G5 is a Lost Cause

[donutmasterjoe 76]

7 hours ago, Misty Shadow said:

If you're a fan of MLP who is keeping up with the series, would you rather come on an MLP site that is encouraging positive discussion about it or an MLP site that is constantly lambasting it? The former, because the latter would demoralize you and make you feel less inclined to talk about the series. There are plenty of G5 fans who don't want to share their thoughts on the series because of their weariness of all the negativity. What's the problem with us just having one megathread devoted to sharing our grievances? There is absolutely no need for us to keep cluttering the site with grievance threads and I don't see why the people who run this site would disagree with me here.

I understand your point where there are plenty of G5 haters that only desire is to spread negative thoughts on the generation, but you can't say because I'm a fan I shouldn't criticizing it. And that's what I'm doing, criticizing. I'm not spreading free hate on G5, if you read every single comment in this thread literally no one is, and this thread as a whole is to discuss our unsatisfication with the generation as a whole, and why that? Just as I said in my previous comment:

21 hours ago, donutmasterjoe said:

I still don't entirely hate it, and Hitch will always remain one of my favorite characters of MLP as a whole, but I refused to buy his brushable because I don't want to give Hasbro money. I'm a male adult, I'm not the main target they want, but I should still be seen as a customer. And as a customer I'm not satisfied with the product, both the show and the toys. So I'm not going to support it until they fix their product or move on, and since many of us discussed the possible end of G5 in 2025, I'll wait for it, and honestly, I hope it's true.

I enjoyed G5 a lot in the past, actually I even had some shame to say I enjoyed MYM because whenever I go people was absolutely spreading hate towards it, without much opinion or critiques. I even mentioned in that same comment how I would like to start drawing in G5 TYT style, despite knowing many people don't like it. I'm glad to be here because I can freely show my opinions for G5, which are currently, not much positive, because G5 is in a point that it does harm even the main core of the franchise which are the toys. You can even say to me that I shouldn't criticize because I'm not the main target, but what if actually the main target isn't enjoying it? Wasn't most of the G5 toys in clearance in many stores?

As you said in your reply, I understand and agree that negativity does take away people that enjoy G5 despite it's flaws, but you didn't get the point here. The truth is that G5 has many flaws, and we as fans can't ignore that, and pointing, discussing and theorizing isn't the same as spread hate because we aren't shouting G5 is trash and bad in everything, we are talking each point we aren't liking it, even if we actually DO like G5, because I do! I WANT so bad to buy the brushables, but I'm worried Hasbro end this generation with bad toys any previous generation hadn't. I don't want 5 different (or exactly the same! See? That's a thing we are DISCUSSING here, because it's a flaw!) Hitches because he's a main character, I want other ponies to collect just what all previous generations had. Even G4 had plenty of different ponies, and that's not only me, there are fans who want to show how sad they are that Hasbro doesn't even care for the franchise's main point. If that does mean not buying the toys or watching the show because that supports Hasbro in money, it's not hate, we just want things to be different for everyone.

[Rock-O-Jello 147]

7 hours ago, Misty Shadow said:

If you're a fan of MLP who is keeping up with the series, would you rather come on an MLP site that is encouraging positive discussion about it or an MLP site that is constantly lambasting it? The former, because the latter would demoralize you and make you feel less inclined to talk about the series. There are plenty of G5 fans who don't want to share their thoughts on the series because of their weariness of all the negativity. What's the problem with us just having one megathread devoted to sharing our grievances? There is absolutely no need for us to keep cluttering the site with grievance threads and I don't see why the people who run this site would disagree with me here.

it's just people expressing their opinions about a silly children's show meant to sell toys to little girls. if you like the show, fine. if they don't like the show, that's also fine.

[nataalya 41]

To be honest I only managed to read the main post. A lot of work. I appreciate it. I'll definitely come back to read the replies in some time, but G5 isn't doing bad because there are a lot of haters from G4. I believe that an equally good or better show would have managed this without any problems. The current situation is mostly bad decisions.  If I were to summarize all the conversations so far and the conclusions drawn from them.

