General issues with Spike

[Blue_Phoenix 34]

I'm at an age where I don't care how many girls are around me. I'm tolerant  but in a way neutral. Spike he, he's the embodiment of bad boy. He's selfish, I dislike his attitude. And I don't see the deal with people wishing he was a pony. That's like me wishing a tomato is a vegetable. It's a produce but it has seeds. 

 

Also little chance he'll get together with Rarity because in Equestrian High he's q dog. 

[Twilight Luna 31,360]

As a character, I like him. His goofiness is a good counterpoint to Twilight’s seriousness. I just dont like Spike-centered episodes that make him out to be an idiot.

[Jeric 46,851]

11 minutes ago, Ray_Knight said:

I'm at an age where I don't care how many girls are around me. I'm tolerant  but in a way neutral. Spike he, he's the embodiment of bad boy. He's selfish, I dislike his attitude. And I don't see the deal with people wishing he was a pony. That's like me wishing a tomato is a vegetable. It's a produce but it has seeds. 

 

Also little chance he'll get together with Rarity because in Equestrian High he's q dog. 

I altered your topic title since it invites an obvious response. There will always be people that share an opinion, so titles phrased with “Am I the only one ... “ should be avoided in general. 

[FlareGun45 2,221]

Selfish?! Spike is the most selfless character in the entire show! He barely complains, he's the most helpful to his friends, he gets pushed around and he doesn't comment about it, and he's the most accepting character cause of his willingness to give Ember, Thorax, Starlight, and Discord a fair chance at friendship! Hell, he even helped his crush try to win over her crush! Even though it's tough for him to be a dragon in a pony world, it's home to him!

People really misunderstand Spike. Gives so much and gets so little. It's fine that you don't like him, but just know the fact that Spike is an awesome friend to all his friends! People don't understand his struggles.

Edited October 5, 2018 by FlareGun45

[BastementSparkle 20,326]

The description of Spike as a "Bad boy" made me laugh out loud. I'm imagining Spike in a leather jacket now, doing that stupid lean Discord showed him. Spike is pretty much the opposite of that, this is the dragon who once tried to be Applejack's servant for life because she saved him, because he wanted to be a "Noble Dragon" and couldn't bring himself to break his code, this is the dragon who spent years as Twilight's Number 1 assistant, doing everything he could to help her and putting up with her insane freak outs, even being her voice of reason often, this is the Dragon who was willing to befriend Thorax the changeling when nopony else would. He handed the Bloodstone scepter over to Ember after grabbing it, because he'd rather be back in Ponyville with his friends. He's a huge nerd who collects comic books and plays O&O, his greatest fear is Twilight sending him away.

Oh, sure, he's got a greedy streak, but apparently that's just a part of dragon nature in this show, and Spike's gotten that much more under control over time. Also, I have to say, I hate how the EQG series turns him into a dog, it's so demeaning for a being who in Equestria is clearly just as intelligent and sapient as the ponies, he's not a dog darn it. There's reasons why his relationship with Rarity hasn't happened, but him being on the level of a dog is absolutely NOT one of them.

[Goat-kun 2,527]

They see me rollin' they hatin'

I'm at an age when I do care about girls. I'm also intolerant. Spike speaks to me. And I don't wish for him to become a pony. I like non-pones and their ways.

[FirePuppy 735]

Whatever happens either way, I'm hoping for less of him for the rest of the show following this season.

[Misty Shadow 7,866]

BAD BOYS BAD BOYS WHAT'CHA GONNA DO

That honestly made me chuckle. People usually hate on Spike for being useless, but a bad boy...I think Spike would actually take that as a compliment. "Being useless" was my reason for not liking Spike in my early brony days, but I feel he's evolved into a great contribution to the show since then. Yes, he was "intolerant" of being around girls in the very early days of the show, but only because he had been raised by the antisocial at the time Twilight...in addition to being a young boy. And yes, he's also shown moments of selfishness alongside plenty of moments of selflessness and maturity...because he's a young boy. God forbid child characters occasionally act like children. And the "selfish, I dislike their attitude" argument can be applied to just about any character. They all have their moments of being self-centered and bratty, it's done for humor. You can have your issues with Spike, but these aren't even issues. They're cherrypicked non-issues.

[CastletonSnob 3,074]

Bad boy is the LAST thing I would describe Spike as. 

