Does Shining and Cadence ruin Twilights Character?

[pinkiefan1287 610]

So during the first season we are suppose to believe that Twilight is someone who has never experienced true friendship from anyone. She just spent her time studying and improving her magic. Then during the last episode of season 2 she then says that, Shining was the only one she called a true friend. Also, Twilight considers Cadence a true friend, because of the time they spent together and showing that Twilight did have fun even after becoming Celestias student. So do both of these characters ruin the idea of Twilight? That she did experience friendship during her life.

 

Let me say this I do like both Shining Armor and Cadence. I do have an idea for Twilight with this 2. Most likely something happened to Twilight that made her not want to be friends and want only to be near her big brother. Because he protected her. Also Twilight could also just want parse for her work from ponies who are older and not ones who are younger then her.

 

So what do you all think of this?

Edited September 19, 2012 by pinkiefan1287

[Hazardus_Havard. 480]

Here's a reasonable theory to it all -

 

After Twilight got accepted by Celestia to be her personal student Twilight had been bound in the books studying like crazy to prove she was a great student. Her friendship with her brother and Cadence from before she got to be a student is her only real friendship she's ever had. She may be able to meet with either of them since they are most likely around the castle where Twilight would be staying at for studies but it's obvious she'd be doing more studying than anything.

 

Many years pass with Twilight being a student and tutored there. It wasn't before long that Princess Celestia notices a magical disturbance and see's her sister is to return soon. Not able to use the EoH herself, she decides to have ponies out in her population use them. She notices five that would fit perfectly with their close ties to one another but a sixth is missing. She figures she can get Twilight to go to Ponyville and finally get some friends she badly needs along with tying herself with the EoH all in one neat little package deal. Celestia has everything figured out and sends Twilight and her assistant Spike which would be her only real friend at the moment out to Ponyville.

 

The rest, as you would say, is history.

 

And with that in mind, it's not too unreasonable to have her not mention the other two at all.

Edited September 19, 2012 by Hazardus_Havard

[AegisReflector 887]

I think she just means that they are the only 2 people in her life that really meant something to her. Hell, Cadence was practically her adopted sister through her early years and Shining is obviously the very cool brother that everybody wants.

 

If you think about it, she just met the other 5 ponies and have no prior relationship to them. I don't know about the age factor or anything, but Twilight has to get used to having this sort of friendship, which can take a couple of years. I know my friends and I didn't automatically click when we first met. Hell, some of my friends became enemies and some enemies became friends. You never know until you play out your relationship and work out your common likes amongst your peers.

 

But, in a child's life, you can never forget your brothers or your mentors. Cadence, the gentile ponysitter, raised Twilight as if she was her own sibling, and Shining would die for the sake of Twilight. That's a relationship that stems from YEARS of communication and events.

[OptimisticNeighsayer 479]

I think you're on the right track for being able to solve the "Twilight friendship paradox". I've read in places that intelligence can play a role in social interaction-- the further apart two people are in intelligence, the less likely that they will have the serious interaction necessary for friendship. And since IQ is very much dependent on one's age as well as one's actual capacities by definition, a very smart pony like Twilight would naturally gravitate towards ponies older than her so that she can feel comfortable talking and interacting with others.

 

I also think it's possible that while Twilight didn't exactly have a concept of friendship before she met her five Ponyville friends, with the passage of time and experience with her 'real' friends, that she is beginning to draw parallels between her relationship with her brother and foalsitter and those with her friends currently. There's nothing that says that Twilight always considered them their "friends", because I think many people tend to delineate a difference between the relationship they have with their family and friends (for good reason of course). Learning about friendship has become almost obsessive for Twilight (at least up to Lesson Zero) and it's very possible that during this time she is beginning to make connections with her past experiences. In other words, her calling Shining Armor and Cadance her friends is retrospective in nature.

Edited September 19, 2012 by JustFairness

[pinkiefan1287 610]

Here's a reasonable theory to it all -

 

After Twilight got accepted by Celestia to be her personal student Twilight had been bound in the books studying like crazy to prove she was a great student. Her friendship with her brother and Cadence from before she got to be a student is her only real friendship she's ever had. She may be able to meet with either of them since they are most likely around the castle where Twilight would be staying at for studies but it's obvious she'd be doing more studying than anything.

