Controversial: Sexism In MLP

[Gravelord Neat-O 305]

there's a controversy over this? i thought everyone got along

[Castle Bleck 19,383]

OH MY GOD HOW DARE WILLING AND ABLE MALES BE GIVEN GENERIC PHYSICAL JOBS FOR PRESUMABLY REASONABLE WAGES

 

[M'gann M'orzz 745]

Is it sexist when most other cartoons have a mostly male cast?? No. Then no MLP FIM isn't sexist at all. And you are the type of person who makes the fandom look bad, taking show targeted at young girls and wanting to make it more about YOU.

Edited January 14, 2014 by M'gann M'orzz

[Nature's Spell 526]

Haven't we had threads about this already? The main cast are all unattached females who do not date. Why would we have any more males than we have now? The male characters they show cover all the basses they need to. Heck if you're not a mane or secondary character you just stand there, even females. The show can't show us every social interaction the mane 6 have!

 

What you're saying is there should be a main character who is male, which is a totally different topic.

Edited January 14, 2014 by Nature's Spell

[VeroxVitrus 71]

Is it sexist when most other cartoons have a mostly male cast?? No. Then no MLP FIM isn't sexist at all. And you are the type of person who makes the fandom look bad, taking show targeted at young girls and wanting to make it more about YOU.

 

It's not about the cast, It's the actual show itself and how it portrays the male gender. IMO, It doesn't matter if it's targeted towards a certain age group as long as it doesn't go overboard and stereotype the other gender.

 

Please take note that I'm a theorist and I'm into this stuff. So you can't really classify someone who's in a fandom under there personality.

[Serbon div 386]

I think Equestria is supposed to portray a perfect society. Would you want a perfect society to have more males or more females? Also did you ever see a female construction worker?

[Dr. Mechano 630]

Would you want a perfect society to have more males or more females? 

 

Why should that matter? I'm not sure I understand the question.

 

Also did you ever see a female construction worker?

 

...Yes? Many women do take on physically-intensive jobs like construction, and do a damn good job at it. 

 

Here's a handful of posts by or about female construction workers.

 

As for the context of the show, remember that Rainbow Dash works in a weather factory in Cloudsdale, as seen in Sonic Rainboom when she briefly shows her friends around her workplace before the competition. This isn't treated as "unfeminine" or "inappropriate" because she's female, and her gender is never made an issue of in the first place. That's how we need to view women in conventionally male-dominated occupations (or men in conventionally female-dominated ones); by treating them as completely equal and just as valid an employee as anyone else, not patronizing them because of their gender (which again, MLP thankfully doesn't do).

[hawkflame 3,310]

It's not about the cast, It's the actual show itself and how it portrays the male gender. IMO, It doesn't matter if it's targeted towards a certain age group as long as it doesn't go overboard and stereotype the other gender.

 

Please take note that I'm a theorist and I'm into this stuff. So you can't really classify someone who's in a fandom under there personality.

 

You're equating a paid professional who does physical labor (which is what these stallions are) with slavery, and I don't think that's fair. 

 

Besides which there are plenty of male characters who aren't in such a role.  Fancypants, Shining Armor, Hoity Toity, Soarin, Mr. Cake, Dash's doctor in Read it and Weep, the sheriff of Appleloosa, Donut Joe, Applejack's Uncle Orange...

[Nah 3,182]

The bronies that cry sexism in MLP most the time are Men's Right's Activists, which trust me, they're nutjobs, MLP was intended for a younger female audience, and I see no point in complaining about it, about so called sexism in it, the show will never be catered to older audiences and it's sad fans take the show seriously. 

 

Also this blog pretty much rounds up what these Bronies think: http://mylittlemisandry.tumblr.com/

 

Seriously, that My Little Misandry blog pisses me off.

[PoniesPlease 365]

No, just, no.

 

Don't make more of something than is actually there.

 

That's how the West ended up in the Middle East.

[n00bert 18]

 

How can a show with a focus on friendship be sexist? Misinterpretation breeds controversy.

 

Men's Right's Activists

 

lol

[Dr. Mechano 630]

Also this blog pretty much rounds up what these Bronies think: http://mylittlemisandry.tumblr.com/

 

Seriously, that My Little Misandry blog pisses me off.

Yeah. Here's an important distinction for the fanbase to remember: Prejudice against men happens, but it happens on an individual level in isolated incidents. It's not a good thing, but it is also nowhere near equivalent to misogyny, which is the institutionalized prejudice against women that permeates our society.

 

Male fans of this show (or really, men in general) have no basis to complain about "misandry," which - while it technically exists - is powerless, isolated, and ultimately does not affect them. Misogyny, by contrast, does affect women (and men, in a broader sense) constantly, and is something this fanbase - for all its talk of love and tolerance - should stand together against.

