Belief Poll

[Black Sabbath 2,486]

9 minutes ago, Sondash Studios said:

You are focusing on the OLD TESTAMENT. The NEW TESTAMENT is when Jesus came to earth to change everything: love your neighbors, do good to those who do bad to you, etc.

The old testament is just as much a part of the bible as the new one. 

10 minutes ago, Sondash Studios said:

Muslims, budhists, monks, etc, all kill people if they don't accept their own views. There is NO love in their religions.

And how does that differ from when the Christians does it? 

[Sondash Studios 4,862]

6 minutes ago, Yamet said:

The old testament is just as much a part of the bible as the new one. 

And how does that differ from when the Christians does it? 

Who? oh of course.

You mean the old catholics who killed heritics for not believing in mary, john, and the apostles...

ya ya ya. Why don't you study first, then bring your case before me.

this is 1st grade stuff for me.

[Black Sabbath 2,486]

7 minutes ago, Sondash Studios said:

You mean the old catholics who killed heritics for not believing in mary, john, and the apostles...

Yes, among other things. But I'm also talking about more modern stuff, like The Lord's Resistance Army and the Christian militias in the Central African Republic. Please explain how what they are doing is different to those of other faiths killing in their religions name. 

Edited May 11, 2018 by Yamet

[IronM17 5,446]

28 minutes ago, Sondash Studios said:

Muslims, budhists, monks, etc, all kill people if they don't accept their own views. There is NO love in their religions.

Christians also killed people and partly still do it. Army of God, Lord resistence army (both are christian terrorist groups who are still active), the Inquisition, witch burning, the crusading ... their are so many examples where christians killed people because of other opinions (and they are not all from the dark age). Or look at some states of the USA where non-christians have big problems (especially atheists, but also muslims or jews). And their are some christian groups (especially the creationistic and evangelicalic ones) who work with a lot of psychologial terror. I don't want to say that all christians are bad, definitelly not, but you can not say that there are no bad christians. 

And for love: I am an atheist, a lot of my friends are atheists, and their is a lot of love. I also have avoved who are christians or muslims. Maybe we don't have the same view on the world, but we don't hate each other and respect their views. And do you have a proof that their is no love in other religons or worldviews. How good do you know them?

 

Edited May 11, 2018 by IronM17

[ShadOBabe 19,014]

17 minutes ago, Yamet said:

The old testament is just as much a part of the bible as the new one.

Yes, and it informs the context of the New Testament. But there are plenty of things from the Old Testament that Jesus explicitly said to stop worrying about. He basically came and changed how the entire dynamic worked. There was no Savior that died for you in the Old Testament.

9 minutes ago, Sondash Studios said:

Why don't you study first, then bring your case before me.

this is 1st grade stuff for me.

Sondash, just some advice from a fellow Christian... stop acting so full of yourself. You're not going to convince anyone of anything acting all high and mighty. I won't judge you, because I used to be the same way, but seriously, have some humility and people will be more receptive towards you.

That is 1st grade human interaction.

Don't stoop to the level of those that cannot act with respect.

Edited May 11, 2018 by ShadOBabe

[Sondash Studios 4,862]

3 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

Yes, and it informs the context of the New Testament. But there are plenty of things from the Old Testament that Jesus explicitly said to stop worrying about. He basically came and changed how the entire dynamic worked. There was no Savior that died for you in the Old Testament.

Sondash, just some advice from a fellow Christian... stop acting so full of yourself. You're not going to convince anyone of anything acting all high and mighty. I won't judge you, because I used to be the same way, but seriously, have some humility and people will be more receptive towards you.

That is 1st grade human interaction.

Don't stoop to the level of those that cannot act with respect.

It's no that. I'm just defending my faith and Bible from ignorant people who only want to annoy others.

5 minutes ago, IronM17 said:

Christians also killed people and partly still do it. Army of God, Lord resistence army (both are christian terrorist groups who are still active), the Inquisition, witch burning, the crusading ... their are so many examples where christians killed people because of other opinions (and they are not all from the dark age). Or look at some states of the USA where non-christians have big problems (especially atheists, but also muslims or jews). And their are some christian groups (especially the creationistic and evangelicalic ones) who work with a lot of psychologial terror. I don't want to say that all christians are bad, definitelly not, but you can not say that there are no bad christians. 

And for love: I am an atheist, a lot of my friends are atheists, and their is a lot of love. I also have avoved who are christians or muslims. Maybe we don't have the same view on the world, but we don't hate each other and respect their views. And do you have a proof that their is no love in other religons or worldviews. How good do you know them?

 

Sorry, I'm not taking my time to answer. next time.

7 minutes ago, Yamet said:

Yes, among other things. But I'm also talking about more modern stuff, like The Lord's Resistance Army and the Christian militias in the Central African Republic. Please explain how what they are doing is different to those of other faiths killing in their religions name. 

They are spiritually blinded. Jesus never commanded us to kill others. Those people are wrong.

[ShadOBabe 19,014]

5 minutes ago, Sondash Studios said:

It's no that. I'm just defending my faith and Bible from ignorant people who only want to annoy others.

