"It's Just A Kids Show"

[Dattebayo 2,850]

Thrashy took the words right out of my speaking hole.

GG

[IlikeBoris 13]

Everything you're bringing up that's supposedly unique to season 4 has been consistently plaguing the series since its inception.

 

There've always been inconsistencies.

 

There've always been rushed episodes (was not Canterlot Wedding the most rushed finale to any season ever?).

 

There've always been "OOC" moments here and there...although if you know me at all, I believe the OOC argument is a total cop-out that actually flattens the third dimension that we give these characters so much praise for.

 

As for deus ex machina...what about the EoH? Magical rainbow gems that combine to form Captain Planet? From the very first episode, I called D.E.M. on those.

 

 

 

Alright, I'll dive out of the fanfiction thing, since it is dead.

 

One of the criticisms I have with FIM over the 80's is that they did limit the cast and so they'd have to swing to extremes of their personality in the demands to the plot.  The 80's characters weren't deep, but at least you had the compassionate smart-one, the emotionally-stunted smart-one, and the smart-one that was just there because they needed a stupidwing pony.  A slightly smaller main cast or a less tight-knit group might allow for developed background ponies that fit the archetypes but don't seem off because they aren't developed much.

 

I think the Rarity/Spike/owl episode was because that's all they had that they could shoehorn into the dynamic.

My post was going to be much longer but kind of pried open my jaw and pulled all of the words out. 

 

I think most of the knee-jerk reactions Bronies have for the claim "it's just a kid's show" comes from the same sort of place that has them feeling the need to justify that they like Friendship is Magic. The same thing as when being asked:

 

"Why do you like a kid's show?"

 

You're put in the spotlight, having to produce an answer that satisfies someone else. You have to make it seem cool; why not go through all of the highlights of the series? You're already creating a higher standard for the show than actually exists on top of your high expectations as both a fan of the series and being a member in a fandom that has serious issues with an unwarranted sense of entitlement. 

 

So yeah. I'm going to go with Thrashy and say that the series hasn't changed from the status quo to match the fandom's ever-growing expectations of it. Which is actually kind of a bad thing for a television series.Except unfortunately...

 

It's just a kids' show.

 

Well, dragging this back to "Why use the quality of this show to justify why your fanfiction is so bad?" um...

 

"Why use the quality of this show to justify why your fanfiction is so bad?" and "why bother writing bad fanfiction for a low-quality show?"

 

I would volunteer to write good fanfiction about a bad show, but I'm so snobbish that I need to understand the source material inside and out, and that would mean volunteering for torture.  And I'm mangling three irons already, though I could accept a short "bad idea into good fic" challenge (if I'm not obligated to finish it,) about two undeveloped OC's in MLP.

 

When I say good, I mean effort.  My writing sucks right now and I can't find a mentor.

Edited May 2, 2014 by IlikeBoris

[Sir Wulfington 276]

@@Sir Wulfington,

 

I know, I was just being odd. I have a tendency to be self indulgent with my amusements.

 

In general I do defend OOC moments since characters should be portrayed with subtle complexity. BUT ...  In MLP each character is defined by specific characteristics and personalities. I've mentioned this in another topic, but I compare this to what A.A. Milne did in his stories. Owl, Pooh, Tigger, etc act within a specific defined personality and traits. MLP, like Pooh, bases most of it's character/plot development around the characters' values and flaws. OOC moments stand out more on a show like this. I completely get it.

 

The story issues you point out are likely due to the method that the team uses (common on most shows). Group writing when situation as a goal leads to inconsistency. It's one thing if you are a sole author and connect two unrelated situations together, but add multiple people ... and you can get a mess. I prefer when a writer starts with theme and character. When they do that on FIM ... they usually produce a solid episode. When they don't, you get Spike At Your Service.

 

Well I forgot to add that there are other things that can justify an "OOC" moment, a character could be written as kind, but get really angry in one episode and act mean (like in Putting Your Hoof Down), and some people will say its OOC. I, on the other hand, see it as depth, it's understandable that a person would say or do unsavory things if they're angry enough, even if they would never do it otherwise. Such a person, however, would be remorseful when they've calmed down and realized what they've done (again, like in Putting Your Hoof Down). I've Heard that people crucified Fluttershy for that episode, because she acted mean, which I don't understand. So it's not just magical influence, mood, of course, can play a role in causing someone to not behave like they normally would.

