Pony Elements

[sweetolebob18 728]

There are many folks who feel that Dash should have been honesty & AJ should have been loyalty. 

AJ has never flat out lied, but has often bent the truth into a pretzel.  S4 E20 "Leap of Faith", for instance, she doesn't denounce the Flim Flam Brothers because it would hurt Granny Smith.  She puts Loyalty ahead of Honesty until it becomes impossible to do this without lying. 

 

Dash has often blurted out an inconvenient Truth, even if it hurts her friends.  In Griffon the Brush Off, for instance, she is going to prank Fluttershy, but Pinkie stops her (How bad you gotta be, Pinkie is the voice of reason?).  Then, she ditches Pinkie because Gilda doesn't like her.  Then, she pranks Gilda & then ditches her.  This is Loyal? Not in my book.  A loyal friend would have tried to help Gilda fit in & make friends w her other friends.

 

Fluttershy is kind?  All the Elements have gone against their element at times, but she has done it the most.  Ask the Dragon in "Dragonshy", the tourist in "Putting Your Hoof Down", the bees in "It Ain't Easy Being Breezy", the cockatrice in "Staremaster", the animals she terrorized at The Grand Galloping Gala in "Best Night Ever"  They will all tell you that she is about as kind as Atilla The Hun having a bad hair day.  IMO, she should be Generosity.

 

Rarity, it is harder to point to specific examples but IMO she fits better as Kindness than Generosity.

 

I just thought it would be helpful to know how many people thought which pony should have which Element.

The damned Internet appears to have eaten the poll.  ARGH!!  Will try to fix this.

[ShadOBabe 19,028]

I think some of your examples of Flutters being "unkind" are actually her being firm.

The dragon, the bees, and the cockatrice would have caused serious injury or death, and she wasn't going to allow that.

 

But the Gala and Putting Your Hoof Down are examples of her letting her usually pent up emotions go out of control. She has very little practice expressing negative emotions in healthy little ways because she doesn't want to be "mean", so she buries them inside. But eventually they explode out of her when she can't take it anymore, and then she just winds up feeling horrible about herself.

Edited December 27, 2014 by ShadOBabe

[Blue Moon 6,345]

Well, it is true that Applejack has lied a few times, but she usually does so with the best interest of her loved ones, or out of pride. However, pride has been a factor of Applejack's personality for a while, and no one's perfect; many of the lessons in her episodes come from her overcoming her pride. Also, she has mixed feelings about not denouncing the Flim Flam Brothers, and does eventually come out with the truth. Many of the episodes in Season Four revolve around the Mane Six staying true to their respective elements in tough situations.

 

Anyway, Applejack, I feel, represents honesty better than Rainbow Dash, and it fits her better than Rainbow Dash. While Rainbow Dash can be more honest than Applejack; she generally does in the sense that she'll say exactly what's on her mind without thinking too much. Contrariwise, Applejack's kind of honesty is less like saying the truth one-hundred percent of the time and more like staying true to your morals and doing things honorably (i.e. not cheating). This is very well represented in the episode: The Super Speedy Cider Squeezy 6000; where Applejack is shown to stick to her values even when her opponent is obviously doing much better than her, and even when it would benefit her family if they won the competition.

 

Season One Rainbow Dash wasn't known for thinking before acting, so it makes sense for her character to try to prank Fluttershy. They had been pranking others all day, and she figured it would be just with the others who reacted to their pranks positively. I highly doubt she viewed her attempted prank on Fluttershy as an act of betrayal to her friends, and I don't either. It was just innocent fun, but Fluttershy is sensitive, so Pinkie Pie warned Rainbow Dash, who had no problem with not pranking Fluttershy (her exact words were: "Yeah, you're right").

 

As for Gilda, she was a older friend she hadn't seen in a while; she wanted to give her some time as well since she had come all the way down. Also, Rainbow Dash didn't ditch Pinkie Pie because Gilda disliked her;I'm sure Rainbow Dash wouldn't have minded if Pinkie Pie came along with them, but Pinkie Pie can't fly, and Rainbow Dash met Gilda in a Flight Camp, so flying was something they both enjoyed. Plus, Rainbow Dash had no idea that Gilda didn't like Pinkie Pie at that point in time, and Rainbow Dash had spent a large portion of her day with Pinkie Pie, which should have satisfied Pinkie Pie, and Pinkie Pie was overreacting to the whole situation (at first; later is becomes more justified). Also, Rainbow Dash DOES try to help Gilda fit in and become friends with her other friends. She has a party set up and everything, and Gilda showed her true colors to Rainbow Dash at that time.

 

Rainbow Dash has a lot more scenes showcasing her loyalty than Applejack. Some examples would be her turning down the Shadowbolts' offer in the second episode of Season One; staying loyal to Fluttershy instead of giving up on her, and directing Spitfire's congratulation to Fluttershy; leaving Wonderbolt Academy (temporarily) after her friends are almost killed even though it has been her dream for a long time; and to her team at the end of Rainbow Falls. Everything said so far is why I think the Element of Loyalty is best for Rainbow Dash, and the Element of Honesty is best suited to Applejack, and not the other way around.

