"Reformed" Villains, Yay or Nay?

[Guest90210 3,569]

What's everyone's thoughts on reforming villains, in general and also in MLP?

 

Personally, I love it when a villain becomes a good guy (when it's done correctly, which is often). There's just something exciting about a long standing rival fighting with the good guys against a new enemy. It also breathes new life into a character and opens up many new opportunities.

 

Also, what MLP villains would you like to see reformed, if any?

[Castle Bleck 19,449]

NOT King Sombra; his Complete-Monster-ness is what sets him apart to make up for his lack of personality.

[RainbowDashington 89]

I'm ok with it. But it's gotta be done right. Lightning Dust is actually reformed, but the scene didn't make the cut.

[Moonlight 7,291]

I don't personally mind reformed villains as long as it's done well and within good reason. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Lightning Dust, Sunset Shimmer, or Gilda reformed, I feel they would work the best with the mane 6.

 

And I liked how they handled Discord and he's just as fun to watch now just like when he was a villain. 

[RainbowDashington 89]

NOT King Sombra; his Complete-Monster-ness is what sets him apart to make up for his lack of personality.

Same here... Besides, he's dead

[Scootalove 10,692]

I'll only support reforming villains if the villain needs to be reformed, if it's executed correctly, and that the reformed villain can serve a purpose in any way whether it's helping their former enemies or open opportunities for them to develop.

 

If the reformation also has a good reason for the villain to be reformed, then I'll be proven wrong.

Edited February 17, 2014 by Scootalove

[Castle Bleck 19,449]

@RainbowDashington,

 

True for the show, but he'll finally be in the comics in a couple of months.

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

I like it if it is done well, and adds to the story overall. I also like it if they don't reform a villain, but ally with them, to show how not everything is in moral black and white zones. 

[Megas 28,136]

It really depends on the character, there's just some antagonist that don't need to be reformed, whether they return or not. I liked Discord's reform, but Trixie's was pretty shitty imo.

 

As for one's I'd like to see, Gilda definitely, she doesn't even have to be friends with the rest of the mane 6, just rekindle her friendship with Rainbow Dash

 

 

I'm ok with it. But it's gotta be done right. Lightning Dust is actually reformed, but the scene didn't make the cut.

 

I'm glad it didn't make the cut then, it felt like a really awkward 180

Edited February 17, 2014 by Megas75

[Castle Bleck 19,449]

They already did Trixie (sort of), so let Gilda and/or Lightning Dust come next.

[RainbowDashington 89]

I'm glad it didn't make the cut then, it felt like a really awkward 180

All it was about was "I'm sorry for my recklessness; you are a true role model"

 

Also, it was cut due to time.

[Guest90210 3,569]

Same here... Besides, he's dead

 

I'm sure they could find a way to bring him back to life if they ever want to.

[RainbowDashington 89]

I'm sure they could find a way to bring him back to life if they ever want to.

There's so many ways they could screw up, but I think they won't touch on Sombra.

[Moved to Elsewhere 11,331]

I'm okay with it as long as it works with the plot.

Also I'd like to see Diamond Tiara and silver Spoon, Gilda, and Lightning Dust reform since I think they have more character potential.

And I think reformed Discord is hilarious.

[Castle Bleck 19,449]

I'm sure they could find a way to bring him back to life if they ever want to.

 

The IDW comics will finally feature him in a couple of months:

 

Edited February 17, 2014 by Anti-Villain

[The Coffee Pony 1,390]

It depends on who's being reformed.

 

There are some who can be reformed like Lightning Dust, Gilda and Diamond Tiara as they are just jerks, Sunset Shimmer who's not really evil so much as a misguided, pompous, arrogant, greedy girl who just needed to be taught a lesson and Discord who also was not really evil just, well, chaotic! He just did whatever he thought was fun problem was it was affecting others negatively. Actually now that I think about it, that's still happening, he's just being less of an ass about it!

 

However there are some who can't be reformed like Chrystalis who's a just a creature that needs to feed off the love of others to survive, it's in her nature and Sombra who's gone past the point of no return by enslaving an entire kingdom.

[zev_zev The outcast 418]

Yes

 

Trixie and Lighting Dust

 

Yes, they did all cool

[Ruddboy Olaf 10,628]

Well,it's a yes and no for me.

 

I don't like them being reformed,but I do like the idea of pretending to be and fooling everyone.

Edited October 10, 2016 by PIKAQIU

[Judgement 445]

I chose Trixie, and Diamond Tiara and Silver Spoon.

 

I don't mind it when characters are reformed, but I don't want it to be clićhe. By clićhe I mean "Oh yay! I'm a good guy now! Just forget about all the bad things I've done in the past!"