 

Many years pass with Twilight being a student and tutored there. It wasn't before long that Princess Celestia notices a magical disturbance and see's her sister is to return soon. Not able to use the EoH herself, she decides to have ponies out in her population use them. She notices five that would fit perfectly with their close ties to one another but a sixth is missing. She figures she can get Twilight to go to Ponyville and finally get some friends she badly needs along with tying herself with the EoH all in one neat little package deal. Celestia has everything figured out and sends Twilight and her assistant Spike which would be her only real friend at the moment out to Ponyville.

 

The rest, as you would say, is history.

 

And with that in mind, it's not too unreasonable to have her not mention the other two at all.

 

I still think that Cadence became Twilights foal sitter when she became Celestias student. Twilight was very young for her age and Celestia still had to run a kingdom. So Cadence was just needed when Celestia was busy. Not to mention is most have been hard to get a princess from a baby sitter.

 

Still your idea work.

[Planty 1,053]

It's just like family relation's.

 

Although some do you don't really call your brother's and sister's friend's. Many people have no friend's apart from brother's and sister's (like twilight) and social interaction is different forma brother to a sister then from a friend to friend.

 

Cadence is her foal sitter, but not her friend. She is much older the twilight and is charged with looking after her, just like how you would not say Celestia is twilight's "friend" despite being in constant talk with each other.

 

She didn't have an friends (or real friend's) before she went to Ponyville, so no i don't think it causes any issues

[pinkiefan1287 610]

It's just like family relation's.

 

Although some do you don't really call your brother's and sister's friend's. Many people have no friend's apart from brother's and sister's (like twilight) and social interaction is different forma brother to a sister then from a friend to friend.

 

Cadence is her foal sitter, but not her friend. She is much older the twilight and is charged with looking after her, just like how you would not say Celestia is twilight's "friend" despite being in constant talk with each other.

 

She didn't have an friends (or real friend's) before she went to Ponyville, so no i don't think it causes any issues

 

 

But how can you watch someone and not try to become friends with them? I mean that is part of the job when babysitting. To watch them and be friends with them.

 

I mean Cadence did more then just watched her. They played together, made a cute little song. Also what it seems Cadence cares a lot for Twilight, as if they were sisters. Twilight also care for her in the same way. Also you can be friends with someone who is way older than you. I do agree with you on Celestia and Twilight relationship. They have a student and teacher relationship.

Edited September 19, 2012 by pinkiefan1287

[Planty 1,053]

But how can you watch someone and not try to become friends with them? I mean that is part of the job when babysitting. To watch them and be friends with them.

 

I mean Cadence did more then just watched her. They played together, made a cute little song. Also what it seems Cadence cares a lot for Twilight, as if they were sisters. Twilight also care for her in the same way. Also you can be friends with someone who is way older than you. I do agree with you on Celestia and Twilight relationship. They have a student and teacher relationship.

 

I can see where your coming from, but it's like Apple Bloom being friend's with Twilight, to me it wouldn't feel like they where real friend's because the age gap causes so many differences. It's just not the same as someone the same or similar age to you for me

[Hazardus_Havard. 480]

I still think that Cadence became Twilights foal sitter when she became Celestias student. Twilight was very young for her age and Celestia still had to run a kingdom. So Cadence was just needed when Celestia was busy. Not to mention is most have been hard to get a princess from a baby sitter.

 

Still your idea work.

 

Almost agreeable. But I don't think that sounds reasonable enough. Cadence was a foal sitter to Twilight, yes. But to have her foal sat while she was tutored by Celestia? I believe Celestia would have the guards on her 24/7 while Twilight went about with her own thing whether that be studying or whatever. I don't think Cadence was a full foal sitter anyways, was probably there to meet up with Twilight's brother Shining Armor in the first place but agreed spending time with Twilight would be just fine with her which sparked the friendship between the two originally.