0) I love the new cast, the ideas for the episodes are great.
1) The G5 is worse to the previous generation in e v e r y possible way
2) The animation from the movie was beautiful. The later chapters of MyM were also well done.
3) The worst thing about G5 is TyT. Great characters, great episodes and everything cut down to a 5-minute video where sometimes 20% is the introduction and end credits. This completely kills the scope for adding depth. I wrote about it from the beginning.
4) Personally, I secretly hope that MyM had to end... I also hope that this is not the end of G5 and we will get a new 3D series. What I mean is that MyM was only on Netflix - the new series doesn't have to be, right?
5) And I really dislike a few arguments:
- MLP has a main target for young children
- This is a franchise and it's all about money
- "We might not have had a new generation or sequel to G4 at all so stfu and don't criticize and judge badly" 

This is the absolute bottom of the discussion. The first thing contradicts the second. Closing yourself to potential consumers, even if it is % of viewers, is not good for someone or something driven by the desire for profit. Especially if that % has their own money. The claim that a cartoon must be for children is perfectly understandable, but it does not justify the deterioration of quality, mistakes and all the rest. Gumball, for example, was a children's cartoon. But the number of jokes and ideas that only the older audience could understand is overwhelming. Bluey is also a charming cartoon that teaches adults a very solid lesson. G5 does everything worse than G4. Talking about how G5 might not happen at all is completely unnecessary. Because it happened and it doesn't change anything. The question remains whether such a policy makes sense in the long term. I bet that many of today's children watching MLP had parents who associated MLP with G4 a few years ago. My younger sister cried when she saw the new ponies because she realized that the old ones were gone. She doesn't watch it, sometimes she rewatches previous seasons. Will today's kids build the same bond with new mane that we did? I doubt it. Everything is limited to short jokes and simple morals. This may translate into the fact that generation 6, if it were ever to be created... if it was written in such a poor way as the current one, would have a completely unsatisfactory result that would end it even sooner than what we currently have. If MyM had appeared during G4 as a side series and content on YouTube, it would have been completely ignored. Currently, we have children of parents from the old generation, we have the old generation themselves, we have a well-made movie, a nice MyM series. TyT is the waste in all this.

It doesn't matter to the company that you're a "deviant"... all that matters is that you have money for their product. It's potentially better to have fans who will spend tens or hundreds of dollars to complete your products. For me, at this point, walking the line that the target group are only children... and cutting yourself off from the rest is simply shooting in the foot. Illogical. And it's not about going to extremes. I never buy this explanation. 

6) "G5 generates the same or greater profits than previous generations"
It's just marketing. A good face for a bad game. "All we did well as we planned and we have got what we headed for"... please... and that's why most of their official channels have great old series (I'm talking about the current state, the "old" generation is uploaded more often than the new one and if a new generation is uploaded, it achieves at best similar numbers to the previous generation, lol) + they have to add previous ones to new as the toys.
I understand it from the point of view that "let's make 5 short videos that will generate 5x more views than 1 long, more demanding and expensive one." Personally, I doubt that the company keeps any separate statistics for each generation. G5 did not achieve their current results individually. There is still support from G4 fans here. TyT itself is strongly supported by a full-length movie featuring themselves. Many G5 viewers mainly follow TyT due to the numerous additions to the main line from MyM. The issue from the beginning of the post - MyM was released only on Netflix as an exclusive. In itself, the fact that new generation toys often come with previous mane six says a lot. In my country, the new generation is not received at all. Pity...

7) The connections between G4 and G5 were so poorly made that at some point I stopped paying attention to it.

I agree that G5 is a huge wasted opportunity. Even apart from the comparison with the G4, the G5 is simply poor. I'm not saying this as a hater. I'm seriously sorry about this. I love the new characters, the ideas for the episodes are very interesting and it's a pity that all this was and is lost on TyT.

Edited May 22 by nataalya

[Rafa Stary 1,271]

The letters in your post are too small for some reason! But I still read everything don't worry 

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

0) I love the new cast, the ideas for the episodes are great.

Love love them I don't but I definitely like them and think they have lots of potential, but TYT lately has just left them bland and uninteresting in my opinion, I'm just no more seeing in the recent episodes the characteristics that make them really fun to watch.

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

1) The G5 is worse to the previous generation in e v e r y possible way

I was thinking about this, and if I should include in the post, but there's one thing (or two things) I actually think G5 does better than G4, but I believe this is extremely subjective, that's why I ignored it in the post, which is that the G5 actually makes whole arcs for the villains, so they made Opaline appear throughout several episodes, thus making then have a longer development, I really liked that and that made me enjoy Opaline more than any of the G4 villains, and the fact this is one thing that G5 tried to do different from G4 just makes me like it even more, as it's somsething pretty unique to it, but that's just how each generation decided to deal with their villains, G1 does it in 5-10 episodes, G4 in 2 episodes and G5 makes a entire story arc, I just prefer the G5 style for this, but I'm not sure if this makes it necessarily better than G4 in this aspect.

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

2) The animation from the movie was beautiful. The later chapters of MyM were also well done.
3) The worst thing about G5 is TyT. Great characters, great episodes and everything cut down to a 5-minute video where sometimes 20% is the introduction and end credits. This completely kills the scope for adding depth. I wrote about it from the beginning.

