Celestia's Dark Magic?

[Capt. Snuggle Gruff 101]

I'm pretty sure this might have been discussed before on a thread.  So If it doesn't belong I apologize.

 

In the premiere of Season 3, we see Princess Celestia using magic to show Twilight Sparkle the story of the Crystal Empire and King Sombra.  However during this scene we see Celestia using what seems to be dark magic.  As she uses her horn to summon, she says that "Hatred and fear take hold".  Now first off she of course isn't speaking of her hatred taking hold, but the possibility that she can control her hatred is there.  She uses this dark magic only to show Twilight what happened to the Crystal Empire, yes, but there could be more to that.  When using this dark magic her eyes glow green and her horn has purple bubble magic around it, however when she destroys the evil crystal shards her eyes are glowing completely white.  This magical appearance seems to be a bit different as well.  Celestia's normal magic does not change her eyes to being white, and the bright yellow background may suggest that she is using a special magic.  Later TS uses some of this dark magic and says that she learned it from Celestia.  Seeing how dangerous the dark magic is, one could speculate to fully control it you would either have to be filled with Hatred and Fear, or have extreme control over your magic.  Princess Celestia using this dark magic shows that maybe perhaps she has a little of evil in her.  Now of course there is the fact that Twilight Sparkle uses this magic later on in the second episode of the premiere.  She does struggle with the conjuring of, and after words she mentions that it was "a little trick" that Celestia taught her.  Hearing that we could say that Twilight hasn't really learned all about dark magic, Celestia has only showed her a quick trick of the dark magic.  Celestia's knowledge of the dark magic is never fully discussed however, but a similar magic is used by her and Luna to banish Sombra, which then turns him into shadow.  Now of course he could have turned into shadow just due to the fact that he was defeated, because the magical beam coming forth from the sister was a beam of light.  So again we see this "Light" magical power, which doesn't really seem like anything weird at all.  Celestia controlling the sun would of course mean that she could use such magical powers.  But is it possible that Celestia knows all about dark magic and just hasn't told Twilight anything about how to use it due to its darkness and hatred?  Over in another thread there is the discussion that Celestia might be a manipulator and takes away free will from the ponies.  Now I personally don't subscribe to that theory, but it does seem possible to me now that I think of it, and with the addition of dark magic I believe that maybe Celestia is a manipulator.  She apparently isn't effected by the use of the dark magic, but how did she come to learn it, and was she ever affected by it?

[Dark Horn 430]

Hmm... interesting topic. First off, I would recommend dividing your posts into paragraphs. While I strangely enjoy reading long, continuous walls of text, most others do not.

 

With that being said, Celestia likely learned this dark magic from Luna, Princess of the Night. It's believable to me that Luna would have acquired some knowledge of the dark arts. It's also possible that she didn't learn it, and she was born with it.

 

For example, no one taught Twilight Sparkle to, say, grow a moustache with her magic. She could just do it naturally.

[NavelColt 22,883]

Celestia is not only over two thousand years old presumably, but is also the leader of an entire country/continent equivalent. On top of that, she's a teacher of magic to disciples. If you ask me, her knowing dark magic doesn't need a whole lot of potential dramatic backstory, because when you're that old and that wise, you're bound to have come into contact with dark magic before, and probably learned it to better understand it.

 

Also, I agree with the above. Paragraph indenting is your friend :3

[Jammo 986]

She's picked up some dark magic over the years.

When you're that old you've likely spent a lot of time researching all facets of magic. She must have some knowledge of it but prefers not to use it. She only used it to educate Twilight and likely doesn't enjoy playing around with darkness but it seemed to be the only way she knew how to illustrate Sombra's power.

[Nomadic 210]

     I think that little display of "Dark Magic" she probably picked it up due to exposure over the countless millennia from potential threats to her kingdom, and that may of been the best way for her to combat it after the lost of the Elements of Harmony through knowledge of how it works. I mean we have seen Celestia over-powered by Queen Chrysalis. Celestia isn't omnipotent, to rule a kingdom for as long as she has it was probably in her best interests to learn the nuances and limitations of dark magic despite the risk of being corrupted because of it.

[SCS 7,537]

I strongly disagree that Princess Celestia is a manipulator, or evil in any way. There is a big difference between having knowledge of evil, and actually doing evil. Yes, she used dark magic - but she did not use it to hurt anyone. Quite the contrary, she used it to demonstrate to Twilight Sparkle what they were up against, so that Twilight, her friends, Cadence, and Shining Armor could save the Crystal Empire from King Sombra. Therefore, while the magic itself was of an evil nature, since she was not using it for evil, she was not doing anything evil. 
 
