I know many consider King Sombra the worst villian ever but . . .

[Koelath 445]

"Sombra was meant to be a threat, not a character! Like Sauron!"

Great. Except he ISN'T A THREAT. He spends the entire episode just growling from behind a shield. Up until nearly the end of the episode, he couldn't do ANYTHING to ANYONE. Sauron at least had minions to send after the heroes. Sombra just made angry noises at them. And even after breaking in, he doesn't manage to do any harm. He's a Sauron wannabe at best.

He was basically a big dog tied down at a post. Sure, he can growl and bark and that might startle you. But a second later, you'll notice he's firmly stuck in place and out of range. Then what minimal sense of threat there even was is gone and his noise is just annoying.

[Mywas 687]

The issue isn't depth, the issue is whether or not it was handled well.  It's not that he was pure evil.  It's that he was boring.  Pure evil can make for great villains if they're presented in the right way.  The shark in Jaws, for instance is a great villain because of the way it was shot.  Jaws and Michael Myers were great villains because of the subtlety of the directors, creating a lot of suspense, and great atmosphere.  Michael Myers is simply *scarier* as an unrepentant killing machine. 

 

Yes, Sombra may have been great *if* DHX were allowed to create something as terrifyingly suspenseful as Carpenter's Halloween or the first Jaws.  But seeing as how this is a child friendly TV show, that's not in the cards.  So you're left with a "Pure evil" force that's not that scary and doesn't have the charisma to make up for it like Discord or Chrysalis.

 

Excuse me but what "Charisma" Did Nightmare Moon Chrysalis or Sunset had? I understand Discord but the others were just as boring as Sombra. Nightmare moon was unthreatning and while She has a backdtory its more focused on Luna rather than Moon herself, heck the only reason nobody complained about her is because nobody had expectations for her.

 

Chrysalis was a stupid James Bond villain whos more annoying than a villain with Charisma. Her speeches were depressing and crinch worthy and her fight with Celestia was just lasers with nothing special

 

Sunset......Do I even need to say It?

 

You can't say he is boring because all villains besides Discord are boring.

[Scootalove 10,689]

Look, opinions aside.

 

No matter what complaining anyone says about the villains, what happened...happened. Not really a purpose in hating a villain, it's just something that's trivial.

[Talisman 31]

"Sombra was meant to be a threat, not a character! Like Sauron!"

 

Great. Except he ISN'T A THREAT. He spends the entire episode just growling from behind a shield. Up until nearly the end of the episode, he couldn't do ANYTHING to ANYONE. Sauron at least had minions to send after the heroes. Sombra just made angry noises at them. And even after breaking in, he doesn't manage to do any harm. He's a Sauron wannabe at best.

 

He was basically a big dog tied down at a post. Sure, he can growl and bark and that might startle you. But a second later, you'll notice he's firmly stuck in place and out of range. Then what minimal sense of threat there even was is gone and his noise is just annoying.

Eenope.

 

Sombra was a constant threat. He neutralized Shining Armor's magic the first time we saw him, leaving only Cadance to maintain the shield. We clearly saw Cadance growing weaker and weaker under the strain, while Sombra grew stronger and constantly tested Cadance's shield. The Crystal Ponies' reactions leave little doubt that Sombra, had he gotten in, would have devastated the Crystal Empire. Twilight and the others were fighting for time the entire way, and had they been even a minute or two late, Sombra would have won.

 

It's easy to look at a challenge like that after the fact that say that, since Sombra didn't harm anypony he wasn't a threat; since Twilight did bypass his traps they were weak and pointless. This, IMO, is an unfair way to view it. It's like saying, since [Olympic athlete] won the gold, everyone else was retroactively dumb for even competing.

 

Sombra neutralized Shining Armor, Twilight, and Cadance. He took out the three biggest threats to himself - an alicorn and two enormously powerful unicorn sorcerers - and in Twilight's case, he did it with traps and failsafes laid down centuries ago. Dude was hardcore.

[Koelath 445]

Eenope.

 

Sombra was a constant threat. He neutralized Shining Armor's magic the first time we saw him, leaving only Cadance to maintain the shield. We clearly saw Cadance growing weaker and weaker under the strain, while Sombra grew stronger and constantly tested Cadance's shield. The Crystal Ponies' reactions leave little doubt that Sombra, had he gotten in, would have devastated the Crystal Empire. Twilight and the others were fighting for time the entire way, and had they been even a minute or two late, Sombra would have won.