Sure he can be a smartass, but other than that, he's one of the nicest characters on the show. 

Edited October 5, 2018 by VG_Addict

[Blue_Phoenix 34]

2 hours ago, FirePuppy said:

Whatever happens either way, I'm hoping for less of him for the rest of the show following this season.

Spike as a character is supposed to be greedy but that doesn't change my opinion. And I hope he's done trying to get with rarity. 

 

Yeah he's a bad boy. If you add up the greed, eye rolls, and his undying lust for rarity (yes I'm interpreting it that way. No questions.) He's a yoshi kind of annoying. 

Just now, VG_Addict said:

Bad boy is the LAST thing I would describe Spike as. 

Sure he can be a smartass, but other than that, he's one of the nicest characters on the show. 

Because it's mlp. 

[CastletonSnob 3,074]

Just now, Ray_Knight said:

Spike as a character is supposed to be greedy but that doesn't change my opinion. And I hope he's done trying to get with rarity. 

 

Yeah he's a bad boy. If you add up the greed, eye rolls, and his undying lust for rarity (yes I'm interpreting it that way. No questions.) He's a yoshi kind of annoying. 

Because it's mlp. 

Lust? What? It's a simple childhood crush. 

Since when does rolling your eyes make you a bad boy? 

[SharpWit 2,647]

Wait,,, was spike a dog in Equestria Girls because he's the underdog of the show? 

He has his moments where he's self centered but he's willing to sacrifice a lot and we've seen him slaving away on more than one occasion.

[Will Guide 21,360]

@Ray_Knight

Like what @FlareGun45 said, Spike's done a lot more good than bad. Everyone has the good and bad sides. It may be your opinion and right to hate a character, but I will speak my mind when I say it's important to look at the good side of characters and people instead of holding all the negatives against them. Everyone has negative flaws and Works through them at their own pace. 

I have stated my belief and you may choose to respond to me. but you shall not convince me from seeing Spike as nothing more than this BAD BOY image you accuse him of.

 

[BastementSparkle 20,326]

31 minutes ago, Ray_Knight said:

Yeah he's a bad boy. If you add up the greed, eye rolls, and his undying lust for rarity (yes I'm interpreting it that way. No questions.)

So, all it takes is being physically attracted to a girl, rolling your eyes on occasion, and having moments of greed to be a "Bad Boy"? Well, today I learned I'm a Bad Boy.

 Honestly, everything you just said makes Spike sound like a normal guy, though "Undying Lust" sounds a bit...overexaggerated for how his crush is typically shown in the show. It also seems to imply that Spike's attraction is based entirely off Rarity's physical appearance, and while it certainly started this way, I think by this point in the show his crush has gone on long enough and he knows Rarity well enough, that it's pretty likely her personality and who she is as a person has contributed to keeping said crush going.

 Besides, you want to point out Spike's greed? How about the times he wasn't greedy, remember when he gave Rarity that Fire Ruby he'd been saving for his Birthday? How about the time he was willing to do extra work and answer fan-mail so Twilight could go on a vacation with her family? When he put his entire reputation as a hero to the Crystal Empire on the line to be supportive of Thorax? Spike's been selfless and generous just as often as he's been greedy.

[Blue_Phoenix 34]

3 minutes ago, Happy Yoshi said:

@Ray_Knight

Like what @FlareGun45 said, Spike's done a lot more good than bad. Everyone has the good and bad sides. It may be your opinion and right to hate a character, but I will speak my mind when I say it's important to look at the good side of characters and people instead of holding all the negatives against them. Everyone has negative flaws and Works through them at their own pace. 

I have stated my belief and you may choose to respond to me. but you shall not convince me from seeing Spike as nothing more than this BAD BOY image you accuse him of.

 

I didn't say I completely hate him? Lmao. This thread's title is general issues with spike as open as I am to opinions. I like his growth but I hope the writers do something solidifying. 

[Van123 29]

everything is fine with him, there are no issues

[FlareGun45 2,221]

5 hours ago, Van123 said:

everything is fine with him, there are no issues

Well that I'll have to disagree with, but every character has issues! It's normal!

[Abstract 832]

I never have liked Spike. I don't even really have a good reason why - I mean, his attitude and persona are definitely not my favorites, but he's not awful either.

Honestly, I think it's just his voice that irritates me so much. Maybe if he had a different voice actor my perception of him would be different.

