Change "Crazy" emoticon into "Disliked" emoticon.

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

1 minute ago, Wightling said:

I know I'll get a lot of "crazies" for this, but I don't like the reaction system very much to begin with. I think it has a lot of repetitive reactions (the "yay", "smiley", and "thanks") and since they don't increase your brohoof count I don't really see the point of them. I honestly think this reaction system was more trouble than it was worth.

Yeah I don't actually even use the reactions though I see the possibility that they hold and how they can enhance the communication, but I don't really have any issue with them either.

[Libra 11,691]

I see this thread managed to catch a following. Allow me to try to mediate between the two more vocal opinions ive seen. To be able to make heads or tails of this. I need to be able to understand core concepts. Lets begin.

user @Dark Qiviut has a point. A lot of people tend to use to "crazy" emotion in place of an actual argument. While ive seen this carried out in one debate pit thread (which is the one discussing either same-sex marriage or transgenderism, either one) i dont agree its used that badly. However, he belives that the crazy emote does not work in a politically heated enviorement. and i agree. people need to know that you cant just use an emote and hide. If you dont like it. ProVide aj argument or better yet, dont bother reading it. dont give the poster the time of day.

However, theres two sides to our coin. @Key Sharkz  has said that he/she (either one) belives that some people are quote unquote "too thin skinned" to handle an emote. Now, while i somewhat agree his/ her statement, telling people to "grow up" or "get some thicker skin" isnt going to make the concern dark made dissapear. That being said, we shouldnt let pixels get under our skin and fester there. However its not a one size fits all.

now onto my opinion. While both sides make decent points. I can only see this going one way or another.  i dont believe adding a "disagree" option would make sense, because i (as for me personally) belive if you disagree with someone. You should be upfrojt and say it. 

a solution i have would be to remove it altogether. dont give people a reaction to hide behind. That way, if they disagree with you or another person, they cant dislike it and run to the hills. 

 

[Feather Scribbles 194]

2 minutes ago, Manaka Hitomi said:

Yeah I don't actually even use the reactions though I see the possibility that they hold and how they can enhance the communication, but I don't really have any issue with them either.

Still... At least they are better than a thumbs up and thumbs down system.

[Jeric 46,851]

2 minutes ago, Key Sharkz said:

Or how about not? If we make it okay to report people for misuse of the "Crazy" emote then basically it leads to a lot of pointless reporting. People will report it any time they are personally offended even if it is harmless. It creates needless work for the staff when people should just learn to not care so much about an emote.

In most cases it would be objectively difficult to interpret the givers intent of an ambiguous image. That isn't how I encourage moderation, because you start chasing ghosts that way. Being an overt ass is one thing, but this would likely not fall into that realm. Basically, you don't have to worry yourself over that. It isn't likely to happen. 

 

[Feather Scribbles 194]

1 minute ago, Ninetales said:

I see this thread managed to catch a following. Allow me to try to mediate between the two more vocal opinions ive seen. To be able to make heads or tails of this. I need to be able to understand core concepts. Lets begin.

user @Dark Qiviut has a point. A lot of people tend to use to "crazy" emotion in place of an actual argument. While ive seen this carried out in one debate pit thread (which is the one discussing either same-sex marriage or transgenderism, either one) i dont agree its used that badly. However, he belives that the crazy emote does not work in a politically heated enviorement. and i agree. people need to know that you cant just use an emote and hide. If you dont like it. ProVide aj argument or better yet, dont bother reading it. dont give the poster the time of day.

However, theres two sides to our coin. @Key Sharkz  has said that he/she (either one) belives that some people are quote unquote "too thin skinned" to handle an emote. Now, while i somewhat agree his/ her statement, telling people to "grow up" or "get some thicker skin" isnt going to make the concern dark made dissapear. That being said, we shouldnt let pixels get under our skin and fester there. However its not a one size fits all.

now onto my opinion. While both sides make decent points. I can only see this going one way or another.  i dont believe adding a "disagree" option would make sense, because i (as for me personally) belive if you disagree with someone. You should be upfrojt and say it. 

a solution i have would be to remove it altogether. dont give people a reaction to hide behind. That way, if they disagree with you or another person, they cant dislike it and run to the hills. 

