's Well That Ends Well was a good Spike episode.

I already liked RD by that time and that episode made me like everypony else a bit less.

I mean RD saved half of the city ten times over and the whole Equestria at least once, gets warm thank you and three kid-fans, Mare Do Well comes in, kind-of saves one person and everyone goes "Yeah, Mare Do Well, the hero of the universe, buck RD!" and do a celebration of MDW.

Not to mention <spoiler?> that when your friend gets way too cocky, trying to humiliate her and destroy her life over and over anonymously is not the best solution ever. 

 

 

 

Sigh... I've had to come to terms with the fact that no matter what she does, some people will always hate Rainbow Dash. The depths that people have gone to in order to continue hating her astound me quite honestly. I've seen people jump on her for her actions in Sleepless in Ponyville and Hurricane Fluttershy. Perhaps we are operating on different moral codes or something, but really now. I get the feeling that if their favorite character said all of Rainbow's lines and committed all her actions in those episodes they'd want to hang a medal around their neck (after wondering why they seemed OOC). Even if I have accepted this, it doesn't make it any less depressing.

 

End rant.

Well that's well written. I've said it before, it' amazing how far some will go just to be able to hate something or someone, yet somewhat ironic considering where we are (MLP forums).

[DrAltaica 13]

Just because Gilda never mistreated Dash specifically does not make her a good friend. Being a good friend also involves understanding that your friends may have other friends, and knowing better than to mistreat or insult them.

Being a true friend means you still act like one even when you wish you weren't.

 

Knowing better and being able to do better are completely different things.

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,160]

If you're only bumping a thread just to post an insulting or abusive reply; don't. Period.

Thread locked.