You can absolutely do that, but you're just going to make it worse if you approach the situation with anger and impatience. And you also have to accept that some people will just never be interested in what you have to say. By all means, be willing to share your faith, but if you're going to debate, you need to accept that some people will always think you're wrong.

Most of your posts are dripping with the attitude of "this is beneath me", which again, will convince nobody of anything. Be like Jesus: humility and patience.

Edited May 11, 2018 by ShadOBabe

[Sondash Studios 4,862]

Just now, ShadOBabe said:

You can absolutely do that, but you're just going to make it worse if you approach the situation with anger and impatience. And you also have to accept that some people with just never be interested in what you have to say. By all means, be willing to share your faith, but if you're going to debate, you need to accept that some people will always think you're wrong.

Most of your posts are dripping with the attitude of "this is beneath me", which again, will convince nobody of anything. Be like Jesus: humility and patience.

Thanks man. I feel better. May God bless you!!!

[Black Sabbath 2,486]

3 minutes ago, Sondash Studios said:

They are spiritually blinded. Jesus never commanded us to kill others. Those people are wrong.

Right, you know who claims the exact same things? Every muslim, buddhist, etc who view killing other people as wrong. So let me ask you again, what differs the actions of those terrorist from those who shares your faith? 

8 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

Yes, and it informs the context of the New Testament. But there are plenty of things from the Old Testament that Jesus explicitly said to stop worrying about. He basically came and changed how the entire dynamic worked. There was no Savior that died for you in the Old Testament.

True, but most of what changed was the rules regarding cleanliness and sacrifice IIRC. The scripture (i.e the part I have a bit of a problem with) still remains the same.  

[ShadOBabe 19,014]

Just now, Sondash Studios said:

Thanks man. I feel better. May God bless you!!!

You too hon. Deep breaths, relax. Nothing no human could ever say will take away from the strength of God.

[Sondash Studios 4,862]

1 minute ago, Yamet said:

Right, you know who claims the exact same things? Every muslim, buddhist, etc who view killing other people as wrong. So let me ask you again, what differs the actions of those terrorist from those who shares your faith? 

True, but most of what changed was the rules regarding cleanliness and sacrifice IIRC. The scripture (i.e the part I have a bit of a problem with) still remains the same.  

Good day sir. I am done here.

[Black Sabbath 2,486]

Just now, Sondash Studios said:

Good day sir. I am done here.

Alright, but before you leave can't you please explain how those who kill in the name of your faith only does so because they're spiritually blinded while those who kill in the names of other faiths do so because said faiths lacks love? I really want to hear you explain that. 

[ShadOBabe 19,014]

1 minute ago, Yamet said:

True, but most of what changed was the rules regarding cleanliness and sacrifice IIRC. The scripture (i.e the part I have a bit of a problem with) still remains the same.

Don't forget the ideas of humility, tollerance, and forgiveness.

Remember the adultress that they brought before Jesus? According to the Old Testament, she should have been stoned to death. And Jesus basically said, "Fine. If any of you here has never sinned, go ahead and throw the first stone." They all left because they all knew they didn't have the right to judge. Literally the only person there that had never sinned was Jesus himself, and he didn't throw a rock at her either. He just let her go in peace.

[Black Sabbath 2,486]

Just now, ShadOBabe said:

Don't forget the ideas of humility, tollerance, and forgiveness.

I'm sorry, but I don't see the forgiveness and tolerance part. I mean, if the new testament was so big about tolerance and forgiveness, why did it add the idea of hell?  Surely, any religion that features a place where those who didn't believe in it gets tormented for eternity can't preach too much about forgiveness and tolerance?  . 

1 minute ago, ShadOBabe said:

Remember the adultress that they brought before Jesus? According to the Old Testament, she should have been stoned to death. And Jesus basically said, "Fine. If any of you here has never sinned, go ahead and throw the first stone." They all left because they all knew they didn't have the right to judge. Literally the only person there that had never sinned was Jesus himself, and he didn't throw a rock at her either. He just let her go in peace.

Alright, I'll admit that I was wrong there. 

[ShadOBabe 19,014]

1 minute ago, Yamet said:

I'm sorry, but I don't see the forgiveness and tolerance part. I mean, if the new testament was so big about tolerance and forgiveness, why did it add the idea of hell?  Surely, any religion that features a place where those who didn't believe in it gets tormented for eternity can't preach too much about forgiveness and tolerance? 

Well you can't have eternal reward without something counter balance it.

And honestly, it's more that it works like this. No one, and I mean NO ONE, actually deserves Heaven. Heaven is a place of no sin, and since we're all sinful, we can't get in there on our own. That's why Jesus was sent. God wants us there, but he doesn't want sin there. So Jesus died so we'd have a ticket in. But you still have to accept that ticket. It's always available and you have your entire mortal life to take it. God didn't make you a robot. He doesn't want love that he has to twist out of you, because that's not actually love. You have the right to reject Him.

