Would a Complete Monster have worked in FiM?

[eddeams 66]

According to TV Tropes, a Complete Monster is a villain who is pure evil and has no redeeming qualities to speak of. They are never presented in a tragic or sympathetic light and are usually meant to be hated by the audience for their sheer depravity. Some of the most notable examples in modern animation include the Lich from Adventure Time and Bill Cipher from Gravity Falls.

However, none of the main villains in FiM, and the My Little Pony franchise as a whole, qualifies as a Complete Monster due to failing the site's heinous standard. The only exception to this is Cosmos from the IDW comics.

Do you think a CM would've worked in this series? What if the Mane Six had to face a foe as vile and terrifying as Bill and the Lich?

[Fluttershutter 2,453]

Nah, I don't think those kind of characters work much at all.

[Splashee 28,563]

I do see the new G5 villains as "being evil just because villains are needed". Kinda like standard 80s cartoons villains who try and fail every new weekly episode (though G5 was not weekly).

 

A Complete Monster would work in FiM. Especially in the early days, like pre-Season 3.

[eddeams 66]

On 2022-11-07 at 6:38 AM, Fluttershutter said:

Nah, I don't think those kind of characters work much at all.

And why not?

[J.J 923]

I mean I really couldn't find subjective sympathy for Tirek he's a sneaky leech who uses trickery and gains the trust of others by deception so he can proceed to take everything special about them to make himself more powerful, Chrysalis you can say has objective purpose and the others it's up to what you headcanon, does the fact that Tirek worked with Cozy and Chrysalis disqualify him from being a "complete monster" bc from my perspective there's literally nothing good about him, and he gets strong by stealing from others, he isn't strong without the magic of creatures that actually retain redeeming qualities, he isn't a loveable rogue, he's just a complete thug that would be nothing without the support of others.... When he blew up the library it was like, this is your inkling, this is what you are up against, he is a soulless coward who will literally kill for self empowerment... He doesn't care about being meticulous or have a plan for others, he just wants to take what is theirs because he's a thug 

Edited November 9, 2022 by Uncle Bumper

[Sir Hugsalot 9,348]

Doesn't MLP already have such villain in form of Tirek, as stated before me? 

I haven't finished entire series, but I do know him for being a complete jerk with no drop of empathy or other redeeming qualities in him. Then there's also Chrysalis, who apparently never turned away from her malevolent ways even when her kin turned away from her and embraced the good instead. 

But if it's not about them and instead what we look for is evil incarnate on Sauron-level then the answer would be no. That would invite actual cruelty and gore into the show and those are traits that don't belong there. Even beings like Darth Sidious from Star Wars would be too much and simply wouldn't fit the show's purpose or style. 

[Octavian 5,420]

Tirek, Sombra and Cosey are all complete monsters IMO, and they work pretty well. They were 'killed' at the end of the series too, emphasising that sometimes people have black hearts and are dangerous and you should be scared of them - important lessons for kids to learn, sadly. It also fits the tendency of FiM to be sharper than the softer preceding and subsequent gens.

In general, I like there to be a mix of complete and redeemable villains, and for the complete villains to have genuine motivations and chances at redemption that are turned down (rather than be Sombra in the series - ie monodimensional). One good thing about a redeemable villain is that you can have the character stick around be tempted to do evil, like Discord, keeping your furry behind on the edge of your seat guessing :3

 

[eddeams 66]

On 2022-11-11 at 12:59 AM, Sir Hugsalot said:

Doesn't MLP already have such villain in form of Tirek, as stated before me? 

I haven't finished entire series, but I do know him for being a complete jerk with no drop of empathy or other redeeming qualities in him. Then there's also Chrysalis, who apparently never turned away from her malevolent ways even when her kin turned away from her and embraced the good instead. 

But if it's not about them and instead what we look for is evil incarnate on Sauron-level then the answer would be no. That would invite actual cruelty and gore into the show and those are traits that don't belong there. Even beings like Darth Sidious from Star Wars would be too much and simply wouldn't fit the show's purpose or style. 

I presume the Lich would also be inappropriate for FiM?

Edited December 16, 2022 by eddeams

[EpicEnergy 23,218]

I would doubt that a complete monster would work in nearly any show.

[eddeams 66]

On 1/29/2023 at 3:06 PM, EpicEnergy said:

I would doubt that a complete monster would work in nearly any show.

Why's that?

[CocoCody 513]

I think it depends on the circumstance. I think villains with redeemable qualitys make them realistic and relatable. A complete villian could compliment a story were they are trying to convey empathise on the good guys. Complete villains can also lead to very campy over the top acting that make them pure lightning rods for the action, but still one dimensional. I do think a great villian needs to have complexity emotionally on some level that could empathize with them on some level that feels real.

Edited March 3, 2023 by CocoCody

[EpicEnergy 23,218]

On 3/2/2023 at 5:39 PM, eddeams said:

Why's that?

Complete monsters are unrelatable and rather difficult to execute properly. Though, now that I think of it, there is a complete monster in FiM already - The Pony of Shadows. Not Stygian himself, but rather, the dark magic that possessed him and was banished.