S07:E25+E26 - Shadow Play

[Hierok 11,831]

• Title: Shadow Play part 1 & 2
• Air Date: October 28, 2017
• Leaked: October 7, 2017
• Written by: Josh Haber
• Synopsis Shadow Play, Part I: When Sunburst discovers the lost journal of Starswirl the Bearded, Twilight becomes obsessed with saving her magical idol from a thousand-year-old prison.
• Synopsis Shadow Play, Part II: With Starswirl and the other Pillars of Old Equestria back from limbo (where they’ve been trapped for a thousand years), Twilight and her friends must work together to defeat the Pony of Shadows. 

 

• Of course remember to join us at the CMC Clubhouse on Equestria.tv!

Edited October 22, 2017 by Hierok

[Sly 236]

Spoiler

IMO the best finale objectively talking (althought I still prefer Twilight's Kingdom over it althought for personal bias). It's incredible, but somehow Josh Haber managed to do a real miracle with this episode. Cramming so many things and characters in just 44 minutes can easely end badly, but him managed to do it very well, and didn't create any pacing problem, all the characters played their parts bery well, and also several mysteries behind the series were unveiled and the lore, worldbuilding and backstory were expanded very well. Haber deserves some major kudos for this finale. Well done.

 

[Pastel 7,630]

Mmmh, at first there were 2 things I found odd :

- Star Swirl actually making an appearance, I was 100% sure he was dead.

- The 5 other Pillars felt a bit random at first, but ok why not...

 

That aside, loved this season finale. Can't wait to see Twilight and Star Swirl's relation being developped in season 8. I bet there's going to be a "Twilight helps Star Swirl finding a new home" episode.

[Hierok 11,831]

5 minutes ago, Blobulle said:

Mmmh, at first there were 2 things I found odd :

- Star Swirl actually making an appearance, I was 100% sure he was dead.

- The 5 other Pillars felt a bit random at first, but ok why not...

 

That aside, loved this season finale. Can't wait to see Twilight and Star Swirl's relation being developped in season 8. I bet there's going to be a "Twilight helps Star Swirl finding a new home" episode.

Star Swirl kinda was an ass to Twilight, so I hope he will give her some more credit. This episode was pretty good and the villain was amazing. It looked like the pony of shadows was not death, so he could return. 

[RulesofRarity 489]

I liked Shadow Play quite a bit. Having said that though I didn't like how Starlight automatically believed that the POS could be reformed, when she initially met the POS he tried to kill Starswirl and Twilight. What about him indicated that he was able to saved? 

They should've given Mistmane and Meadowbrooke a little more to do. During the flashback battle they literally did nothing. 

I'm glad that the princesses weren't captured or defeated. I'm hoping the shadow returns eventually. Lastly, seeing Starswirl was a dream come true. 

Edited October 14, 2017 by RulesofRarity

[Tao 7,564]

I did like this end of the season 8 and we got some good connections from the Pony Tails theme we had in the camping EP in the early part of this season.  Which is nice in not only did they keep in expanding the world, we also got some carry over from the Second EG Movie with the fight with the Sirens of all things!   We also got some back history on the Elements on how they came to be, also the Tree of Harmony and more history than we've been given in the last few seasons of the Pony world!

 

[Drunkfrank 1,125]

18 minutes ago, RulesofRarity said:

I liked Shadow Play quite a bit. Having said that though I didn't like how Starlight automatically believed that the POS could be reformed, when she initially met the POS he tried to kill Starswirl and Twilight. What about him indicated that he was able to saved? 

They should've given Mistmane and Meadowbrooke a little more to do. During the flashback battle they literally did nothing. 

I'm glad that the princesses weren't captured or defeated. I'm hoping the shadow returns eventually. Lastly, seeing Starswirl was a dream come true. 

Well, the first thing Starlight tried to do in The Cutie Remark was erase Twilights friendships, Starlight believes not everything is as apparent as it seems.