 

No. I like it when an antagonist becomes a protagonist, but only when the antagonist still acts the way they did before. The things writers sometimes don't realize is maybe an antagonist who is a total jerk is popular BECAUSE he or she is a jerk. This goes for everything, not just MLP.

[Koelath 445]

The idea that all villains can be reformed by the "magic" of friendship is blatantly idiotic. It insults the intelligence of all viewers and plainly ignores the facts of the real world. No more villains should be reformed. If you can't breathe new possibilities into a character without fundamentally altering the character's entire basis then either get a new character or better writers to work on the old one.

[Guest90210 3,569]

The idea that all villains can be reformed by the "magic" of friendship is blatantly idiotic. It insults the intelligence of all viewers and plainly ignores the facts of the real world. No more villains should be reformed. If you can't breathe new possibilities into a character without fundamentally altering the character's entire basis then either get a new character or better writers to work on the old one.

 

While it is true that in real life reforming villains doesn't really happen, I like to think that most TV shows, especially cartoons, are a way to suspend reality and enjoy something that isn't like real life in a lot of ways. Like I said in my original post, it's exciting to me for a villain to have a change of ways and help the good guys fight off a new threat.

[Torrent505 370]

I'm in the camp for reforming Gilda, I always thought the way they just ended their friendship was just so harsh and sudden. I felt the message of the episode came off on the side of abandoning old friends a it quickly for your new ones. I think an episode were she returns and has to suffer through all the mane 6 trying to set her off, especially pinkie, would be hilarious.

 

The episode wouldn't even have to end with a reformation by Gilda. Maybe she ends up getting mad at the end and suggests to Rainbowdash that they have grown apart and that she can't handle her new friends, but the mane 6 fess up to having been trying to set her off and learn a lesson about forgiveness and of being over protective of their friend. The episode could end with them agreeing to still be friends and to more slowly get Gilda used to the mane 6 and the mane 6 used to Gilda.

 

(But this episode would probably never run due to the possible perceived lesbian undertones the public might see in a little girls cartoon about magic ponies and friendship)

[Koelath 445]

While it is true that in real life reforming villains doesn't really happen, I like to think that most TV shows, especially cartoons, are a way to suspend reality and enjoy something that isn't like real life in a lot of ways. Like I said in my original post, it's exciting to me for a villain to have a change of ways and help the good guys fight off a new threat.

 

It'd be more exciting to see a show not hang itself with a noose formed out of cliche deus ex machina. "Oh, is there a villain who needs beating?! BAM, REFORMED!"

 

They did it twice already with Trixie and Sunset Shimmer, three times if Discord counts (he wasn't reformed for the sake of beating him, but for the sake of obvious fanservice).

 

Saying reforming villains doesn't really happen is just wrong. Some villains can be reformed. It happens in life. But not all of them can, and this show risks allowing it to become a cop-out plot device if it turns to that too often. Say anything about how cartoons suspend reality but reality can be toyed with without instilling plainly incorrect worldviews in the viewers (the smaller, dumber ones the franchise exists for who will be taught that friendship is a magical cure-all pill) or insulting the intelligence of the rest (the older, smarter ones who latched onto FiM and know better).

 

FiM is popular, among other reasons, because it isn't just one big mass of fluffy hollow candy cliche like everything else in the MLP franchise. Having the "magic of friendship" randomly reform all the villains is about as revolting a fluffy cliche as there could ever be in a show.

 

New interest and life can be injected into a bad guy without the cliche of reformation. I'm just saying, moderate the plot device.

 

 

"We wanna bring (Discord, Trixie) back. How could we do that?" "How about (he, she) becomes good?" "Great idea! Totally original!" - Reform a villain or two. But don't let that be the default go-to for making a villain relevant again.

 

So far, the only good reformation was Discord. Sunset and Trixie were handled like garbage. If it's used in moderation and done well, have at it. But don't just use it as a poorly-handled cliche like it was with those two.

[LooneyBrony 6]

Villain reformation can work if done well but Keep Calm and Flutter On is an example of how to not do it well since the result would be asking some confounding and uncomfortable questions like:

 

"why did the elements would turn a potentially redeemable character into a cruel case of And I Must Scream?"

 

or

 

"Given that 'yeah he's reformed but he doesn't deserve my trust' look that everypony gives at the end, that is what is considered a friendship?"

 

Or at the very least, without proper pacing, you get a mess where even fans of the episode would say that it seemed rushed

[Rainboom Dash 1,056]

I'm in favor of reforming villains but I don't think every single villain should be reformed, just a few. (I chose Trixie, Sunset Shimmer, Gilda and Lightning Dust)