General Chat Thread

[Killian Jones 2,655]

And to be fair, if you pirate and you never buy, you are not allowed to complain about any issue within the games industry.

[AJHunter 265]

Scumbag SunVox:

Site provides an SDK, but no documentation for it at all.

 

Seriously, why even give us an SDK?

[Killian Jones 2,655]

Scumbag SunVox:

Site provides an SDK, but no documentation for it at all.

 

Seriously, why even give us an SDK?

 

no documentation is better then an incorrect one, like Facebook.

[Vicke 3,189]

And to be fair, if you pirate and you never buy, you are not allowed to complain about any issue within the games industry.

 

That was a funny comment.

I've pirated several games without buying them, because they turn out to be crap.

[Killian Jones 2,655]

That was a funny comment.

I've pirated several games without buying them, because they turn out to be crap.

 

In that case I just don't buy games that don't offer a demo before release, you cannot expect me to buy Day 1 without a demo.

[AJHunter 265]

no documentation is better then an incorrect one, like Facebook.

 

No facebook is better than a wall full of idiots.

 

Scumbag google, only giving me "cracked" APK files for a free software when I'm looking for documentation.

 

To weigh in on the piracy discussion, My philosophy is that it's better that an artist be seen and heard than payed. But I'm still eventually gonna pay of my five or six complete discographies I torrented >.>

[Bronium 512]

@Tich

• I'd never actually complain about bugs. I don't think I've ever said a pirated game is buggy (even if it is). I don't know many that do, but then again, small sample space. I mean, that's kind of the unspoken agreement all pirates, right?
• The problem I have with steam is that the client has to be running to play games that you already own and that's on your hard drive. If you lose your account (I did for no god damn reason) then your fucked off all the games you bought. And the worst thing is, the moment you spend a cent on steam, you can't leave it, lest you lost all that money.
• The offline mode has to be activated through steam. You still have to enter your account, which has to be connected to the internet to turn on offline mode and I'm not sure people always play on offline mode.
• That's what I meant by inconvenience. All the stuff you have to get through to play a game. And steam gets past all this stuff. Yet they have their service problems themselves. You have to be always online or at least be online long enough to turn offline mode on.

[Vicke 3,189]

In that case I just don't buy games that don't offer a demo before release, you cannot expect me to buy Day 1 without a demo.

 

The only games i've pirated within this year is Resident Evil: Raccoon City and some The Sims 3 expansion.

I would never in my life pay full price for a sloppy expansion. It is something that should have been in the game in the first place.

And being a Resident Evil fan i was going to buy it, but i heard it was total crap. So i pirated it to try the first levels and thank god that i did.

[Starshine 16,333]

My philosophy is that it's better that an artist be seen and heard than payed

And here we have, the artist

 

Believe me when I said some creator/artist/developer/whatever prefers to be paid rather than be known worldwide

[Bronium 512]

And to be fair, if you pirate and you never buy, you are not allowed to complain about any issue within the games industry.

I think that's a bit flawed. Even though I didn't buy a game, doesn't mean I can't see it's faults. If somethings bad for the industry, I don't have to buy the game to tell the industry that they're wrong. My opinion does not matter less if I don't buy games. It matters less to the industry, but my points are just as valid.

[Vicke 3,189]

I think that's a bit flawed. Even though I didn't buy a game, doesn't mean I can't see it's faults. If somethings bad for the industry, I don't have to buy the game to tell the industry that they're wrong. My opinion does not matter less if I don't buy games. It matters less to the industry, but my points are just as valid.

 

Well said.

[Bronium 512]

@,

 

Yeah, Star Weaver is pretty much right on the ball here. I mean, it's still an industry. They rather get paid, ya know? I mean, if you have no way to buy the game legally, I'm sure they don't mind, but otherwise, I'd think they'd want you to buy, rather than pirate.