 

And I agree that having multiple writers can screw up a story, but it doesn't have to. If they have someone keeping track lore, character personalities, etc. and making sure it remains consistent (save for stuff like character development), than it'd be fine. But it's obvious at this point that the writers at DHX don't, probably because they don't care. I think they just do whatever they feel like over there, even if they're contradicting what other writers on the team have written, which is really, really bad.

[Shanks 10,811]

"Why do you like a kid's show?"

I will indeed agree that a lot of bronies get too defensive about this but that has nothing to do with it for me at all and I am sure many other critics of particular trends in this show. I don't see this or any other "kids show" that has any appeal beyond just kids as a kids show because frankly that just encourages mediocrity because who cares about a stupid "kids show" anyway? That is what I find extremely ironic about this is that entertainment geared toward adults has gone downhill even farther and faster than entertainment geared toward children and yet I hear nobody saying "it is just an adult show what do you expect?" Seriously I am thinking of making either a blog post or thread about the double standard here about how people automatically expect kids shows to be lousy yet have no such expectations for more "mature" shows even though most of the "mature" shows are even more patronizing than most of the "kids shows". I don't think it always stems from an unwarranted sense of entitlement to simply not want the show to go down the shitter or rather at least not yet when so many others have already done so. I hope my theory about the rushed nature of twilicorn being the reason why this season is so lacking is true because if that is the case than if they take more time with season 5 than they can flesh things out a bit more and get things back on track again.

Edited May 2, 2014 by EarthbendingProdigy

[Sir Wulfington 276]

Everything you're bringing up that's supposedly unique to season 4 has been consistently plaguing the series since its inception.

 

There've always been inconsistencies.

 

There've always been rushed episodes (was not Canterlot Wedding the most rushed finale to any season ever?).

 

There've always been "OOC" moments here and there...although if you know me at all, I believe the OOC argument is a total cop-out that actually flattens the third dimension that we give these characters so much praise for.

 

As for deus ex machina...what about the EoH? Magical rainbow gems that combine to form Captain Planet? From the very first episode, I called D.E.M. on those.

 

Whether or not people want to admit it, the writing strength of this show has always undulated - yes, even during the much revered "Faustian Era". The show never, at any point, had what most people would consider a "highly cerebral plot", and to expect such convoluted storytelling out of something that's just kind of meant to be a more intelligent throwback to the original show - mixing slice-of-life stories with fantasy-adventure stories without it seeming like a 20 minute long toy commercial - well, is just silly. Really, this show's biggest crime is remaining consistent with the inconsistencies it had from the start. I think this chart explains it best:

 

 

 

Tangent: As one of the biggest Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles fanboys you'll ever meet, let me just say that the original '80s show was chock full of flaws, animation errors, and a crap-ton of other oversights. Yet it still contained enough for kids and adults alike to enjoy that it is held as a classic by no minority of people. The same type of people who nitpick MLP would, I'm sure, find plenty to hate about TMNT. And that would only stand as further proof that a show's strength of writing means jack shit as long as the aspects about the show people enjoy outweigh the aspects that irritate them. As I've said before, "objectivity" is for shit in a world where most people lack the ability to dissociate their subjective opinions of something from the objective facts about that thing.

 

So at the end of the day, the title of this thread is only half relevant. It SHOULD read:

 

"It's just a TV show."

 

If you honestly dedicate good chunks of your life to stressing over what happens in that show, then you're far beyond my help.

 

You're right, there have been logical errors in the past episodes as well (I'm currently going over the earlier episodes to find out if there's any serious problems in the writing), stuff that went over my head back then because I originally just watched, and didn't look out for holes in the writing. Since S4, I do, not just for this show, but for any work of fiction. It's because of the fact that I've learned of plot holes that I never noticed that I've become more alert to such things. But I think the show has lately gotten even more inconsistent, or at the very least, they've been far more noticeable, not simply because I'm actively searching them out now.

 

It's certainly gotten more boring, in my opinion.