I really like the 3D too despite the clear downgrade in MyM, but they had no escape, but it was good, unfortunately the same effort isn't put into TyT's visuals and that is just super cheap.

Yeah I also think the worst thing in G5 is TyT, I don't think it was in Season 1 because for me it fulfilled its purpose during that time, it was meant to be this minor production with no intention of telling deep stories, so there was no need to watch it if you didn't want, which is why I think TyT is a problem now, they finished MyM, but the story continues after MyM, so they are forcing us to switch to this really bad short format if we want to know what is going to happen. And yeah 20% of a episode is wasted in introduction and credits, sometimes it's worse, there was one where 65% was Hitch taking care of animals and 35% was Allura, I don' need to see more of Hitch taking care of animals, I already know his skills, I need to see more of Allura, and I can't even say that if the episode was 20 minutes long I would've seen more of her, given how even in the 20 minutes special she got little screentime, I don't get it. Imagine if FiM's story continued into Pony Life? That is just what happened with G5.

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

4) Personally, I secretly hope that MyM had to end... I also hope that this is not the end of G5 and we will get a new 3D series. What I mean is that MyM was only on Netflix - the new series doesn't have to be, right?

i don't know but I have the feeling that MyM was already thought as a series not planned to run for years from the beginning, if the 3D was indeed expensive, then I can't imagine them expecting the series to last longer than just 1 year and a half, I'm almost sure if they did another 3D series, it would be around the same length as MyM, the series they choose to continue was 100x cheaper and 2D, that's why I don't think they are going to make "MyM 2", the cheapest investment with the highest return is the best choice for these companies (I'm saying from a corporate perspective, I really don't know if that's indeed the case of TyT), also I don't know but I don't see them releasing this series for free on Youtube, but that's me, maybe they would, based on how they like to upload clips and scene compilations of the MyM episodes but not never the full actual episodes, I think it might have something to do with a contract with Netflix (it was in those plannings from Hasbro's last year presentation after all)

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

- MLP has a main target for young children
- This is a franchise and it's all about money
- "We might not have had a new generation or sequel to G4 at all so stfu and don't criticize and judge badly" 

This is the absolute bottom of the discussion. The first thing contradicts the second. Closing yourself to potential consumers, even if it is % of viewers, is not good for someone or something driven by the desire for profit. Especially if that % has their own money. The claim that a cartoon must be for children is perfectly understandable, but it does not justify the deterioration of quality, mistakes and all the rest. Gumball, for example, was a children's cartoon. But the number of jokes and ideas that only the older audience could understand is overwhelming. Bluey is also a charming cartoon that teaches adults a very solid lesson. G5 does everything worse than G4. Talking about how G5 might not happen at all is completely unnecessary. Because it happened and it doesn't change anything. The question remains whether such a policy makes sense in the long term. I bet that many of today's children watching MLP had parents who associated MLP with G4 a few years ago. My younger sister cried when she saw the new ponies because she realized that the old ones were gone. She doesn't watch it, sometimes she rewatches previous seasons. Will today's kids build the same bond with new mane that we did? I doubt it. Everything is limited to short jokes and simple morals. This may translate into the fact that generation 6, if it were ever to be created... if it was written in such a poor way as the current one, would have a completely unsatisfactory result that would end it even sooner than what we currently have. If MyM had appeared during G4 as a side series and content on YouTube, it would have been completely ignored. Currently, we have children of parents from the old generation, we have the old generation themselves, we have a well-made movie, a nice MyM series. TyT is the waste in all this.

It doesn't matter to the company that you're a "deviant"... all that matters is that you have money for their product. It's potentially better to have fans who will spend tens or hundreds of dollars to complete your products. For me, at this point, walking the line that the target group are only children... and cutting yourself off from the rest is simply shooting in the foot. Illogical. And it's not about going to extremes. I never buy this explanation. 

Here you enter a territory that I have to tread with caution because I don't know very much about it, I'm not saying that you're wrong, you could be right, but the lack of information and certainty that I have doesn't allow me to reach a conclusion, but anyway. That's why I said that I would have no problem with it if the entire purpose of this generation was to be like TyT, just focused on the children, with these short episodes and stories with no depth at all, I would've disliked it but I would've understood and accepted it, I would recognize that it just wasn't for me, now, if even kids may be unhappy with G5, then...?, no idea, I just assumed that TyT is made mostly for children due to how it's written and generally made, while MyM was made with the Bronies/G4 fans in mind, that's why the longer format, the better visuals (I know you can't compare 3D to 2D, but let's admit, this one is a strong exception), deeper stories and all the G4 connections, I actually forgot to talk about this, but TyT also lacked connections to G4 in its first season, there were one or two references in a few episodes, but generally, it really lacked them in comparison to MyM, why? Because Hasbro must thought that kids don't care about the continuity, the connections, these stuff, that they just want fast 5 minutes sillines, I say this because I can imagine a kid not having fun watching MyM due to its more "mature style", but that's just speculation, if they don't like TyT then Hasbro is failing both sides, if it continues like this then I'll just be more convinced that they are going to close the doors for this generation in 2025.