[Killian Jones 2,655]

I think that's a bit flawed. Even though I didn't buy a game, doesn't mean I can't see it's faults. If somethings bad for the industry, I don't have to buy the game to tell the industry that they're wrong. My opinion does not matter less if I don't buy games. It matters less to the industry, but my points are just as valid.

 

I'm not saying you can't make a valid point, but you have no right to complain, you can't complain that the games you want aren't being released or aren't seeing sequels when you failed to support development in the first place. And the idea that some have that someone else will do it has become so ingrained that it's gotten to the point where actually good games are either being massively overlooked or just not selling enough. And then people who pirate cannot complain.

 

Companies see where money goes, if something sells well, companies are inclined to copy the success formula, when something failed. Speaking happens with your wallet.

 

@,

 

Yeah, Star Weaver is pretty much right on the ball here. I mean, it's still an industry. They rather get paid, ya know? I mean, if you have no way to buy the game legally, I'm sure they don't mind, but otherwise, I'd think they'd want you to buy, rather than pirate.

 

I don't mind piracy in that case, if the system has no way of delivering the items to you which you are willing to pay for, then piracy is literally the only option, and no one can lose money because for neither party there was anything to gain.

 

Piracy in some instances can't be justified, but in most it's wanting something for nothing.

[Vicke 3,189]

I'm not saying you can't make a valid point, but you have no right to complain, you can't complain that the games you want aren't being released or aren't seeing sequels when you failed to support development in the first place. And the idea that some have that someone else will do it has become so ingrained that it's gotten to the point where actually good games are either being massively overlooked or just not selling enough. And then people who pirate cannot complain.

 

Companies see where money goes, if something sells well, companies are inclined to copy the success formula, when something failed. Speaking happens with your wallet.

 

Ofcourse pirates have the rights to complain about stuff like that.

But i hope they have some shame and think twice before they pirate something without buying it.

[AJHunter 265]

And here we have, the artist

 

Believe me when I said some creator/artist/developer/whatever prefers to be paid rather than be known worldwide

 

But the idea is that, through being seen and heard, the artist becomes more popular, more people start buying their stuff, attending shows, and, most importantly, sharing with others.

 

Case in point: Pirate Bay's "Promo Bay" system. An artist, usually a musician or video... person (I forget what word I'm looking for), uploads an album, EP, single, exclusive promotion package, etcetera, and allows it to be downloaded for free on their site. They apply for Promo Bay (which is free), and if they're accepted, their ad is put up and Pirate Bay hosts a torrent of whatever it is the hopeful person wanted. This has taken one band, Monster Cat, from not having their own instruments to touring the world, just because word of them got out and people paid for merch and physical copies.

[Starshine 16,333]

A random intermission!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But the idea is that, through being seen and heard, the artist becomes more popular, more people start buying their stuff, attending shows, and, most importantly, sharing with others.

 

Case in point: Pirate Bay's "Promo Bay" system. An artist, usually a musician or video... person (I forget what word I'm looking for), uploads an album, EP, single, exclusive promotion package, etcetera, and allows it to be downloaded for free on their site. They apply for Promo Bay (which is free), and if they're accepted, their ad is put up and Pirate Bay hosts a torrent of whatever it is the hopeful person wanted. This has taken one band, Monster Cat, from not having their own instruments to touring the world, just because word of them got out and people paid for merch and physical copies.

 

And how many times that works? There are countless artists out there never got a chance to rise because they have no solid footing on the market thanks to piracy.

 

If they are already popular enough, maybe spreading free stuff can help. But if the artist had to start from zero, betcha they will die before the next summer

[Bronium 512]

@,

See, you said issues in the industry. Issues and not games. I have a right to complain about issues. Not because I'm looking out for myself (because many issues like intrusive DRM doesn't affect me) but a message is greater if the voice is larger. If the company is evil, I have a right to my fellow gamers to help them call the company out on the evil. It's for the good of the industry.

 

You're totally right that I shouldn't demand certain games to be released (and when I do, I've always already bought the game). The industry listens to the wallet, and I'm just taking advantage of the system.