 

This I can live with. However, as happy as I am with the range of reactions we currently have, is there any room for any more? I personally don't have any ideas in mind, but as long as they are not "too controversial", then the more the better in my opinion! They allow a person to express what they are thinking instead of an emotionless "thumbs up" or "thumbs down".

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Ninetales said:

user @Dark Qiviut has a point. A lot of people tend to use to "crazy" emotion in place of an actual argument. While ive seen this carried out in one debate pit thread (which is the one discussing either same-sex marriage or transgenderism, either one) i dont agree its used that badly. However, he belives that the crazy emote does not work in a politically heated enviorement. and i agree. people need to know that you cant just use an emote and hide. If you dont like it. ProVide aj argument or better yet, dont bother reading it. dont give the poster the time of day.

 

What do you mean "hide behind"? It shows who leaves what reaction on every post.

[Rikifive 24,183]

You know, teacup, shocked and shrug reactions can have almost the same effect as the one explained in this thread, when used in a specific way. Say, how would you react if you'd be talking seriously and out of the sudden I'd drop shrug/shocked or teacup and leave? Not really nice in my opinion -- yeah, they should remove these too... and few others... That's not the way to solve the problem. There was an uncontrollable fire started by somebody? Prohibit the production of matches/lighters and every single thing, that could lead to that, even glass bottles, you never know these humans... such villains...

On a side note, I think I have used that reaction only once and it was on @Jeric's post. He didn't complain... or did he?  

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

Just now, Feather Scribbles said:

Still... At least they are better than a thumbs up and thumbs down system.

Yeah thumbs up/down I think isn't really very constructive or creative approach to this system. I think the current reaction system is miles ahead of the thumb system when looking at the value it generates to the communication and how you can creatively use it to even represent non binary reactions correctly which I think greatly adds to the feel of the conversation.

[Jeric 46,851]

1 minute ago, Feather Scribbles said:

Still... At least they are better than a thumbs up and thumbs down system.

Yes I agree, and I'm going on the record here that we will not be instituting any system that decreases brohoofs. Put simply, if you disagree with something that strongly, use your words and engage the member you disagree with. Reactions are intended to be something fun that adds color or flavor, not a replacement for discussion. 

[Feather Scribbles 194]

2 minutes ago, Manaka Hitomi said:

Yeah thumbs up/down I think isn't really very constructive or creative approach to this system. I think the current reaction system is miles ahead of the thumb system when looking at the value it generates to the communication and how you can creatively use it to even represent non binary reactions correctly which I think greatly adds to the feel of the conversation.

Precisely. Plus, if a thumbs up and thumbs down system was implemented, people would be more concerned about the amount of likes they get versus the reactions/responses they get from people. I am in favor of not only keeping the reactions we have now, but maybe adding a few more? (I've got no ideas.)

[SharpWit 2,647]

14 minutes ago, ZethaPonderer said:

I would suggest place restrictions of 'Crazy' in Debate Pit and substitute it instead of 'Respectfully Disagree'.

Or just add it since that would be really useful there, but more so I think I just want to see your idea of using fancy pants come to light 

[ZethaPonderer 2,199]

2 minutes ago, Ninetales said:

i dont believe adding a "disagree" option would make sense, because i (as for me personally) belive if you disagree with someone. You should be upfrojt and say it. 

a solution i have would be to remove it altogether. dont give people a reaction to hide behind. That way, if they disagree with you or another person, they cant dislike it and run to the hills. 

 

Well that's how you wish to view it since you're curious to know why that person disagreed with you and most likely would want everyone to agree with you, hence why your statement "You should be upfront and say it if you disagree" would make sense.