I agree on the Siren flashback, let us not forget that Mistmane is exstremely powerful, I am willing to bet Starswirl and Mistmane could handle the Sirens by themselves.

[n1029 227]

All the mythology building and stuff was great and all, but the biggest thing I took away from this was the writers finally recognizing that Spike and RD can be a really awesome tag team, as well as the subtle character development for Rainbow favoring pragmatism over a competition opportunity.

 

Edited October 14, 2017 by n1029

[Zel 56]

Good ending for this season. A shame I didn't really care much for any of the legends episode because I obviously would have been a little more excited to see all of them in these episodes. I like a lot of things in these episodes. But didn't like some things too.

First, the treatment the legends were given weren't really equal. Starswirl and Flash Magnus for example were more in the spotlight during this episode than Meadowbrook. I get that with this many characters it would have been difficult but some of them were just above average backround characters in this two parter.

Secondly, the "trials" the M6 did to recover the missing items were also quite inequal : I really like the part about Fluttershy getting the mask because it was a really perfect way to showcase what make Fluttershy a great pony, the Rarity one was... more of a mixed bag for me because it felt really... empty and a bit easy. But again there was just no time to focus a bit more on this part.

Thirdly, the evil foe of this finale was... not that threatening. Like at all. He did nothing at all for the entire episodes. Yeah, he did some bad stuff in the past... I suppose (we didn't really se any of his wrongdoings...) but in the present he just appeared, tried to battle a bit with Twillight, flew and destroy a barrier spell. So yeah... as a vilain... it was just nothing at all. I didn't really understand what his plans were exactly, what he wanted, how he aimed to attain it or... anything really.

Apart from these nitpicks it was a good episode. It showcased the M5 and their qualities, Starlight qualities, a good conflict between Starswirl and Twillight with both sides having sort of an understable view of the subject, a bit more lore fleshed out (even if... I don't really know if the chronology isn't a bit flimsy...), a good use of the map (I'm looking at you Triple Threat !) and a good showcase of Twillight in the last bit of the last episode were she act like a true princess of friendship by going inside the shadow to make things right

[Castle Bleck 19,330]

Most of it was top-notch… except the Pony Of Shadows.

Let's see… Tragic, misunderstood ex-hero? Check. Evil, suped-up alter-ego? Check. Plot to cover the world in eternal darkness? Check. Domain in a haunted forest? Check. Underwhelming performance after all the hype? Check.

Congratulations - he was officially just an R63 ripoff of Nightmare Moon!

And sadly, he was completely unrelated to her or Sombra (who - despite his screentime issues - still managed to squeeze-in as much unique powers, presence, intelligence, etc., as he could).

Edited July 31, 2023 by Castle Bleck

[Sly 236]

24 minutes ago, The Artist Formerly Known As A.V. said:

Most of it was top-notch... except The Pony Of Shadows.

 

Let's see... Misunderstood, tragic ex-hero? Check. Evil, suped-up alter-ego? Check. Plot to cover the world in eternal darkness? Check. Domain in a haunted forest? Check. Underwhelming performance after all the hype? Check.

 

Congratulations -- he was officially just a Rule 63 ripoff of Nightmare Moon!

 

And sadly, he was completely unrelated to her or Sombra (whom -- despite his screentime issues -- still managed to squeeze in as much unique intelligence, powers, presence, etc., as he could).

Personally I think his backstory was better than NMM's one: Luna became evil just for mere gelousy. Stygian became evil because he just wanted to stand to the pillars' side but they trashed him away without even giving him the chance of explaining why he took their artefacts (another difference between NMM also is that the real reasons of him turning evil have been never known to anypony, before Twilight talked to him, while it has always been known that Luna became evil because she was gelous of her sister). I agree about him having an underwelming performance but at least his backstory was better than NMM. At least for me. 

