Is Rainbow Dash REALLY the fastest character in Equestria?

[ShadowPirateX 600]

She's definently one of the fastest characters we've seen so far.

[Sunny Fox 5,952]

This is Occam's razor in motion. I could suggest Twilight can survive an anvil falling on her skull because we see her live through it, or you could suggest that she can survive because the gravity is lighter in Equestria. One is simple, and is a suitable solution to the circumstance, while the other might be correct as well, but is full of assumptions and needlessly complicated. The first answer is conclusively better.

 

That's a complete misrepresentation of the situation. Occam's Razor chooses between two competing hypotheses that equally fit the facts of the case and have equal amounts of evidence. I know as well as you do that Twilight survived an anvil falling on her head. "We saw her live through it" is evidence and a fact, it is not a hypothesis. For you to suggest she could live through it happening again is also not a hypothesis, it's a prediction. A hypothesis is an attempt to explain the facts of the case, i.e. why Twilight survived the anvil. "She survived it because we saw her live through it" is not an explanation in any sense and it is not a hypothesis. It's the very fact we're trying to account for. "Equestria's gravity is less than earth gravity" is an explanation for Twilight's survival, making it a hypothesis, which would require supporting proof.  But the competing hypothesis would be more like "Twilight has a harder head than other ponies", which would also require supporting evidence, not "she lived through it once".

 

Of course, the real answer is that this was simply a situation of cartoon slapstick, exactly the same as when While E. Coyote gets an anvil to the head. You might as well ask why Daffy Duck can survive a shotgun to the face, with only his beak being on back to front. It doesn't require explanation, because it's purely an attempt at physical humour.

 

 

 

 

Same rules apply here. I can say Rainbow Dash can dodge lightning because she saw it coming and moved out of the way, which is simple and works in the present circumstance. Or I can say that she sense the electric charge, which would require a ridiculous amount of assumptions, like understanding the pony immune system and pegasus biology, or figuring whether or not Rainbow Dash in particular can sense an electrical charge. It's something that would take a writers statement and dozens of showings to prove, and you're trying to do it with only two circumstances. Given what we have, the first idea is the better one. I'm not saying your idea is wrong; it may, in fact, turn out to be the truth. I'm saying that currently, you don't have enough information to be right.

This is not the same as the above example. We can agree that the lightning doesn't hit Dash, just like we could agree that Twilight survived the anvil. We're trying to account for this. In this case, you're saying she can avoid the lightning because she sees it coming and is simply fast enough to move out of the way, which actually is an explanation, and therefore not equivalent to the "first answer" you mentioned above, which was not an explanation but a statement of known facts, that are not in any way being disputed.

 

Hyperbole is not going to help your case. "A ridiculous amount of assumptions," is it? I only actually need to assume that "she has hair", which the electrical charge would cause to stand on end, as electrical charge tends to do in real life.

 

 

Tangential point: Why would I need to understand the "pony immune system"? The immune system fights diseases and pathogens; it has nothing to do with sensing anything.

 

Besides, your theory also has assumptions about RD's/pony biology. You're assuming that RD has nerve conduction velocities fast enough to enable her see lightning coming, decide to evade it and then put her decision into practice in order to evade the lightning, which is not only as much of a necessary assumption as anything on the other hypothesis, but is far less plausible, considering the science behind nerve conduction.

 

In fact, your theory has even more explanatory work to do after all the assumptions. If RD is moving at the speed of lightning (or technically, fast enough to move out of the way, which might not be quite as fast, but still orders of magnitude faster than the speed of sound, so the point still stands), why doesn't the compression of the air when she moves generate heat? At that sort of speed, she should be bursting into flames. Why don't the g forces from moving that fast kill her? Where does the energy come from to accelerate her from rest to Mach X? Is she the Equestrian equivalent of the Flash, who explicitly has the Required Secondary Superpowers necessary to survive going as fast as he goes? You'd have to make unsupported assumptions to justify your view.

 

It's something that would take a writers statement and dozens of showings to prove:

 

Tell me then, which of the writer's statements and dozens of showings do you use to support your hypothesis that RD sees the lightning coming and moves fast enough to avoid it? If I need that much evidence, don't you also need that much evidence? If you can accept your theory on the strength of two scenes (actually one, see my previous post about the scene in Princess Twilight Sparkle) why does the same not apply to my theory?

 

Given what we have, the first idea is the better one. I'm not saying your idea is wrong; it may, in fact, turn out to be the truth. I'm saying that currently, you don't have enough information to be right.