 

To help further that point, I believe if Cadence WAS foal sitting when Celestia was tutoring Twilight, wouldn't Spike be in the picture more? Spike was hatched by Twilight and since then was under the watchful eye of herself, so I doubt she'd leave him alone at such a young age. After Spike was manageable enough to work things on his own Twilight was probably old enough to be on her own from then on. I think in the show right now Twilight is aged around late teens and older, so probably around 16-21 sounds right.

 

To prove that theory a bit, take a look at her friends. I doubt they'd be too out of the age bracket between each other seeing as they all got their cutie marks at the same time. Putting that into perspective they also have their own jobs and support themselves as such. Sounds reasonable enough to put them all around the 16-21 age.

 

Dear god that's a lot for me to go out and attempt to prove something.

[pinkiefan1287 610]

Almost agreeable. But I don't think that sounds reasonable enough. Cadence was a foal sitter to Twilight, yes. But to have her foal sat while she was tutored by Celestia? I believe Celestia would have the guards on her 24/7 while Twilight went about with her own thing whether that be studying or whatever. I don't think Cadence was a full foal sitter anyways, was probably there to meet up with Twilight's brother Shining Armor in the first place but agreed spending time with Twilight would be just fine with her which sparked the friendship between the two originally.

 

To help further that point, I believe if Cadence WAS foal sitting when Celestia was tutoring Twilight, wouldn't Spike be in the picture more? Spike was hatched by Twilight and since then was under the watchful eye of herself, so I doubt she'd leave him alone at such a young age. After Spike was manageable enough to work things on his own Twilight was probably old enough to be on her own from then on. I think in the show right now Twilight is aged around late teens and older, so probably around 16-21 sounds right.

 

To prove that theory a bit, take a look at her friends. I doubt they'd be too out of the age bracket between each other seeing as they all got their cutie marks at the same time. Putting that into perspective they also have their own jobs and support themselves as such. Sounds reasonable enough to put them all around the 16-21 age.

 

Dear god that's a lot for me to go out and attempt to prove something.

 

What kinda of guard would want to watch a filly all day and all night? It just seems like a waste to have a guard do that. Not to mention to one is threatening her life, so a guard could be over kill. Twilight has been given the chance to be taught by Celestia and she get's to live in the castle.(To what I can tell from the episode) So she must be freaking out right now and not being near her parents, is making her scared. So a guard watching her would most likely also freak Twilight out even more and have her scared even more. With Cadence she at least has someone who is kind and gentle.

 

Shining maybe there, but we don't know if guards train at the castle.

 

As for where was Spike. It is said, that Celestia watched him during Twilight's training. So maybe during training she saw him and after a few years they begin be together more.

 

As for your last one, i'm not 100% sure where u r going with this.

 

Kinda don't want to go into this anymore if we can. U have your idea and I have mine.

Edited September 20, 2012 by pinkiefan1287

[OptimisticNeighsayer 479]

@pinkiefan1287

 

I've been looking over the screenshots for "A Canterlot Wedding", and the scenes regarding Twilight's memory of her time with Cadence seem to imply that Cadence was in her life before she became Celestia's pupil (in that Twilight didn't have her cutie mark yet). This of course seems to confirm the fan theories out there that Twilight's parents are either very rich or have royal connections...

[pinkiefan1287 610]

@pinkiefan1287

 

I've been looking over the screenshots for "A Canterlot Wedding", and the scenes regarding Twilight's memory of her time with Cadence seem to imply that Cadence was in her life before she became Celestia's pupil (in that Twilight didn't have her cutie mark yet). This of course seems to confirm the fan theories out there that Twilight's parents are either very rich or have royal connections...

 

I looked at the pic and her cute mark is missing. So it could be true that she was not yet Celestia's student at the time. Still her room looks like the other rooms in the castle and for all we know it is an animation error and they just forgot. Like in Hurricane Fluttershy, do u believe that Fluttershy went back to flight school after getting her cute mark?

It can still be debated, but I feel we are getting off track a little now with the topic.