Edited January 14, 2014 by Dr. Mechano

[hawkflame 3,310]

Yeah. Here's an important distinction for the fanbase to remember: Prejudice against men happens, but it happens on an individual level in isolated incidents. It's not a good thing, but it is also nowhere near equivalent to misogyny, which is the institutionalized prejudice against women that permeates our society.

 

Male fans of this show (or really, men in general) have no basis to complain about "misandry," which - while it technically exists - is powerless, isolated, and ultimately does not affect them. Misogyny, by contrast, does affect women (and men, in a broader sense) constantly, and is something this fanbase - for all its talk of love and tolerance - should stand together against.

Well I do think that society has stacked things against men in comparison to women in certain ways (the draft, prison sentences, treatment of victims of rape or domestic abuse, etc.) I really don't think that applies here. Targeting a show like MLP seems like they're looking for something to complain about.

 

And it looks like they're just targeting MLP. If they were also looking at shows where women are portrayed unfairly as well, they might have a more credible stance, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

[Dr. Mechano 630]

Well I do think that society has stacked things against men in comparison to women in certain ways (the draft, prison sentences, treatment of victims of rape or domestic abuse, etc.) I really don't think that applies here. Targeting a show like MLP seems like they're looking for something to complain about.

I see what you're saying, I really do. In fact, I don't even completely disagree, because some of what you're saying (particularly about male rape and abuse victims) is absolutely correct. But I want to clarify that this isn't some case of "female privilege" so much as it is "male privilege backfiring."

 

The issue here is that the things you mentioned (the treatment of male abuse victims in particular) aren't really examples of women are being unfavorably privileged. Rather, it's a result of our culture's patriarchal, regressive gender roles that dictate that women are supposedly "the weaker sex," and that men are supposed to "tough it out." This is so pervasive that it even influences legal decisions, unfortunately. So I agree that male abuse victims should be taken just as seriously as female victims. This idea that "men are strong and therefore cannot be victims of domestic abuse" is a wholly patriarchal notion, however, not some supposed pro-female bias. The whole "You're a man, tough it out" thing is steeped in traditional gender roles, which are stifling to people regardless of sex.

 

It is my belief that the few times men aren't advantaged by society, it's due to the very same biases that usually do favor those men. All the more reason to challenge traditional gender prejudices, as men - and especially women - are severely limited by these gender-based expectations. Basically, I agree that men face some unique prejudices that women don't, but my argument is that those prejudices are because of the expectations of other men, rather than women.

Edited January 14, 2014 by Dr. Mechano

[Silverwisp the Bard 2,353]

OT: Nope.

In other groundbreaking news: The Friendzone is not a thing.

 

 

 

 

Also this blog pretty much rounds up what these Bronies think

I think I actually got dumber reading their frontpage. Just nuke it.

 

 

Would you want a perfect society to have more males or more females?

Judging by your age, I'll assume that's the hormones speaking. Don't worry, it will pass.

 

 

 

Also did you ever see a female construction worker?

Yup, worked with one for a while, building stone stairs.

[Serbon div 386]

 

 

Judging by your age, I'll assume that's the hormones speaking. Don't worry, it will pass.

Hahahahahahhaa xD And you are old and experienced? Well you can interpret it that way if you want. What I was trying to say that in nature there is naturally more females, since males are supposed to have more offspring. I usually go to my village where I was born during summer vacations and I work with chicken and when new chicks are born there's like at least 10 hens to 1 rooster, if we even get a rooster that is. And since there is so much female ponies in the show, I supposed it would be like that. And what is not a perfect society if it isn't made by Nature/God (depends on your beliefs)?

 

 

Yup, worked with one for a while, building stone stairs.

While our school was being reconstructed I only saw male workers, which is why I developed that opinion.

[Silverwisp the Bard 2,353]

 

 

What I was trying to say that in nature there is naturally more females, since males are supposed to have more offspring.

Well, that is heavily dependent on species, environment ect.

As for the show, I assume it is meant to be a 1:1 ratio between the sexes (monogamous heterosexual relationships seem to be the norm). The actual gap in the show (which has been getting smaller as of late) is mostly likely due to female ponies being easier to create rather than any hidden meaning behind it.

[Serbon div 386]

 

 

As for the show, I assume it is meant to be a 1:1 ratio between the sexes (monogamous heterosexual relationships seem to be the norm). The actual gap in the show (which has been getting smaller as of late) is mostly likely due to female ponies being easier to create rather than any hidden meaning behind it.

Why would there be a 1:1 sex ratio if we see more females then males in the show? And I don't know what hidden meaning you are speaking of.

[Silverwisp the Bard 2,353]

Why would there be a 1:1 sex ratio if we see more females then males in the show?

Because its the default setting, anthropomorphized animals or no. Just like they are way more males than females in GI Joe: It could mean that in that universe the gender ratio is vastly different to ours. But I probably doesn't.

There are no real indicators in the show that the shortage of males is due to anything but convenience for the animators.

[Serbon div 386]

 

 

There are no real indicators in the show that the shortage of males is due to anything but convenience for the animators.