 

You were the one who brought up the scene in Princess Twilight Sparkle. It could have confirmed your idea, but I showed that if anything, it goes against your idea and supports mine. In fact, that scene provides evidence that favours one hypothesis over the other, which takes Occam's Razor off the table.

 

Even after all that, I still haven't begun to examine the assumption that the lightning in Equestria moves as fast as real life lightning. I actually don't think it does, and I can show why I think so. (Please note that this is different from just assuming that lightning in Equestria is slower, which I believe would be bad logic. If it can be proved somehow, then it's no longer bad logic, and I can use it as an argument.)

 

Last Roundup

 

 

 

 

 

Princess Twilight Sparkle

 

 

 

 

 

The lightning generally takes four frames to move across the screen, which makes me doubt it's really all that fast. In fact, it takes four frames to move across the screen whether the scene has Dash in close up or in the middle distance, which actually shows that the speed of lightning in Equestria is variable. Even so, the fact that it takes four frames to move across the screen in real time (about 1 second, which is fast, but still not lightning speed or even speed of sound speed) still goes against the conclusion that Dash's "lightning dodge" is a supersonic event. And there's no bullet time effect like for Neo in the Matrix, that's as it happens.

 

Occam's Razor cuts both ways, you know. Going back to original point of debate: Is the Sonic Rainboom an event based on speed or on magic?

 

Pinkie described it as a "sonic boom and rainbow, all at once". Which is simpler? That Pinkie Pie meant the thing that happens when something goes faster than the speed of sound in air  (which is the definition of a sonic boom), or that she meant a "sonic boom Equestria style" which includes the assumption of some kind of magical aspect for it to trigger?

 

Out of these two, which is simpler? That 1. the sonic rainboom is a product only of speed, or that 2. it is the product of both speed and some kind of magical switch that RD can decide to turn on or off?

 

Which is simpler? That Pinkie Pie was right about the nature of the sonic rainboom, or that she was actually mistaken? If she was mistaken, why didn't Twilight correct her? Was Twilight also mistaken? That seems like another assumption. If she wasn't mistaken, why didn't she correct Pinkie Pie? Now you have to explain why she knew Pinkie was wrong but didn't decide to set her straight for some reason.

 

So, to conclude: you can't use Occam's Razor here, when you did try to use it you applied it to a very skewed misrepresentation of what the topic of debate was, and if you applied it in the same fashion to the original point of debate, you merely prove the point that we should take Pinkie Pie at her word and conclude that the Sonic Rainboom is a supersonic, speed based event.

 

I will read your response, but I may not reply further, since this is taking up a lot of my time on an issue that really isn't that important, about a pony whom I don't rank very highly on my personal scale (RD), in order to prove her superiority over a pony whom I don't like at all (Lightning Dust). It was fun to debate you, but at this point, I don't see how I can convince you of my position, and you haven't convinced me of your position either.

[Fractured 2,684]

 

I will read your response, but I may not reply further, since this is taking up a lot of my time on an issue that really isn't that important, about a pony whom I don't rank very highly on my personal scale (RD), in order to prove her superiority over a pony whom I don't like at all (Lightning Dust). It was fun to debate you, but at this point, I don't see how I can convince you of my position, and you haven't convinced me of your position either.

It seems, as a point of interest, that you have won anyway. Simply put, I have no more logical moves to make here, and I refuse to put pride above truth. Though i'm honestly not entirely on board with sensing electrical charges, I will accept your notion that Rainbow Dash's speed is lower than what I assumed. It seems the Sonic Rainboom is indeed a product of supersonic speeds.

[Sunny Fox 5,952]

It seems, as a point of interest, that you have won anyway. Simply put, I have no more logical moves to make here, and I refuse to put pride above truth. Though i'm honestly not entirely on board with sensing electrical charges, I will accept your notion that Rainbow Dash's speed is lower than what I assumed. It seems the Sonic Rainboom is indeed a product of supersonic speeds.

It was a good debate, though, to refute your argument presented me with a lot of difficulty. I appreciate your honesty as well, it's rare that someone would be willing to make such a post. Shall we shake hands on "Rainbow Dash is awesome?"  There's a conclusion I think we can both support.

[Chaypell13 5]

I think she's the fastest PEGASUS in Equestria but there are Earth ponies who can challenge her. At her fastest speed, she is the quickest but every pegasus can use some training to get better, even Spitfire. Rainbow is faster than her because of this. Fluttershy in the Harmony/Part two episode, did catch up because she had the determination/motivation to do so, not because of her natural skill. In the race between Dash and Spitfire, the latter of the two won because she had trained harder then.