 

@Vicke

I don't think that they're entitles to ask for sequels. I mean, what if they just pirate the sequel?

 

Piracy in some instances can't be justified, but in most it's wanting something for nothing.

Or the game is sometimes better than the actual non pirated versions, due to DRM. Mind you, DRM doesn't affect pirates. They've already circumnavigated the DRM. The actual users though, have not.

[Vicke 3,189]

@,

See, you said issues in the industry. Issues and not games. I have a right to complain about issues. Not because I'm looking out for myself (because many issues like intrusive DRM doesn't affect me) but a message is greater if the voice is larger. If the company is evil, I have a right to my fellow gamers to help them call the company out on the evil. It's for the good of the industry.

 

You're totally right that I shouldn't demand certain games to be released (and when I do, I've always already bought the game). The industry listens to the wallet, and I'm just taking advantage of the system.

 

@Vicke

I don't think that they're entitles to ask for sequels. I mean, what if they just pirate the sequel?

 

 

Or the game is sometimes better than the actual non pirated versions, due to DRM. Mind you, DRM doesn't affect pirates. They've already circumnavigated the DRM. The actual users though, have not.

 

They probably will pirate the sequel, or not. Its diffrent from person to person.

But they DO have all the rights they need to ask for a sequel. They thought the game was good and just by asking for a sequel proves that the game had potetial.

[Bronium 512]

But they DO have all the rights they need to ask for a sequel. They thought the game was good and just by asking for a sequel proves that the game had potetial.

Well, I guess they can ask for a sequel, but they can't demand it and they sure as hell can't expect their opinion to actually count. I mean, they didn't provide support to the developer. I mean, donate or just buy the game later (and not at 50% off. The price at which you pirated the game) to show support and then you can demand but other than that, you've gotta ask.

Edited September 29, 2012 by Bronium

[Vicke 3,189]

Well, I guess they can ask for a sequel, but they can't demand it and they sure as hell can't expect their opinion to actually count. I mean, they didn't provide support to the developer. I mean, donate or just buy the game later (and not at 50% off. The price at which you pirated the game) to show support and then you can demand but other than that, you've gotta ask.

 

Nobody have the right to demand something.

[Killian Jones 2,655]

@@Bronium, But complaining when you didn't purchase is like a cheat, it's like trying to say the food in McDonalds is bad even though you never ate there.

 

The problem is, you can't get all outrtaged and entitled over any practice if you aren't affected by it. And as for Steam, you guys are making it a bigger deal then it is, not looking at practices by for example Ubisoft or more recently Blizzard.

 

 

They probably will pirate the sequel, or not. Its diffrent from person to person.

But they DO have all the rights they need to ask for a sequel. They thought the game was good and just by asking for a sequel proves that the game had potetial.

 

However pirates forget games cost often an easy 2 million dollars to make, and the industry needs people to pay the entire staff in order to make these games.

 

It's not unreasonable for me to ask you to buy a game you like.

[Bronium 512]

Nobody have the right to demand something.

What if you're a producer of the sequel? You have an expectation for them to produce the product you paid them to produce.

[Vicke 3,189]

@, If those pirates are so selfish that they won't buy a game that they like, its just them being stupid and ignorant.

I used to download a lot of games before when i hardly had any money. But now when i do have a lot of it, i hardly download anything.

 

 

@@Bronium, You still can't demand them. It is something the producer has to count with, i the game fails, don't expect a sequal.

[AJHunter 265]

A random intermission!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And how many times that works? There are countless artists out there never got a chance to rise because they have no solid footing on the market thanks to piracy.

 

If they are already popular enough, maybe spreading free stuff can help. But if the artist had to start from zero, betcha they will die before the next summer

 

But that's the thing: In many cases with Promo Bay, the artist either started from nothing or had but a small local following.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying piracy is right, I'm just saying that, if done right, it can be a powerful marketing tool. More record companies and artists need to realize this, IMO.

[Killian Jones 2,655]

@@Vicke, Which is good, buying games brings us good sequels and better original IP.