It's still all that we have, and from what we have we should deduce not speculate. 

[Page.Turner 940]

Oh no! Sexism towards MEN!? How unfair! *sarcasm intensifies*

 

I'm sorry, but I feel that the statement needs to be trivialized at least a little bit

 

There is no sexism in MLP:FiM nor any other generation seen before. To even take the most unimportant thing about the show (the lack of male characters seen) which has nothing to do with how the show is run and try to turn it into the "plight of the male gender"? It not only is ignorant and childish, but it just heavily forces the ideal that men are more important than women and if they are, in any way, being neglected their "rights" then something HAS TO BE DONE ABOUT IT!!!

 

But if you look in the opposite direction in the real world? MLP:FiM is nothing but a dream. Women have been, and still are, trivialized by men in modern society. But when we say something about it? When we bring it to attention? We're seen as nothing but hormonal bitches who will never get a guy with THAT kind of attitude.

 

I could go on forever, but I won't There's no point.

 

TL;DR There is no sexism in MLP =___= And not only is the show geared towards the female gender? It also doesn't owe you anything, such as more background males.

[Dr. Mechano 630]

But if you look in the opposite direction in the real world? MLP:FiM is nothing but a dream. Women have been, and still are, trivialized by men in modern society. But when we say something about it? When we bring it to attention? We're seen as nothing but hormonal bitches who will never get a guy with THAT kind of attitude.

I hate how this attitude pervades the MLP fandom in particular too. The misogyny in this fanbase is so prevalent that it's becoming normalized and accepted as okay. And I feel that we must call this sort of behavior out wherever we see it, as silence condones.

 

Many - not all, but many - male fans of the show view any complaints about misogyny in the fandom as "just women whining" (nevermind that many men also oppose misogyny). This fandom is full of unabashed sexism, rape jokes, and objectification and marginalization of female fans, but if anyone speaks out against it, certain male fans inevitably start freaking out and claiming that by having their sexist normativity challenged at all, then suddenly they're the ones being oppressed by women. This is how pervasive misogyny is. Simply speaking out against misogyny and striving for equal treatment is - from their perspective - somehow "misandrist."

 

I'm glad more fans are calling this out, and I encourage more of the so-called "silent majority" of tolerant fans to stop being so silent and speak out against brony bigotry. If we agree that the bigoted fans are a vocal minority, then we need to speak up and be more vocal than they are.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Dr. Mechano

[Vixor 80]

It's still all that we have, and from what we have we should deduce not speculate. 

 

But that's wrong, there is no REAL evidence that the ratio is uneven, especially when you consider just how inconsistent those background pony shots are.(clones everywhere!) On the other hand, evidence that points torwards an even ratio is the fact that the ponies are monogamous, and Manehattan seems to have an even ratio as well, though that's relying on background pony shots again.

 

There is no definitive answer, but I'm confident in saying that it's much more likely that the ratio is even. If you want to headcanon that it's uneven, by all means do so; headcanons are fun, but it gets a little annoying when people try to push radical headcanons/theories like that as actually canon.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Vixor

[Guest]

Hasbro is a business.

 

MLP is a brand.

 

They are in this to make money.

 

Why did I just bold those fonts? Simple: because these are important things to remember. The target audience is, has been, always shall be young girls. Girls at that age are not really interested in boys as statistics show. So as a result they do not show many male characters because really when you're 7 and female, at that age most boys are still "icky". It has nothing to do with sexism, and everything to do with: "that is what sells." 

 

It's what little girls want to see, and it's what will make the money. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

[hawkflame 3,310]

I hate how this attitude pervades the MLP fandom in particular too. The misogyny in this fanbase is so prevalent that it's becoming normalized and accepted as okay. And I feel that we must call this sort of behavior out wherever we see it, as silence condones.

 

Many - not all, but many - male fans of the show view any complaints about misogyny in the fandom as "just women whining" (nevermind that many men also oppose misogyny). This fandom is full of unabashed sexism, rape jokes, and objectification and marginalization of female fans, but if anyone speaks out against it, certain male fans inevitably start freaking out and claiming that by having their sexist normativity challenged at all, then suddenly they're the ones being oppressed by women. This is how pervasive misogyny is. Simply speaking out against misogyny and striving for equal treatment is - from their perspective - somehow "misandrist."

 

I'm glad more fans are calling this out, and I encourage more of the so-called "silent majority" of tolerant fans to stop being so silent and speak out against brony bigotry. If we agree that the bigoted fans are a vocal minority, then we need to speak up and be more vocal than they are.

I think there's a lot of thought that because they like a show like MLP that gives them license to say whatever they want when it comes to gender. Either that or because they like a "girly" show they need to reaffirm their manliness by acting like a dick.

 

It's interesting because this is a show that's so progressive when it comes to gender and defining how girls and women can be anything without judgment. You'd think that guys who freely and openly identify with female ponies would be similarly open minded.

 

I do agree, though, that we need to pay attention and call out this behavior when it happens.