[Silver Letter 1,832]

I think Rainbow Dash has to be at least as fast as Spitfire, a pony that has to be getting old. Rainbow Dash is a wonderbolt now. She has earned that privilege through her superior flying skills and that includes being the fastest. She has not competed directly against Spitfire in a fair race but I think Dash would win. I think she is also likely to be the best flyer overall, in terms of speed and grace and intelligence. The other flyers she has met has not proven themselves to be incredibly graceful.

 

 

Fluttershy in the Harmony/Part two episode, did catch up because she had the determination/motivation to do so

Or because of the plot. Fluttershy is one of the worst flyers in Equestria. She has no business catching up to Tank, much less Rainbow Dash. And Dash and Spitfire never directly raced one another.

[thecreeper123455 14]

She is truly the fastest if somethin motivates her enough. Otherwise she is among the fastest.

[Old Fluttershy 349]

I agree Rainbow Dash is probably the fastest Pegasus but, if we're talking about fastest pony then I'd have to give that to Pinkie Pie as she can basically disappear and reappear at a different place. We have seen this in Party of One. Also Applejack was either as fast or faster than Rainbow Dash during the running of the leaves.

[Pastel 7,630]

Yep, she's the fastest. She's the only one whose ever gone fast enough to do a sonic rainboom. 

From Sonic Rainboom:

Pinkie Pie: You really need to get out more. The sonic rainboom is legendary! When a Pegasus like Rainbow Dash gets going sooo fast... BOOM! A sonic boom and a rainbow can happen all at once!

 

From The Cutie Mark Chronicles:

Rainbow Dash: [voiceover] Most people thought that the Sonic Rainboom was just an old mare's tail.

 

How could they know the existence of sonic rainbooms (even if it's a legend)?

 

EDIT: Oops! Someone has already said that.

Like Jack Rakan:

Mahou Sensei Negima Chapter 244 Page 03.jpg

Woah! Another Negima! fan.

But Rakan is an exception.

Edited August 12, 2014 by Blobulle

[Sunny Fox 5,952]

From Sonic Rainboom:

Pinkie Pie: You really need to get out more. The sonic rainboom is legendary! When a Pegasus like Rainbow Dash gets going sooo fast... BOOM! A sonic boom and a rainbow can happen all at once!

 

From The Cutie Mark Chronicles:

Rainbow Dash: [voiceover] Most people thought that the Sonic Rainboom was just an old mare's tail.

 

How could they know the existence of sonic rainbooms (even if it's a legend)?

 

EDIT: Oops! Someone has already said that.

Woah! Another Negima! fan.

But Rakan is an exception.

Applejack also says "Rainbow Dash here is the only pony to ever pull it off." So the sonic rainboom maybe "legendary" because Rainbow already did it as a filly. Or, slightly more speculative, it was famous as a theory, as in the idea was already known, but nobody had done it until RD. I'm pretty sure the idea of a sonic boom was considered a sound theory (haha) even before we could build a plane that could go that fast to confirm it. Just like we have a theoretical understanding of what it would be like to travel at close to the speed of light, even though we don't have any technology that allows us to go that fast.

 

I'm glad to see someone else knows Negima, it seems kind of like an obscure manga in general.

[Darker 1,351]

I'm willing to believe that any Alicorn is faster, also other magical beings like Discord are probably faster, since they use teleportation. And Tirek after absorbing all of the flying magic of the pegasus probably became faster.

 

And maybe Rd is faster on the sky, but maybe there's someone faster on land.

[Khaoios 1,970]

As of now, yes she is indeed the fastest, however i would not be surprised if somepony or something beating her speed.

[Lelek 178]

It is self proclaimed by Rainbow Dash. I don't think she is the fastest. Pinkie Pie can be suprisingly fast (faster than RD? IDK)

[TheMarkz0ne 962]

After 4 seasons can we safely say Dashie is the fastest character in her universe? I really think Lightning Dust isn't faster and Super Alicorn Magic Infused Twilight isn't faster either. You want to see an episode just all about Dash and maybe the origins of her speed and her true speed limit?

[~SadisticFluttershy~ 779]

Watch this become a debate with all the Rainbow Dash fans from the fanclub.

 

 

My opinion? Yes. Dash is the fastest Pegasus in Equestria. 