 

You're right, it's just a tv show. But that doesn't mean the writer shouldn't make sure everything makes sense within the established sense of logic in his or her fictional setting. I've seen the nostalgia critics "Is It Ever Okay To Nitpick?" video, and I strongly disagree with it. He says that my anger at plot holes and such is not about said plot holes and such, but because the story failed to keep my from noticing them. Well what happens if it's impossible to not notice because it's so painfully obvious? Or if I get a case of fridge logic after it's over? Just because I didn't notice doesn't mean it's good writing, if it exists, and ruins the believability of the story, than the story is bad, whether I notice the problem during or after the story's over.

 

I don't understand the mentality today with so many people, that holes in the writing don't matter, shouldn't all authors be expected to write a believable story? Not one with logical fallacies that shatter that any sense of believability? It feels like more and more people are ceasing to care about quality writing in favor of mindless entertainment, and all it can possibly do is encourage writers to not give a shit about the quality of their work, because all it needs is "action!" and "feelz!" and the masses will just eat that right up. It's really fucking sad. I don't know about you, but I have no desire to eat a delicious steak and mashed potato dinner if it's served on a plate made of fecal matter.

 

And I don't "stress" over these things, I keep track of what happens in a story to make sure it comes together to form a coherent narrative, and if it does, I'm glad, if it doesn't, I declare it shit and move on.

Edited May 2, 2014 by Sir Wulfington

[Jeric 46,837]

I don't think it's indifference. I will admit that after watching a few panels online, I noticed that some of the writers don't tend to come access as passionate as most of the VA's, but I believe that reserved distance in writers is common ... unless you happen to be an Indie. I also recall that a few core writers specifically address that they have characters that they struggle to write for when they have an assignment.

 

 I can't think of one show I loved that didn't have a few bad episodes. By bad, I mean the ones that make you want to reach over and embrace the amnesiac qualities of tequila. Star Trek, BSG, The Office, South Park, Sic Feet Under, All in the Family, Waltons, Sopranos, West Wing, M*A*S*H, I could go on. They all are well written shows. They all produced retched garbage at some point. Even my favorite, Breaking Bad, has an episode with a housefly that some fans can't stand.

 

MLP (using a marketing statement here) is the best of it's class. I know some would say Adventure Time, or Regular Show ... but that is both debatable and unfair.

[crazitaco 596]

Tell that to Nickelodeon please maybe they'd actually care about the quality of what they put out.

God, yes.

I was flipping through the channels the other day and ended up getting a sample of just how low they've gone.

The show was "Monsters Vs. Aliens", based on that crappy dreamworks movie.

The episode involved the blue slime dude and the president being trapped in a fast food joint that has been accidentally teleported into space... and then the restraunt gets attacked by a zombie space gorilla, they are exposed to the vacume of space, and the president literally strips down to his underwear and acts moronic because of "lack of oxygen".

I'm not even kidding. That was the WORST thing I've ever seen on nick. It is inexcusably bad. The fact that it is being marketed as "for kids" worries me to no end. When did "kid's show" stop meaning fun and wholesome and start to mean stupid and immature?

[Sir Wulfington 276]

I don't think it's indifference. I will admit that after watching a few panels online, I noticed that some of the writers don't tend to come access as passionate as most of the VA's, but I believe that reserved distance in writers is common ... unless you happen to be an Indie. I also recall that a few core writers specifically address that they have characters that they struggle to write for when they have an assignment.

 

 I can't think of one show I loved that didn't have a few bad episodes. By bad, I mean the ones that make you want to reach over and embrace the amnesiac qualities of tequila. Star Trek, BSG, The Office, South Park, Sic Feet Under, All in the Family, Waltons, Sopranos, West Wing, M*A*S*H, I could go on. They all are well written shows. They all produced retched garbage at some point. Even my favorite, Breaking Bad, has an episode with a housefly that some fans can't stand.

 

MLP (using a marketing statement here) is the best of it's class. I know some would say Adventure Time, or Regular Show ... but that is both debatable and unfair.

 

Why don't those writers ask the writers that can write those characters well for help then? And just because lots of "good" shows have bad episodes, doesn't mean we should just accept that it as something that can't be avoided. Maybe the problems is that writers are sometimes forced to hammer out episodes even when they don't have any good ideas. Or something that would make sense. This problem definitely effects MLP because of it's toy-selling status, I'm certain things like EQG and Twilicorn were created for the sake of selling toys, not because the writers actually intended for those to happen.