However I don't share your view since personally speaking, I don't expect people to agree with me. People don't have to agree all the time throughout their life. Sometimes they disagree wholeheartedly and they don't need to tell me upfront about it cause I feel like they should be entitled to their right to disagree. 'Respectfully Disagree' is a clear expression of the individual hating his enemy's guts, but still having respect for his enemy's right to say what he wants to say. Doesn't mean what he said has zero value, just that it's something you don't agree with. What's irrational to some is rational to others.

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

2 minutes ago, Rikifive said:

know, teacup, shocked and shrug 

Personally I think they are quite good examples on what the reaction system represents and what I think are good approaches to this system

Example shocked reaction it portrays that you are shocked because of something  it doesn't really touch on the post or the author of the post it was added on much at all like crazy for example which targets the post or potentially the author which I believe could be an issue on some contexts

Teacup is maybe my favourite of the reactions it doesn't really have any message yet it can say more than the other reactions I think because it doesn't really target anyone and almost everything is up to interpretation which I think greatly enhances it.

Shrug is another reaction that mostly and most heavily targets the one who gave it and their feeling on the content which I think is what reactions should achieve.

But as I said crazy can be used to target the post or the author of the post which gives it a possibility that it could be used or interpreted that way which could be an issue 

[Prometheus 3,038]

Ooft lads, all of this petty squabble over something as simple and mundane as a reaction?

If you find yourself misinterpreting the meaning behind a certain reaction, that's your problem, not the site's, or whoever had reacted in the first place. If you're seriously getting offended due to the reaction you got on a post, then I really don't know what to say. In my opinion, the current reaction system is fine as is, it serves its purpose well and there are no visible flaws with it as a concept or in its execution. I can understand the desire for additional reactions, but replacing certain reactions because you merely misinterpreted the meaning behind it? Just nah, man. 

 

 

[The Recherche 29,968]

2 hours ago, Feather Scribbles said:

Plus, if a thumbs up and thumbs down system was implemented, people would be more concerned about the amount of likes they get versus the reactions/responses they get from people.

I'm going to stop you there for just one minute. While I agree that Upvote/Downvote systems are worse than what the MLP Forums has now, I still don't think reaction systems as a whole are a very good thing if you want to discourage upvote-hogging. I'm living proof; I used to be obsessed with the brohoof count a few months ago (self-worth issues). I have since gotten over this, but the point I'm making is that the effect is still there. It's not as bad, but it can still encourage unhealthy behaviors and attitudes, especially since there's a Leaderboard. 

As for my input on this entire issue? I don't really care, honestly. I won't exactly cry myself to sleep if it's removed, nor will I if someone reacts to one of my posts that way. I kinda understand the idea of it being unhealthy for a heated debate, but when you get to that point, you might as well argue in favor of the reaction system being turned off in the Debate Bit, if not everywhere. Honestly, I wouldn't be against this... but it's the higher-ups choice whether to keep it around or not (including the Crazy reaction in particular).

[Libra 11,691]

18 minutes ago, Key Sharkz said:

What do you mean "hide behind"? It shows who leaves what reaction on every post.

perhaps i made a poor choice of words. What i mean is people choosing the reaction to hide that they dont really have an argument, however i could be wrong.

6 minutes ago, ZethaPonderer said:

Well that's how you wish to view it since you're curious to know why that person disagreed with you and most likely would want everyone to agree with you, hence why your statement "You should be upfront and say it if you disagree" would make sense.

However I don't share your view since personally speaking, I don't expect people to agree with me. People don't have to agree all the time throughout their life. Sometimes they disagree wholeheartedly and they don't need to tell me upfront about it cause I feel like they should be entitled to their right to disagree. 'Respectfully Disagree' is a clear expression of the individual hating his enemy's guts, but still having respect for his enemy's right to say what he wants to say. Doesn't mean what he said has zero value, just that it's something you don't agree with. What's irrational to some is rational to others.