 

Fluttershy has many scenes showcasing her kindness; so many that it would be very difficult to name them all. All the moments you named have a explanation; the dragon had hurt her friends and she couldn't just sit by. All she did was scold him for what he did wrong, but she did lighten up on him at the end, showing that she forgave him. She wasn't in the right mind with the tourist; she had been essentially brainwashed by Iron Will, whose show she had attended to help her with being less of a pushover, which was a trait she obtained from being so nice. If she had continued to listen to the breezies and had not sent them back to their land; they would have been stuck there which would have been terrible for them. The nicer thing for her to have done in that situation was forcefully tell them to leave; which she did.

 

As for the cockatrice, she had no choice; Twilight was turned to stone, and the Cutie Mark Crusaders were in danger. If she hadn't used her stare, Twilight and the Cutie Mark Crusaders would have likely stayed stone forever (or, at least a very long time). And for the Gala: imagine if what you had expected and wished for (in her case, it would have been to meet all the new animals) had turned out not to be true, and things don't go as planned. You'd probably be pretty upset too, right? Fluttershy isn't perfect; even she has her moments of going over the edge, but for the most part; she is very kind, and kinder than most.

 

Rarity's generosity is showcased very well in Suited For Success and Rarity Takes Manehattan. In Suited For Success, she uses her time and resources to create twelve dresses for her friends; all free of charge. She even insists that she does so. It takes a long time and resources to make one dress; twelve dresses is amazing and extremely generous of Rarity; she could have used that time and those materials to turn a profit in her shop, but she was generous to her friends.

 

In Rarity Takes Manehattan, she has a whole song dedicated to her generosity, and she helps out her opponent with some materials. Rarity represents her element very well.

 

That said, I think the current distribution of the elements is fine just the way it is.

[duidamasterXD 9,627]

I’ve always found the idea that each character should behave in accordance with their element 100% of the time unnecessarily limiting, for the record. Applejack would not be a better character if she was completely honest with herself and others all of the time, and the same holds true for every other character. Any attempt at doing this would require the writers painting themselves into a corner, desperately trying to conform everyone’s actions to some unspoken standard, all the while cutting off a great deal of these characters’ humanity. At the end of the day, it’s very human to slip up and develop blind spots even when it comes to virtues we treasure highly.

 

In addition to this, I’ve also found it unhelpful to add and weigh up defining acts in an attempt to prove one character “better” than another, or more worthy of having a certain element than another. Realistically, your favorite main pony has slipped up at some point and Applejack probably hasn’t at some other point, for example. Doesn’t make her somehow more worthy than anybody else, and her chronicled struggles being honest with herself and others don’t make her unworthy either. The important thing for me is that each character’s element is tied to one of their greatest strengths, and also with some of their most meaningful conflicts.

 

Twilight’s element is magic/friendship/empathy/whatever, and she was awarded it after sitting alone and studying for most of her life. Realistically, there must’ve been hundreds of people better at being a friend than Twilight was in the first episode and she took a decent amount of time to become good at it. Every episode that we see her failing to understand somebody else isn’t some big knock at her worthiness, because her path of growth involves her learning to understand others and she makes significant progress after every misstep.

 

Fluttershy is so kind, at least in part, because she is so vulnerable and dependent on the kindness of others. Appropriately her main struggles have been with overcoming those vulnerabilities and finding an appropriate balance so that she isn’t taken advantage of.

 

Pinkie Pie is the element of laughter even while being the character most famous for having disturbing or depressing meltdowns, and this is because of her tendency to focus on everyone else’s happiness and neglect herself in the process.

 

Applejack has told plenty of little white lies here and there, but more importantly, has a major trend of self-delusion. Life is filled with harsh truths, and hers more than most. She isn’t strong enough to run a farm by herself, her sister is growing up fast whether she likes it or not, and trying to run a perfect family reunion might not fill a hole left by certain people not being there. And she’ll usually make a pretty big fool of herself for most of an episode before acknowledging these things, but she always does. Living in accordance to her principles is something AJ prides herself on, after all.

 

Rainbow Dash and Rarity are pretty similar, both in the way they suit their element and in their being commonly criticized for not suiting them. Rarity is a proactive, ambitious, forward-thinking young lady who desperately wants to move up. And yet, she also genuinely believes that making the lives of others better through small acts of kindness is one of the greatest things a person can do, and is unwilling to move up if it means leaving important friends or principles behind. The strength of her longing to be successful makes her determination to cling to her values even more meaningful.

 

And as for Dash, she also has some lofty goals and dreams of glory. And yet, she also desperately needs loyalty and attention from others in order to feel validated. One of her lowest points (“Why am I all alone ? “) coincides with the point where she felt the most abandoned and betrayed. Because of this, her style of showing affection (as abrasive as she can be in showing it) is through being there for her friends and providing encouragement when they need it. And also similarly to Rarity, her dreams of glory and fame make her even greater commitment to her friends and values all the more amazing.

 

TLDR, behavior that doesn’t line up with a character’s element is often (but not always) evidence of really good writing, not bad. I’m more than satisfied with the elements as they were assigned.

[Pastel 7,630]

AJ has never flat out lied, but has often bent the truth into a pretzel.  S4 E20 "Leap of Faith", for instance, she doesn't denounce the Flim Flam Brothers because it would hurt Granny Smith.  She puts Loyalty ahead of Honesty until it becomes impossible to do this without lying.

It's one of the key episodes, every mane 6 violates their element in them.

[RainbowTashie 379]

I have posted in another topic how i think that AJ is capable of wielding all the elements save magic. Although she can use her magic lasso on me anyday