Edited May 2, 2014 by Sir Wulfington

[Shanks 10,811]

 When did "kid's show" stop meaning fun and wholesome and start to mean stupid and immature?

I think it was a gradual process but I think much of it has to do with the broader dumbing down of society in general, entertainment is a reflection of a culture and when a culture gets dumbed down it is only natural that the entertainment quality would go down with it. 

[Sir Wulfington 276]

God, yes.

I was flipping through the channels the other day and ended up getting a sample of just how low they've gone.

The show was "Monsters Vs. Aliens", based on that crappy dreamworks movie.

The episode involved the blue slime dude and the president being trapped in a fast food joint that has been accidentally teleported into space... and then the restraunt gets attacked by a zombie space gorilla, they are exposed to the vacume of space, and the president literally strips down to his underwear and acts moronic because of "lack of oxygen".

I'm not even kidding. That was the WORST thing I've ever seen on nick. It is inexcusably bad. The fact that it is being marketed as "for kids" worries me to no end. When did "kid's show" stop meaning fun and wholesome and start to mean stupid and immature?

 

Trust me, that's nothing compared to the infamous Squidward toenail scene. How THAT got on the air, I have no fucking idea.

[Moved to Elsewhere 11,330]

As for my opinions on this, yes I agree that saying something should avoid criticism just because it's for kids is stupid because hey networks like Nickelodeon do that and look at them now but I feel like this fandom takes these things a little overboard. Say a character does something out of the ordinary for them "OMG, THEY'RE OOC, THEY'RE RUINED FOREVER SCREW YOU WRITERS GO DIE!" Or how some act like elitist and are just like, "Anyone who likes the newer episodes are just blindly accepting anything Hasbro throws at them and can't judge quality." Well have you ever thought they might actually like it and are just along for the ride. It sometimes gets hard for me to enjoy an episode not necessarily because of the episode itself, because I feel like all these critics just keep ranting and ranting one how the episode sucks because of these very deep reasons that I don't even notice. You could say I could just not read or watch them, but they usually constantly keep bringing it up in other stuff so it's kind of hard for me to avoid it.

 

Personally I think the show is doing fine and I am still really enjoying it. 

 

Now don't think I'm saying no one can critique the show because that would make me a hypocrite since I can be a critic sometimes. But please, don't be little people who are still enjoying the show and lower down on the nitpicking a little.

 

so I agree with the statement, I just think some people can a bit too harsh on the show.

[Jeric 46,837]

@@Sir Wulfington,

 

True, some modern shows avoid over saturation by sticking to a low episode count, but MLP kinda already did that and I don't think it was very popular. I'm sure not going to advocate for that lest I be tarred and feathered.

 

Either way, you make valid points, but I am not sure I agree that the quality of the writing on the whole is taken that big of a nose dive. Maybe it's just my perspective since I basically binge watched the show without the luxury of discussing each one, and building expectations in the off season.

 

To your original point, the handicap/excuse, about the show quality getting a pass because it's a kids show would start to annoy me. Especially when you see how the better episodes touch on deeper themes and lessons.

Edited May 2, 2014 by Jeric

[crazitaco 596]

I think it was a gradual process but I think much of it has to do with the broader dumbing down of society in general, entertainment is a reflection of a culture and when a culture gets dumbed down it is only natural that the entertainment quality would go down with it. 

I think you're right, and that's why I felt so disturbed by that show. Its not just a matter of me thinking it was bad, it was disturbingly bad.

It disturbs me knowing that is what kid's shows on nick have become, especially considering I used to watch nick myself. The shows on it, while not necessarily educational, weren't so devoid of quality as to insult the viewer's intelligence. Spongebob back in the day was full of witty, clever humor. I consider shows like Hey Arnold! to be wholesome because the characters felt very realistic and were well written.

I feel like if I had watched these shows on Nick as a kid, I would literally be stupider than I am today.

 

Trust me, that's nothing compared to the infamous Squidward toenail scene. How THAT got on the air, I have no fucking idea.