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

6) "G5 generates the same or greater profits than previous generations"
It's just marketing. A good face for a bad game. "All we did well as we planned and we have got what we headed for"... please... 

It's what written in that image from their presentation last year XD "TyT viewers 22% higher repeat purchase rate than other MLP shows" "93% of the Girls want to buy TyT and love it!" "Higher than MyM, FiM, Barbie and Rainbow High!", I wouldn't call them straight liars, but damn, when things are reported to be this good, it's because there's always something suspicious about it, there's at least some evidence to prove part of it, like the views, TyT episodes perform all above 100k views and there is the big plus of the series being uploaded in two channels plus the many International MLP and TyT channels around the world also uploading it. Now the rest is an exaggeration, I strongly doubt that if it was all these flowers their plans would have changed, if TyT was really a blast then they wouldn't have to worry about releasing episodes every week, I believe that no one is innocent enough to think that the company will arrive at the presentation and say "hmmm well, our product isn't doing so well!"

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

and that's why most of their official channels have great old series (I'm talking about the current state, the "old" generation is uploaded more often than the new one and if a new generation is uploaded, it achieves at best similar numbers to the previous generation, lol) + they have to add previous ones to new as the toys.

This is another red alert, so TyT is a blast and performs better than other MLP shows, right? Okay, then explain me why there are much more FiM content uploaded on the MLP official channel than TyT content? Not only that, but there's also more Equestria Girls there than TyT, "but there is a channel just for TyT" there are also channels just for FiM and Equestria Girls only, and not only that, the FiM and EQG live streams always have more views than the TyT streams, both on MLP official and on the channels focused on each of the respective shows, it's very notable, and I'm not even counting the fact that the FiM and EQG channels strangely always have 2 streams going on at the same time, so I made a fair comparison since TyT is always just one.

So there is something wrong, compare it to the Transformers channel, there they upload all the Transformers shows in the same pattern, one episode of each show, no priority to one over the other, and the streams oftenly also have around the same number of viewers for each one of the shows.

17 hours ago, nataalya said:

I understand it from the point of view that "let's make 5 short videos that will generate 5x more views than 1 long, more demanding and expensive one." Personally, I doubt that the company keeps any separate statistics for each generation. G5 did not achieve their current results individually. There is still support from G4 fans here. TyT itself is strongly supported by a full-length movie featuring themselves. Many G5 viewers mainly follow TyT due to the numerous additions to the main line from MyM. The issue from the beginning of the post - MyM was released only on Netflix as an exclusive. In itself, the fact that new generation toys often come with previous mane six says a lot. In my country, the new generation is not received at all. Pity...

7) The connections between G4 and G5 were so poorly made that at some point I stopped paying attention to it.

I agree that G5 is a huge wasted opportunity. Even apart from the comparison with the G4, the G5 is simply poor. I'm not saying this as a hater. I'm seriously sorry about this. I love the new characters, the ideas for the episodes are very interesting and it's a pity that all this was and is lost on TyT.

You know? I would be a lot more okay and probably wouldn't have made this thread if they at least made MyM as the end of G5's story, not the generation, if they continued with TyT after it I reallly wouldn't mind it, but if the story and all those character arcs ended in MyM, and TyT Season 2 happened with no intention of continuing the story, just being a silly series with nothing really interesting going on, maintaining its position of a minor production, I would've understood it, I would still be disappointed because I would be sad that the story for G5 would've ended in MyM and we wouldn't be getting more of it, but I'm wouldn't be this disappointed to the point of making this thread, because what they are doing is the opposite, they're continuing the story in TyT and forcing the ones who liked MyM to watch it if they are curious about the story, this is just unacceptable for me, continuing the story of a movie franchise or a series in something like a comic is one thing, this is just straight trolling the few fans like me who actually supported this generation, I didn't love G5 as G4 but I also barely complained about it even though it has a lot of problems, I still supported it, I paid Netflix to watch it, and this is what we get in return? we deserve better, they at least had the decency to keep MyM instead of taking it off Netflix and not uploading it anywhere else, that would be just outrageous.

Also, I forgot to mention this little detail, but now that you said in the end "all of these cool stuff in lost in TyT", remember Zipp's detective logs from MyM? So...she's not even doing them in TyT, but she did it in the recently released game "A Zephyr Heights Mystery"! So awesome but ironic at the same time, for you to see how good things are 

By the way, thanks for reading it ^^