As for the color of the magic: I believe that there is a spectrum of magic in Equestria, ranging from negative to positive energy. Negative energy would be associated with negative thoughts and emotions such as hatred, fear, jealousy, greed, and anger. Positive energy would be associated with positive thoughts and emotions such as love, courage, selflessness, generosity, and kindness. The color of the magic being used would be indicative of its fundamental emotion.
 
Princess Celestia's eyes and horn became evil looking and discolored when performing Sombra's magic in particular, because I believe that his magic is the highest order of dark magic. Chrysalis's magic took on a sickly green color, but did not involve a distortion of the user like Sombra's magic did, so it was of a lower order of dark magic. Nightmare Moon's magic was not evil, as it originated out of inappropriately handled negative emotions instead of a strong and deliberate will to destroy love. When Celestia banished the dark crystals she had conjured up using Sombra's dark magic of the highest order, her eyes turned white because she used light magic similar to the Elements of Harmony. The Elements of Harmony would be light magic of the highest order.
 
To put things on a scale, in order from most evil, to not evil, to most good:
 
 

Dark Magic

• Magic such as that used by King Sombra. Evil of the highest order, to the point of temporarily distorting the user. It is possible that prolonged use of the magic permanently distorts the user, given how angry and evil Sombra looks in comparison to other ponies.
• Magic such as that used by Queen Chrysalis. Evil, but not as dark as Sombra's magic.
• Magic such as that used by Nightmare Moon. Not evil, but severely misguided and negative.
   

Neutral Magic

• Magic that is used for ordinary tasks, and does not necessarily involve emotion. It is neither positive nor negative.
• Chaotic magic. Chaotic magic is neutral in the sense that it is neither inherently good nor bad, and it can be used for either one, or neither, through the free will of the being that wields it.
   

 

Light Magic

• Magic used by Princess Cadence. Has the power to spread love and light to other beings, and can temporarily keep dark magic at bay.
• Magic used by Princess Luna or Princess Celestia. Is primeval, fundamental, powerful, and highly good. 
• Magic used by wielders of the Elements of Harmony. Light magic of the highest order.
   

 

 
Even though Princess Celestia knows how to do dark magic, it is apparent that she chose the path of harmony. I would guess that a being as powerful as King Sombra would in turn be fully aware of how to do light magic. If he was not, why would he fear the Crystal Heart enough to lock it away behind a series of elaborate magical traps and puzzles? But, unlike Princess Celestia, he chose the path of hatred, and that is what lead to his inevitable defeat. The ignorant and selfish nature of dark magic, no matter how powerful it seems on the surface, will always lead to the user's eventual defeat.

Edited July 27, 2013 by SCS

[Scootalove 10,689]

I think Celestia learned dark magic along the way, when she was a filly growing up and learning about magic from her mentor. She might have learned magic but she isn't evil since, she used it to assist Twilight in helping Shining Armor and Cadence protect the Crystal Ponies in the Crystal Empire from King Sombra. Celestia probably read some books that had dark magic in it and, decided to use it to help Twilight but she didn't use it to inflict harm.

[Xievie 498]

Something I've always believed magic is like:

Dark Magic =/= Evil

Light/Holy Magic =/= Good

In videogames or even My Little Pony, would magic related to fire or water be limited to good or evil?

The magic is not good or evil, it's how you use it is what is good or evil.

Not 100% on topic, but has a bit to do with it.

 

As for controlling hatred and fear for magic like this, I would bet Celestia has this (considering Princess Luna obviously did) and can control and channel it.

Anything else I would say is covered by other posters on the topic.

[RrVPfX9cPtw59FpC 1,304]

Just because someone knows a lot about something doesn't mean they should teach it. If I knew how to rob a bank and I was a teacher, I wouldn't teach my students that. So yes, I believe that Celestia is simply trying to protect Twilight.

[Zygen 6,066]

I think dark magic is a dangerous magic, and she knows that so she doesn't teach Twilight much of it.

 

I do think it requires anger and hate to use, because when Twilight gets mad she ends up using the dark magic. Possibly not intentionally.

 

I think it just requires discipline, but I don't think using dark magic in equestria atleast makes you evil if you control it.

 

Think of something like the apprentice in The force Unleashed, or something like that. He uses the dark side of the force, but still also does good to.(To an extent).

 

Or maybe like Riku from Kingdom hearts, Atleast in chain of memories he uses his dark powers for good.

 

Or maybe like Megaman's Chaos Union in Megaman Battle Network 5.. well sorta.

 

So i think maybe Celesia just doesn't think Twilights ready to try and control the dangers of dark magic, because it has the potential to corrupt, if not used correctly.

 

I don't think Celestia is a manipulator personally.