I've seen that scene, and yes, its pretty cringeworthy. Spongebob has turned to more slapstick and gross-out ren and stimpy esque humor because they don't know how to write clever humor anymore. And even then, they fail miserably at gross out. There was nothing funny about that scene, it was just nasty and mean.

Not sure if I'm just growing up or what, but I feel bad for Squidward. I really pity him, and I really hate Spongebob for his cruelty. Spongebob used to be an example someone with good intentions gone wrong. He used to feel bad, and just seemed unaware that his actions were hurting squidward. Now it just looks like he's tormenting poor Squiddy on purpose, which means that Squidward's feelings are actually justifiable to me.

Edited May 2, 2014 by crazitaco

[Thrashy 2,800]

You're right, it's just a tv show. But that doesn't mean the writer shouldn't make sure everything makes sense within the established sense of logic in his or her fictional setting. I've seen the nostalgia critics "Is It Ever Okay To Nitpick?" video, and I strongly disagree with it. He says that my anger at plot holes and such is not about said plot holes and such, but because the story failed to keep my from noticing them. Well what happens if it's impossible to not notice because it's so painfully obvious? Or if I get a case of fridge logic after it's over? Just because I didn't notice doesn't mean it's good writing, if it exists, and ruins the believability of the story, than the story is bad, whether I notice the problem during or after the story's over.

 

I don't understand the mentality today with so many people, that holes in the writing don't matter, shouldn't all authors be expected to write a believable story? Not one with logical fallacies that shatter that any sense of believability? It feels like more and more people are ceasing to care about quality writing in favor of mindless entertainment, and all it can possibly do is encourage writers to not give a shit about the quality of their work, because all it needs is "action!" and "feelz!" and the masses will just eat that right up. It's really fucking sad. I don't know about you, but I have no desire to eat a delicious steak and mashed potato dinner if it's served on a plate made of fecal matter.

 

And I don't "stress" over these things, I keep track of what happens in a story to make sure it comes together to form a coherent narrative, and if it does, I'm glad, if it doesn't, I declare it shit and move on.

 

Yes, we all establish our own sense of logic in even the most illogical of fictional settings, to varying degrees. And therein lies the key word: varying. People tend to hold widely varying views as to what qualifies as a violation of our logic. Due to the purely subjective nature of how each of us perceives a piece of media, a person may suspend his or her disbelief under entirely different conditions than someone else. I.e., what may be a believable story to you may be a total pile of horseshit to someone else, and what may be a completely ludicrous story to you may very well be the next Citizen Kane for someone else.

 

I'm never adverse to the idea of a show like MLP improving itself, but I'm not seeing the so-called nosedive in quality that others are seeing. This poses one of two possibilities: Either the expectations of people like me are ridiculously low (did really, ANY of us really have any expectations about this girly cartoon about rainbow-colored ponies upon watching our first episode?), or the expectations of people like you have grown ridiculously high as the seasons progress, and such people are merely using "the show's going downhill" as an excuse to justify their own disenchantment with something they once loved. Kind of like how CR "ragequit the fandom" after Twilicorn.

 

Point is, the show's quality was never predicated on the desires of self-entitled 20-something year-old college kids. It was predicated on what Lauren Faust herself - and you can corroborate this for yourself by looking back on the dA post you shared in the OP - said was the core demographic: Kids and their parents. (As far as I'm aware, the show is still very much continuing to please this demo.) This show was never "for us", and I truly hope it stays that way. For the writers to give into the outright demands that some of you are throwing at them would completely throw this show in the shitter, as far as I'm concerned.

Edited May 2, 2014 by The Thrashy One

[Andaasonsan 3,205]

I think that while being a kid's show is not an excuse for bad writing, it still puts constraints on what they can do.

 

Think about it, a FiM episode has to have a story that isn't too complicated or too subtle that young children can follow AND it has to be told in under 22 minutes. The end result is that you are going to have stories told in broad strokes, where character actions are going to be exaggerated, and where you're not going to spend too much time agonizing over having an air-tight plot.

[IlikeBoris 13]

Yes, we all establish our own sense of logic in even the most illogical of fictional settings, to varying degrees. And therein lies the key word: varying. People tend to hold widely varying views as to what qualifies as a violation of our logic. Due to the purely subjective nature of how each of us perceives a piece of media, a person may suspend his or her disbelief under entirely different conditions than someone else. I.e., what may be a believable story to you may be a total pile of horseshit to someone else, and what may be a completely ludicrous story to you may very well be the next Citizen Kane for someone else.