 

It's easy to look at a challenge like that after the fact that say that, since Sombra didn't harm anypony he wasn't a threat; since Twilight did bypass his traps they were weak and pointless. This, IMO, is an unfair way to view it. It's like saying, since [Olympic athlete] won the gold, everyone else was retroactively dumb for even competing.

 

Sombra neutralized Shining Armor, Twilight, and Cadance. He took out the three biggest threats to himself - an alicorn and two enormously powerful unicorn sorcerers - and in Twilight's case, he did it with traps and failsafes laid down centuries ago. Dude was hardcore.

Yeah, constantly tested...And never broke until the very end of the episode. And Twilight stumbling into some traps hardly makes Sombra threatening. He didn't neutralize her, she neutralized herself by being careless.

 

Yeah, the crystal ponies acted scared...So? They're not the ones who should feel scared. The viewer should. It's like if everyone in the show swore Pinkie Pie was a jerk. They can say it until time stops and everyone in the show can buy into it but it's the viewer who must be convinced or else it's a failure. Sure, they acted scared and threatened but I didn't believe it. And if a show cannot make the viewer believe a character who is allegedly scary and threatening is actually scary or threatening, that's a big flaw in the character.

 

They can act like he's scary and say he's scary over and over but he wasn't able to back that up. That's what's called an informed attribute, and it's generally a sign of a lousy character.

 

What I should have been thinking during the episode: "This guy's gonna seriously wreck some s### if he gets through that..."

 

What I actually was thinking during the episode: "Ugh, is he just gonna look menacing from behind a magical playpen gate the whole time? Some threat...DO ANYTHING ALREADY!"

 

He doesn't have to harm anybody to be a threat. He just has to be threatening. As it was, the characters sure loved to talk about how threatening he was, but he wasn't. Case in point, when he neutralized Shining's magic, I should have felt a jolt of alarm or suspense or something, like I did when the other villains were at work. But I didn't, because in his entire time being there, he simply failed to be threatening. Even knowing that this series thrives on happy endings, there were points during Discord and Chrysalis' episodes where I felt they might best the good guys. I felt none of that here because Sombra wasn't a threat. He was a lousy villain and character. And even a lousy take on 'pure evil'.

 

He was basically Zecora: This evil scary beast in theory, nothing of the sort in practice.

[ukxRainbowdash 165]

They aren't real villains though.

Sombra is a villan, he wanted domination and was close to getting it,

The vines caused more destruction, but do not count as a real physical villan.

[Castle Bleck 19,356]

@Koelath,

 

Sauron also had "informed attributes"; by your logic, he sucked as well.

Edited February 10, 2014 by SkyBound
Post Restored

[Kraken B. Trippin 43]

See, I hated Chrysalis solely because her plan only worked in the least bit because everypony was being stupid except for Twilight Sparkle. If anypony had even been paying the least bit of attention, Chrysalis would of gotten slapped down hardcore.

 

Sombra on the other hand, was just colossally boring. I hardly even remember the episodes that were featured in his story arc. And personally, I rank a stupid plotline that I remember due to it's stupidity worse than a plotline that was so uninspired that I can't be bothered to remember it.

 

Chrysalis for worst villain to me.

[Castle Bleck 19,356]

His actions being... cursing the entire Crystal Empire, "equalizing" other unicorns, spreading dark crystals despite the barrier, setting a s***load of traps 1,000 years in advance, and trying to overkill a child just for holding his Achilles' Heel.

 

There you go; all fixed for you.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Anti-Villain

[hawkflame 3,310]

Excuse me but what "Charisma" Did Nightmare Moon Chrysalis or Sunset had? I understand Discord but the others were just as boring as Sombra. Nightmare moon was unthreatning and while She has a backdtory its more focused on Luna rather than Moon herself, heck the only reason nobody complained about her is because nobody had expectations for her.

 

Chrysalis was a stupid James Bond villain whos more annoying than a villain with Charisma. Her speeches were depressing and crinch worthy and her fight with Celestia was just lasers with nothing special

 

Sunset......Do I even need to say It?