Edited October 15, 2017 by Sly

[Castle Bleck 19,330]

On 2017-10-15 at 12:23 PM, Sly said:

Personally I think his backstory was better than NMM's one: Luna became evil just for mere gelousy. Stygian became evil because he just wanted to stand to the pillars' side but they trashed him away without even giving him the chance of explaining why he took their artefacts (another difference between NMM also is that the real reasons of him turning evil have been never known to anypony, before Twilight talked to him, while it has always been known that Luna became evil because she was gelous of her sister). I agree about him having an underwelming performance but at least his backstory was better than NMM. At least for me. 

I'll concede that Stygian himself was still interesting.

Edited July 31, 2023 by Castle Bleck

[Sly 236]

25 minutes ago, The Artist Formerly Known As A.V. said:

 

I'll concede that Stygian himself was still interesting.

Yeah, in the end the Pony of Shadows (aka Stygian) was way more interesting in terms of character and backstory, than as villain, but personally I'm fine with that.

[Hierok 11,831]

16 hours ago, The Artist Formerly Known As A.V. said:

Most of it was top-notch... except The Pony Of Shadows.

 

Let's see... Misunderstood, tragic ex-hero? Check. Evil, suped-up alter-ego? Check. Plot to cover the world in eternal darkness? Check. Domain in a haunted forest? Check. Underwhelming performance after all the hype? Check.

 

Congratulations -- he was officially just a Rule 63 ripoff of Nightmare Moon!

 

And sadly, he was completely unrelated to her or Sombra (whom -- despite his screentime issues -- still managed to squeeze in as much unique intelligence, powers, presence, etc., as he could).

I totally agree with you that he was underwhelming. The pony of shadows should have been an umbrum or something like that. I assummed in another topic that he was a servant of Sombra or Grogar. I would personally chose for Grogar since he is still alive and could be threat of the season 8 finale. But this episode was indeed a good one. 

[Sly 236]

Just now, Hierok said:

I totally agree with you that he was underwhelming. The pony of shadows should have been an umbrum or something like that. I assummed in another topic that he was a servant of Sombra or Grogar. I would personally chose for Grogar since he is still alive and could be threat of the season 8 finale. But this episode was indeed a good one. 

I still think that Stygian himself was a well done character thought. Sure he didn't do much as villain as the Pony of Shadows, but at the very least his backstory was well done.

[Hierok 11,831]

Just now, Sly said:

I still think that Stygian himself was a well done character thought. Sure he didn't do much as villain as the Pony of Shadows, but at the very least his backstory was well done.

I agree with you there, but Stygian could have been the reason the pillars were locked up and he teamed up with the pony of shadows. He could have been the key to the pony of shadows because they were friends. It could have been a friendship lesson and you would have had a better antagonist. I actually hoped it would be a three parter, because it is quite an important scene in the show.

[Tacodidra 61,081]

Spoiler

Wonderful episodes! Not quite my favorite two-parter but brilliant at any rate.

First of all, it was great to see Star Swirl (or "Mr. the Bearded" ) for the first time, as well as the other legendary ponies interacting with the Mane 6. The same goes for all the other characters who had small roles, even Garble (as annoying as he is, it was great to see him get outsmarted).

The ending was quite touching. It was also nice that the whole cast got to play a part in saving Equestria, though Starlight deserves the most credit here. A couple of nods to Equestria Girls too (though I somehow didn't recognize the sirens), which I liked.

I can't think of anything that particularly bothered me in these episodes. Well, maybe Star Swirl should have spoken Old Ponish instead of English, but I understand why he didn't. I'm looking forward to future episodes and possible appearances from the legendary ponies (especially Somnambula!). I rate these episodes 9.5/10.

 

[ggg-2 3,552]

My girlfriend and I came up with the idea of an "element of strength" years ago, and this finale technically made it canon. .....Where the hell's my damn royalty check Hasbro? XD

[Ashen Pathfinder 16,161]

@Hierok

Just letting you know that with the Canadian airing of this episode I went ahead and moved the thread to S7 Discussion, and edited the title. Apologies for the inconvenience.