 

I'm never adverse to the idea of a show like MLP improving itself, but I'm not seeing the so-called nosedive in quality that others are seeing. This poses one of two possibilities: Either the expectations of people like me are ridiculously low (did really, ANY of us really have any expectations about this girly cartoon about rainbow-colored ponies upon watching our first episode?), or the expectations of people like you have grown ridiculously high as the seasons progress, and such people are merely using "the show's going downhill" as an excuse to justify their own disenchantment with something they once loved. Kind of like how CR "ragequit the fandom" after Twilicorn.

 

Point is, the show's quality was never predicated on the desires of self-entitled 20-something year-old college kids. It was predicated on what Lauren Faust herself - and you can corroborate this for yourself by looking back on the dA post you shared in the OP - said was the core demographic: Kids and their parents. (As far as I'm aware, the show is still very much continuing to please this demo.) This show was never "for us", and I truly hope it stays that way. For the writers to give into the outright demands that some of you are throwing at them would completely throw this show in the shitter, as far as I'm concerned.

 

Bravo.

 

Some of me is from the viewpoint of someone about the same age as Faust, and I'm thinking that my happiness and unhappiness with the show is related to how similar and different I am to her.  (I would have called Firefly mother-brave and just testing her gymnastic agility the same as the roller-skater, Rainbow Dash seems like not being a jet-stuntpilot is worth dying over.)

 

I am imposing some 20-something college student  desires, but in the context of friendship.  Which is weird because I'm probably a sociopath considering my lack of maintaining social connections.  And I vaguely know the plot from "Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants."

 

The only standard I have for MLP:FIM is that it doesn't ruin the memories of my childhood.  (Considering that I've finally seen a G3 episode that I like, and all the grimdark FIM videos that are worth the bandwith, maybe my standards have lowered.)

[Krosp I 114]

 

 

Kids and their parents. (As far as I'm aware, the show is still very much continuing to please this demo.) This show was never "for us", and I truly hope it stays that way. For the writers to give into the outright demands that some of you are throwing at them would completely throw this show in the shitter, as far as I'm concerned.

 

Never before has someone been after my own heart.  It really does seem like the problem that people have with the show is one that they've made for themselves. The ire drawn from the phrase "it's just a kid's show" really seems more like projection than anything. The idea that the creators, artists, musicians and other staff of this show does things on this show specifically for us, or heaven forbid, that this show is "for us" curdles the tapioca in my gullet. 

 

Before you inevitably get on my case about how the fandom gets the occasional nod, especially in seasons 3 and 4: I realize it does. The show is still not yours.

[FoxyCryptid 4,328]

Yes, we all establish our own sense of logic in even the most illogical of fictional settings, to varying degrees. And therein lies the key word: varying. People tend to hold widely varying views as to what qualifies as a violation of our logic. Due to the purely subjective nature of how each of us perceives a piece of media, a person may suspend his or her disbelief under entirely different conditions than someone else. I.e., what may be a believable story to you may be a total pile of horseshit to someone else, and what may be a completely ludicrous story to you may very well be the next Citizen Kane for someone else.

 

I'm never adverse to the idea of a show like MLP improving itself, but I'm not seeing the so-called nosedive in quality that others are seeing. This poses one of two possibilities: Either the expectations of people like me are ridiculously low (did really, ANY of us really have any expectations about this girly cartoon about rainbow-colored ponies upon watching our first episode?), or the expectations of people like you have grown ridiculously high as the seasons progress, and such people are merely using "the show's going downhill" as an excuse to justify their own disenchantment with something they once loved. Kind of like how CR "ragequit the fandom" after Twilicorn.

 

Point is, the show's quality was never predicated on the desires of self-entitled 20-something year-old college kids. It was predicated on what Lauren Faust herself - and you can corroborate this for yourself by looking back on the dA post you shared in the OP - said was the core demographic: Kids and their parents. (As far as I'm aware, the show is still very much continuing to please this demo.) This show was never "for us", and I truly hope it stays that way. For the writers to give into the outright demands that some of you are throwing at them would completely throw this show in the shitter, as far as I'm concerned.