 

You can't say he is boring because all villains besides Discord are boring.

 

Are you kidding me?  Nightmare Moon and Chrysalis, *especially* Chrysalis, oozed charisma and presence.  Everything she did, the way she spoke, even the way she moved, was done with elegance, power, and a real sense of menace.  She's straight out of the classic Disney villain mold, a la Maleficent or Ursula. 

 

Sunset Shimmer isn't the greatest, but at least she's an actual *character*, with motivations, feelings, and a *personality*.  They *all* had some personality.  What did Sombra have?

[Castle Bleck 19,356]

Are you kidding me?  Nightmare Moon and Chrysalis, *especially* Chrysalis, oozed charisma and presence.  Everything she did, the way she spoke, even the way she moved, was done with elegance, power, and a real sense of menace.  She's straight out of the classic Disney villain mold, a la Maleficent or Ursula. 

 

Sunset Shimmer isn't the greatest, but at least she's an actual *character*, with motivations, feelings, and a *personality*.  They *all* had some personality.  What did Sombra have?

 

NMM = backstory.

Discord = personality.

Chrysalis = motivation.

Sombra = presence.

Sunset =

[Mywas 687]

Are you kidding me? Nightmare Moon and Chrysalis, *especially* Chrysalis, oozed charisma and presence. Everything she did, the way she spoke, even the way she moved, was done with elegance, power, and a real sense of menace. She's straight out of the classic Disney villain mold, a la Maleficent or Ursula.

 

Sunset Shimmer isn't the greatest, but at least she's an actual *character*, with motivations, feelings, and a *personality*. They *all* had some personality. What did Sombra have?

>Are you kidding me

ofcourse, Everyone who has a different opinion must be trolling. Because clearly your opinions are facts.

 

and you keep on forgetting Sombras role.

For example the one could argue that Darth Maul is a boring and shallow villain whos only character trait is being Palpatines student and having cool Lightsaber skills.

But at the same time He is a good villain because he represents how evil a Sith Lord could be.

 

Its the same with Sombra. While he is not a quirky joker and his only motive is powerhunger. He represents Twilights biggest fear: Failing the test and letting Celetia down. He is what she needs to overcome to pass the test. And when he puts her in that crystal barriel she was forced to put the need of others infront of her needs. He a obstacle she needed to overcome and he did that just fine.

[Talisman 31]

Okay, let's take this point-by-point.

 

 

Yeah, constantly tested...And never broke until the very end of the episode. And Twilight stumbling into some traps hardly makes Sombra threatening. He didn't neutralize her, she neutralized herself by being careless.

You are wrong there. Sombra did neutralize Twilight. Again, it's easy to dismiss traps after the fact, just like it's easy to dismiss riddles after the solution has been handed to you. Twilight didn't have that luxury, and the fact that the writers had to cram all this into a 40-minute timeslot didn't help matters.

 

 

Yeah, the crystal ponies acted scared...So? They're not the ones who should feel scared. The viewer should. It's like if everyone in the show swore Pinkie Pie was a jerk. They can say it until time stops and everyone in the show can buy into it but it's the viewer who must be convinced or else it's a failure. Sure, they acted scared and threatened but I didn't believe it. And if a show cannot make the viewer believe a character who is allegedly scary and threatening is actually scary or threatening, that's a big flaw in the character.

They can act like he's scary and say he's scary over and over but he wasn't able to back that up. That's what's called an informed attribute, and it's generally a sign of a lousy character.

I don't know what you expected. Sombra was never going to raven through town, tearing ponies apart. The crystal ponies evinced actual pain when asked to remember his reign, and flew into a panic when they realized he had returned. Celestia considered him a dire threat. If you're not willing to accept the reactions of the characters, what do you want?

 

Also, I think you do not know what "informed attribute" means.  To qualify, a character must show no evidence of said attribute, but Sombra demonstrated power, cunning, and malice.

 

 

He doesn't have to harm anybody to be a threat. He just has to be threatening. As it was, the characters sure loved to talk about how threatening he was, but he wasn't. Case in point, when he neutralized Shining's magic, I should have felt a jolt of alarm or suspense or something, like I did when the other villains were at work. But I didn't, because in his entire time being there, he simply failed to be threatening. Even knowing that this series thrives on happy endings, there were points during Discord and Chrysalis' episodes where I felt they might best the good guys. I felt none of that here because Sombra wasn't a threat. He was a lousy villain and character. And even a lousy take on 'pure evil'.
 