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

The issue with Spike is that his character doesn't really contribute into anything and usually he is there for the sake of just being there. Which annoys me since his character doesn't seem to have any purpose other than just being there.

[Dashy 4 Ever 4,835]

Who? Me?

(Starts to cry)

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

On 10/6/2018 at 1:17 AM, BasementSparkle said:

Besides, you want to point out Spike's greed? How about the times he wasn't greedy, remember when he gave Rarity that Fire Ruby he'd been saving for his Birthday? How about the time he was willing to do extra work and answer fan-mail so Twilight could go on a vacation with her family? When he put his entire reputation as a hero to the Crystal Empire on the line to be supportive of Thorax? Spike's been selfless and generous just as often as he's been greedy.

I think the general issue there is that for me atleast those actions feel forced and superficial. It feels like he did those things only because he had to and not because he wanted to do so in the first place.

What I mean is that in many situations he chooses something and then after he sees how the things are turning out only then he changes his initial choice. It doesn't really feel like he even considers what will happen before he makes the initial choice. 

Feels like he just goes with the flow and doesn't even think for himself. On some rare occasions he shows some intellect but usually those are brushed off by him playing the straight guy in comedic situations.

Because of that in my eyes his character lacks genuinity. It doesn't really feel like his decisions are even his own.

His character doesn't usually add anything significant into the scene and in scenes where he is the focus he basically is just doing what he was told to do 

[BastementSparkle 20,326]

1 hour ago, -Enigma- said:

I think the general issue there is that for me atleast those actions feel forced and superficial. It feels like he did those things only because he had to and not because he wanted to do so in the first place.

What I mean is that in many situations he chooses something and then after he sees how the things are turning out only then he changes his initial choice. It doesn't really feel like he even considers what will happen before he makes the initial choice. 

Feels like he just goes with the flow and doesn't even think for himself. On some rare occasions he shows some intellect but usually those are brushed off by him playing the straight guy in comedic situations. 

Because of that in my eyes his character lacks genuinity. It doesn't really feel like his decisions are even his own.

His character doesn't usually add anything significant into the scene and in scenes where he is the focus he basically is just doing what he was told to do 

I don't really understand this, all of the instances of Spike's generosity I mentioned make perfect sense to me.

Rarity comments on how rare Fire Rubies are and makes it very, very clear, without outright saying it, that she'd really like to have the gem. Spike considers it for a moment, before deciding to give it to her instead of keeping it. This is obviously motivated in part by his crush on her, but it doesn't necessarily take away that it was still a generous choice.

When it comes to Twilight going on her vacation, Twilight says she wants to go but that she can't simply because she has too many Princess duties to take care of, Spike tries to convince her to take a break and go anyway, but she refuses so he finally settles on doing her work for her so she can go. This makes perfect sense, Spike is her #1 assistant and he takes that job very seriously, he's also one of Twilight's closest friends and pretty much a member of her family, he cares about her a lot and wants her to take a break and enjoy herself.

As for the incident with Thorax, Spike does initially choose not to stand up for him out of fear, but he immediately feels guilty for that choice and thinks it was wrong, he considers Thorax his friend and he feels he should have stood up then, after finding Thorax, he stands up for him this time because he knows that's what he should have done in the first place. Makes sense, Spike and Thorax had obviously become friends, Spike knows he's not a bad guy and Thorax even saved his life, he hesitated the first time because he feared losing his heroic reputation and the respect of the ponies he loves, but he considered it worth putting those on the line to stand by a friend.

 To me, all of these situations make perfect sense and I don't see how they aren't genuine, Spike never "Had" to do any of these. He didn't have to give that gem to Rarity, he didn't have to stay behind to let Twilight go on her cruise, he didn't have to stand up for Thorax, but he wanted to. As for him changing his initial choice, people change their minds, Spike clearly hesitates and takes a moment to think before giving the gem to Rarity, but in the Thorax case it was less changing his mind and more just him being too scared to do what he really wanted the first time.

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

14 minutes ago, BasementSparkle said:

I don't really understand this, all of the instances of Spike's generosity I mentioned make perfect sense to me.

Rarity comments on how rare Fire Rubies are and makes it very, very clear, without outright saying it, that she'd really like to have the gem. Spike considers it for a moment, before deciding to give it to her instead of keeping it. This is obviously motivated in part by his crush on her, but it doesn't necessarily take away that it was still a generous choice.