A respectfully disagree would help. But it lacks a problem.

See, its just me speaking. But i would prefer it if people were specific in their reasoning as to why they disagree with what i did or do. I understand this is not a one size fits all, and most people are happy. In fact, even some of the othe reactions have me scratching my head wondering "why did they do that?" Me personally i want people to be specific and tell me why they disagree, instead of using a pixelated reaction, but once again, thats the way i view things and i can respect people who view it differently.

[Dark Qiviut 22,396]

13 minutes ago, Ninetales said:

A respectfully disagree would help.

The shrug reaction operates as a “respectfully disagree” very effectively. Indicates disagreement to a comment without being volatile.

Edited May 28, 2018 by Dark Qiviut

[Rikifive 24,183]

33 minutes ago, Manaka Hitomi said:

Personally I think they are quite good examples on what the reaction system represents and what I think are good approaches to this system

Example shocked reaction it portrays that you are shocked because of something  it doesn't really touch on the post or the author of the post it was added on much at all like crazy for example which targets the post or potentially the author which I believe could be an issue on some contexts

Teacup is maybe my favourite of the reactions it doesn't really have any message yet it can say more than the other reactions I think because it doesn't really target anyone and almost everything is up to interpretation which I think greatly enhances it.

Shrug is another reaction that mostly and most heavily targets the one who gave it and their feeling on the content which I think is what reactions should achieve.

But as I said crazy can be used to target the post or the author of the post which gives it a possibility that it could be used or interpreted that way which could be an issue 

Yes, but as every single reaction here, it can be used and/or interpreted wrongly; here is an example:

Somepony posts a serious status update, where he rants on something (rl problems, for example); what could he think of you if you'd put ...

Shrug Reaction: To me it kinda seems like "Nobody cares, deal with it" or "IDK" in this situation. Not really nice. I'd prefer to receive that crazy reaction at that point, less mean, as it's at least kind of funny. There's no description, where it says, that whenever I receive crazy reaction then that means, that I'm crazy or there's something wrong with me. Perhaps somepony was just like "Yeah, this word is crazy".

Shocked Reaction: being like "And? That's not a big problem mate, there are worse things, deal with it.".

Teacup: Simply representing ignorance. Somebody has problems and you're throwing a pretty much meaningless reaction, which is almost like a meme, without saying a word. Sipping a tea to somebody's problems and carry on, maybe bring also popcorn to that--- Friendship is magic they said, nothing about teacups, so can't blame anypony....

The only options at this point are brohoof to agree, that something indeed 'sux' or frown, to show, that you at least a little bit care. Any other reaction, even smile, would kinda be an abuse in that case.

 

Yeah, there are situations, where any reaction could be offensive to be honest. As said by ponies above, if you disagree with something and stuff, specify your thoughts, rather than just dropping a reaction and be like "ok, noice". Any reaction can be misused, so blame the users.

Edited May 28, 2018 by Rikifive

[Denim&Venöm 18,916]

1 hour ago, Jeric said:

A little heads up, in the past many many fun and cool ideas died in committee because of this line of thinking. Should we continue to bow to the one or two less mature individuals, or should is it possible we can treat this as we would any thread we disagree with and just shrug, roll your eyes, and move on? 

Cool ideas such as? 

[Libra 11,691]

7 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

The shrug reaction operates as a “respectfully disagree” very effectively. Indicates disagreement to a comment without being volatile.

that would make sense. However in my case i need people to be as specific as possible when disagreeing with me, a simple reaction would give me confusion as to why they disliked something as the reaction does not answer "why" they disagreed with it. However like i said earlier, other people are different.

[ZethaPonderer 2,199]

3 minutes ago, Rikifive said:

Yes, but as every single reaction here, it can be used and/or interpreted wrongly; here is an example:

Somepony posts a serious status update, where he rants on something (rl problems, for example); what could he think of you if you'd put ...