Well, I found him to be very threatening. He was visually quite impressive, with his blackfire mane, glowing eyes, and evolution from cloud of darkness into physical unicorn. He canonically fought Celestia and Luna together, and they were only able to achieve a Pyrrhic victory against him - they beat him, but lost the Empire. He straight-up beat Shining Armor, a unicorn of tremendous power, and very quickly. He beat Cadance, an alicorn.

 

He beat Twilight through pure planning - and suggesting that Twilight "stumbled into some traps" is pretty insulting to her. How, pray tell, was she supposed to pass the Fear Door without both dark magic and Spike to show her how it worked? How was she supposed to escape that final trap, the one that started generating dark crystals inside Cadance's shield? That's right - she didn't. Sombra flat-out beat Twilight.

 

I realize we disagree, and that's fine. I'm never going to convince you. Different opinions, right? I do, however, feel that your assessment of Sombra ignores or trivializes several important elements.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Talisman

[Metemponychosis 1,261]

Interesting. But I see them as more an extension of Discord rather than an entity on their own.

[Castle Bleck 19,356]

@Talisman,

 

Oh, yeah, I forgot those:

 

His actions being... fighting 2 alicorns single-handedly, cursing the entire Crystal Empire, "equalizing" other unicorns, reducing the niece of said alicorns to a near-dead wreck, spreading dark crystals despite her barrier, setting a s***load of traps 1,000 years in advance, and trying to overkill a child just for holding his Achilles' Heel.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Anti-Villain

[Techno-chan 41]

i don't consider Sombra the worst D: hes my favourite!!

i honestly thought that the seeds and the idea around them were, well stupid. i don't really like Discord tho and hes like, the reason that they even came up. so maybe im just bias.

[Castle Bleck 19,356]

@Valtamaria,

 

Hey, don't sweat it. I actually think:

 

1. Discord

2. Sombra

3. NMM/Chrysalis

4. Sunset

 

And that's if you don't count all the filler bad guys.

[Koelath 445]

She has a backstory its more focused on Luna rather than Moon herself

Gee, it's almost as if her backstory is all about Luna... 

 

There you go; all fixed for you.

Again with the traps...You're confusing precaution and paranoia for a threatening presence. 

 

If you're not willing to accept the reactions of the characters, what do you want?

 

He was visually quite impressive, with his blackfire mane, glowing eyes, and evolution from cloud of darkness into physical unicorn.

 

He canonically fought Celestia and Luna together

I can react to a spider as if it's Satan incarnate but it's still just a spider. Sombra himself lacked the presence to make those reactions work.

 

Yes, he was visually impressive. That makes his lacking presence all the more disappointing.

 

And "He canonically fought Celestia and Luna together" would be an example of saying he's a threat but saying it doesn't make me feel the threat. All we ever see of that fight is the finishing blow against him and that's just not a big impact. I mean, if I fought two big strong dudes all alone, I'd sound pretty tough...But if all anyone ever saw of the fight was the moment I go down, well, that's pretty weak.

 

Yeah, he set some traps...So he was precautious, cool. But precaution is not inherently threatening.

 

The most he did himself threat-wise was neutralize Shining Armor. We do see the enslaved empire in flashback but that's all it is: A flashback. In the present events of the episode, Sombra's pretty lame...Especially considering how much the flashbacks hyped him. Him doing some real damage is exactly what we should've gotten but they just crammed too much into too little time. He'd have seriously benefited from a three-parter.

Edited February 9, 2014 by Cheese Sandwich

[Mywas 687]

Gee, it's almost as if her backstory is all about Luna...

 

 

Again with the traps...You're confusing precaution and paranoia for a threatening presence.

 

 

I can react to a spider as if it's Satan incarnate but it's still just a spider. Sombra himself lacked the presence to make those reactions work.

 

Yes, he was visually impressive. That makes his lacking presence all the more disappointing.