[Hierok 11,831]

11 minutes ago, PathfinderCS said:

@Hierok

Just letting you know that with the Canadian airing of this episode I went ahead and moved the thread to S7 Discussion, and edited the title. Apologies for the inconvenience.

No problem. 

(2100)

Edited October 22, 2017 by Hierok

[Kyoshi Frost Wolf 41,330]

I have unpopular opinions for this finale. It had great setup, the premiere of a legendary figure and a badass antagonist, but the finale ended up disappointing me. 

My main problem is simply this: It eventually became the Starlight show. That wouldn't be a problem, if they didn't make every other character totally brain dead to do it. How weird that the only pony who objected at all to the plan was Starlight and bigger shock, she was right the whole time. Wowee. None of the other characters, you know, the ones who hold the elemts and the ones who friggin created them, NEVER considered talking it out with Stygian? What about when Starlight suggested it? Did none of them ever think "You know, that might actually work, friendship and all that.'? Apparently, all of those characters became blind morons just so Starlight could be the one that was right all along. It doesn't sit right with me. If the others, including the other pillars, actually objected to Starswirl's idea at some point, that would have been fine. Instead they blindly followed the obvious asshole Starswirl because reasons. 

That is why I can't really say I liked this finale much. The moment Starlight started suggesting something else, that was the moment I knew exactly what was going to happen and it was so predictable that it hurt. I get it that it is suppose to be Starlight knowing what it is like being rejected for past actions, but I couldn't get passed how dumb the other characters were to get that point across. Also the pony of shadows, as cool as he was, still didn't do a whole lot. Tirek did for sure so we know it is possible.

I probably would give this finale a 4/10, maybe a 5 at the most. Still better than Cutie Remark though. Hated that one. While the finale is a sheer disappointment for me, this season was quite good overall. Possibly my favorite.

 

[Thrond 3,263]

I found this mostly boring. I just don't care about the world, which has grown more and more generic as the show goes on, and I don't think this does any of its characters justice. It has its moments, but they couldn't overcome my lack of investment, and it really lost me any time it started expositing backstory. And I agree with @Kyoshi's issues with Starlight's part in this.

For probably the final time, you can find a full review at my blog. 

[n1029 227]

I kinda get the criticisms about the worldbuilding, but the character moments made up for it in this episode, imo. And I felt Starlight worked as being the one to set things right since she probably saw herself in Stygian. Even if the Mane 6 do have plenty of history in forgiving others they still didn't have the deeply personal experience of receiving it that Starlight did (though if you didn't like Cutie Re-Mark either I guess you would be inclined to disliking this episode too). I imagine Star Swirl's authoritative presence probably made them more inclined to just doing what he said, too.

 

Edited October 23, 2017 by n1029

[Thrond 3,263]

2 hours ago, n1029 said:

And I felt Starlight worked as being the one to set things right since she probably saw herself in Stygian. Even if the Mane 6 do have plenty of history in forgiving others they still didn't have the deeply personal experience of receiving it that Starlight did (though if you didn't like Cutie Re-Mark either I guess you would be inclined to disliking this episode too).

I probably wouldn't have minded half as much if a. Starlight had convinced Twilight sooner and b. I found Starlight remotely interesting. I don't like "Cutie Re-Mark," but Starlight isn't one of my issues with it 

2 hours ago, n1029 said:

I imagine Star Swirl's authoritative presence probably made them more inclined to just doing what he said, too.

Okay, but, Twilight... is a princess. This is the one time I wish she had acted more like one. 

Edited October 23, 2017 by AlexanderThrond

[heavens-champion 1,905]

On 10/22/2017 at 5:04 AM, Kyoshi said:

I have unpopular opinions for this finale. It had great setup, the premiere of a legendary figure and a badass antagonist, but the finale ended up disappointing me. My main problem is simply this: It eventually became the Starlight show.

From what I heard, it was more of a team effort than simply Starlight.