To backup my talk, Twilight was the fastest in the episode: "Twilights Kingdom" because she had all Alicorn magic in her posession. Her own, Celestia, Luna and Cadence which made her pretty much unstoppable. Talk about OP right?

 

Anyway.. she was faster than RD because of it. Which the part where she flew out of the library when she broke the front door and flew into the air speeding past dash like a jet that it spun dash in circles.

 

When all of her alicorn magic was taken from Tirek, it made her useless. When the Mane 6 unlocked the chest from the Tree of Harmony and got the Rainbow Power. They all distributed the magic back through Equestria including the princesses.

 

When that happened, Twilight was back to normal with just her own magic. Therefore, Rainbow Dash still stands as the fastest Pegasus in all of Equestria.

 

That's just my opinion of the matter.

[TheMarkz0ne 962]

Watch this become a debate with all the Rainbow Dash fans from the fanclub.

 

 

My opinion? Yes. Dash is the fastest Pegasus in Equestria. 

To backup my talk, Twilight was the fastest in the episode: "Twilights Kingdom" because she had all Alicorn magic in her posession. Her own, Celestia, Luna and Cadence which made her pretty much unstoppable. Talk about OP right?

 

Anyway.. she was faster than RD because of it. Which the part where she flew out of the library when she broke the front door and flew into the air speeding past dash like a jet that it spun dash in circles.

 

When all of her alicorn magic was taken from Tirek, it made her useless. When the Mane 6 unlocked the chest from the Tree of Harmony and got the Rainbow Power. They all distributed the magic back through Equestria including the princesses.

 

When that happened, Twilight was back to normal with just her own magic. Therefore, Rainbow Dash still stands as the fastest Pegasus in all of Equestria.

 

That's just my opinion of the matter.

I don't think Twilight was that fast enough. Maybe Rainbow could do some damage to Tirek. How do you hit someone you can't hit? Dash can control the weather on top of the buccaneer blaze. Also the sonic rainboom could pile drive through Tirek. 

[~SadisticFluttershy~ 779]

I don't think Twilight was that fast enough. Maybe Rainbow could do some damage to Tirek. How do you hit someone you can't hit? Dash can control the weather on top of the buccaneer blaze. Also the sonic rainboom could pile drive through Tirek. 

I don't think so. Rainbow Dash can do such thing, but Twilight pulled alot of DragonBall Z action in there that could easily obliterate Rainbow Dash

 

The battle between Twilight and Tirek was just OP as hell. Neither could defeat another. Tirek cheated in the end anyway.

[ponylaces 1,870]

If she was the fastest in Equestria, she would've became a Wonderbolt a loooooooong time ago.

[Castle_Cross 331]

I like to think , that celestia is the fastest, but she just don't wants to show it :3

[zaqwert11 70]

well i think Rainbow Dash is the fastest being we know of but i think there might be someone who is faster. 

[Perradial 114]

No, actually, I think. Pinkie can appear and angry Flutters can catch RD.

[Zekromic 1,054]

I like to think , that celestia is the fastest, but she just don't wants to show it :3

Maybe, after all, Celly used to share Dashie's love for speed and she liked to flight train with Commander Hurricane. Don't believe me? read the Journal 

 

I can't say Dashie could be the absolute fastest flier in Equestria, as the say goes "There's always someone better than you", and there are tons of pegasi who train as hard

[Lisa 5,553]

Yeah, I reckon she's the fastest being in Equestria. 

Although it's questionable if she's not.

[Osiria 142]

According to Sweet and Elite, when Fancy Pants asked Rarity why she thought Fleetfoot would win the Wonderbolts Derby,

 

Rarity said: "My friend Rainbow Dash talks about her all the time. She says what Fleetfoot lacks in size, she makes up for in speed.

 

And given Spitfire and Fleetfoot thinks that Dashie is a better flier than Soaring (but you can argue being better doesn't necessarily mean faster).

 

 

So I guess:

Fleetfoot > Spitfire > Rainbow Dash > Soaring

 

 

 

But of course there are still dragons (Dashie thinks they're so slow  ), griffons and whatnot that we don't know how fast they can fly. 

 

Since we're talking about fastest being but not just fliers, don't forget Pinkie

Edited December 7, 2014 by Osiria

[Guest]

@@TheMarkz0ne, as the question of 'is RD the fastest pony?' already has a dedicated thread, I have merged yours as a continuation of the pre-existing thread. Please ensure you use the search function before making a thread, you might find that what you wish to discuss is already being discussed elsewhere.