Edited September 20, 2012 by pinkiefan1287

[FoxyCryptid 4,330]

If anything I think it made her better. I liked seeing the happy childlike side of her come out a little more. It's nice to have Shining to make heartwarming scenes with too.

[2nd lieutenant Blitzkriege 1]

I think that the show introducing these characters can lead to many diffrent ideas or spin offs they can now do. So eventhough you point out the contradictions it can comeback to help the overall appeal of some episodes now that these lovers are introduced. I dont think it necesarilly ruins twilight but again introducing these lovers now opens more possibility's than ever before with a possible change ling comeback. I personally like Twilight having these friends in the childhood but its hard to debate wether it really ruins the "idea" of her.

[Zerul 555]

Pretty much what the previous posers said. It adds depth to the character if anything She's a massive introvert and she needed to have close ties to someone.Twilights whole babysitting song was cute too I liked it.

[Hazardus_Havard. 480]

What kinda of guard would want to watch a filly all day and all night? It just seems like a waste to have a guard do that. Not to mention to one is threatening her life, so a guard could be over kill. Twilight has been given the chance to be taught by Celestia and she get's to live in the castle.(To what I can tell from the episode) So she must be freaking out right now and not being near her parents, is making her scared. So a guard watching her would most likely also freak Twilight out even more and have her scared even more. With Cadence she at least has someone who is kind and gentle.

 

Shining maybe there, but we don't know if guards train at the castle.

 

As for where was Spike. It is said, that Celestia watched him during Twilight's training. So maybe during training she saw him and after a few years they begin be together more.

 

As for your last one, i'm not 100% sure where u r going with this.

 

Kinda don't want to go into this anymore if we can. U have your idea and I have mine.

 

Here's a small counter to that.

 

I agree with JustFairness with his cutie mark thing, though it does make me think about her parents now. Man, where they rich or something? Maybe collecting royalties from the previous generations, eh? ....not too important to point out though at the moment.

 

The guards imposing? Well, first off her brother is the captain of the guard. Probably not at the time though, I'd imagine he was definitely in it at the time though and going through ranks pretty quickly to achieve that status in only a few years time. Having a brother in the royal guard would immediately have Twilight see the guards in a different light so young and probably wouldn't find them at all imposing.

 

Another addition to that - if there was any, even a smidgen of doubt to the guards in her mind even with her brother in it, she would've gotten over it with her intelligence. She would've remembered they were there to protect the princess and would do so with her. Yeah, I can imagine she was scared at first with the major changes being made in her life. Still she still had Celestia to help her with that along with whenever her parents came over or her brother/Cadence. Might've taken some time but she'd adjust to it.

 

Also, I'm not certain where they would train either, still thinking that out. I'd have to imagine it'd be near or on the castle grounds from all the map sources from the show have given.

 

The last bit, that was just more for a reinforcement to information on her being just the right pony for being friends with the other five, nothing more to it. Also to clarify, I didn't really put out that Cadence didn't come over or anything of such. I can imagine she could would and most likely did so, but the majority of the time, she is still a princess and has to be back over where she is needed. Yes, she is still young but I can properly assume they'd have her train and such for her duties back at her homestead. Any visits Cadence made wouldn't be very long so who else but the guards or Celestia herself to watch over Twilight most of the time. I can also imagine her parents making visits and taking her with them from time to time but the bulk of her living stay would be at the castle.

 

Final note on this post, didn't recall about the Spike being watched by Celestia, interesting bit of info there. And I can find it also understandable , he IS the first dragon heard of in the show not in place to show mischief or do harm to ponies. I recall Twilight mentioning there wasn't a lot of information of the dragon race in general in an episode to Spike so Celestia would probably watch and make sure he wasn't harmful.

 

Edit - Crap, that wasn't small at all....

Edited September 20, 2012 by Hazardus_Havard

[Tuxedo Kamen! 114]

I think only the opening implies that TS has no friends. I think that she does have friends, and that the lesson that Celestia is trying to teach is their value. In the pilot, two ponies invite her to party, implying friendship. TS is more interested in her studies then her true friends. So her quests are more lessons in social interaction than actual friendship