 

Now, When I talk about more serious plots I mean that in a Disney sort of way(kind of like what the comics have done)

[Shanks 10,811]

I think that while being a kid's show is not an excuse for bad writing, it still puts constraints on what they can do.

They keep saying that the stories have to simple so the kids will understand but there is a major difference between a plot being simple and dumbed down, even a show with a complicated plot can still be dumbed down it happens all the time. A simple plot can still be a compelling plot without being dumbed down, take the original Star Wars Trilogy for example. The plot was very simple and George Lucas himself admits that he borrowed extensively from many different stories and legends some new, some old yet those movies are still regarded as classics even to this day. Evil empire, ancient order of warriors with a code of honor, old wise sage, conflict between good and evil, the fate of the world (or in that case galaxy) at stake ect... yet it still worked. It worked because George Lucas and the staff had high standards, they set out to make good movies and they damn well did. The writers to their credit have for the most part done a good job and Hasbro does often make them do stupid things (twilicorn is a very good example of this) and much of season 4 being crappy is probably because they pressured them to get the episodes done ASAP but that still dosen't change that season 4 is still a very disappointing season.

[IlikeBoris 13]

I think that while being a kid's show is not an excuse for bad writing, it still puts constraints on what they can do.

 

Think about it, a FiM episode has to have a story that isn't too complicated or too subtle that young children can follow AND it has to be told in under 22 minutes. The end result is that you are going to have stories told in broad strokes, where character actions are going to be exaggerated, and where you're not going to spend too much time agonizing over having an air-tight plot.

 

For the show writers, that is true.  There are probably dramas with unnoticed padding and cut details that weaken the story vs having a novel that might flex the boundaries by a little bit.

 

For fan-fictioners, the only constraint is the attention span of the audience, since there is only time and praise instead of page expectation and time slots.

 

I guess it is a little weird to hold the work-for-free crowd to higher standards, but they have lower constraints and hopefully lofty goals.

[Scootalove 10,685]

I've heard that quote a lot of times, so I find that most people like to throw it around. With a show that is for kids, they can have plots that are really interesting and not very complex but they grab your attention.  Even when the story has to be brought down a bit to understand it easily, there is a lot more than meets the eye if you look at it closely.

[TheChosenPony 279]

A show for kids..... or is it?

 

PONYCEPTION

 

[Virgil 685]

The fact that Friendship Is Magic is technically a children's show makes the writing quality more important, not less important! Children need the best influences they possibly can have, and if you raise them improperly, it makes the mistakes that much more difficult to correct once they have grown up, assuming they even can be corrected at all. The "it's just for kids" attitude that Sir Wulfington describes is...deeply insensitive, at best.

Precisely, things made for children... well for starters, should be good, so the children develop standards in what they enjoy which will extend to their adulthood (which is why a good children's book is a good book period. Example: The Hobbit ) ; adversely if I child is only exposed to... let's call it "mush" ( or better yet St. Paul's real word for "Filthy Rags" ), they have no concern for standards in entertainment as adults ( e.g. Transformers 4 ).

 

But what concerns me the most is the effect that bad writing has on a child in terms of their moral development. For if a child learns no stories that inspire them or teach them something important as a child; when as adults they are faced with trials and tribulations, they will lack the moral courage to overcome such circumstances.

 

In fact if someone claims that I take "kid's stuff too seriously", my reply will simply be, " and you don't take it seriously enough".  

[Shanks 10,811]

In fact if someone claims that I take "kid's stuff too seriously", my reply will simply be, " and you don't take it seriously enough".  

Yes what kids watch, read, play does have an effect on them even if it isn't always immediate but as the saying goes "garbage in garbage out."

Edited May 3, 2014 by EarthbendingProdigy

[Not_A_Replicant 96]

Faust is one of my biggest role-models, and posts like that is big reason why. She's defends us so well, it's awesome. I mean she just called every anti-brony an a**hole. I honestly think her attitude right there basically proves that, although My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic was and technically still is a kid's show, it has a certain side to it that anyone can enjoy. And that you shouldn't be judged on trivial things like what kind of TV show entertains you. I just wish my parents could understand this.