But if you do, then you can't get into Heaven, because you didn't let Jesus take your sin onto himself. So you're stuck outside the pearly gates, where the only other place to go is wherever Satan decides to take you. And he's not the Prince of Darkness for no reason.

[IronM17 5,446]

1 minute ago, Sondash Studios said:

Sorry, I'm not taking my time to answer. next time.

Well, when you make such assertions, than you should prove them. But when you don't do it, you should not wonder that people think you don't have proofs and that you maybe lie or have only empty allegations.

I don't want to attack or offense you because of your believes, but it is for me really annoying to see when somebody say that people who don't believe into God or the Bible are ignorant or want to annoy others. Or that people with other views are bad. Both are for me really heavy allegations, especially when there are no proofs. I also don't say that all christians are bad. Not even all creationists or evangelicals are bad (I had in my former school class a friend who was a creationist, but we were still friends, even when we had different worldviews). Ignorant people are for me people who can not accept that others have different opinions or attack them because of the different opinions.

@ShadOBabe Can in your religion somebody came into heaven when he don't believe into god, but still helped other people and does nothing bad in the world? Same for people who have another god (or more than one)?

 

[ShadOBabe 19,014]

Just now, IronM17 said:

Can in your religion somebody came into heaven when he don't believe into god, but still helped other people and does nothing bad in the world? Same for people who have another god (or more than one)?

Good deeds don't buy your way into Heaven, and no human in existance that isn't Jesus Christ will ever be without sin. Even the "little" sins that many people don't think are actually bad are still sins. A lot of people think that that's just arrogance when Christians say that, but those Christians are sinners too.

That "ticket" I mentioned? Yeah, you actually have to take it. You have to actually want to accept it. If you ACTUALLY want it, then you'd actually want to change for the better. You can't just lip service your way out of things. God knows what you think and feel. You can't be all "oh, yeah, I totes believe now", and then continue to do all the sins you did before, because that obviously means you were just talking out of your rear.

Well in the Christian believe system, no other gods actually exist. That's not a controversial position either, all religions think they're THE ONE. But yeah, you won't bribe your way into Heaven by "being good", and "no other gods before me" isn't considered a suggestion. This isn't the pirate code from Pirates of the Carribean. This "code" has actual rules.

Lemme sum it up in a less talky way: No you can't just get into Heaven by "being good", because no one actually is "good". And worshipping gods (or even just other things) other than THE God is considered Idolatry, which is another sin. And since there's that "No Sin Past This Point" rule at the Pearly Gates, then you still wouldn't get in without that aforementioned Forgiveness Ticket. Which you cannot get unless you actually WANT it.

 

And before you say something along the lines of, "Well other religions would say the same thing! They'd say that YOU'D go to Hell or something similar because you don't believe what they think", don't worry, I'm perfectly aware of that. Contrary to a lot of people on the internet, I'm actually okay with people thinking I'm incorrect. I believe what I do because it lines up with how I think about and experience the world we live in. I won't foist it upon others, but I am perfectly willing to share my opinions on it.

Though right now, I have a drawing to be working on. I mostly just showed up to defuse the arguing that was going on. I think peaceful discourse is more useful than bickering.

[IronM17 5,446]

@ShadOBabeWell, thanks for your information. I appreciate your opinions and views, even if I do not share them. I also think that there are no people who have never done anything bad, but I also do not think that there is an identity that judges us or that it is a heaven we come to when we die. But that's just my point of view which I got over a long time, and for so many different reasons.

[ShadOBabe 19,014]

1 minute ago, IronM17 said:

@ShadOBabeWell, thanks for your information. I appreciate your opinions and views, even if I do not share them. I also think that there are no people who have never done anything bad, but I also do not think that there is an identity that judges us or that it is a heaven we come to when we die. But that's just my point of view which I got over a long time, and for so many different reasons.

No problem man. I'm just glad we can all talk openly and still respect each other, even if we are all very different.

[PiratePony 8,486]

@IronM17 even this is up for debate within Christianity. It really is up to the Devine Mercy of Christ.

Recently the bishop of Rome had a bit to say about it.

 

 

[Guest]

I won't hide any comments because I believe it to be a valuable example as to how to diffuse tension, but I would like to remind everyone that the goal of this thread is not to contest each other's religious beliefs but to simply express their own. Please remain on topic.

 

Thank you

[Thorgir the Mighty 736]

Jesus is The King of Kings and Lord of Lords

[Here No Longer 5,281]

I believe that it is highly unlikely a higher power exists. As for organized religion? I frankly think that it's a scam. 

[Scarlet SoftPaws 3,586]

No not really, I'm a bit of an agnostic wiccan. I don't believe that magic is real, and unless I see irrefutable proof of the deities, I will only somewhat believe in them. I do follow the wiccan rede as my guideline for living though.

I have been in and out of Christianity since I was born up until I was 23, and I just couldn't find much truth to anything being taught.

[Shadow Dancer 111]

I'm just a random Christian though it is nice to see a place on the internet where people of different beliefs are talking pretty civilly. Sadly a rare treat in the world.