 

And "He canonically fought Celestia and Luna together" would be an example of saying he's a threat but saying it doesn't make me feel the threat. All we ever see of that fight is the finishing blow against him and that's just not a big impact. I mean, if I fought two big strong dudes all alone, I'd sound pretty tough...But if all anyone ever saw of the fight was the moment I go down, well, that's pretty weak.

 

Yeah, he set some traps...So he was precautious, cool. But precaution is not inherently threatening.

 

The most he did himself threat-wise was neutralize Shining Armor. We do see the enslaved empire in flashback but that's all it is: A flashback. In the present events of the episode, Sombra's pretty lame...Especially considering how much the flashbacks hyped him. Him doing some real damage is exactly what we should've gotten but they just crammed too much into too little time. He'd have seriously benefited from a three-parter.

Again. THE EPISODE WAS NOT ABOUT HIM. Why do people keep on denying this? The.episode.was.about.twilight's.test.

 

Heck how come nobody complains about the three jocks from clouddale? they barely appeared, How come nobody says "I expected another Trixie"? How come nonody complains about the two snobs from Sweet and Elite? They were barely in the episode?

[Talisman 31]

I can react to a spider as if it's Satan incarnate but it's still just a spider. Sombra himself lacked the presence to make those reactions work.

If you react to a spider as if it's Satan incarnate, it means nothing. If an established badass like Celestia reacts to a spider as if it's Satan incarnate, I'm going to assume it's a valid threat.

 

 

And "He canonically fought Celestia and Luna together" would be an example of saying he's a threat but saying it doesn't make me feel the threat. All we ever see of that fight is the finishing blow against him and that's just not a big impact. I mean, if I fought two big strong dudes all alone, I'd sound pretty tough...But if all anyone ever saw of the fight was the moment I go down, well, that's pretty weak.

By that logic, none of the villains were the least bit threatening. Nightmare Moon? Did nothing, got pwned by the Elements. Discord? Nopony got hurt; nopony died. Chrysalis? Put Celestia down (but it seems that you don't consider Celestia very impressive), then got banished by True Love. Therefore, none of these villains were threatening, since we never saw them carry through on any Evil Deeds of Evilness.

 

The nature of the TV-Y rating prevents any violence or gore. Sombra was never going to be able to be shown doing evil things as a Sauron stand-in ought to do. From the sound of this, this automatically kills any chance he ever had to be threatening in your eyes.

 

 

The most he did himself threat-wise was neutralize Shining Armor. We do see the enslaved empire in flashback but that's all it is: A flashback. In the present events of the episode, Sombra's pretty lame...Especially considering how much the flashbacks hyped him. Him doing some real damage is exactly what we should've gotten but they just crammed too much into too little time.

He neutralized Shining Armor. He also beat Cadance in raw power, which you keep ignoring. He also beat Twilight through cunning, which you also keep ignoring. He also left a failsafe trap around the Crystal Heart which made Cadance's shield utterly meaningless. It's fine that you don't like Sombra, but please stop denying things he legitimately accomplished.

 

 

He'd have seriously benefited from a three-parter.

On this we agree, though I wonder what he could have possibly done within the bounds of TV-Y to satisfy you.

[Koelath 445]

Again. THE EPISODE WAS NOT ABOUT HIM. Why do people keep on denying this? The.episode.was.about.twilight's.test.

 

Heck how come nobody complains about the three jocks from clouddale? they barely appeared, How come nobody says "I expected another Trixie"? How come nonody complains about the two snobs from Sweet and Elite? They were barely in the episode?

...Did you seriously just compare a MAJOR VILLAIN to some nothing one-off antagonists? This isn't even worth a response.

 

But if you must know, it WAS about him. Twilight's test was to defend the city, a task which is literally all about Sombra. And people complain about Sombra because the series set a standard with previous major villains and that standard is now expected by the fans.

 

By that logic, none of the villains were the least bit threatening. Nightmare Moon? Did nothing, got pwned by the Elements. Discord? Nopony got hurt; nopony died. Chrysalis? Put Celestia down (but it seems that you don't consider Celestia very impressive), then got banished by True Love. Therefore, none of these villains were threatening, since we never saw them carry through on any Evil Deeds of Evilness.

 

The nature of the TV-Y rating prevents any violence or gore. Sombra was never going to be able to be shown doing evil things as a Sauron stand-in ought to do. From the sound of this, this automatically kills any chance he ever had to be threatening in your eyes.