When it comes to Twilight going on her vacation, Twilight says she wants to go but that she can't simply because she has too many Princess duties to take care of, Spike tries to convince her to take a break and go anyway, but she refuses so he finally settles on doing her work for her so she can go. This makes perfect sense, Spike is her #1 assistant and he takes that job very seriously, he's also one of Twilight's closest friends and pretty much a member of her family, he cares about her a lot and wants her to take a break and enjoy herself.

As for the incident with Thorax, Spike does initially choose not to stand up for him out of fear, but he immediately feels guilty for that choice and thinks it was wrong, he considers Thorax his friend and he feels he should have stood up then, after finding Thorax, he stands up for him this time because he knows that's what he should have done in the first place. Makes sense, Spike and Thorax had obviously become friends, Spike knows he's not a bad guy and Thorax even saved his life, he hesitated the first time because he feared losing his heroic reputation and the respect of the ponies he loves, but he considered it worth putting those on the line to stand by a friend.

 To me, all of these situations make perfect sense and I don't see how they aren't genuine, Spike never "Had" to do any of these. He didn't have to give that gem to Rarity, he didn't have to stay behind to let Twilight go on her cruise, he didn't have to stand up for Thorax, but he wanted to. As for him changing his initial choice, people change their minds, Spike clearly hesitates and takes a moment to think before giving the gem to Rarity, but in the Thorax case it was less changing his mind and more just him being too scared to do what he really wanted the first time.

Those are good examples and i see how they can be viewed from that perspective as well but what i was talking about was referring more to his character as a whole in those situations and not those situations alone. Those situations alone without much context of the character or how he behaves on other situations seem pretty good and fine. But when i look those situations keeping in mind his character and contributions to the shows narrative as a whole those scenes dont really feel that genuine.

Maybe that is just me though, maybe i am projecting something based on my own experiences into Spike because i havent been impressed on how he has been handled as a character and that is why the light i view him in is distorted somehow.

But let me shed some light into how i see those situations in detail:

First the fire ruby scene:

IIRC the situation at that moment is that he has a Fire Ruby that he has deliberately been saving for that occasion and that is briefly emphasized on the scene then we see Rarity and she notices the gem in question. after she briefly expresses her interest on the gem, Spike jumps into a conclusion of giving it to her rather quickly considering how important the gem was supposed to be to him, yeah it is a generous choice but if you take into consideration how he behaved after and before that and on many other episodes, you'll see that the difference in this situation was that Rarity was the target of the generous act. And based on how Spike has been acting towards her basically every time they interacted I'd say that he was pretty much "forced" to give it to her. As that is basically what his other actions towards her have been proving. 

I think Spike would've been better in that episode had he not given the gem to her, I think it would've solidified him as his own character and not dependent on other characters 

 

Twilight Case:

I dont recall seeing the episode where there was a case like that so i cant really comment on that

 

Thorax Case:

The situation basically was that they were hunting the changeling that was sighted Then Spike has contact with the changeling and notices that he is not a bad guy. after that is where the problem starts He couldv'e told straight up what the situation was to everyone but instead of that he basically squirmed around until he was basically "forced" to tell what was going on by the situation. Yeah it was a brave act to put yourself on the stake on behalf of others but another look into his character on other episodes reveals that he really is not the type of guy to do that. Based on my impression of him he pretty much picks the easiest route most times and relies on others to basically do everything.

What I feel that is not genuine is that you cannot really expect those kind of actions from him based on how the other episodes have constructed his character, to me it doesnt feel that those situations could come naturally

[BastementSparkle 20,326]

Just now, -Enigma- said:

IRC the situation at that moment is that he has a Fire Ruby that he has deliberately been saving for that occasion and that is briefly emphasized on the scene then we see Rarity and she notices the gem in question. after she briefly expresses her interest on the gem, Spike jumps into a conclusion of giving it to her rather quickly considering how important the gem was supposed to be to him, yeah it is a generous choice but if you take into consideration how he behaved after and before that and on many other episodes, you'll see that the difference in this situation was that Rarity was the target of the generous act. And based on how Spike has been acting towards her basically every time they interacted I'd say that he was pretty much "forced" to give it to her. As that is basically what his other actions towards her have been proving. 