Shrug Reaction: To me it kinda seems like "Nobody cares, deal with it" or "IDK" in this situation. Not really nice. I'd prefer to receive that crazy reaction at that point, less mean, as it's at least kind of funny.

Shocked Reaction: being like "And? That's not a big problem mate, there are worse things, deal with it.".

Teacup: Simply representing ignorance. Somebody has problems and you're throwing a pretty much meaningless reaction, which is almost like a meme, without saying a word. Sipping a tea to somebody's problems and carry on, maybe bring popcorn to that--- Friendship is magic they said, nothing about teacups, so can't blame anypony....

The only options at this point are brohoof to agree, that something indeed 'sux' or frown, to show, that you at least a little bit care. Any other reaction, even smile, would kinda be an abuse in that case.

So we're gonna play the interpretation game out of reactions. Ok here's mine,

Shrug: Indifference, Confusion, Neither Agree nor Disagree.

Shocked: It could be an exaggerated depiction of liking someone's comment or it could be its a clear expression of expressing shock when reading a comment.

Teacup: It's just a fancy version of a typical 'like' reaction where it gives off a 'I concur' or 'Happy to talk with you' reaction.

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

2 minutes ago, Rikifive said:

Yes, but as every single reaction here, it can be used and/or interpreted wrongly; here is an example:

Somepony posts a serious status update, where he rants on something (rl problems, for example); what could he think of you if you'd put ...

Shrug Reaction: To me it kinda seems like "Nobody cares, deal with it" or "IDK" in this situation. Not really nice. I'd prefer to receive that crazy reaction at that point, less mean, as it's at least kind of funny.

Shocked Reaction: being like "And? That's not a big problem mate, there are worse things, deal with it.".

Teacup: Simply representing ignorance. Somebody has problems and you're throwing a pretty much meaningless reaction, which is almost like a meme, without saying a word. Sipping a tea to somebody's problems and carry on--- Friendship is magic they said, nothing about teacups, so can't blame anypony....

The only options at this point are brohoof to agree, that something indeed 'sux' or frown, to show, that you at least a little bit care. Any other reaction, even smile, would kinda be an abuse in that case.

 

Yeah, there are situations, where any reaction could be offensive to be honest. As said by ponies above, if you disagree with something and stuff, specify your thoughts, rather than just dropping a reaction and be like "ok, noice". Any reaction can be misused, so blame the users.

Yeah that is true but they don't explicitly say that it becomes very subjective and depends on the context and interpretation at that point. What I was saying in my post was that crazy is or at least feels or could feel more clear when used when compared to the others. 

I personally have no issue with it I was just trying to see why so many users react so strongly on it.

[Rikifive 24,183]

8 minutes ago, ZethaPonderer said:

So we're gonna play the interpretation game out of reactions.

That wasn't my goal, but while you shared your opinion - even from your interpretations it's easy to see how these can be offensive when misused.

And does that mean, that these should be removed too?

 

---

To me that crazy reaction is just kind of funny, never had any issues with that - but no wonder why users are offended when members use that to be mean... But believe me, putting a shrug where you shouldn't can be as mean and ignorant as that crazy one.

Edited May 28, 2018 by Rikifive

[Jeric 46,851]

11 minutes ago, Denim&Venom said:

Cool ideas such as? 

Turning the entire site into a shrine for Rarity.

Seriously though, a few community events. Some we should consider taking a fresh look at. 

[Dark Qiviut 22,396]

7 minutes ago, Manaka Hitomi said:

Yeah that is true but they don't explicitly say that it becomes very subjective and depends on the context and interpretation at that point. What I was saying in my post was that crazy is or at least feels or could feel more clear when used when compared to the others. 

I personally have no issue with it I was just trying to see why so many users react so strongly on it.

I think there could be a solution for something like this. Have a system where tagging it with a reaction (or specific ones) requires the user to either explain why or reply. If they don’t, the reaction is rejected.