 

In what reality did I ever say violence or gore was necessary to create a threat? Never mind that the rating does not at all prevent violence anyway and the series is full of it.

 

Nightmare Moon was an awful villain due to being little more than an introductory plot device to establish the main cast and Elements. Discord damn near broke reality itself, as well as the minds of all the main heroes. Chrysalis came very close to conquering the whole of Equestria, foiled only by rating-required stupidity (god forbid there's ever a downer ending). Sombra? He growled behind a shield. Oh, and he fought a couple people. And yet again, he didn't beat Twilight through cunning. He beat Twilight purely by a win of chance that she stumbled into some random traps he set centuries ago out of paranoia.

 

And Celestia isn't an "established badass". She consistently sends a group of townsfolk to do her job and occasionally requires them to save her skin while on said job. She's nearly on par with Spike on the badass scale.

[Talisman 31]

...Did you seriously just compare a MAJOR VILLAIN to some nothing one-off antagonists? This isn't even worth a response.

 

But if you must know, it WAS about him. Twilight's test was to defend the city, a task which is literally all about Sombra. And people complain about Sombra because the series set a standard with previous major villains and that standard is now expected by the fans.

Eenope. It was all about Twilight. Sombra was the threat to force Twilight's actions. That entire two-parter was building up to whether Twilight was enough of a leader to sacrifice her own dearest wish to save the Crystal Ponies.

 

 

In what reality did I ever say violence or gore was necessary to create a threat? Never mind that the rating does not at all prevent violence anyway and the series is full of it.

You keep insisting that Sombra was never threatening and dismissing examples I and others offer. Your logic seem to be, he never harmed anypony, therefore, he's not a threat.

 

 

Nightmare Moon was an awful villain due to being little more than an introductory plot device to establish the main cast and Elements. Discord damn near broke reality itself, as well as the minds of all the main heroes. Chrysalis came very close to conquering the whole of Equestria, foiled only by rating-required stupidity (god forbid there's ever a downer ending). Sombra? He growled behind a shield. Oh, and he fought a couple people. And yet again, he didn't beat Twilight through cunning. He beat Twilight purely by a win of chance that she stumbled into some random traps he set centuries ago out of paranoia.

Double standards much? The only I think we can agree on is Discord. You dismiss Sombra and Nightmare Moon at the same time as you say Chrysalis "came very close to conquering the whole of Equestria." This is blatantly untrue; she came close to conquering one city, at which she signally failed. Explain to me how Bugpony is scarier than Shadowhorse?

 

And you constantly dismiss Sombra's traps because . . . um . . . not following your logic here. He out-planned and out-magicked Twilight Sparkle. He just did. It happened.

 

 

 

And Celestia isn't an "established badass". She consistently sends a group of townsfolk to do her job and occasionally requires them to save her skin while on said job. She's nearly on par with Spike on the badass scale.

. . . yeah, I think we've reached a stalemate here. Clearly, my arguments aren't going to sway you, and nothing you've said has altered my opinion. I thought Sombra did a good job as the Looming Threat; you clearly didn't. Agree to disagree?

 

(and no way am I starting a debate on whether Celestia's a badass; I don't entirely trust myself to stay calm)

[FNGRpony 658]

If i may no one has ever said the plunder seeds "are my all time favorite."

their not thought of as a person, erm pony,

no one has ever said plunder seeds are best pony, and for all honesty,

their a force of nature.

Like a plague spreading, or a field burning.

 

Unless your asserting that's what sombre is.

^ I disagree, Jammo. The Plunder Seeds had a will and life force to react to new threats, a goal it wanted to achieve, an intellect to carry out orders--as well as find and capture the royal sisters--, and body structure apparently advance enough to take in meat.

 

It is for all proposes the antagonist of that main arc.

 

-

 

Horror fans: "How dare Rob Zombie try and give Michael Myers depth. Pure evil is cool."

MLP fans : " How darw they not try to give Sombra depth. Pure evil is not cool"

wat

 

 

I loved rob zombies first Halloween.

I was still unimpressed with sombre..... so i don't see what your getting at.

 

could you pain a better picture?

[Castle Bleck 19,356]

He strikes me as an Advancing Boss Of Doom, similar to Killer Croc in Batman: Arkham Asylum.