I think Spike would've been better in that episode had he not given the gem to her, I think it would've solidified him as his own character and not dependent on other characters 

I still don't see how he was "Forced" into giving the gem to her. Giving the gem to her is entirely his choice, everything he does for Rarity is basically his own choice, his feelings for her strongly influence those choices but it doesn't take away that he's the one deciding to do them. The gem might have been important to him, but Rarity was even more important, he considered it more worthwhile to see her happy with them gem than to enjoy it himself. 

5 minutes ago, -Enigma- said:

Twilight Case:

I dont recall seeing the episode where there was a case like that so i cant really comment on that

It's the beginning of "Once Upon a Zeppelin" a Season 7 episode.

5 minutes ago, -Enigma- said:

The situation basically was that they were hunting the changeling that was sighted Then Spike has contact with the changeling and notices that he is not a bad guy. after that is where the problem starts He couldv'e told straight up what the situation was to everyone but instead of that he basically squirmed around until he was basically "forced" to tell what was going on by the situation. Yeah it was a brave act to put yourself on the stake on behalf of others but another look into his character on other episodes reveals that he really is not the type of guy to do that. Based on my impression of him he pretty much picks the easiest route most times and relies on others to basically do everything.

What I feel that is not genuine is that you cannot really expect those kind of actions from him based on how the other episodes have constructed his character, to me it doesnt feel that those situations could come naturally

He wasn't really "Forced" into saying anything, he chose to do so. He failed to say anything the first time around, then deliberately went back to find Thorax and bring him back so he could stand up properly for him this time. If he didn't want to say anything, he could have let Thorax go the first time and simply let the others think what they want, but he didn't, he went out of his way to correct his mistake. 

 As for Spike always taking the easy route and not being the kind of guy to do that...I disagree, strongly. What about in "Gauntlet of Fire" where he decided to take place in the Gauntlet to make sure that nobody like Garble who would want to hurt ponies would get in charge? What about "Dragon Quest" when he refused to smash the Phoenix Egg to the teenage dragon's faces? What about "Equestria Games" where he was the one to immediately leap into action and save the empire from that giant ice cloud? What about "The Crystal Empire", where even before Twilight orders him to take the heart to Cadance, he willingly follows Twilight the whole time to be with her and support her, even knowing things might get dangerous?

I think Spike is absolutely the kind of character who'd make sacrifices or even put himself in danger to do the right thing or help his friends, he can be lazy or greedy sometimes, but Rarity can also be greedy and Rainbow can be lazy, does that somehow negate the times they're generous or hard-working? I don't think Spike is the kind to take the easy way out at all, he's been Twilight's #1 assistant for years and he's typically show to actually be very hard-working at that job.

[碇 シンジン 27,431]

Just now, BasementSparkle said:

 As for Spike always taking the easy route and not being the kind of guy to do that...I disagree, strongly. What about in "Gauntlet of Fire" where he decided to take place in the Gauntlet to make sure that nobody like Garble who would want to hurt ponies would get in charge? What about "Dragon Quest" when he refused to smash the Phoenix Egg to the teenage dragon's faces? What about "Equestria Games" where he was the one to immediately leap into action and save the empire from that giant ice cloud? What about "The Crystal Empire", where even before Twilight orders him to take the heart to Cadance, he willingly follows Twilight the whole time to be with her and support her, even knowing things might get dangerous?

I think Spike is absolutely the kind of character who'd make sacrifices or even put himself in danger to do the right thing or help his friends, he can be lazy or greedy sometimes, but Rarity can also be greedy and Rainbow can be lazy, does that somehow negate the times they're generous or hard-working? I don't think Spike is the kind to take the easy way out at all, he's been Twilight's #1 assistant for years and he's typically show to actually be very hard-working at that job.

From those situations Dragon Quest and The Crystal empire are only ones that I feel that he is acting genuine 

As in Dragon Quest it was his own choice not to smash the egg  compared to the Equestria Games for example where it really wasnt a choice as if he did not do that he would've pretty much died  or atleast many ponies would've died so I dont really see that kind of choices as choices that can define his character as they are pretty obvious choices to anyone in that situation and because of that I see them as "forced" 

 

Yeah he has qualities that enable him to do that but i dont thing that the examples that the show has presented us are the best representation of his qualities and that is why i feel that his character doesnt add to much