 

 

 

Just like family!

Edited February 10, 2014 by Anti-Villain

[Koelath 445]

Eenope. It was all about Twilight. Sombra was the threat to force Twilight's actions. That entire two-parter was building up to whether Twilight was enough of a leader to sacrifice her own dearest wish to save the Crystal Ponies.

 

 

You keep insisting that Sombra was never threatening and dismissing examples I and others offer. Your logic seem to be, he never harmed anypony, therefore, he's not a threat.

 

 

Double standards much? The only I think we can agree on is Discord. You dismiss Sombra and Nightmare Moon at the same time as you say Chrysalis "came very close to conquering the whole of Equestria." This is blatantly untrue; she came close to conquering one city, at which she signally failed. Explain to me how Bugpony is scarier than Shadowhorse?

 

And you constantly dismiss Sombra's traps because . . . um . . . not following your logic here. He out-planned and out-magicked Twilight Sparkle. He just did. It happened.

 

 

. . . yeah, I think we've reached a stalemate here. Clearly, my arguments aren't going to sway you, and nothing you've said has altered my opinion. I thought Sombra did a good job as the Looming Threat; you clearly didn't. Agree to disagree?

 

(and no way am I starting a debate on whether Celestia's a badass; I don't entirely trust myself to stay calm)

Her test was saving the crystal ponies. Without Sombra, there would be no test because there'd be nothing from which to save them. Ergo, the test was about Sombra. Defeating him, specifically, but about him nonetheless.

 

And yes, Chrysalis came close to taking just one city...Which just so happened to be the only seat of power in Equestria (prior to the Crystal Empire's return). Taking Canterlot would leave the rest open to rapid conquest. There are no trained guards in Ponyville or Manehattan. If she had conquered Canterlot, it's a safe bet that she would have conquered Equestria.

 

And I dismiss his traps because being cautious and/or paranoid doesn't make him threatening or scary. It makes him cautious and/or paranoid. If I lay out some mousetraps on a hypothetical whim and those traps catch some mice a decade after the fact...That isn't outplanning them because I had no idea they'd even be there. That's just serendipity. (I got to use "serendipidity" in a conversation! *confetti cannon ensues*). Now if he'd seen Twilight going after the thing and laid the traps ahead of her, that would be legitimately besting her.

 

As for "bugpony VS. shadowhorse", that's a debate about visual design. Chrysalis wins that one by sheer alien-ness, while Sombra wins in the category of looking really badass.

 

And that's precisely the problem: Looming is all he did. He appeared and looked scary and...Yeah, mostly just that. If he really wanted to seem dangerous, he'd have done something more than sit around and growl until the shields fell.

 

People love to compare him to Sauron. Well, Sauron sent armies and all manner of evil things all over the place. Even with his focus largely on one group, he still managed to do a fair deal elsewhere. Sombra stayed in one place, and only managed a dent's worth of damage there. Even with his personal focus on the Crystal Empire/mane six, he could've sent some evil to Ponyville or Canterlot or some other places too. Have the heroes spread out, having to ward off Sombra's conquest on multiple fronts, then he's a threat.

 

Or the second part could have started off with the shield being neutralized then had Sombra close in from a distance rather than just reappear right by the place. Make it a three-parter, then they'd have time to really establish this big terrible power he's supposed to have at his disposal. A monster of single-minded evil beelining its way toward the frantic heroes with destruction left in its wake, that's threatening. A growling guy sitting outside a magic bubble...Ehhh.

 

Sombra's like a killer behind prison bars. Yeah, sure, he's kinda scary...But not threatening. And letting the killer out a few minutes to closing time, with guards in place to hold him back...Okay, maybe that's a bit more threatening...But not by too much.

 

Agree to disagree but whatever else he did, there's just no way around that to me: This great terrible evil, this monstrous entity who enslaved an entire empire for a millennium, cursed the whole lot of them upon his defeat and created such fear that his very name invoked terror spent the majority of his appearance sitting outside and growling.

Nightmare Moon could get away with that because she was by necessity just a plot device to establish crucial world elements (the Elements, the main cast banding together, a basic world mythology, etcetera)...But here, after the likes of previous villains, that's just a letdown.